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DNA definition for descendants from the High Stewards of Scotland

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  • Belinda
    A smart researcher in the Project L21Plus list has looked at the QHV9S (royal and ancient Stewart) signature and recognised that it can be defined by 3
    Message 1 of 15 , Nov 7, 2010
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      A smart researcher in the Project L21Plus list has looked at the QHV9S (royal and ancient Stewart) signature and recognised that it can be defined by 3 particular DYS values, each of which is off-modal from the Western Atlantic Modal for R1b. These are GATAH4=10, 406S1=11, 565=11. He found these in 5 people who had tested L21+ (R1b1b2a1b5) and matched QHV9S closely, and 3 of them are Stewarts in the red group. I've checked in the Stewart project results, and all but one of the `Charles II' red group have all three marker values. The odd man out is in a different subclade, so he could well be misclassified.

      I think the 10, 11, 11 definition of GATAH4, 106S1, 565, is looking rock solid for descendants of the Stewart High Stewards of Scotland.

      Belinda
    • James A. Stewart
      Belinda this is way over my head, I have no idea what you just said! Can you give it in English? ... From: Belinda Date: 11/07/10 16:37:21 To:
      Message 2 of 15 , Nov 7, 2010
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        Belinda this is way over my head, I have no idea what you just said! Can you give it in English?  
         
        -------Original Message-------
         
        From: Belinda
        Date: 11/07/10 16:37:21
        Subject: [Stewart-DNA] DNA definition for descendants from the High Stewards of Scotland
         
         

        A smart researcher in the Project L21Plus list has looked at the QHV9S (royal and ancient Stewart) signature and recognised that it can be defined by 3 particular DYS values, each of which is off-modal from the Western Atlantic Modal for R1b. These are GATAH4=10, 406S1=11, 565=11. He found these in 5 people who had tested L21+ (R1b1b2a1b5) and matched QHV9S closely, and 3 of them are Stewarts in the red group. I've checked in the Stewart project results, and all but one of the `Charles II' red group have all three marker values. The odd man out is in a different subclade, so he could well be misclassified.

        I think the 10, 11, 11 definition of GATAH4, 106S1, 565, is looking rock solid for descendants of the Stewart High Stewards of Scotland.

        Belinda

         
         
         
         
         
         
      • Belinda
        Hi James If your surname is Stewart and you have a R1b haplogroup, one of the possibilities for your ancient origin is that you descend from the ancient line
        Message 3 of 15 , Nov 7, 2010
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          Hi James
          If your surname is Stewart and you have a R1b haplogroup, one of the possibilities for your ancient origin is that you descend from the ancient line of Stewarts who were High Stewards of Scotland before the year 1300, or one of their descendants.

          Now you can now check three specific DYS marker values to see if this is the case. It will only work properly if you have had 67 markers tested, as none of the defining markers appears in the first 25, GATAH4 is in the first 37, but 406S1 and 565 are only in the full 67.

          If you have GATAH4=10, 406S1=11 and 565=11, there is a strong probability that your Stewarts come from the line of the High Stewards.

          Belinda

          --- In Stewart-DNA@yahoogroups.com, "James A. Stewart" <jb46@...> wrote:
          >
          > Belinda this is way over my head, I have no idea what you just said! Can you
          > give it in English?
          >
          > From: Belinda
          > Date: 11/07/10 16:37:21
          > To: Stewart-DNA@yahoogroups.com
          > Subject: [Stewart-DNA] DNA definition for descendants from the High Stewards
          > of Scotland
          >
          >
          > A smart researcher in the Project L21Plus list has looked at the QHV9S
          > (royal and ancient Stewart) signature and recognised that it can be defined
          > by 3 particular DYS values, each of which is off-modal from the Western
          > Atlantic Modal for R1b. These are GATAH4=10, 406S1=11, 565=11. He found
          > these in 5 people who had tested L21+ (R1b1b2a1b5) and matched QHV9S closely
          > and 3 of them are Stewarts in the red group. I've checked in the Stewart
          > project results, and all but one of the `Charles II' red group have all
          > three marker values. The odd man out is in a different subclade, so he could
          > well be misclassified.
          >
          > I think the 10, 11, 11 definition of GATAH4, 106S1, 565, is looking rock
          > solid for descendants of the Stewart High Stewards of Scotland.
          >
          > Belinda
          >
        • James A. Stewart
          Hi Belinda I have in fact those DYS markers in my R1b Haplogroup and I am a Stewart. I have a paper trail to Henrico county, VA. In the early 1600 s. It is
          Message 4 of 15 , Nov 7, 2010
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            Hi Belinda
             
