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Re: The City Without A Church.....

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  • Bob M.
    I dream d in a dream I saw a city invincible to the attack of the rest of the earth. I dreamed that was the new city of Friends, Nothing was greater there than
    Message 1 of 12 , Jan 31, 2007
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      I dream'd in a dream I saw a city invincible
      to the attack of the rest of the earth.

      I dreamed that was the new city of Friends,
      Nothing was greater there than the quality
      of robust Love, it lead the rest,

      It was seen every hour in the actions of the
      men of that city,

      And in all their looks and words.

      (Walt Whitman)

      Earth needs a place where men can live away
      from all national rivalries, social conventions,
      self-contradictory moralities and contending
      religions; a place where human beings, freed from
      all slavery of the past, can devote themselves
      wholly to the discovery and practice of the
      Divine Consciousness that is seeking to manifest
      itself.

      (The Mother - of Auroville)

      Bob M.
      _______________________________

      --- In Soar_Like_An_Eagle_2@yahoogroups.com, "Bob M."
      <new_trail_blazer@...> wrote:
      >
      > I, John,
      >
      > Saw the Holy City,
      >
      > New Jerusalem,
      >
      > Coming down from God out of Heaven.
      >
      > * * *
      >
      > And I saw no Temple therein.
      >
      > * * *
      >
      > And His servants shall serve Him;
      >
      > And they shall see His Face;
      >
      > And His Name shall be written on their foreheads.
      >
      > - - - - - - - -
      >
      > http://henrydrummond.wwwhubs.com/city.htm
      >
      > Bob M.
      >
    • Bob M.
      Religion says that single individuals cannot be trusted, whether they are meditating or not. They need communities, masters, monasteries where they can live
      Message 2 of 12 , Feb 1, 2007
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        "Religion says that single individuals cannot
        be trusted, whether they are meditating or not.
        They need communities, masters, monasteries
        where they can live together. Those who are on
        a higher level of consciousness can watch over
        others and help them. It became essential that
        religions should not be left in the hands of
        individuals; they should be organized and should
        be in the hands of those who have arrived at a
        high point of meditation." (Osho)

        Bob M.
      • Bob M.
        That which conforms can never flower in goodness. There must be freedom, and freedom comes only when you understand the whole problem of envy, greed,
        Message 3 of 12 , Feb 2, 2007
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          "That which conforms can never flower in
          goodness. There must be freedom, and freedom
          comes only when you understand the whole
          problem of envy, greed, ambition, and the
          desire for power. It is freedom from those
          things that allows the extraordinary thing
          called character to flower. Such a man has
          compassion, he knows what it is to love - not
          the man who merely repeats a lot of words
          about morality. So the flowering of goodness
          does not lie within society, because society
          in itself is always corrupt. Only the man who
          understands the whole structure and process
          of society, and is freeing himself from it, has
          character, and he alone can flower in goodness."
          (J. Krishnamurti)

          Bob M.
        • Karen
          This is wonderful Bob and perfect timing. Thanks for posting it. Hope all is well. Karen Bob M. wrote: That which conforms can
          Message 4 of 12 , Feb 2, 2007
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            This is wonderful Bob and perfect timing. Thanks for posting it.
            Hope all is well.
            Karen

            "Bob M." <new_trail_blazer@...> wrote:
            "That which conforms can never flower in
            goodness. There must be freedom, and freedom
            comes only when you understand the whole
            problem of envy, greed, ambition, and the
            desire for power. It is freedom from those
            things that allows the extraordinary thing
            called character to flower. Such a man has
            compassion, he knows what it is to love - not
            the man who merely repeats a lot of words
            about morality. So the flowering of goodness
            does not lie within society, because society
            in itself is always corrupt. Only the man who
            understands the whole structure and process
            of society, and is freeing himself from it, has
            character, and he alone can flower in goodness."
            (J. Krishnamurti)

            Bob M.






