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T&NO class C-30-4 and C-30-5 Bay Window Cabooses

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  • sunbeam1314
    Hello List. Does anyone on this list know of a published picture of a C-30-4 or -5 wearing Southern Pacific Billboard Lettering with T&NO reporting marks
    Message 1 of 10 , Jul 2, 2006
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      Hello List.

      Does anyone on this list know of a published picture of a C-30-4 or -5
      wearing Southern Pacific "Billboard Lettering" with T&NO reporting
      marks below in the 1955 to 1960 time frame?

      I have looked through most of my SP Library and can't find any
      documentation as to what would be correct. T&NO? TNO? or just a 500
      series number?

      Thanks
      Frank
    • John Patterson
      Frankie Baby; Look in Steve Goen s Texas&New Orleans Color Pictorial .On Page 93,there s a photo of a pair of C-30-4 Bay window Cabooses*(*Numbers 501&504)in
      Message 2 of 10 , Jul 2, 2006
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        Frankie Baby;
        Look in Steve Goen's "Texas&New Orleans Color
        Pictorial".On Page 93,there's a photo of a pair of C-30-4 Bay window
        Cabooses*(*Numbers 501&504)in Ennis dated January 15,1961. Hope that helps
        you. John P.


        On 7/2/06, sunbeam1314 <sunbeam1314@...> wrote:
        >
        > Hello List.
        >
        > Does anyone on this list know of a published picture of a C-30-4 or -5
        > wearing Southern Pacific "Billboard Lettering" with T&NO reporting
        > marks below in the 1955 to 1960 time frame?
        >
        > I have looked through most of my SP Library and can't find any
        > documentation as to what would be correct. T&NO? TNO? or just a 500
        > series number?
        >
        > Thanks
        > Frank
        >
        >
        >


        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Frank Fertitta
        Thanks, John. That s EXACTLY what I was looking for! Frank John Patterson wrote: Frankie Baby; Look in Steve Goen s Texas&New
        Message 3 of 10 , Jul 2, 2006
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          Thanks, John. That's EXACTLY what I was looking for!
          Frank

          John Patterson <bongomonkey05@...> wrote:
          Frankie Baby;
          Look in Steve Goen's "Texas&New Orleans Color
          Pictorial".On Page 93,there's a photo of a pair of C-30-4 Bay window
          Cabooses*(*Numbers 501&504)in Ennis dated January 15,1961. Hope that helps
          you. John P.

          On 7/2/06, sunbeam1314 <sunbeam1314@...> wrote:
          >
          > Hello List.
          >
          > Does anyone on this list know of a published picture of a C-30-4 or -5
          > wearing Southern Pacific "Billboard Lettering" with T&NO reporting
          > marks below in the 1955 to 1960 time frame?
          >
          > I have looked through most of my SP Library and can't find any
          > documentation as to what would be correct. T&NO? TNO? or just a 500
          > series number?
          >
          > Thanks
          > Frank
          >
          >
          >

          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]






          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Barrybennetttoo@aol.com
          Hiya Gents Southern Pacific Freight Cars, Vol 2 Cabooses by Tony Thompson has very clear photo s on pages 224 and 225 of showing stacked billboard lettering,
          Message 4 of 10 , Jul 3, 2006
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            Hiya Gents

            Southern Pacific Freight Cars, Vol 2 Cabooses by Tony Thompson has very
            clear photo's on pages 224 and 225 of showing stacked billboard lettering, T&NO
            below, numbers 502 and 508. Please note that both have orange bays, a paint
            scheme introduced in 1961. Both photo's are are dated 1961. The inference from
            the notes to the photo's is that the scheme was newly applied, so possibly
            no block lettering before 1961 repainting of the bays. I can find no other
            info.

            Cheers

            Barry Bennett
            Coventry, England








            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • John Patterson
            On page 27 of Steve Goen s book,there s a photo of a Caboose Hop on route to Englewood Yard showing a 2-10-2 pushing Bay Window Caboose 533 in April 1950. The
            Message 5 of 10 , Jul 3, 2006
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              On page 27 of Steve Goen's book,there's a photo of a 'Caboose Hop'on route
              to Englewood Yard showing a 2-10-2 pushing Bay Window Caboose 533 in April
              1950.
              The Caboose has "Southern Pacific"in straight Roman leters and T&NO
              Markings.
              Hope this helps.