            I have in fact those DYS markers in my R1b  Haplogroup and I am a Stewart. I have a paper trail to Henrico county, VA. In the early 1600's. It is thought that my Steward's were from Northamptonshire, England. It is thought that Charles Steward so spelled brought to Virginia in 1638. Thus they would be considered Anglicized-scots.
             
            Locus
            1
            2
            3
            4
            5
            6
            7
            8
            9
            10
            11
            12
            DYS#
            393
            390
            19*
            391
            385a
            385b
            426
            388
            439
            389-1
            392
            389-2
            Alleles
            13
            24
            14
            11
            11
            14
            12
            12
            12
            13
            13
            30
            PANEL 2 (13-25)
            Locus
            13
            14
            15
            16
            17
            18
            19
            20
            21
            22
            23
            24
            25
            DYS#
            458
            459a
            459b
            455
            454
            447
            437
            448
            449
            464a**
            464b**
            464c**
            464d**
            Alleles
            16
            9
            10
            11
            11
            24
            15
            19
            28
            14
            16
            16
            16
            PANEL 3 (26-37)
            Locus
            26
            27
            28
            29
            30
            31
            32
            33
            34
            35
            36
            37
            DYS#
            460
            GATA H4
            YCA II a
            YCA II b
            456
            607
            576
            570
            CDY a
            CDY b
            442
            438
            Alleles
            11
            11
            20
            23
            15
            15
            16
            15
            37
            37
            13
            12
            PANEL 4 (38 - 47)
            Locus
            38
            39
            40
            41
            42
            43
            44
            45
            46
            47
            DYS#
            531
            578
            395S1a
            395S1b
            590
            537
            641
            472
            406S1
            511
            Alleles
            12
            9
            15
            16
            8
            10
            10
            8
            10
            10
            PANEL 4 (48 - 60)
            Locus
            48
            49
            50
            51
            52
            53
            54
            55
            56
            57
            58
            59
            60
            DYS#
            425
            413a
            413b
            557
            594
            436
            490
            534
            450
            444
            481
            520
            446
            Alleles
            12
            22
            23
            15
            10
            12
            12
            16
            8
            12
            21
            20
            12
            PANEL 4 (61 - 67)
            Locus
            61
            62
            63
            64
            65
            66
            67
            DYS#
            617
            568
            487
            572
            640
            492
            565
            Alleles
            12
            11
            13
            11
            11
            12
            12

            *Also known as DYS 394

            **On 5/19/2003, these values were adjusted down by 1 point because of a change in Lab nomenclature.

            ***A value of “0” for any marker indicates that the lab reported a null value or no result for this marker. All cases of this nature are retested multiple times by the lab to confirm their accuracy. Mutations causing null values are infrequent, but are passed on to offspring just like other mutations, so related male lineages such as a father and son would likely share any null values.

            ¤   
             
            -------Original Message-------
             
            From: Belinda
            Date: 11/7/2010 5:18:50 PM
            Subject: [Stewart-DNA] Re: DNA definition for descendants from the High Stewards of Scotland
             
             



            Hi James
            If your surname is Stewart and you have a R1b haplogroup, one of the possibilities for your ancient origin is that you descend from the ancient line of Stewarts who were High Stewards of Scotland before the year 1300, or one of their descendants.

            Now you can now check three specific DYS marker values to see if this is the case. It will only work properly if you have had 67 markers tested, as none of the defining markers appears in the first 25, GATAH4 is in the first 37, but 406S1 and 565 are only in the full 67.