            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • Bob M.
            Good morning Karen, I m hangin in, but sometimes it seems like it s only by a thread, Karen. Death or returning to the Source often seems a better option then
            Message 5 of 12 , Feb 3, 2007
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              Good morning Karen,

              I'm hangin' in, but sometimes it seems like it's
              only by a thread, Karen. Death or returning to the
              Source often seems a better option then having to
              be fully awake amongst the wall-to-wall living dead.
              So once again thank God for little children, some
              young people, animals, and music. As surely there's
              very, very little love and joyful free-spiritedness
              anywhere else in these last dark days. The long-
              conditioned, corrupt, and fallen 'me, me, me' attitude
              and lifestyle and it's karmic consequences of human
              lifelessness and insanity prevails everywhere.

              And indeed old K-boy was pretty sharp and
              insightful at times Karen, but without having any
              first-hand experience in living in the real world,
              he was, and by his own admission, a flop so far
              as being of any real value in the awakening of
              others. Likewise because of his spoiled upbringing,
              concealed ways of error, and dependant and quite
              frankly parasitical lifestyle, he really couldn't very
              well point the finger at others or pass judgment
              upon the rest of the quick, the slick, and the dead.
              Hence the fall in his latter years into essentially
              an intellectual, theoretical, anti-authoritarian,
              anti-religious based 'teaching', which appealed
              largely to and bolstered and justified the many
              shenanigans and similar K-type short-comings
              of largely the many irremediably dys-functional and
              various other unfortunate souls who were lacking
              in having had a reasonably sound, wholesome,
              and loving upbringing. As he himself definitely
              did have in his critical early formative years, and
              which is where his deep, though not totally
              balanced, organismal sensitivity was developed,
              and which he rightly insisted was absolutely
              necessary in order for radical-transformation to
              take place, as was in fact the case with himself.
              Yet innate sensitivity and one or two 'turning point'
              experiences along with a good line of psycho-
              babbling gab alone surely don't make for a first
              class 'World Teacher', nohow, save for perhaps on
              paper (green) alone. But the man with the lantern,
              or is it the trumpet(?), must surely come one day.

              So meanwhile 'let the dead bury their dead' and
              come fly with me, Karen.

              Bob M.

              P. S. Following is another fairly heads-up observation
              of the poor fragile and spineless 'self-sufficiency'
              teaching leech:

              'A Mind Rich With Innocence'

              "Truth, the real God-the real God, not the God that
              man has made - does not want a mind that has been
              destroyed, petty, shallow, narrow, limited. It needs a
              healthy mind to appreciate it; it needs a rich mind -rich,
              not with knowledge but with innocence-a mind upon
              which there has never been a scratch of experience, a
              mind that is free from time. The gods that you have
              invented for your own comforts accept torture; they
              accept a mind that is being made dull. But the real
              thing does not want it; it wants a total, complete human
              being whose heart is full, rich, clear, capable of intense
              feeling, capable of seeing the beauty of a tree, the smile
              of a child, and the agony of a woman who has never had
              a full meal. You HAVE to HAVE THIS *extraordinary
              feeling, this sensitivity to everything* - to the animal, to
              the cat that walks across the wall, to the squalor, the dirt,
              the filth of human beings in poverty, in despair. You
              HAVE to be *sensitive - which is to feel intensely*, not
              in any particular direction, which is not an emotion which
              comes and goes, but which is to be sensitive with your
              nerves, with your eyes, with your body, with your ears,
              with your voice. You HAVE to be *sensitive completely
              all the time*. Unless you are so completely sensitive,
              there is no intelligence. INTELLIGENCE (God/Love?)
              COMES WITH SENSITIVITY AND OBSERVATION."
              (J. Krishnamurti - 'Book of Life' - 5/1)
              ______________________________________

