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Should Lk 11:9-10 follow 11:13?

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  • David Inglis
    Lk 11:5-8 and 11:11-13 both involve asking and giving, and Lk 11:9-10 appears as though it would fit better after both passages, i.e. after 11:13 instead of
    Message 1 of 4 , Feb 10, 2013
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      Lk 11:5-8 and 11:11-13 both involve asking and giving, and Lk 11:9-10 appears as though it would fit better after both
      passages, i.e. after 11:13 instead of 11:8. Interestingly, Tertullian refers to the verses in this order in Adv Marcion
      IV. Does anyone know of any other support for such a revised verse order?



      David Inglis, Lafayette, CA, 94549, USA

      https://sites.google.com/site/inglisonmarcion/Home/marcion/marcion-s-gospel-compared-verse-by-verse-with-luke/lk-11



      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Stephen Carlson
      ... I m a little confused. Your page (that you link too) indicates that Luke 11:9-10 came before vv.5-8 and 11-13 in Tertullian s treatment of Marcion, but
      Message 2 of 4 , Feb 11, 2013
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        On Sun, Feb 10, 2013 at 11:59 PM, David Inglis <davidinglis2@...>wrote:
        >
        > Lk 11:5-8 and 11:11-13 both involve asking and giving, and Lk 11:9-10
        > appears as though it would fit better after both
        > passages, i.e. after 11:13 instead of 11:8. Interestingly, Tertullian
        > refers to the verses in this order in Adv Marcion
        > IV. Does anyone know of any other support for such a revised verse order?
        >

        I'm a little confused. Your page (that you link too) indicates that Luke
        11:9-10 came before vv.5-8 and 11-13 in Tertullian's treatment of Marcion,
        but your question here seems to place vv.9-10 after them. What's going on?

        Stephen
        --
        Stephen C. Carlson, Ph.D. (Duke)
        Post-Doctoral Fellow, Theology, Uppsala


        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • David Inglis
        Stephen, my apologies. The only excuse I can give is that our heating is currently on the fritz, and so my brain was too cold for cogent thought last night! In
        Message 3 of 4 , Feb 11, 2013
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          Stephen, my apologies. The only excuse I can give is that our heating is currently on the fritz, and so my brain was too
          cold for cogent thought last night! In Adv. Marcion IV.26 Tertullian does indeed refer to Lk 11:9-10 immediately after
          the LP, and thus before either 5-8 or 11-13. So, is this just a device of Tertullian's, or is there any support for a
          revised order here (although different to the one I asked in the previous email).



          David Inglis, Lafayette, CA, 94549, USA

          https://sites.google.com/site/inglisonmarcion/Home/marcion/marcion-s-gospel-compared-verse-by-verse-with-luke/lk-11



          From: Synoptic@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Synoptic@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Stephen Carlson
          Sent: Monday, February 11, 2013 4:24 AM
          To: Synoptic@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: Re: [Synoptic-L] Should Lk 11:9-10 follow 11:13?





          On Sun, Feb 10, 2013 at 11:59 PM, David Inglis davidinglis2@... <mailto:davidinglis2%40comcast.net> >wrote:
          >
          > Lk 11:5-8 and 11:11-13 both involve asking and giving, and Lk 11:9-10
          > appears as though it would fit better after both
          > passages, i.e. after 11:13 instead of 11:8. Interestingly, Tertullian
          > refers to the verses in this order in Adv Marcion
          > IV. Does anyone know of any other support for such a revised verse order?
          >

          I'm a little confused. Your page (that you link too) indicates that Luke
          11:9-10 came before vv.5-8 and 11-13 in Tertullian's treatment of Marcion,
          but your question here seems to place vv.9-10 after them. What's going on?

          Stephen
          --
          Stephen C. Carlson, Ph.D. (Duke)
          Post-Doctoral Fellow, Theology, Uppsala

          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



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          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Stephen Carlson
          ... Not having studied Tertullian s Adv. Marc. in any detail, I can t really offer much. My default assumption is that one should not infer that his order is
          Message 4 of 4 , Feb 11, 2013
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            On Mon, Feb 11, 2013 at 4:45 PM, David Inglis <davidinglis2@...>wrote:

            > **
            >
            > Stephen, my apologies. The only excuse I can give is that our heating is
            > currently on the fritz, and so my brain was too
            > cold for cogent thought last night! In Adv. Marcion IV.26 Tertullian does
            > indeed refer to Lk 11:9-10 immediately after
            > the LP, and thus before either 5-8 or 11-13. So, is this just a device of
            > Tertullian's, or is there any support for a
            > revised order here (although different to the one I asked in the previous
            > email).
            >

            Not having studied Tertullian's Adv. Marc. in any detail, I can't really
            offer much. My default assumption is that one should not infer that his
            order is that of Marcion's unless he makes an explicit comment to that
            effect.

            Dieter Roth has fairly recently completed a dissertation at the University
            of Edinburgh on using Tertullian to reconstruct Marcion's gospel. I don't
            know if he's going to publish it, but if so there may be something new and
            useful on the question.

            Stephen
            --
            Stephen C. Carlson, Ph.D. (Duke)
            Post-Doctoral Fellow, Theology, Uppsala


            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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