            If you have GATAH4=10, 406S1=11 and 565=11, there is a strong probability that your Stewarts come from the line of the High Stewards.

            Belinda

            --- In Stewart-DNA@yahoogroups.com, "James A. Stewart" <jb46@...> wrote:
            >
            > Belinda this is way over my head, I have no idea what you just said! Can you
            > give it in English?
            >
            > From: Belinda
            > Date: 11/07/10 16:37:21
            > To: Stewart-DNA@yahoogroups.com
            > Subject: [Stewart-DNA] DNA definition for descendants from the High Stewards
            > of Scotland
            >
            >
            > A smart researcher in the Project L21Plus list has looked at the QHV9S
            > (royal and ancient Stewart) signature and recognised that it can be defined
            > by 3 particular DYS values, each of which is off-modal from the Western
            > Atlantic Modal for R1b. These are GATAH4=10, 406S1=11, 565=11. He found
            > these in 5 people who had tested L21+ (R1b1b2a1b5) and matched QHV9S closely
            > and 3 of them are Stewarts in the red group. I've checked in the Stewart
            > project results, and all but one of the `Charles II' red group have all
            > three marker values. The odd man out is in a different subclade, so he could
            > well be misclassified.
            >
            > I think the 10, 11, 11 definition of GATAH4, 106S1, 565, is looking rock
            > solid for descendants of the Stewart High Stewards of Scotland.
            >
            > Belinda
            >

             
             
             
             
             
             
          • Michael Stewart
            389-2 More to the genetic story of the ancient line, for those of us with 389-2 marker value of 30 so far appear to all hail from the Appin Stewarts with a
            Message 5 of 15 , Nov 7, 2010
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              389-2
              More to the genetic story of the ancient line, for those of us with 389-2 marker value of "30" so far appear to all hail from the Appin Stewarts with a most recent common ancestor just over 300 years ago. 

              For my American cousins who have not yet been able to take their family trees across the pond, if you have this marker value, this could be a good clue as to where your peeps came from. The year your forefather emigrated, could tell us a bit more about his diaspora including why and how he came to be in the US. They could have been in good favor of King Charles, running from Cromwell, bolting from the Hanovarians, working for the House of Hanover, fleeing famine, or one of the many other scenarios that are particular to certain generations of our Scottish predecessors. First American destinations tell part of the story too, especially if all the neighbors had highland names also.


              Sláinte

              Michael T. Stewart, P.E.

              "Cuimhnich air na daoine o'n d'thaining thu" ~ Remember those from whom you are descended

            • Allan M Stewart
              Dear Belinda: I am kit 48747 and part of the red group - Charles II. Two quick questions, please: 1. I have been tested to 67 markers, but all I know is that
              Message 6 of 15 , Nov 7, 2010
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                Dear Belinda:
                I am kit 48747 and part of the red group - Charles II.  Two quick questions, please:
                1.  I have been tested to 67 markers, but all I know is that I'm R1b1b2.  What tests do I need to do to see if I'm in the group you show as R1b1b2a1b5?
                2.  What can I read to understand what all of these things are - i.e. GATAH4, 406S1, 565?
                Many thanks.
                Allan

                On Sun, Nov 7, 2010 at 5:37 PM, Belinda <belindadettmann@...> wrote:
                 

                A smart researcher in the Project L21Plus list has looked at the QHV9S (royal and ancient Stewart) signature and recognised that it can be defined by 3 particular DYS values, each of which is off-modal from the Western Atlantic Modal for R1b. These are GATAH4=10, 406S1=11, 565=11. He found these in 5 people who had tested L21+ (R1b1b2a1b5) and matched QHV9S closely, and 3 of them are Stewarts in the red group. I've checked in the Stewart project results, and all but one of the `Charles II' red group have all three marker values. The odd man out is in a different subclade, so he could well be misclassified.

                I think the 10, 11, 11 definition of GATAH4, 106S1, 565, is looking rock solid for descendants of the Stewart High Stewards of Scotland.