              --- In Soar_Like_An_Eagle_2@yahoogroups.com, Karen
              <miraclesofmind@...> wrote:
              >
              > This is wonderful Bob and perfect timing. Thanks for posting it.
              > Hope all is well.
              > Karen
              >
              > "Bob M." <new_trail_blazer@...> wrote:
              > "That which conforms can never flower in
              > goodness. There must be freedom, and freedom
              > comes only when you understand the whole
              > problem of envy, greed, ambition, and the
              > desire for power. It is freedom from those
              > things that allows the extraordinary thing
              > called character to flower. Such a man has
              > compassion, he knows what it is to love - not
              > the man who merely repeats a lot of words
              > about morality. So the flowering of goodness
              > does not lie within society, because society
              > in itself is always corrupt. Only the man who
              > understands the whole structure and process
              > of society, and is freeing himself from it, has
              > character, and he alone can flower in goodness."
              > (J. Krishnamurti)
              >
              > Bob M.
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >
            • Bob M.
              As the biographer of Annie Besant s multi-faceted life, Arthur Nethercot had to take into account Krishnamurti s life and the way it was related to Besant. One
              Message 6 of 12 , Feb 4, 2007
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                As the biographer of Annie Besant's
                multi-faceted life, Arthur Nethercot
                had to take into account Krishnamurti's
                life and the way it was related to Besant.
                One point specifically puzzled Nethercot
                about Krishnamurti and that was his loss
                of memory of everything that had happened
                before 1929. Apparently this loss did not
                happen in that year itself for Nethercot
                had interviewed people who stated that even
                in 1932 Krishnamurti was able to remember
                "these earlier events perfectly." As not
                to impugn Krishnamurti's integrity Nethercot
                proposed the following explanation: Here
                then is an extraordinary case of a man who,
                after a long and bizarre struggle with life,
                has finally got himself and his mind under
                almost complete control--has perhaps
                hypnotized himself so that he can relegate
                to oblivion most of the things he does not
                want to remember, because they recall the
                unhappy days when he was becoming an
                individual and was escaping from the
                domination of others whom he had cause to
                love and admire...I should hate to think of
                him as a charlatan; I prefer to think of him
                as a sort of schizophrenic, or at least a man
                of a now permanently divided dual personality.

                Nethercot seems to suggest that Krishnamurti
                was mentally ill because he suppressed his
                past.

                Krishnamurti's thoughts about his memory are
                contained in a letter from Mary Lutyens to
                Nethercot, when the latter had requested her
                to raise the question of Krishnamurti's memory
                again. She wrote that "there is no question
                of amnesia; he is just not interested in the
                past and cannot bring his mind to it and
                cannot see its importance....He wouldn't be
                able to tell you what happened a fortnight ago
                ....He is very fully alive in the present and
                excited about what goes on inside himself
                from day to day. What that is it is
                impossible to say, for he lives in a world
                and state of consciousness so different from
                the normal that one can scarcely glimpse it..."

