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Re: [SurvivorsOfHomicide1] Forgiveness

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  • Roxana Reyes Davis
      Dear Patricia, Group,   When my father lost one of his sisters, my aunt Irma at the hands of her alcoholic husband, and not so long , he lost a very close
    Message 1 of 8 , Sep 12, 2011
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      Dear Patricia, Group,
       
      When my father lost one of his sisters, my aunt Irma at the hands of her alcoholic husband, and not so long , he lost a very close brother murdered, victim of assault, I thought dad was going to dwell in hate and bitterness.  What I saw was a man that experienced deep sadness but that embraced hope and left behind any desire for revenge. 
       
      I personally learned that I can only experience true forgiveness by the power of God in me.  It is humanly impossible to forgive when the loss is so great...  Years ago I was a victim of domestic violence and my ex-husband abused one of my children sexually.  I was so hurt, so angry.  Out of my "duty" as a Christian I told him "I forgive you" and tried to move on with my life but the truth is I was deeply hurt.  I remembered those that abused me sexually as a child and I resented my ex and cried for the abused against my daughter and felt angry because I could not forgive myself for making the bad decision of being with such a man. 
      I joined Celebrate Recovery ministry in my church last year.  when I joined a 12 step study group,  I learned so many things!  To choose not to forgive keep me a prisoner of the person that hurt me even if that person died or is no longer close to me.  Forgiveness is not necessarily something to negotiate with those that hurt us especially if they can damage us.  But to forgive makes me free to love others and to experience growth!  I could never reached the point where I am today without God's grace in my life, His power is making all the difference!
       
      My dad is 83 now,  those that killed our loved ones are not alive,  some relatives decided to dwell in bitterness, others decided to pretend it didn't happened, we choose to ask God for help to overcome that that is impossible and found hope and freedom!
      From my heart, Roxana

      Papito Dios llega a los Niños  Father God Children's Outreach Ministry


      --- On Sun, 9/11/11, patriciahung@... <patriciahung@...> wrote:

      From: patriciahung@... <patriciahung@...>
      Subject: [SurvivorsOfHomicide1] Forgiveness
      To: SurvivorsOfHomicide1@yahoogroups.com
      Date: Sunday, September 11, 2011, 2:23 PM

       
      Maybe you've had this discussion before, but I heard a sermon today (likely prompted by 9/11) and I was wondering how you all feel about "forgiveness".

      I am angry, of course, but when I think of the two who killed my daughter, I don't feel anything and I'm wondering if I'm weird. If I let myself really think about it, then I feel an overwhelming sadness, but I think I protect myself by not letting the feelings go deep enough to feel anything for the two people who killed her.

      I'm wondering if any of you have made it to forgiveness and if so, how?

      Thanks,
      Patricia

    • Matthew Larson
      Hi Patricia, sorry you qualify to be here. I lost mom, dad, my nephew and his girlfriend in a quadruple homicide the March before 9/11. The only thought I had
      Message 2 of 8 , Sep 12, 2011
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        Hi Patricia, sorry you qualify to be here.

        I lost mom, dad, my nephew and his girlfriend in a quadruple homicide the March before 9/11. The only thought I had on 9/11 was "Welcome to the party, everyone. We've (my sister [nephew was her son] and I) been here six months already.

        But on forgiveness, briefly, I have learned that forgiveness is something I do for me, not for the defendant.

        The best definition I have ever heard, and the one that spoke to my heart is this:

        "Forgiveness is the action you take when you give up the hope of having a different or better yesterday."

        Say it a few times, let the words sink in.

        Matt Larson

        (Oh, and Lorri, oddly enough, that is how my sister's name is spelled.)

         

        ----- Original Message -----

        From: LorriE

        Sent: 09/12/11 12:28 AM

        To: SurvivorsOfHomicide1@yahoogroups.com

        Subject: [SurvivorsOfHomicide1] Re: Forgiveness


         

        Hi Patriciahung, Forgiveness...I forgave my self for the hate I felt in my heart towards the p.o.s that murdered my Mother and it was at that point I was able to let go of the hate and guilt that had consumed me. I don't feel I have to forgive him that is God's job.I think everyone deals with this issue there own way. So I would have to say no I can't and won't forgive him.