                Belinda


              • Belinda Dettmann
                Hi Allan To go beyond R1b1b2 you need a deep clade test. if you go to your Haplotree page on FTDNA you will see a link to order this test. GATAH4, 406S1 and
                Message 7 of 15 , Nov 7, 2010
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                  Hi Allan

                  To go beyond R1b1b2 you need a deep clade test. if you go to your Haplotree page on FTDNA you will see a link to order this test.

                   

                  GATAH4, 406S1 and 565 are marker names, so you can find your values for these markers on your Y-DNA results page, or on the Y-DNA results page at the Stewart Project where you can compare your values with those of other Stewart testers. See http://www.familytreedna.com/public/Stewart/default.aspx?section=yresults

                   

                  Belinda

                   

                  On Behalf Of Allan M Stewart

                  Dear Belinda:

                  I am kit 48747 and part of the red group - Charles II.  Two quick questions, please:

                  1.  I have been tested to 67 markers, but all I know is that I'm R1b1b2.  What tests do I need to do to see if I'm in the group you show as R1b1b2a1b5?

                  2.  What can I read to understand what all of these things are - i.e. GATAH4, 406S1, 565?

                  Many thanks.

                  Allan

                  On Sun, Nov 7, 2010 at 5:37 PM, Belinda <belindadettmann@...> wrote:

                   

                  A smart researcher in the Project L21Plus list has looked at the QHV9S (royal and ancient Stewart) signature and recognised that it can be defined by 3 particular DYS values, each of which is off-modal from the Western Atlantic Modal for R1b. These are GATAH4=10, 406S1=11, 565=11. He found these in 5 people who had tested L21+ (R1b1b2a1b5) and matched QHV9S closely, and 3 of them are Stewarts in the red group. I've checked in the Stewart project results, and all but one of the `Charles II' red group have all three marker values. The odd man out is in a different subclade, so he could well be misclassified.

                  I think the 10, 11, 11 definition of GATAH4, 106S1, 565, is looking rock solid for descendants of the Stewart High Stewards of Scotland.

                  Belinda





                • songbird_1226
                  Michael, In looking at (my husband) Wayne s Y-DNA DYS results, I find at Locus 12, DYS# 389-2, Allele 30. Is this what you re referring to, as far as being
                  Message 8 of 15 , Nov 8, 2010
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                    Michael,

                    In looking at (my husband) Wayne's Y-DNA DYS results, I find at Locus 12, DYS# 389-2, Allele 30. Is this what you're referring to, as far as being connected to the Appin Stewarts?

                    Thanks,
                    Katie Steuart



                    --- In Stewart-DNA@yahoogroups.com, Michael Stewart <mtstew@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > 389-2
                    > More to the genetic story of the ancient line, for those of us with 389-2 marker value of "30" so far appear to all hail from the Appin Stewarts with a most recent common ancestor just over 300 years ago.
                    >
                    > For my American cousins who have not yet been able to take their family trees across the pond, if you have this marker value, this could be a good clue as to where your peeps came from. The year your forefather emigrated, could tell us a bit more about his diaspora including why and how he came to be in the US. They could have been in good favor of King Charles, running from Cromwell, bolting from the Hanovarians, working for the House of Hanover, fleeing famine, or one of the many other scenarios that are particular to certain generations of our Scottish predecessors. First American destinations tell part of the story too, especially if all the neighbors had highland names also.
                    >
                    >
                    > Sláinte
                    >
                    > Michael T. Stewart, P.E.
                    > mtstew@...
                    >
                    > "Cuimhnich air na daoine o'n d'thaining thu" ~ Remember those from whom you are descended
                    >
                  • Allan M Stewart
                    Many thanks. I have ordered the deep clade test, I think. The computer didn t seem to finish that request, but I got an email saying I had ordered it.
                    Message 9 of 15 , Nov 8, 2010
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                      Many thanks.  I have ordered the deep clade test, I think.  The computer didn't seem to finish that request, but I got an email saying I had ordered it.
                      Cheers!
                      Allan

                      On Sun, Nov 7, 2010 at 8:38 PM, Belinda Dettmann <belindadettmann@...> wrote:
                       

                      Hi Allan

                      To go beyond R1b1b2 you need a deep clade test. if you go to your Haplotree page on FTDNA you will see a link to order this test.

