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Slovak coal miners

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  • charles michlik
    Ahoj, While constructing my family tree, I found that both my paternal and maternal grandfathers as well as some of their brothers-in-law immigrated to the
    Message 1 of 20 , Sep 20, 2004
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      Ahoj,

      While constructing my family tree, I found that both my paternal and maternal grandfathers as well as some of their brothers-in-law immigrated to the coal fields of Western Pennsylvania. I wondered how they ended up there--did the coal companies recruit workers in Slovakia and pay for their passage to the US and Western Pa.? Or was this word-of-mouth from other Slovaks? Are you aware of any books that discuss the Slovak coal miners journey? Thank you!

      Charles Michlik



      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • J. Michutka
      ... I strongly recommend you read the autobiography of Joseph Grisak (1873-1950), which is available on-line as a pdf at
      Message 2 of 20 , Sep 20, 2004
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        At 06:42 AM 9/20/04 -0700, you wrote:
        >Ahoj,
        >
        >While constructing my family tree, I found that both my paternal and
        >maternal grandfathers as well as some of their brothers-in-law immigrated
        >to the coal fields of Western Pennsylvania. I wondered how they ended up
        >there--did the coal companies recruit workers in Slovakia and pay for
        >their passage to the US and Western Pa.? Or was this word-of-mouth from
        >other Slovaks? Are you aware of any books that discuss the Slovak coal
        >miners journey? Thank you!


        I strongly recommend you read the autobiography of Joseph Grisak
        (1873-1950), which is available on-line as a pdf
        at http://www.saed.kent.edu/~lucak/topica/Grisak.pdf . I'm sending you
        privately a review I wrote of it a while back, and I think you'll see that
        it's pertinent. You might also enjoy reading the title story in _That
        Enduring Land_ by Timrava (probably available by inter-library loan); while
        not about Slovak miners specifically, it gives a portrait of the
        discussions and dynamics and tensions as village men debate going to America.

        Julie Michutka
        jmm@...


        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Martin Votruba
        ... A useful reference, Julie. Naturally, some of Grisak s more general comments probably need to be taken with a grain of salt -- right at the start, e.g.,
        Message 3 of 20 , Sep 20, 2004
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          > autobiography of Joseph Grisak (1873-1950), which is available on-line
          > as a pdf at http://www.saed.kent.edu/~lucak/topica/Grisak.pdf

          A useful reference, Julie. Naturally, some of Grisak's more general
          comments probably need to be taken with a grain of salt -- right at the
          start, e.g., he imagines there was no compulsory education when he entered
          school in the 1880s, while the Kingdom actually introduced a mandatory
          6-year school attendance in 1777. Such instances do not reduce its
          usefulness as a window on an immigrant's personal experience. Thanks,
          Julie, for posting it.


          > did the coal companies recruit workers in Slovakia

          M. Mark Stolarik from the U. of Ottawa, who specializes in Slovak
          immigration, thinks it possible that some recruiters reached the Slovak
          counties of the Kingdom, but he also says that he has found no record of
          any such instance.


          Martin

          votruba "at" pitt "dot" edu
        • Caye Caswick
          My grandfather did a bit of mining in Canada (silver mining in his case) before heading for RI and then Cleveland -- he was from Kiev -- and the mandatory
          Message 4 of 20 , Sep 20, 2004
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            My grandfather did a bit of mining in Canada (silver
            mining in his case) before heading for RI and then
            Cleveland -- he was from Kiev -- and the mandatory
            schooling is why my grandmother could read and write
            Hungarian -- and knew a bunch of folks who headed to
            PA for the coal mining too.


            Caye





            --- Martin Votruba <votrubam@...> wrote:

            > > autobiography of Joseph Grisak (1873-1950), which
            > is available on-line
            > > as a pdf at
            > http://www.saed.kent.edu/~lucak/topica/Grisak.pdf
            >
            > A useful reference, Julie. Naturally, some of
            > Grisak's more general
            > comments probably need to be taken with a grain of
            > salt -- right at the
            > start, e.g., he imagines there was no compulsory
            > education when he entered
            > school in the 1880s, while the Kingdom actually
            > introduced a mandatory
            > 6-year school attendance in 1777. Such instances do
            > not reduce its
            > usefulness as a window on an immigrant's personal
            > experience. Thanks,
            > Julie, for posting it.
            >
            >
            > > did the coal companies recruit workers in Slovakia
            >
            > M. Mark Stolarik from the U. of Ottawa, who
            > specializes in Slovak
            > immigration, thinks it possible that some recruiters
            > reached the Slovak
            > counties of the Kingdom, but he also says that he
            > has found no record of
            > any such instance.
            >
            >
            > Martin
            >
            > votruba "at" pitt "dot" edu
            >
            >




