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Re: [SoCalFire] how does automatic aid work?

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  • Don Root
    ... (cue rimshot)
    Message 1 of 9 , Sep 3, 2001
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      Harry Marnell wrote:
      >
      > pretty well

      (cue rimshot)
    • Tim Tribble
      Automatic Aid: This is where 2 entities have previously agreed to aid eachother. Usually in a Mutual Threat Zone (MTZ)An example of this would be here in
      Message 2 of 9 , Sep 3, 2001
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        Automatic Aid: This is where 2 entities have
        previously agreed to aid eachother. Usually in a
        Mutual Threat Zone (MTZ)An example of this would be
        here in Sacramento. The City of West Sacramento in
        Yolo County has an engine on the first alarm
        assignment for areas of downtown Sacramento. The same
        goes the other way. Sacramento has engines that are
        automatically dispatched from the CAD system. They
        call the other center on the phone (See Don Root's
        comments)

        Mutual Aid is a looser agreement where an agency is
        asked to send a resource, but they can say no and
        usually need to have the approval of the Duty Chief of
        the Department. An example of this was during the
        fires in Modoc County they needed CFR at Alturas
        Airport as a temp Tanker Base. Through the Mutual Aid
        System a request was made for a CFR or type 1 engine
        with foam and CFR trained personnel. OES is the
        coordinating point for the Mutual Aid System in CA. We
        called Sacramento Metro Fire Protection District (SAC)
        and asked them if they would be willing to staff an
        OES Engine with 4 of their CFR personnel for this
        incident. They are under no obligation to say yes.
        However, SAC is a major player in the M/A System and
        were on the road in an hour or so.

        Hope this helps, if you have any other questions
        please feel free to e-mail me.

        Tim Tribble
        Dispatcher/Clerk
        OES Fire/Rescue Branch
        --- Mark Panitz <mpanitz@...> wrote:
        > I have listen to the LACOFD frequency, occasionally
        > they would stay
        > automatic aid with (what ever city) now since that
        > is coming out on a
        > LACOFD frequence
        > how does the other agency find out? does the LACOFD
        > dispatcher call the
        > other dispatcher? or is the county dispatcher also
        > dispatching the other
        > agency?
        >
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        =====
        Donald "Tim" Tribble
        KD6MDV
        Sacramento, CA

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      • Chris Halladay
        Tim: Would this be another good example? An auto accident at the midpoint on the Golden Gate Bridge in San Francisco. Both SFFD and Marin FD is dispatched,
        Message 3 of 9 , Sep 3, 2001
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          Tim:

          Would this be another good example? An auto accident at the midpoint on the Golden Gate Bridge in San Francisco. Both SFFD and Marin FD is dispatched, right??

          Chris Halladay
          Fresno, CA
          ----- Original Message -----
          From: Tim Tribble
          To: SoCalFire@yahoogroups.com
          Sent: Monday, September 03, 2001 4:03 PM
          Subject: Re: [SoCalFire] how does automatic aid work?


          Automatic Aid: This is where 2 entities have
          previously agreed to aid eachother. Usually in a
          Mutual Threat Zone (MTZ)An example of this would be
          here in Sacramento. The City of West Sacramento in
          Yolo County has an engine on the first alarm
          assignment for areas of downtown Sacramento. The same
          goes the other way. Sacramento has engines that are
          automatically dispatched from the CAD system. They
          call the other center on the phone (See Don Root's
          comments)

          Mutual Aid is a looser agreement where an agency is
          asked to send a resource, but they can say no and
          usually need to have the approval of the Duty Chief of
          the Department. An example of this was during the
          fires in Modoc County they needed CFR at Alturas
          Airport as a temp Tanker Base. Through the Mutual Aid
          System a request was made for a CFR or type 1 engine
          with foam and CFR trained personnel. OES is the
          coordinating point for the Mutual Aid System in CA. We
          called Sacramento Metro Fire Protection District (SAC)
          and asked them if they would be willing to staff an
          OES Engine with 4 of their CFR personnel for this
          incident. They are under no obligation to say yes.
          However, SAC is a major player in the M/A System and
          were on the road in an hour or so.