                       

                      GATAH4, 406S1 and 565 are marker names, so you can find your values for these markers on your Y-DNA results page, or on the Y-DNA results page at the Stewart Project where you can compare your values with those of other Stewart testers. See http://www.familytreedna.com/public/Stewart/default.aspx?section=yresults

                       

                      Belinda

                       

                      On Behalf Of Allan M Stewart

                      Dear Belinda:

                      I am kit 48747 and part of the red group - Charles II.  Two quick questions, please:

                      1.  I have been tested to 67 markers, but all I know is that I'm R1b1b2.  What tests do I need to do to see if I'm in the group you show as R1b1b2a1b5?

                      2.  What can I read to understand what all of these things are - i.e. GATAH4, 406S1, 565?

                      Many thanks.

                      Allan

                      On Sun, Nov 7, 2010 at 5:37 PM, Belinda <belindadettmann@...> wrote:

                       

                      A smart researcher in the Project L21Plus list has looked at the QHV9S (royal and ancient Stewart) signature and recognised that it can be defined by 3 particular DYS values, each of which is off-modal from the Western Atlantic Modal for R1b. These are GATAH4=10, 406S1=11, 565=11. He found these in 5 people who had tested L21+ (R1b1b2a1b5) and matched QHV9S closely, and 3 of them are Stewarts in the red group. I've checked in the Stewart project results, and all but one of the `Charles II' red group have all three marker values. The odd man out is in a different subclade, so he could well be misclassified.

                      I think the 10, 11, 11 definition of GATAH4, 106S1, 565, is looking rock solid for descendants of the Stewart High Stewards of Scotland.

                      Belinda






                    • replycs
                      Dear Cousin Allan! I received an e-mail from FTDNA for the Campbeltown project, to tell me you had applied for the test... That s great! Personally, I would be
                      Message 10 of 15 , Nov 8, 2010
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                        Dear Cousin Allan!

                        I received an e-mail from FTDNA for the Campbeltown project, to tell me you had applied for the test... That's great!

                        Personally, I would be very surprised if you were anything other than R1b1b2a1b5, as your yDNA and mine are so very close, along with our cousin Edward in Ohio and my brother John and cousin Kenneth in England.


                        Best regards,


                        Charles.
                        # 57979
                        --- In Stewart-DNA@yahoogroups.com, Allan M Stewart <allan.m.stewart@...> wrote:
                        >
                        > Dear Belinda:
                        > I am kit 48747 and part of the red group - Charles II. Two quick questions,
                        > please:
                        > 1. I have been tested to 67 markers, but all I know is that I'm R1b1b2.
                        > What tests do I need to do to see if I'm in the group you show as
                        > R1b1b2a1b5?
                        > 2. What can I read to understand what all of these things are - i.e.
                        > GATAH4, 406S1, 565?
                        > Many thanks.
                        > Allan
                        >
                        > On Sun, Nov 7, 2010 at 5:37 PM, Belinda <belindadettmann@...>wrote:
                        >
                        > >
                        > >
                        > > A smart researcher in the Project L21Plus list has looked at the QHV9S
                        > > (royal and ancient Stewart) signature and recognised that it can be defined
                        > > by 3 particular DYS values, each of which is off-modal from the Western
                        > > Atlantic Modal for R1b. These are GATAH4=10, 406S1=11, 565=11. He found
                        > > these in 5 people who had tested L21+ (R1b1b2a1b5) and matched QHV9S
                        > > closely, and 3 of them are Stewarts in the red group. I've checked in the
                        > > Stewart project results, and all but one of the `Charles II' red group have
                        > > all three marker values. The odd man out is in a different subclade, so he
                        > > could well be misclassified.
                        > >
                        > > I think the 10, 11, 11 definition of GATAH4, 106S1, 565, is looking rock
                        > > solid for descendants of the Stewart High Stewards of Scotland.
                        > >
                        > > Belinda
                        > >
                        > >
                        > >
                        >
                      • Allan M Stewart
                        Dear Charles: Good to hear from you. Yes, I ve agreed to take the test, and now I ll be a bundle of nerves waiting to see if I ve passed! Cheers! Allan
                        Message 11 of 15 , Nov 8, 2010
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                          Dear Charles:
                          Good to hear from you.  Yes, I've agreed to take the test, and now I'll be a bundle of nerves waiting to see if I've passed!
                          Cheers!
                          Allan