        --- In SurvivorsOfHomicide1@yahoogroups.com, "patriciahung@..." <patriciahung@...> wrote:
        >
        > Maybe you've had this discussion before, but I heard a sermon today (likely prompted by 9/11) and I was wondering how you all feel about "forgiveness".
        >
        > I am angry, of course, but when I think of the two who killed my daughter, I don't feel anything and I'm wondering if I'm weird. If I let myself really think about it, then I feel an overwhelming sadness, but I think I protect myself by not letting the feelings go deep enough to feel anything for the two people who killed her.
        >
        > I'm wondering if any of you have made it to forgiveness and if so, how?
        >
        > Thanks,
        > Patricia
        >

         


      • patriciahung@rogers.com
        Thank you Matt for sharing. I m also sorry that you qualify for this group too - for everyone here.
        Message 3 of 8 , Sep 25, 2011
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          Thank you Matt for sharing. I'm also sorry that you qualify for this group too - for everyone here.

          --- In SurvivorsOfHomicide1@yahoogroups.com, "Matthew Larson" <radtech1@...> wrote:
          >
          > Hi Patricia, sorry you qualify to be here.
          >
          > I lost mom, dad, my nephew and his girlfriend in a quadruple homicide the March before 9/11. The only thought I had on 9/11 was "Welcome to the party, everyone. We've (my sister [nephew was her son] and I) been here six months already.
          >
          > But on forgiveness, briefly, I have learned that forgiveness is something I do for *me*, not for the defendant.
          >
          > The best definition I have ever heard, and the one that spoke to my heart is this:
          >
          > "Forgiveness is the action you take when you give up the hope of having a different or better yesterday."
          >
          > Say it a few times, let the words sink in.
          >
          > Matt Larson
          >
          > (Oh, and Lorri, oddly enough, that is how my sister's name is spelled.)
          > ----- Original Message -----
          > From: LorriE
          > Sent: 09/12/11 12:28 AM
          > To: SurvivorsOfHomicide1@yahoogroups.com
          > Subject: [SurvivorsOfHomicide1] Re: Forgiveness
          >
          > Hi Patriciahung, Forgiveness...I forgave my self for the hate I felt in my heart towards the p.o.s that murdered my Mother and it was at that point I was able to let go of the hate and guilt that had consumed me. I don't feel I have to forgive him that is God's job.I think everyone deals with this issue there own way. So I would have to say no I can't and won't forgive him.
          >
          > --- In SurvivorsOfHomicide1%2540yahoogroups.com , "patriciahung@" <patriciahung@> wrote:
          > >
          > > Maybe you've had this discussion before, but I heard a sermon today (likely prompted by 9/11) and I was wondering how you all feel about "forgiveness".
          > >
          > > I am angry, of course, but when I think of the two who killed my daughter, I don't feel anything and I'm wondering if I'm weird. If I let myself really think about it, then I feel an overwhelming sadness, but I think I protect myself by not letting the feelings go deep enough to feel anything for the two people who killed her.
          > >
          > > I'm wondering if any of you have made it to forgiveness and if so, how?
          > >
          > > Thanks,
          > > Patricia
          > >
          >
        • LorriE
          Hi Patricia,FORGIVENESS now that s a word we don t need or want to hear. I can tell you how I got through it.I heard from so many people you need to forgive
          Message 4 of 8 , Oct 22, 2011
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            Hi Patricia,FORGIVENESS now that's a word we don't need or want to hear. I can tell you how I got through it.I heard from so many people "you need to forgive him for killing your two moms" I was not about to forgive him as far as I was concerned that was not my job it was GOD'S job. I did forgive myself for feeling the hate in my heart towards the *@#$**. I forgave myself and from that point on I felt like that was not my burden any more. I set myself free from the hate and I have never looked back it worked for me. So when people say you have to forgive him/her you don't, but forgive yourself at that point you will be set free.I hope this help's.