                http://www.alpheus.org/html/articles/thopv/kandwt.html

                Bob M.
                ___________________________________________

                --- In Soar_Like_An_Eagle_2@yahoogroups.com, "Bob M."
                <new_trail_blazer@...> wrote:
                >
                > Good morning Karen,
                >
                > I'm hangin' in, but sometimes it seems like it's
                > only by a thread, Karen. Death or returning to the
                > Source often seems a better option then having to
                > be fully awake amongst the wall-to-wall living dead.
                > So once again thank God for little children, some
                > young people, animals, and music. As surely there's
                > very, very little love and joyful free-spiritedness
                > anywhere else in these last dark days. The long-
                > conditioned, corrupt, and fallen 'me, me, me' attitude
                > and lifestyle and it's karmic consequences of human
                > lifelessness and insanity prevails everywhere.
                >
                > And indeed old K-boy was pretty sharp and
                > insightful at times Karen, but without having any
                > first-hand experience in living in the real world,
                > he was, and by his own admission, a flop so far
                > as being of any real value in the awakening of
                > others. Likewise because of his spoiled upbringing,
                > concealed ways of error, and dependant and quite
                > frankly parasitical lifestyle, he really couldn't very
                > well point the finger at others or pass judgment
                > upon the rest of the quick, the slick, and the dead.
                > Hence the fall in his latter years into essentially
                > an intellectual, theoretical, anti-authoritarian,
                > anti-religious based 'teaching', which appealed
                > largely to and bolstered and justified the many
                > shenanigans and similar K-type short-comings
                > of largely the many irremediably dys-functional and
                > various other unfortunate souls who were lacking
                > in having had a reasonably sound, wholesome,
                > and loving upbringing. As he himself definitely
                > did have in his critical early formative years, and
                > which is where his deep, though not totally
                > balanced, organismal sensitivity was developed,
                > and which he rightly insisted was absolutely
                > necessary in order for radical-transformation to
                > take place, as was in fact the case with himself.
                > Yet innate sensitivity and one or two 'turning point'
                > experiences along with a good line of psycho-
                > babbling gab alone surely don't make for a first
                > class 'World Teacher', nohow, save for perhaps on
                > paper (green) alone. But the man with the lantern,
                > or is it the trumpet(?), must surely come one day.
                >
                > So meanwhile 'let the dead bury their dead' and
                > come fly with me, Karen.
                >
                > Bob M.
                >
                > P. S. Following is another fairly heads-up observation
                > of the poor fragile and spineless 'self-sufficiency'
                > teaching leech:
                >
                > 'A Mind Rich With Innocence'
                >
                > "Truth, the real God-the real God, not the God that
                > man has made - does not want a mind that has been
                > destroyed, petty, shallow, narrow, limited. It needs a
                > healthy mind to appreciate it; it needs a rich mind -rich,
                > not with knowledge but with innocence-a mind upon
                > which there has never been a scratch of experience, a
                > mind that is free from time. The gods that you have
                > invented for your own comforts accept torture; they
                > accept a mind that is being made dull. But the real
                > thing does not want it; it wants a total, complete human
                > being whose heart is full, rich, clear, capable of intense
                > feeling, capable of seeing the beauty of a tree, the smile
                > of a child, and the agony of a woman who has never had
                > a full meal. You HAVE to HAVE THIS *extraordinary
                > feeling, this sensitivity to everything* - to the animal, to
                > the cat that walks across the wall, to the squalor, the dirt,
                > the filth of human beings in poverty, in despair. You
                > HAVE to be *sensitive - which is to feel intensely*, not
                > in any particular direction, which is not an emotion which
                > comes and goes, but which is to be sensitive with your
                > nerves, with your eyes, with your body, with your ears,
                > with your voice. You HAVE to be *sensitive completely
                > all the time*. Unless you are so completely sensitive,
                > there is no intelligence. INTELLIGENCE (God/Love?)
                > COMES WITH SENSITIVITY AND OBSERVATION."
                > (J. Krishnamurti - 'Book of Life' - 5/1)
                > ______________________________________
                >
                > --- In Soar_Like_An_Eagle_2@yahoogroups.com, Karen
                > <miraclesofmind@> wrote:
                > >
                > > This is wonderful Bob and perfect timing. Thanks for posting it.
                > > Hope all is well.
                > > Karen
                > >
                > > "Bob M." <new_trail_blazer@> wrote:
                > > "That which conforms can never flower in
                > > goodness. There must be freedom, and freedom
                > > comes only when you understand the whole
                > > problem of envy, greed, ambition, and the
                > > desire for power. It is freedom from those
                > > things that allows the extraordinary thing
                > > called character to flower. Such a man has
                > > compassion, he knows what it is to love - not
                > > the man who merely repeats a lot of words
                > > about morality. So the flowering of goodness
                > > does not lie within society, because society
                > > in itself is always corrupt. Only the man who
                > > understands the whole structure and process
                > > of society, and is freeing himself from it, has
                > > character, and he alone can flower in goodness."
                > > (J. Krishnamurti)
                > >
                > > Bob M.
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                > >
                >
              • Bob M.
                He (Krishnamurti) is just not interested in the past and cannot bring his mind to it and cannot see its importance....He is very fully alive in the present
                Message 7 of 12 , Feb 5, 2007
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                  "He (Krishnamurti) is just not interested in the
                  past and cannot bring his mind to it and cannot
                  see its importance....He is very fully alive in
                  the present and excited about what goes on inside
                  himself from day to day. What that is it is
                  impossible to say, for he lives in a world and
                  state of consciousness so different from the normal
                  that one can scarcely glimpse it..." (M. L.)