                          On Mon, Nov 8, 2010 at 10:33 AM, replycs <replycs@...> wrote:
                           

                          Dear Cousin Allan!

                          I received an e-mail from FTDNA for the Campbeltown project, to tell me you had applied for the test... That's great!

                          Personally, I would be very surprised if you were anything other than R1b1b2a1b5, as your yDNA and mine are so very close, along with our cousin Edward in Ohio and my brother John and cousin Kenneth in England.

                          Best regards,

                          Charles.
                          # 57979


                          --- In Stewart-DNA@yahoogroups.com, Allan M Stewart <allan.m.stewart@...> wrote:
                          >
                          > Dear Belinda:
                          > I am kit 48747 and part of the red group - Charles II. Two quick questions,
                          > please:
                          > 1. I have been tested to 67 markers, but all I know is that I'm R1b1b2.
                          > What tests do I need to do to see if I'm in the group you show as
                          > R1b1b2a1b5?
                          > 2. What can I read to understand what all of these things are - i.e.
                          > GATAH4, 406S1, 565?
                          > Many thanks.
                          > Allan
                          >
                          > On Sun, Nov 7, 2010 at 5:37 PM, Belinda <belindadettmann@...>wrote:

                          >
                          > >
                          > >
                          > > A smart researcher in the Project L21Plus list has looked at the QHV9S
                          > > (royal and ancient Stewart) signature and recognised that it can be defined
                          > > by 3 particular DYS values, each of which is off-modal from the Western
                          > > Atlantic Modal for R1b. These are GATAH4=10, 406S1=11, 565=11. He found
                          > > these in 5 people who had tested L21+ (R1b1b2a1b5) and matched QHV9S
                          > > closely, and 3 of them are Stewarts in the red group. I've checked in the
                          > > Stewart project results, and all but one of the `Charles II' red group have
                          > > all three marker values. The odd man out is in a different subclade, so he
                          > > could well be misclassified.
                          > >
                          > > I think the 10, 11, 11 definition of GATAH4, 106S1, 565, is looking rock
                          > > solid for descendants of the Stewart High Stewards of Scotland.
                          > >
                          > > Belinda
                          > >
                          > >
                          > >
                          >


                        • Michael Stewart
                          Hi Katie, So far, of those related to me (Charles II group (the red group)), those with the 389-2 = 30 are Appin Stewarts and our most recent ancestors are all
                          Message 12 of 15 , Nov 8, 2010
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                            Hi Katie,

                            So far, of those related to me (Charles II group (the red group)), those with the 389-2 = 30 are Appin Stewarts and our most recent ancestors are all within the last 300 years. This might be useful by others to guide their research towards or away from Appin depending on the presence or absence of the "30." I am not an expert though. This is just a possibility. 

                            My Kit #: 128499

                            Cheers

                            On Nov 8, 2010, at 7:12 AM, songbird_1226 wrote:

                             

                            Michael,

                            In looking at (my husband) Wayne's Y-DNA DYS results, I find at Locus 12, DYS# 389-2, Allele 30. Is this what you're referring to, as far as being connected to the Appin Stewarts?