          Hope this helps, if you have any other questions
          please feel free to e-mail me.

          Tim Tribble
          Dispatcher/Clerk
          OES Fire/Rescue Branch
          --- Mark Panitz <mpanitz@...> wrote:
          > I have listen to the LACOFD frequency, occasionally
          > they would stay
          > automatic aid with (what ever city) now since that
          > is coming out on a
          > LACOFD frequence
          > how does the other agency find out? does the LACOFD
          > dispatcher call the
          > other dispatcher? or is the county dispatcher also
          > dispatching the other
          > agency?
          >
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          > SoCalFire-unsubscribe@egroups.com
          > To contact the list owner, send an e-mail to
          > SoCalFire-Owner@egroups.com
          >
          >
          >
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          > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
          >
          >


          =====
          Donald "Tim" Tribble
          KD6MDV
          Sacramento, CA

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          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Temp Berdan
          I can t tell you if there is a formal pact throughout all of CA, but when the Painted Cave fire burned 600+ homes in Santa Barbara, there were Mutual Aid
          Message 4 of 9 , Sep 5, 2001
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            I can't tell you if there is a formal pact throughout all of CA, but
            when the Painted Cave fire burned 600+ homes in Santa Barbara, there
            were "Mutual Aid" engines from all over the state on scene, mostly for
            structure protection.

            As a former long time SBA County resident, I can sure tell you that
            _all_ SBA area fire depts. respond on Mutual Aid frequently, throughout
            SoCal and North to SLO and Monterey Counties, with 5 engine strike
            teams.
            If it is a brush/forest fire, 20 person crews often go, although SBA
            County does _not_ keep a lot of crews staffed during fire season. Must
            be a budget problem there.
            T
            /

            -----Original Message-----
            From: Tim Tribble [mailto:tcomm_specialist@...]
            Sent: Monday, September 03, 2001 4:03 PM
            To: SoCalFire@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: Re: [SoCalFire] how does automatic aid work?


            Automatic Aid: This is where 2 entities have
            previously agreed to aid eachother. Usually in a
            Mutual Threat Zone (MTZ)An example of this would be
            here in Sacramento. The City of West Sacramento in
            Yolo County has an engine on the first alarm
            assignment for areas of downtown Sacramento. The same
            goes the other way. Sacramento has engines that are automatically
            dispatched from the CAD system. They call the other center on the phone
            (See Don Root's
            comments)

            Mutual Aid is a looser agreement where an agency is
            asked to send a resource, but they can say no and
            usually need to have the approval of the Duty Chief of
            the Department. An example of this was during the
            fires in Modoc County they needed CFR at Alturas
            Airport as a temp Tanker Base. Through the Mutual Aid
            System a request was made for a CFR or type 1 engine
            with foam and CFR trained personnel. OES is the
            coordinating point for the Mutual Aid System in CA. We
            called Sacramento Metro Fire Protection District (SAC)
            and asked them if they would be willing to staff an
            OES Engine with 4 of their CFR personnel for this
            incident. They are under no obligation to say yes.
            However, SAC is a major player in the M/A System and
            were on the road in an hour or so.

            Hope this helps, if you have any other questions
            please feel free to e-mail me.