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          • raybravo2000
            Ahoj, I ve read what Martin, Julia, and Caye said about this. I would wonder this. Why would anyone need to recruit coal miners? I have respect for the
            Message 5 of 20 , Sep 20, 2004
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              Ahoj,

              I've read what Martin, Julia, and Caye said about this. I would
              wonder this. Why would anyone need to recruit coal miners? I have
              respect for the miners because it is dangerous and important work,
              but at that time (19th cen.) was it really skilled work that needed
              recruiters?

              Colin

              --- In Slovak-World@yahoogroups.com, charles michlik <cmichlik@s...>
              wrote:
              > Ahoj,
              >
              > While constructing my family tree, I found that both my paternal
              and maternal grandfathers as well as some of their brothers-in-law
              immigrated to the coal fields of Western Pennsylvania. I wondered
              how they ended up there--did the coal companies recruit workers in
              Slovakia and pay for their passage to the US and Western Pa.? Or was
              this word-of-mouth from other Slovaks? Are you aware of any books
              that discuss the Slovak coal miners journey? Thank you!
              >
              > Charles Michlik
              >
              >
              >
              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • gergely
              I disagree, from what I ve read, they needed masses bodies with strong backs. Agreed that many were experienced coal miners from the old country, who could
              Message 6 of 20 , Sep 20, 2004
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                I disagree, from what I've read, they needed masses bodies with strong
                backs.

                Agreed that many were experienced coal miners from the old country, who
                could probably be more valuable, but I don't believe that was the thrust of
                the recruitment. Remember, in the late 19th century, the US was still
                relatively scarcely populated with an industrial revolution going on that
                was making huge manpower demands.

                Jack Gergely
                Newport News

                -----Original Message-----
                From: David [mailto:humblebe@...]
                Sent: Monday, September 20, 2004 10:37 AM
                To: Slovak-World@yahoogroups.com
                Subject: Re: [Slovak-World] Re: Slovak coal miners


                Hi: Yes they needed skilled workers along with common laborers. They were
                opening different mines and they needed people with the skills of mining.
                Along with the skilled miners they also needed people skilled in the
                different trades.
                Dave Kuchta

                At 05:40 PM 9/20/2004 +0000, you wrote:
                >Ahoj,
                >
                >I've read what Martin, Julia, and Caye said about this. I would
                >wonder this. Why would anyone need to recruit coal miners? I have
                >respect for the miners because it is dangerous and important work,
                >but at that time (19th cen.) was it really skilled work that needed
                >recruiters?
                >
                >Colin
                >
                >--- In Slovak-World@yahoogroups.com, charles michlik <cmichlik@s...>
                >wrote:
                > > Ahoj,
                > >
                > > While constructing my family tree, I found that both my paternal
                >and maternal grandfathers as well as some of their brothers-in-law
                >immigrated to the coal fields of Western Pennsylvania. I wondered
                >how they ended up there--did the coal companies recruit workers in
                >Slovakia and pay for their passage to the US and Western Pa.? Or was
                >this word-of-mouth from other Slovaks? Are you aware of any books
                >that discuss the Slovak coal miners journey? Thank you!
                > >
                > > Charles Michlik
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >Yahoo! Groups Links
                >
                >
                >
                >






                Yahoo! Groups Links
              • gergely
                I have two great books on the subject, both written during the period. I can t put my finger on them right now, will have to search for them. Both books,
                Message 7 of 20 , Sep 20, 2004
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                  I have two great books on the subject, both written during the period. I
                  can't put my finger on them right now, will have to search for them.

                  Both books, along with other period stuff that I have read, say that the
                  steamship companies did the recruiting. As I understand it, the steerage
                  passengers (about 1000 per trip) at about 10 to 30 dollars per, basically
                  made the ships commercially viable, which subsidized the few hundred
                  upper-class passengers and the mail.