                            Thanks,
                            Katie Steuart

                            --- In Stewart-DNA@yahoogroups.com, Michael Stewart <mtstew@...> wrote:
                            >
                            > 389-2
                            > More to the genetic story of the ancient line, for those of us with 389-2 marker value of "30" so far appear to all hail from the Appin Stewarts with a most recent common ancestor just over 300 years ago.
                            >
                            > For my American cousins who have not yet been able to take their family trees across the pond, if you have this marker value, this could be a good clue as to where your peeps came from. The year your forefather emigrated, could tell us a bit more about his diaspora including why and how he came to be in the US. They could have been in good favor of King Charles, running from Cromwell, bolting from the Hanovarians, working for the House of Hanover, fleeing famine, or one of the many other scenarios that are particular to certain generations of our Scottish predecessors. First American destinations tell part of the story too, especially if all the neighbors had highland names also.
                            >
                            >
                            > Sláinte
                            >
                            > Michael T. Stewart, P.E.
                            > mtstew@...
                            >
                            > "Cuimhnich air na daoine o'n d'thaining thu" ~ Remember those from whom you are descended
                            >



                            Sláinte

                            Michael T. Stewart, P.E.

                            "Cuimhnich air na daoine o'n d'thaining thu" ~ Remember those from whom you are descended

                          • Eula Kuhns
                            My Wm. Paul Stewart s DNA has 389-2 , Alleles 30. Does rthis mean he is an Appin Stewart? His closset matches are from Scotland. His Kit #53482. His DYS# 393
                            Message 13 of 15 , Nov 9, 2010
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                              My Wm. Paul Stewart's DNA has 389-2 , Alleles 30.  Does rthis mean he is an Appin Stewart? 
                              His closset matches are from Scotland.  His Kit #53482. 
                              His DYS# 393    390   19   391 385a   385b   426  388  439  389-1   392   389-2
                              Alleles      13      24    14   10   10      14       12    12    13    13       13      30
                              Thank, & Regards,   Eula Kuhns for Wm Paul Stewart   ekkuhns@...
                                             
                              ----- Original Message -----
                              Sent: Monday, November 08, 2010 2:11 PM
                              Subject: Re: [Stewart-DNA] Re: DNA definition for descendants from the High Stewards of Scotland

                               

                              Hi Katie,


                              So far, of those related to me (Charles II group (the red group)), those with the 389-2 = 30 are Appin Stewarts and our most recent ancestors are all within the last 300 years. This might be useful by others to guide their research towards or away from Appin depending on the presence or absence of the "30." I am not an expert though. This is just a possibility. 

                              My Kit #: 128499

                              Cheers

                              On Nov 8, 2010, at 7:12 AM, songbird_1226 wrote:

                               

                              Michael,

                              In looking at (my husband) Wayne's Y-DNA DYS results, I find at Locus 12, DYS# 389-2, Allele 30. Is this what you're referring to, as far as being connected to the Appin Stewarts?

                              Thanks,
                              Katie Steuart

                              --- In Stewart-DNA@yahoogroups.com, Michael Stewart <mtstew@...> wrote:
                              >
                              > 389-2
                              > More to the genetic story of the ancient line, for those of us with 389-2 marker value of "30" so far appear to all hail from the Appin Stewarts with a most recent common ancestor just over 300 years ago.
                              >
                              > For my American cousins who have not yet been able to take their family trees across the pond, if you have this marker value, this could be a good clue as to where your peeps came from. The year your forefather emigrated, could tell us a bit more about his diaspora including why and how he came to be in the US. They could have been in good favor of King Charles, running from Cromwell, bolting from the Hanovarians, working for the House of Hanover, fleeing famine, or one of the many other scenarios that are particular to certain generations of our Scottish predecessors. First American destinations tell part of the story too, especially if all the neighbors had highland names also.
                              >
                              >
                              > Sláinte
                              >
                              > Michael T. Stewart, P.E.
                              > mtstew@...
                              >
                              > "Cuimhnich air na daoine o'n d'thaining thu" ~ Remember those from whom you are descended
                              >



                              Sláinte

                              Michael T. Stewart, P.E.