                  Eckhart Tolle, like Krishnamurti, also feels that
                  the past (one's own personal history) is of no
                  value in the awakening/enlightening of others.
                  And likewise I find him also considerably worldly
                  experience lacking and therefore quite out of
                  touch with the real world too. Nor has he explored
                  the abyss thoroughly and transcended all the
                  'Truths' either, and especially those regarding
                  the integrity and soundness of his own sanity and
                  being. Making him but another one of the long line
                  of impotent false prophets who appeal to the minds,
                  'self'-ego, and pocketbooks of many of the fallen
                  herd, whose hearts and human spirits have unfortunately
                  been developed irremediably insensitive and cold.
                  Hopefully though he won't deceive any of the 'elect',
                  or those who are developmentally fully wholesome,
                  soundly spirited, and sane, though just not yet in
                  full discovery, realization, and rounded implementation
                  of the fact.

                  Bob M.
                  ________________________________________

                  --- In Soar_Like_An_Eagle_2@yahoogroups.com, "Bob M."
                  <new_trail_blazer@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > As the biographer of Annie Besant's
                  > multi-faceted life, Arthur Nethercot
                  > had to take into account Krishnamurti's
                  > life and the way it was related to Besant.
                  > One point specifically puzzled Nethercot
                  > about Krishnamurti and that was his loss
                  > of memory of everything that had happened
                  > before 1929. Apparently this loss did not
                  > happen in that year itself for Nethercot
                  > had interviewed people who stated that even
                  > in 1932 Krishnamurti was able to remember
                  > "these earlier events perfectly." As not
                  > to impugn Krishnamurti's integrity Nethercot
                  > proposed the following explanation: Here
                  > then is an extraordinary case of a man who,
                  > after a long and bizarre struggle with life,
                  > has finally got himself and his mind under
                  > almost complete control--has perhaps
                  > hypnotized himself so that he can relegate
                  > to oblivion most of the things he does not
                  > want to remember, because they recall the
                  > unhappy days when he was becoming an
                  > individual and was escaping from the
                  > domination of others whom he had cause to
                  > love and admire...I should hate to think of
                  > him as a charlatan; I prefer to think of him
                  > as a sort of schizophrenic, or at least a man
                  > of a now permanently divided dual personality.
                  >
                  > Nethercot seems to suggest that Krishnamurti
                  > was mentally ill because he suppressed his
                  > past.
                  >
                  > Krishnamurti's thoughts about his memory are
                  > contained in a letter from Mary Lutyens to
                  > Nethercot, when the latter had requested her
                  > to raise the question of Krishnamurti's memory
                  > again. She wrote that "there is no question
                  > of amnesia; he is just not interested in the
                  > past and cannot bring his mind to it and
                  > cannot see its importance....He wouldn't be
                  > able to tell you what happened a fortnight ago
                  > ....He is very fully alive in the present and
                  > excited about what goes on inside himself
                  > from day to day. What that is it is
                  > impossible to say, for he lives in a world
                  > and state of consciousness so different from
                  > the normal that one can scarcely glimpse it..."
                  >
                  > http://www.alpheus.org/html/articles/thopv/kandwt.html
                  >
                  > Bob M.
                  > ___________________________________________
                • Bob M.
                  Jerusalem And did those feet in ancient time Walk upon England s mountains green? And was the holy Lamb of God On England s pleasant pastures seen? And did the
                  Message 8 of 12 , May 15, 2007
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                    Jerusalem

                    And did those feet in ancient time
                    Walk upon England's mountains green?
                    And was the holy Lamb of God
                    On England's pleasant pastures seen?

                    And did the Countenance Divine
                    Shine forth upon our clouded hills?
                    And was Jerusalem builded here
                    Among these dark Satanic mills?