            --- In SurvivorsOfHomicide1@yahoogroups.com, "patriciahung@..." <patriciahung@...> wrote:
            >
            > Maybe you've had this discussion before, but I heard a sermon today (likely prompted by 9/11) and I was wondering how you all feel about "forgiveness".
            >
            > I am angry, of course, but when I think of the two who killed my daughter, I don't feel anything and I'm wondering if I'm weird. If I let myself really think about it, then I feel an overwhelming sadness, but I think I protect myself by not letting the feelings go deep enough to feel anything for the two people who killed her.
            >
            > I'm wondering if any of you have made it to forgiveness and if so, how?
            >
            > Thanks,
            > Patricia
            >
          • Weeping Willow
            I m NEW here. And so having said that; I m going to jump in with both feet. We have to FORGIVE...not for them but for OURSELVES. Doesn t mean we have to
            Message 5 of 8 , Nov 4, 2011
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              I'm NEW here. And so having said that; I'm going to jump in with both feet.
              We have to FORGIVE...not for them but for OURSELVES. Doesn't mean we have to FORGET...but we must forgive.
              Forgiveness is a Two-way Street.
              Jesus says "Forgive so that ye may be forgiven, for as ye judge so shall ye BE judge." I forgave the killer of my sister because the hate and anger was eating me alive...and making my days more UN-bearable then really needed to be. I was also making life unbearable for those around me who didn't understand my hate and anger.

              I also forgave them because killing is killing is killing.
              And God Forbid one day my anger and madness get the best of me and I do the unthinkable.

              Not like spazz out and kill someone without reason...but say someone breaks in my home, and I shoot to kill.
              I have KILLED.
              Doesn't matter the reasoning, the person is still dead and it was because of ME. I can pray God will forgive me, but He clearly tells us that if I don't forgive, then I can't expect to be forgiven either.

              So I have forgiven them, and I pray I never have to walk a day in THEIR shoes knowing I killed a person.

              Once I forgave them the hate and anger left me, and I have my life back to live, as the alive should rightly do. LIVE,if only because our loved ones can't.

              Now all I feel is pity. I'd hate to be them right about now, forgiven or not. Can you imagine living with the memories, visions, and audio effects of someone dying because of you?!

              Sure they can strut around in their little world of bars and commissaries and LIE to one another about THEIR role in the deaths of OUR loved ones...but when those lights go out at night and the dark of the darkest come out---those screams are still there and the eyes of that deceased persons soul are still boring holes into their eyes---if only in their heads. What Hell.

              Yes, I forgave...but I will NEVER forget...and I pray they NEVER forget either. And THAT is one judgement I CAN live with.
              Willow

              --- In SurvivorsOfHomicide1@yahoogroups.com, "LorriE" <hdlorri69@...> wrote:
              >
              > Hi Patricia,FORGIVENESS now that's a word we don't need or want to hear. I can tell you how I got through it.I heard from so many people "you need to forgive him for killing your two moms" I was not about to forgive him as far as I was concerned that was not my job it was GOD'S job. I did forgive myself for feeling the hate in my heart towards the *@#$**. I forgave myself and from that point on I felt like that was not my burden any more. I set myself free from the hate and I have never looked back it worked for me. So when people say you have to forgive him/her you don't, but forgive yourself at that point you will be set free.I hope this help's.
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > --- In SurvivorsOfHomicide1@yahoogroups.com, "patriciahung@" <patriciahung@> wrote:
              > >
              > > Maybe you've had this discussion before, but I heard a sermon today (likely prompted by 9/11) and I was wondering how you all feel about "forgiveness".
              > >
              > > I am angry, of course, but when I think of the two who killed my daughter, I don't feel anything and I'm wondering if I'm weird. If I let myself really think about it, then I feel an overwhelming sadness, but I think I protect myself by not letting the feelings go deep enough to feel anything for the two people who killed her.
              > >
              > > I'm wondering if any of you have made it to forgiveness and if so, how?
              > >
              > > Thanks,
              > > Patricia
              > >
              >
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