                              "Cuimhnich air na daoine o'n d'thaining thu" ~ Remember those from whom you are descended

                            • Michael Stewart
                              Hello Eula, First, I look at how many markers match overall. The group administrator has been good enough to arrange like Y-DNA signatures together to make
                              Message 14 of 15 , Nov 9, 2010
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                                Hello Eula,

                                First, I look at how many markers match overall. The group administrator has been good enough to arrange like Y-DNA signatures together to make this easier for us. In my case, I have been plugged in with what has been named the "Charles II" group due to having so many markers in common. BTW, the group name is just a name. I am not descended from Chuck, but those in this group who are have the common MALE ancestor with me and the Appin Stewarts in John Stewart of Bonkyl. (John of Bonkyl was killed 22 July 1298 at Falkirk fighting beside Wallace against Longshanks. John was Captain of the Archers and was overrun by Edward's Calvary, so I have read.) ...but, I digress... 
                                 
                                Next, I look at individual markers to see which mutations have occurred with these my closest cousins and how these might indicate specific branches of the Stewart Tree and where we might find our most recent common ancestor.

                                With that, the 389-2 = 30 within the highly matching Charles II group are proven Appin Stewarts.

                                In your William Paul Stewart, the 30 would not indicate Appin origins using my logic as too few overall markers are matching. Only 9 of 12 match. The 30 in Wm Paul's case is mere coincidence that it matches Appin.

                                My recommendation is to find those who match 11 of 12 at least to try to determine origins. However, you are casting a wide net. The best way to narrow your search is to test for more markers. The closer you can get to 67 the better. 

                                Slainte,
                                Mike




                                On Nov 9, 2010, at 9:58 AM, Eula Kuhns wrote:

                                53482


                                Sláinte

                                Michael T. Stewart, P.E.

                                "Cuimhnich air na daoine o'n d'thaining thu" ~ Remember those from whom you are descended

                              • Eula Kuhns
                                Thank you for your insite. This is all so difficult to try to come to any conclusions, as to where my ancestors were from originally. All of our ancestors
                                Message 15 of 15 , Nov 9, 2010
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                                  Thank you for your insite.  This is all so difficult to try to come to any conclusions, as to where my ancestors were from originally.  All of our ancestors were in Ireland and the British Isles.  Regards, Eula/for Wm Paul Stewart ekkuhns@...
                                  ----- Original Message -----
                                  Sent: Tuesday, November 09, 2010 2:58 PM
                                  Subject: [Stewart-DNA] finding Stewart cousins using mutations as clues

                                   

                                  Hello Eula,


                                  First, I look at how many markers match overall. The group administrator has been good enough to arrange like Y-DNA signatures together to make this easier for us. In my case, I have been plugged in with what has been named the "Charles II" group due to having so many markers in common. BTW, the group name is just a name. I am not descended from Chuck, but those in this group who are have the common MALE ancestor with me and the Appin Stewarts in John Stewart of Bonkyl. (John of Bonkyl was killed 22 July 1298 at Falkirk fighting beside Wallace against Longshanks. John was Captain of the Archers and was overrun by Edward's Calvary, so I have read.) ...but, I digress... 
                                   
                                  Next, I look at individual markers to see which mutations have occurred with these my closest cousins and how these might indicate specific branches of the Stewart Tree and where we might find our most recent common ancestor.

                                  With that, the 389-2 = 30 within the highly matching Charles II group are proven Appin Stewarts.

                                  In your William Paul Stewart, the 30 would not indicate Appin origins using my logic as too few overall markers are matching. Only 9 of 12 match. The 30 in Wm Paul's case is mere coincidence that it matches Appin.

                                  My recommendation is to find those who match 11 of 12 at least to try to determine origins. However, you are casting a wide net. The best way to narrow your search is to test for more markers. The closer you can get to 67 the better. 

                                  Slainte,
                                  Mike




                                  On Nov 9, 2010, at 9:58 AM, Eula Kuhns wrote:

                                  53482


                                  Sláinte

                                  Michael T. Stewart, P.E.

                                  "Cuimhnich air na daoine o'n d'thaining thu" ~ Remember those from whom you are descended

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