                  I'm not sure, but I believe that actual recruitment from companies
                  guaranteeing jobs was a bit illegal because of indentured servitude laws.
                  Of course, the emigrants left the old country because they knew that jobs
                  were plentiful, no doubt told to them off-the-record by the recruiters.

                  Jack Gergely
                  Newport News



                  -----Original Message-----
                  From: charles michlik [mailto:cmichlik@...]
                  Sent: Monday, September 20, 2004 9:42 AM
                  To: Slovak-World@yahoogroups.com
                  Subject: [Slovak-World] Slovak coal miners


                  Ahoj,

                  While constructing my family tree, I found that both my paternal and
                  maternal grandfathers as well as some of their brothers-in-law immigrated to
                  the coal fields of Western Pennsylvania. I wondered how they ended up
                  there--did the coal companies recruit workers in Slovakia and pay for their
                  passage to the US and Western Pa.? Or was this word-of-mouth from other
                  Slovaks? Are you aware of any books that discuss the Slovak coal miners
                  journey? Thank you!

                  Charles Michlik



                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





                  Yahoo! Groups Links
                • David
                  Hi: Yes they needed skilled workers along with common laborers. They were opening different mines and they needed people with the skills of mining. Along with
                  Message 8 of 20 , Sep 20, 2004
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                    Hi: Yes they needed skilled workers along with common laborers. They were
                    opening different mines and they needed people with the skills of mining.
                    Along with the skilled miners they also needed people skilled in the
                    different trades.
                    Dave Kuchta

                    At 05:40 PM 9/20/2004 +0000, you wrote:
                    >Ahoj,
                    >
                    >I've read what Martin, Julia, and Caye said about this. I would
                    >wonder this. Why would anyone need to recruit coal miners? I have
                    >respect for the miners because it is dangerous and important work,
                    >but at that time (19th cen.) was it really skilled work that needed
                    >recruiters?
                    >
                    >Colin
                    >
                    >--- In Slovak-World@yahoogroups.com, charles michlik <cmichlik@s...>
                    >wrote:
                    > > Ahoj,
                    > >
                    > > While constructing my family tree, I found that both my paternal
                    >and maternal grandfathers as well as some of their brothers-in-law
                    >immigrated to the coal fields of Western Pennsylvania. I wondered
                    >how they ended up there--did the coal companies recruit workers in
                    >Slovakia and pay for their passage to the US and Western Pa.? Or was
                    >this word-of-mouth from other Slovaks? Are you aware of any books
                    >that discuss the Slovak coal miners journey? Thank you!
                    > >
                    > > Charles Michlik
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >Yahoo! Groups Links
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                  • Martin Votruba
                    ... Serfdom was abolished in 1781 in the Kingdom, all the remnants were gone by the middle of the 19th century, so that was not an issue any more when Slovak
                    Message 9 of 20 , Sep 20, 2004
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                      > a bit illegal because of indentured servitude laws

                      Serfdom was abolished in 1781 in the Kingdom, all the remnants were gone
                      by the middle of the 19th century, so that was not an issue any more when
                      Slovak immigration started around 1880.

                      > I don't believe that was the thrust of the recruitment

                      I agree with Jack and Colin that the recruiters looked for manpower. The
                      steel mills are supposed to have been particularly active. Those were the
                      kind of recruiters M. M. Stolarik thinks might have reached the Slovak
                      counties, but says there's no record of them there. Thanks for mentioning
                      the recruiters from the shipping companies, Jack.


                      Martin

                      votruba "at" pitt "dot" edu
                    • Gregory J Kopchak
                      Check out http://www.iarelative.com/history/bremen.htm for an ad from a Steamer Line circa 1900 looking for immmigrants for America. Austria-Hungary made the
                      Message 10 of 20 , Sep 20, 2004
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                        Check out

                        http://www.iarelative.com/history/bremen.htm

                        for an ad from a Steamer Line circa 1900 looking
                        for immmigrants for America.

                        Austria-Hungary made the simple public display of
                        such an ad a crime in 1903 in an effort to stop
                        the flow of people from Slovakia, Bohemia, and
                        Moravia.