              On 7/3/06, Barrybennetttoo@... <Barrybennetttoo@...> wrote:
              >
              > Hiya Gents
              >
              > Southern Pacific Freight Cars, Vol 2 Cabooses by Tony Thompson has very
              > clear photo's on pages 224 and 225 of showing stacked billboard lettering,
              > T&NO
              > below, numbers 502 and 508. Please note that both have orange bays, a
              > paint
              > scheme introduced in 1961. Both photo's are are dated 1961. The inference
              > from
              > the notes to the photo's is that the scheme was newly applied, so possibly
              >
              > no block lettering before 1961 repainting of the bays. I can find no other
              >
              > info.
              >
              > Cheers
              >
              > Barry Bennett
              > Coventry, England
              >
              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >
              >
              >


              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • Bill Kelly
              The & was dropped in 1957, so a car repainted after that would be just TNO. Later, Bill Kelly
              Message 6 of 10 , Jul 3, 2006
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                The "&" was dropped in 1957, so a car repainted after that would be just
                TNO.
                Later,
                Bill Kelly



                Frank wrote:
                > Thanks, John. That's EXACTLY what I was looking for!
                > Frank
                >
                > John Patterson <bongomonkey05@...> wrote:
                > Frankie Baby;
                > Look in Steve Goen's "Texas&New Orleans Color
                > Pictorial".On Page 93,there's a photo of a pair of C-30-4 Bay
                > window
                > Cabooses*(*Numbers 501&504)in Ennis dated January 15,1961. Hope that
                > helps
                > you. John P.
                >
                > On 7/2/06, sunbeam1314 <sunbeam1314@...> wrote:
                > >
                > > Hello List.
                > >
                > > Does anyone on this list know of a published picture of a C-30-4
                > or -5
                > > wearing Southern Pacific "Billboard Lettering" with T&NO
                > reporting
                > > marks below in the 1955 to 1960 time frame?
                > >
                > > I have looked through most of my SP Library and can't find any
                > > documentation as to what would be correct. T&NO? TNO? or just a
                > 500
                > > series number?
                > >
                > > Thanks
                > > Frank
                > >
                > >
                > >
                >
                > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                >
                >
                >
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                >
                >
                > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
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                >
                >
                >
                >
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                >
                >
                >
                >
              • Barry Bennett
                The 1961 repaint photo s that I referred to show the ampersand, which is why I referred to the reporting mark as T & NO. It is possible that only the bays had
                Message 7 of 10 , Jul 3, 2006
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                  The 1961 repaint photo's that I referred to show the ampersand, which
                  is why I referred to the reporting mark as T & NO.

                  It is possible that only the bays had been painted, but the rest of
                  the cars' paintwork looks very fresh and give the impression of a
                  full repaint, as it is possible they may still have had vermillion
                  ends is not repainted before.

                  The cars are based in Houston on local service, so I expect were a
                  Houston paint job.

                  Cheers

                  Barry


                  --- In TNO@yahoogroups.com, Bill Kelly <wbkelly@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > The "&" was dropped in 1957, so a car repainted after that would be
                  just
                  > TNO.
                  > Later,
                  > Bill Kelly
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > Frank wrote:
                  > > Thanks, John. That's EXACTLY what I was looking for!
                  > > Frank
                  > >
                  > > John Patterson <bongomonkey05@...> wrote:
                  > > Frankie Baby;
                  > > Look in Steve Goen's "Texas&New Orleans Color
                  > > Pictorial".On Page 93,there's a photo of a pair of C-30-4 Bay
                  > > window
                  > > Cabooses*(*Numbers 501&504)in Ennis dated January 15,1961. Hope
                  that
                  > > helps
                  > > you. John P.
                  > >
                  > > On 7/2/06, sunbeam1314 <sunbeam1314@...> wrote:
                  > > >
                  > > > Hello List.
                  > > >
                  > > > Does anyone on this list know of a published picture of a C-30-
                  4
                  > > or -5
                  > > > wearing Southern Pacific "Billboard Lettering" with T&NO
                  > > reporting
                  > > > marks below in the 1955 to 1960 time frame?
                  > > >
                  > > > I have looked through most of my SP Library and can't find any
                  > > > documentation as to what would be correct. T&NO? TNO? or just a
                  > > 500
                  > > > series number?
                  > > >
                  > > > Thanks
                  > > > Frank
                  > > >
                  > > >
                  > > >
                  > >
                  > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
                  > > --------------------~-->
                  > > Something is new at Yahoo! Groups. Check out the enhanced email
                  > > design.
                  > > http://us.click.yahoo.com/SISQkA/gOaOAA/yQLSAA/8ZCslB/TM
                  > > ------------------------------------------------------------------
                  --~->
                  >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
                  > > Replies go to the list.
                  > > Contact the list owner at TNO-owner@yahoogroups.com
                  > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  >
                • Frank Fertitta
                  Thanks for your input, Bill. Frank Bill Kelly wrote: The & was dropped in 1957, so a car repainted after that would be just TNO. Later,
                  Message 8 of 10 , Jul 3, 2006
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                    Thanks for your input, Bill.
                    Frank