            Tim Tribble
            Dispatcher/Clerk
            OES Fire/Rescue Branch
            --- Mark Panitz <mpanitz@...> wrote:
            > I have listen to the LACOFD frequency, occasionally
            > they would stay
            > automatic aid with (what ever city) now since that
            > is coming out on a
            > LACOFD frequence
            > how does the other agency find out? does the LACOFD dispatcher call
            > the other dispatcher? or is the county dispatcher also
            > dispatching the other
            > agency?
            >
            > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
            >
            > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
            > SoCalFire-unsubscribe@egroups.com To contact the list owner, send an
            > e-mail to SoCalFire-Owner@egroups.com
            >
            >
            >
            > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
            > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
            >
            >


            =====
            Donald "Tim" Tribble
            KD6MDV
            Sacramento, CA

            __________________________________________________
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          • Los Angeles Fire Department
            ... other ... Yes (and for those just joining this discussion) that is the scenario for a majority of agencies here in The Golden State. ... two ... together),
            Message 5 of 9 , Sep 8, 2001
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              --- In SoCalFire, Don Root mentioned...

              > The dispatchers either have a "ring down" telephone line, call the
              other
              > center, have an audio intercom between the two locations

              Yes (and for those just joining this discussion) that is the scenario
              for a majority of agencies here in The Golden State.

              > (I believe
              > L.A. City and L.A. County still have their T-1 intercom between the
              two
              > centers, which also allows them to patch their radios systems
              together),

              You are correct. The T-1 tie-line has been in place for many years
              and does allow for the frequencies to be patched. While that voice
              and data capable pipeline can be used as an intercom between LAFD and
              LACoFD, it has proven far easier to use the one-button activated
              primary ringdown line (a supervised circuit that was used 4,155 times
              for a multitude of purposes last year) or dedicated seven-digit speed
              dial to non-published numbers (on rotary) to contact the other
              Department. I regretfully don't have the breakdown for the total
              usage of the seven-digit speed dial between LAFD-LACoFD at hand, but
              it is historically less than the ring-down line and vastly eclipses
              the rare use of the T1 line for voice contact.

              In the LAFD/LACoFD scenario that prompted this thread, an example...

              For a City address that borders the County. The 9-1-1 call will be
              routed to and processed by a Firefighter/Dispatcher working at the
              LAFD's Control Facility (OCD). Upon receipt of the call, a flashing
              text prompt will appear at the bottom of the Dispatcher's screen
              indicating that this is a pre-determined Automatic Aid district (IAZ
              or Initial Action Zone) as the result of a formal written agreement
              between the agencies.

              That same LAFD CAD screen shows the anticipated IAZ assignment (i.e.
              LACoFD Engine 1, Truck 3, Squad 5) and the exact driving distance
              from their respective Quarters to the address in the City
              jurisdiction. The LAFD Dispatcher who took the call (or a colleague
              at their side) presses the button for the ring-down line and is
              connected with their LACoFD counterpart. A succinct request is then
              made by the LAFD Dispatcher (i.e. "Automatic Aid request to a
              reported Structure Fire at 123 South Main Street"). The LACoFD
              Dispatcher enters the address into their CAD. After getting an almost
              instantaneous confirmation that LACoFD's CAD recognizes the address
              as being within the IAZ, the LACoFD reply is something as simple
              as: "You will be getting Engine 20". The LAFD Dispatcher affirms the
              ID of the responding LACoFD Company(s) and advises the LACoFD
              Dispatcher of the LAFD Tac Channel.

              If perchance the LACoFD assignment is different than anticipated (i.e
              Engine 7 rather than the expected Engine 9), the LAFD Dispatcher will
              seek clarification for the reason and any ETA difference.

              This procedure and the LAFD CAD prompts have been in place for more
              than a quarter of a century. Groundwork for peer-to-peer CAD
              communications has been underway for nearly as long, but not a fully
              funded endeavor by either agency. The LAFD will be an active
              participant in APCO's eagerly anticipated Project 36 that will help
              standardize guidelines for such peer-to-peer CAD communications.

              > or use the OES Fire radio network to pass the information.

              The Fire radio network and OASIS are but a few of the wonderful
              support mechanisms provided by OES to the LAFD and other FD's in our
              region. We are profoundly grateful for such support.

              Stay Safe!

              Brian
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