                        Article 46 of the law states, "Any one who encourages
                        emigration at a public meeting by speeches, or by
                        distributing printed matter or pamphlets, or by
                        exhibiting these publicly, shall be punished with
                        imprisonment for not more than two months, and by a
                        fine not exceeding 600 crowns."

                        Greg Kopchak
                        It's All Relative


                        -----Original Message-----
                        From: gergely [mailto:gergely@...]
                        Sent: Monday, September 20, 2004 2:43 PM
                        To: Slovak-World@yahoogroups.com
                        Subject: RE: [Slovak-World] Slovak coal miners


                        I have two great books on the subject, both written during the period. I
                        can't put my finger on them right now, will have to search for them.

                        Both books, along with other period stuff that I have read, say that the
                        steamship companies did the recruiting. As I understand it, the steerage
                        passengers (about 1000 per trip) at about 10 to 30 dollars per, basically
                        made the ships commercially viable, which subsidized the few hundred
                        upper-class passengers and the mail.

                        I'm not sure, but I believe that actual recruitment from companies
                        guaranteeing jobs was a bit illegal because of indentured servitude laws.
                        Of course, the emigrants left the old country because they knew that jobs
                        were plentiful, no doubt told to them off-the-record by the recruiters.

                        Jack Gergely
                        Newport News



                        -----Original Message-----
                        From: charles michlik [mailto:cmichlik@...]
                        Sent: Monday, September 20, 2004 9:42 AM
                        To: Slovak-World@yahoogroups.com
                        Subject: [Slovak-World] Slovak coal miners


                        Ahoj,

                        While constructing my family tree, I found that both my paternal and
                        maternal grandfathers as well as some of their brothers-in-law immigrated to
                        the coal fields of Western Pennsylvania. I wondered how they ended up
                        there--did the coal companies recruit workers in Slovakia and pay for their
                        passage to the US and Western Pa.? Or was this word-of-mouth from other
                        Slovaks? Are you aware of any books that discuss the Slovak coal miners
                        journey? Thank you!

                        Charles Michlik



                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





                        Yahoo! Groups Links











                        Yahoo! Groups Links
                      • WHew536674@cs.com
                        Hi, I am about half done reading Hunky: The Immigrant Experience by Nicholas Stevensson Karas. It is a very interesting book in the respect that the author
                        Message 11 of 20 , Sep 20, 2004
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                          Hi,

                          I am about half done reading Hunky: The Immigrant Experience by Nicholas
                          Stevensson Karas. It is a very interesting book in the respect that the author
                          brings together fact and fiction. To quote the back of the book, it is about
                          "two families that lived on opposite sides of the continental divide high in the
                          Capathian Mountains of 19th century east-central Europe. It spans 3
                          generations and a hundred years in their plight to escape more than a thousand years
                          of oppression and servitude."

                          The families are Rusyns who went to the steel mills and the coal mines of W.
                          PA. Whether it is fact or fiction the author talks about an employee of one
                          of the mines who is recruiting men from the above mentioned area. He instructs
                          them to say "no" when they process through EI when asked if they have
                          employment. The mine is opening new mines and needs strong backs. The "old
                          immigrants", the English, Irish, German, Scottish, can speak English and are leaving
                          those labor intensive jobs for better paying jobs. The European immigrants
                          thought the money was pretty good compared to what they had back home. The goal
                          was to work in the mines or mills, save a thousand dollars and go back home.
                          The mining and steel industry saw them as inexpensive labor who were willing
                          to take jobs that the "old" immigrants didn't want. I am really enjoying this
                          book and recommend it. Got it through Barns and Nobel.

                          Joyce


                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        • David
                          Not in mining. You had to know what you where doing. In fact, to be a certified miner you had to have two years of work in the mines before getting certified.
                          Message 12 of 20 , Sep 20, 2004
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                            Not in mining. You had to know what you where doing. In fact, to be a
                            certified miner you had to have two years of work in the mines before
                            getting certified. Each miner, is a contractor in itself. That's why they
                            looked for miners from the old country. We are talking about miners...not
                            mine workers. In fact, in the early years, if an immigrant labor died in
                            the mine, they had less compassion then if they lost a mine mule. It was
                            the miner that mined the coal that the company needed to exist. This is
                            different then from what I am writing about, but in 1902, certain mines in
                            Ohio or Illinois where selective in whom they employed. I have a letter
                            from a company looking for miners or mine workers. In the letter they said
                            Irish and Blacks shouldn't apply. That also goes for Anthracite coal miners
                            who were on a six month strike that spoke English. They did say, that they
                            would hire all the Italians they could get. Coal mining was quite different
                            then the steel or auto industry. The subject line says...COAL MINERS.
                            Dave Kuchta

