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Re: [Synoptic-L] Papias

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  • Karel Hanhart
    Larry, In my studies I frequently came across the idea that Papias frowned on Mark, because his order didn t match the Johannine order. As I recall it was
    Message 1 of 1 , Aug 4, 2007

      In my studies I frequently came across the idea that Papias frowned on Mark, because his order didn' t match the Johannine order. As I recall it was explained that John placed the entry in Jerusalem early in hs Gospel in contradition to the synoptics.
      However, I myself came to the conclusion that 'taxis' is connected with the Jewish feasts. LS shows that taxis may be a military term OR a term used for the order of priestly sacrifice. It sparked my research in the at the time hotly debated sacrificial calender question concerning Pesach (Passover) and Shabuoth (Pentecost): the socalled Boethusian question in rabbinica.
      I came to the conclusion that the 'sabbata' in the first chapters of Mark refer to the seven Pentecostal weeks on the Jewish festival calendar. Thus Mark started with Pentecost and ends up with Pesach. Thus Mark didnot write in the right order.
      If interested I'll be happy to refer you to the pages of my study.



      ----- Original Message -----
      From: Larry J. Swain
      To: Synoptic@yahoogroups.com
      Sent: Friday, August 03, 2007 7:19 PM
      Subject: [Synoptic-L] Papias

      I've doing some reading in and about Papias of late and have a
      question. J. B. Lightfoot and Eduard Schweizer (not sure on the
      latter) have both explained the Elder's comments about Mark not being
      "in order" etc as to be taken in comparison to the Elder's own gospel,
      or at least his oral teaching of the material that would become the
      4th gospel. This seems to me a very likely explanation since it seems
      that the Elder had something to do with the 4th Gospel and it is well
      known that the chronology of John differs from the Synoptics,
      sometimes significantly.

      HOwever, I haven't seen this idea referred to or discussed much in
      assessments of Papias' comments regarding Mark and the Synoptics. Is
      it because it isn't a widely known idea, or has it for some reason
      that I've not discovered yet been shown to be unlikely?

      As I write I also think of Irenaeus, and I should go look this up but
      I'm going off memory, who excoriates a set of Christians in part for
      having only the gospel of Mark and so therefore according to him have
      gone into error. But part of his comments have to do with the issue
      of "time", how old Jesus was, how long his ministry was, etc (does he
      use similar vocabulary to Papias' Elder, such as "taxis"? I don't
      have immediate access to a text of Irenaeus.), and how this effects
      order and the measure of time. This would seem to possibly be a
      continuation of the same discussion as Papias reports of the Elder,
      there are problems in the Marcan, specifically (and perhaps the
      Synoptics in general), ordering of Jesus' life.

      Thanks in advance!

      BTW, as long as I have your attention, about 10 years Charles Hill
      published an article in JTS on Eusebius' source of information
      regarding the composition of Luke and John as being Papias. I found
      the article convincing and to have explanatory power re: Eusebius and
      his use and disparagement of Papias. I wonder if any others here have
      read it and what they thought.

      Larry Swain
      University of Illinois at Chicago

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