                    Bring me my bow of burning gold:
                    Bring me my arrows of desire:
                    Bring me my spear: O clouds unfold!
                    Bring me my chariot of fire.

                    I will not cease from mental fight,
                    Nor shall my sword sleep in my hand
                    Till we have built Jerusalem
                    In England's green and pleasant land.

                    William Blake

                    Bob M.
                  • Bob M.
                    It would be wise if after a certain age, perhaps let us say forty or forty-five, or younger still, you retired from the world, before you are too old. What
                    Message 9 of 12 , May 21, 2007
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                      "It would be wise if after a certain age, perhaps let
                      us say forty or forty-five, or younger still, you retired
                      from the world, before you are too old. What would happen
                      if you did retire not merely to enjoy the fruit of sensate
                      gatherings but retired in order to find yourself, in order
                      to think and feel profoundly, to meditate, to discover
                      reality? Perhaps you may save mankind from the sensate,
                      worldly path it is following, with all its brutality,
                      deception and sorrow. Thus there may be a group of people,
                      being disassociated from worldliness, from its
                      identifications and demands, able to guide it, to teach it.
                      Being free from worldliness they will have no authority,
                      no importance and so will not be drawn into its stupidities
                      and calamities. For a man (or woman) who is not free from
                      authority, from position, is not able to guide, to teach
                      another. A man (or woman) who is in authority is identified
                      with his (or her) position, with his (or her) importance,
                      with his (or her) missionary work and so is in bondage.
                      To understand the freedom of truth there must be freedom
                      to experience. If such a group came into being then they
                      could produce a new world, a new culture."
                      (J. Krishnamurti Ojai 4th Public Talk 4th June, 1944)

                      Bob M.
                    • Bob M.
                      Hello Peter, Your feedback is interesting Peter, but I just don t think you have me rightfully pegged. Perhaps it is not possible to do so via such a medium.
                      Message 10 of 12 , May 22, 2007
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                        Hello Peter,

                        Your 'feedback' is interesting Peter, but I just don't
                        think you have me rightfully pegged. Perhaps it is not
                        possible to do so via such a medium. Perhaps you're
                        incapable of understanding me under any circumstances.
                        It (pure all-knowing being [in action]) must all begin
                        with self-understanding, yet without an innate core
                        soul-sensitivity or a deeply implanted God or Love seed,
                        this will not be achieved in the whole of a lifetime by
                        anyone. If I do have any troubles it would be that there
                        presently exists so very, very few souls on the planet
                        with whom Love and Joy can truly be shared with, save for
                        perhaps fleetingly and/or fragmentarily. Thanks though
                        for your interest and comments Peter and do enjoy these
                        last days of global insanity to the max.

                        Bob M.
                        __________________________________________________

                        --- In Soar_Like_An_Eagle_2@yahoogroups.com, "proustienne2001"
                        <proustienne2001@...> wrote:
                        >
                        > My dear Bob, I think you are looking to the world for something
                        the
                        > world will never give you. You will have to search for love within
                        > your own dear heart. I can see your hurt and pain. As you know all
                        > too well, this world is full of bullshit. I think your great love
                        can
                        > overcome this. Your life has been full of sadness and loss and
                        > loneliness. I understand. You have a great soul and spirit. I will
                        > write again soon.
                        > Peter
                      • Bob M.
                        Hi once again Peter, Same day - different library. I might add here that I ve stopped using the word bullshit in preferrence of the far move loving,
                        Message 11 of 12 , May 22, 2007
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                          Hi once again Peter,

                          Same day - different library.

                          I might add here that I've stopped using the word
                          'bullshit' in preferrence of the far move loving,
                          understanding, and compassionate term 'monkey-business'.
                          Which is one, along with 'monkey-shines', that my
                          dear old dad often used in the days of my youth to
                          describe the then and of course this continuing
                          wall-to-wall circus called humanity. I think here of
                          Nietzsche's view that man is a rope over the abyss
                          stuck between the ape and the superman. Amen to that one!

                          Again enjoy your days Peter,

                          Bob M.
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