                            At 04:32 PM 9/20/2004 -0400, you wrote:
                            >I disagree, from what I've read, they needed masses bodies with strong
                            >backs.
                            >
                            >Agreed that many were experienced coal miners from the old country, who
                            >could probably be more valuable, but I don't believe that was the thrust of
                            >the recruitment. Remember, in the late 19th century, the US was still
                            >relatively scarcely populated with an industrial revolution going on that
                            >was making huge manpower demands.
                            >
                            >Jack Gergely
                            >Newport News
                            >
                            >-----Original Message-----
                            >From: David [mailto:humblebe@...]
                            >Sent: Monday, September 20, 2004 10:37 AM
                            >To: Slovak-World@yahoogroups.com
                            >Subject: Re: [Slovak-World] Re: Slovak coal miners
                            >
                            >
                            >Hi: Yes they needed skilled workers along with common laborers. They were
                            >opening different mines and they needed people with the skills of mining.
                            >Along with the skilled miners they also needed people skilled in the
                            >different trades.
                            >Dave Kuchta
                            >
                            >At 05:40 PM 9/20/2004 +0000, you wrote:
                            > >Ahoj,
                            > >
                            > >I've read what Martin, Julia, and Caye said about this. I would
                            > >wonder this. Why would anyone need to recruit coal miners? I have
                            > >respect for the miners because it is dangerous and important work,
                            > >but at that time (19th cen.) was it really skilled work that needed
                            > >recruiters?
                            > >
                            > >Colin
                            > >
                            > >--- In Slovak-World@yahoogroups.com, charles michlik <cmichlik@s...>
                            > >wrote:
                            > > > Ahoj,
                            > > >
                            > > > While constructing my family tree, I found that both my paternal
                            > >and maternal grandfathers as well as some of their brothers-in-law
                            > >immigrated to the coal fields of Western Pennsylvania. I wondered
                            > >how they ended up there--did the coal companies recruit workers in
                            > >Slovakia and pay for their passage to the US and Western Pa.? Or was
                            > >this word-of-mouth from other Slovaks? Are you aware of any books
                            > >that discuss the Slovak coal miners journey? Thank you!
                            > > >
                            > > > Charles Michlik
                            > > >
                            > > >
                            > > >
                            > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                            > >
                            > >
                            > >
                            > >
                            > >
                            > >Yahoo! Groups Links
                            > >
                            > >
                            > >
                            > >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >Yahoo! Groups Links
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >Yahoo! Groups Links
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                          • gergely
                            Miner Dave, OK, I don t think that we disagree anywhere except in semantics. I didn t notice, or wouldn t have recognized the your distinction between miners
                            Message 13 of 20 , Sep 21, 2004
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                              Miner Dave,

                              OK, I don't think that we disagree anywhere except in semantics. I didn't
                              notice, or wouldn't have recognized the your distinction between miners
                              versus mine workers. It's a very legitimate distinction, I've just never
                              heard it used before

                              I do know that my ancestors who emmigrated from the Rusyn counties were
                              young unskilled laborers, not skilled technicians when they immigrated to PA
                              (one to McAdoo, BTW).

                              Jack Gergely
                              Newport News


                              -----Original Message-----
                              From: David [mailto:humblebe@...]
                              Sent: Monday, September 20, 2004 3:40 PM
                              To: Slovak-World@yahoogroups.com
                              Subject: RE: [Slovak-World] Re: Slovak coal miners



                              Not in mining. You had to know what you where doing. In fact, to be a
                              certified miner you had to have two years of work in the mines before
                              getting certified. Each miner, is a contractor in itself. That's why they
                              looked for miners from the old country. We are talking about miners...not
                              mine workers. In fact, in the early years, if an immigrant labor died in
                              the mine, they had less compassion then if they lost a mine mule. It was
                              the miner that mined the coal that the company needed to exist. This is
                              different then from what I am writing about, but in 1902, certain mines in
                              Ohio or Illinois where selective in whom they employed. I have a letter
                              from a company looking for miners or mine workers. In the letter they said
                              Irish and Blacks shouldn't apply. That also goes for Anthracite coal miners
                              who were on a six month strike that spoke English. They did say, that they
                              would hire all the Italians they could get. Coal mining was quite different
                              then the steel or auto industry. The subject line says...COAL MINERS.
                              Dave Kuchta

