Chuks comments on the Eucharist.
- Chuck below are your comments:
I will make my one brief response. First off I would
suggest that you might want to read the "community
rule" or "the manual of discipline" as it is called in
some editions from the Qumran community of the Dead
Sea. There you will see a meal that is all but
identical to the Eucharist. It was instituted by the
community of Qumran long before Jesus or John came on
the scene. The meal was intended to re-enact portions
of temple worship including the daily sacrifice. You
can see a modern enactment of the Essene ritual at any
Roman Catholic mass complete with the ceremonial
washing of the hands by the priest, consecration of
the bread and wine and the two part division of the
sacrifice. The first is called the mass of the
Catechumens and the second is called the mass of the
Faithful. In the Essene movement one was not allowed
to partake of the sacred meal until he had proved
himself for at least a year as one who upheld the
community rule and the law of Moses. In addition to
these facts you can observe the Priests of the RCC
taking communion (bread) in a little pouch to shutins
just as missionaries carried the Eucharist with them
in the first century. The Agape feast is another name
for this meal as it was practiced daily by the people
of the Way an offshoot of the Essenes movement that
differed mostly in their attitude toward enemies.
I am surprised that you think the Eucharist was such a
late development when it was being practiced ritually
during the ministry of Paul and documented long before
out four Gospels came into existence.
As always, Thank you for your comments.
3.) On the trip to the other side the disciples become
aware that they have forgotten to take loaves. Note
that it is in the plural form of noun ARTOUS. The
point is not that they forgot to bring food; they
forgot to bring the loaves necessary to celebrate the
This is an excellent example of an anachronistic
reading. The Eucharist evolved over multiple decades
after Jesus died, and there is no evidence in Mark of
an awareness of a tradition of re-enacting the Last
Supper. Are you suggesting Mark would have his
readers believe the disciples celebrated the Lord's
Supper before there was a Last Supper?
4.) In Marks narrative the fact that the disciples
would even discuss not having loaves is an indication
to Jesus that they do not understand the point of the
The feedings were not parables. They were miracle
stories and were not recorded in the synoptics to
teach symbollic or allegorical lessons (Jn interprets
the feeding of the 5,000 allegorically in his gospel,
making it even more striking that the synoptics do NOT
8.) There are two points that Mark wants his readers
to get from this symbolic equation. First, among the
twelve disciples only five were called by Jesus.
Secondly the way to recognize the leaven of the
Pharisees and of Herod is by doing the Math i.e. by
counting as in comparing the ratio of loaves to the
number of baskets of leftovers.
If this was what Mark wanted his readers to
understand, he failed miserably, didn't he?
Rick Richmond rickr2889@...
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