                    Bill Kelly <wbkelly@...> wrote:
                    The "&" was dropped in 1957, so a car repainted after that would be just
                    TNO.
                    Later,
                    Bill Kelly

                    Frank wrote:
                    > Thanks, John. That's EXACTLY what I was looking for!
                    > Frank
                    >
                    > John Patterson <bongomonkey05@...> wrote:
                    > Frankie Baby;
                    > Look in Steve Goen's "Texas&New Orleans Color
                    > Pictorial".On Page 93,there's a photo of a pair of C-30-4 Bay
                    > window
                    > Cabooses*(*Numbers 501&504)in Ennis dated January 15,1961. Hope that
                    > helps
                    > you. John P.
                    >
                    > On 7/2/06, sunbeam1314 <sunbeam1314@...> wrote:
                    > >
                    > > Hello List.
                    > >
                    > > Does anyone on this list know of a published picture of a C-30-4
                    > or -5
                    > > wearing Southern Pacific "Billboard Lettering" with T&NO
                    > reporting
                    > > marks below in the 1955 to 1960 time frame?
                    > >
                    > > I have looked through most of my SP Library and can't find any
                    > > documentation as to what would be correct. T&NO? TNO? or just a
                    > 500
                    > > series number?
                    > >
                    > > Thanks
                    > > Frank
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    >
                    > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
                    > --------------------~-->
                    > Something is new at Yahoo! Groups. Check out the enhanced email
                    > design.
                    > http://us.click.yahoo.com/SISQkA/gOaOAA/yQLSAA/8ZCslB/TM
                    > ----------------------------------------------------------~->

                    >
                    >
                    > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
                    > Replies go to the list.
                    > Contact the list owner at TNO-owner@yahoogroups.com
                    > Yahoo! Groups Links
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >






                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • Anthony Thompson
                    ... The ampersand was officially deleted in mid-1957, and some repaints eliminated it even earlier, possibly in anticipation of what they knew was coming. I
                    Message 9 of 10 , Jul 3, 2006
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                      Barry Bennett wrote:
                      > The 1961 repaint photo's that I referred to show the ampersand, which
                      > is why I referred to the reporting mark as T & NO.
                      >
                      > It is possible that only the bays had been painted, but the rest of
                      > the cars' paintwork looks very fresh and give the impression of a
                      > full repaint, as it is possible they may still have had vermillion
                      > ends is not repainted before.

                      The ampersand was officially deleted in mid-1957, and some
                      repaints eliminated it even earlier, possibly in anticipation of what
                      they knew was coming. I really doubt a 1961 repaint would include the
                      ampersand, except perhaps as a way of thumbing the nose at San
                      Francisco. The most likely explanation is that only the orange bays
                      were painted, and the rest of the car left alone. Certainly the
                      vermillion end was long obsolete by that time, and I doubt they would
                      have been left. Has anyone seen evidence of vermillion ends and orange
                      bays?

                      Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
                      2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
                      (510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
                      Publishers of books on railroad history
                    • Barry Bennett
                      Does anyone have any evidence of the vermillion ends surviving beyond the official adoption of orange in 1955. Cheers Barry ... of ... what ... the ... would
                      Message 10 of 10 , Jul 3, 2006
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                        Does anyone have any evidence of the vermillion ends surviving beyond
                        the official adoption of orange in 1955.

                        Cheers

                        Barry




                        --- In TNO@yahoogroups.com, Anthony Thompson <thompson@...> wrote:
                        >
                        > Barry Bennett wrote:
                        > > It is possible that only the bays had been painted, but the rest
                        of
                        > > the cars' paintwork looks very fresh and give the impression of a
                        > > full repaint, as it is possible they may still have had vermillion
                        > > ends is not repainted before.
                        >
                        > The ampersand was officially deleted in mid-1957, and some
                        > repaints eliminated it even earlier, possibly in anticipation of
                        what
                        > they knew was coming. I really doubt a 1961 repaint would include
                        the
                        > ampersand, except perhaps as a way of thumbing the nose at San
                        > Francisco. The most likely explanation is that only the orange bays
                        > were painted, and the rest of the car left alone. Certainly the
                        > vermillion end was long obsolete by that time, and I doubt they
                        would
                        > have been left. Has anyone seen evidence of vermillion ends and
                        orange
                        > bays?
                        >
                        > Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
                        > 2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
                        > (510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
                        > Publishers of books on railroad history
                        >
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