                              At 04:32 PM 9/20/2004 -0400, you wrote:
                              >I disagree, from what I've read, they needed masses bodies with strong
                              >backs.
                              >
                              >Agreed that many were experienced coal miners from the old country, who
                              >could probably be more valuable, but I don't believe that was the thrust of
                              >the recruitment. Remember, in the late 19th century, the US was still
                              >relatively scarcely populated with an industrial revolution going on that
                              >was making huge manpower demands.
                              >
                              >Jack Gergely
                              >Newport News
                              >
                              >-----Original Message-----
                              >From: David [mailto:humblebe@...]
                              >Sent: Monday, September 20, 2004 10:37 AM
                              >To: Slovak-World@yahoogroups.com
                              >Subject: Re: [Slovak-World] Re: Slovak coal miners
                              >
                              >
                              >Hi: Yes they needed skilled workers along with common laborers. They were
                              >opening different mines and they needed people with the skills of mining.
                              >Along with the skilled miners they also needed people skilled in the
                              >different trades.
                              >Dave Kuchta
                              >
                              >At 05:40 PM 9/20/2004 +0000, you wrote:
                              > >Ahoj,
                              > >
                              > >I've read what Martin, Julia, and Caye said about this. I would
                              > >wonder this. Why would anyone need to recruit coal miners? I have
                              > >respect for the miners because it is dangerous and important work,
                              > >but at that time (19th cen.) was it really skilled work that needed
                              > >recruiters?
                              > >
                              > >Colin
                              > >
                              > >--- In Slovak-World@yahoogroups.com, charles michlik <cmichlik@s...>
                              > >wrote:
                              > > > Ahoj,
                              > > >
                              > > > While constructing my family tree, I found that both my paternal
                              > >and maternal grandfathers as well as some of their brothers-in-law
                              > >immigrated to the coal fields of Western Pennsylvania. I wondered
                              > >how they ended up there--did the coal companies recruit workers in
                              > >Slovakia and pay for their passage to the US and Western Pa.? Or was
                              > >this word-of-mouth from other Slovaks? Are you aware of any books
                              > >that discuss the Slovak coal miners journey? Thank you!
                              > > >
                              > > > Charles Michlik
                              > > >
                              > > >
                              > > >
                              > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >Yahoo! Groups Links
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >Yahoo! Groups Links
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >Yahoo! Groups Links
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >






                              Yahoo! Groups Links
                            • Caye Caswick
                              Here s all I know about my grandfather -- he immigrated to Canada in 1913 and worked in the silver mines for a few years till he coughed up blood. He had a
                              Message 14 of 20 , Sep 21, 2004
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                                Here's all I know about my grandfather -- he
                                immigrated to Canada in 1913 and worked in the silver
                                mines for a few years till he coughed up blood. He
                                had a knack for math -- but in 1913 he was 20 years
                                old, so other than his knack, he had the same
                                education anyone from Kiev would have had, nothing
                                special, as his family was huge and not wealthy.
                                After realizing mining would probably kill him, he
                                moved onto waiting tables and hosting in a restaurant
                                in Rhode Island. Apparently a woman was sweet on him
                                and he wasn't impressed. He literally said he had to
                                leave town to avoid her advances (who knows, stories
                                get imbelished) . . . but then by the early 1920's he
                                was working as a Tool & Dye maker at National Acme in
                                Cleveland -- which I'm sure was basically due to his
                                math skill and probably due to his convincing someone
                                on the interview he could handle it. I have no idea
                                if any of his family were in the mining industry, but
                                something tells me it's highly possible, maybe I'll
                                uncover more someday. I feel pretty lucky just to
                                have found my Gram's ancestors. One of four
                                grandparents down, three to go.

                                Anyone have any other career or skilled labor inpupt?
                                Learning more about mining is pretty interesting, at
                                least to me, not to mention how an immigrant made a
                                living.


                                Caye



                                --- raybravo2000 <colinv@...> wrote:

                                > Ahoj,
                                >
                                > I've read what Martin, Julia, and Caye said about
                                > this. I would
                                > wonder this. Why would anyone need to recruit coal
                                > miners? I have
                                > respect for the miners because it is dangerous and
                                > important work,
                                > but at that time (19th cen.) was it really skilled
                                > work that needed
                                > recruiters?
                                >
                                > Colin
                                >
                                > --- In Slovak-World@yahoogroups.com, charles michlik
                                > <cmichlik@s...>
                                > wrote:
                                > > Ahoj,
                                > >
                                > > While constructing my family tree, I found that
                                > both my paternal
                                > and maternal grandfathers as well as some of their
                                > brothers-in-law
                                > immigrated to the coal fields of Western
                                > Pennsylvania. I wondered
                                > how they ended up there--did the coal companies
                                > recruit workers in
                                > Slovakia and pay for their passage to the US and
                                > Western Pa.? Or was
                                > this word-of-mouth from other Slovaks? Are you
                                > aware of any books
                                > that discuss the Slovak coal miners journey? Thank
                                > you!
                                > >
                                > > Charles Michlik
                                > >
                                > >
                                > >
                                > > [Non-text portions of this message have been
                                > removed]
                                >
                                >




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                              • David
                                Jack: No problem. Most people who say, miners, think that everyone working in a mine is a miner. Miner, is the man that mines coal. Yes, it s only a mere
                                Message 15 of 20 , Sep 21, 2004
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                                  Jack: No problem. Most people who say, "miners," think that everyone
                                  working in a mine is a miner. "Miner," is the man that mines coal. Yes,
                                  it's only a mere technical term but not everyone can mine coal. A miner
                                  has to know how to timber his chute, make batteries (a term used in chutes)
                                  and of course, how to drill in the right directions in the breast or face
                                  of the coal, then placing the powder (or dynamite) and in more modern
                                  times, setting the caps on certain timing so the coal, will fall away from
                                  the top and bottom rock. Along with that, he has to know certain skills on
                                  how veins are laid out and what to do when the veins pinch out or fault.
                                  There is a lot to know about safety and of course to know about the various
                                  gases or problems that crop up in a coal mine.
                                  Dave

                                  At 07:28 AM 9/21/2004 -0400, you wrote:
                                  >Miner Dave,
                                  >
                                  >OK, I don't think that we disagree anywhere except in semantics. I didn't
                                  >notice, or wouldn't have recognized the your distinction between miners
                                  >versus mine workers. It's a very legitimate distinction, I've just never
                                  >heard it used before
                                  >
                                  >I do know that my ancestors who emmigrated from the Rusyn counties were
                                  >young unskilled laborers, not skilled technicians when they immigrated to PA
                                  >(one to McAdoo, BTW).
                                  >
                                  >Jack Gergely
                                  >Newport News
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >-----Original Message-----
                                  >From: David [mailto:humblebe@...]
                                  >Sent: Monday, September 20, 2004 3:40 PM
                                  >To: Slovak-World@yahoogroups.com
                                  >Subject: RE: [Slovak-World] Re: Slovak coal miners
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >Not in mining. You had to know what you where doing. In fact, to be a
                                  >certified miner you had to have two years of work in the mines before
                                  >getting certified. Each miner, is a contractor in itself. That's why they
                                  >looked for miners from the old country. We are talking about miners...not
                                  >mine workers. In fact, in the early years, if an immigrant labor died in
                                  >the mine, they had less compassion then if they lost a mine mule. It was
                                  >the miner that mined the coal that the company needed to exist. This is
                                  >different then from what I am writing about, but in 1902, certain mines in
                                  >Ohio or Illinois where selective in whom they employed. I have a letter
                                  >from a company looking for miners or mine workers. In the letter they said
                                  >Irish and Blacks shouldn't apply. That also goes for Anthracite coal miners
                                  >who were on a six month strike that spoke English. They did say, that they
                                  >would hire all the Italians they could get. Coal mining was quite different
                                  >then the steel or auto industry. The subject line says...COAL MINERS.
                                  >Dave Kuchta
                                  >
                                  >At 04:32 PM 9/20/2004 -0400, you wrote:
                                  > >I disagree, from what I've read, they needed masses bodies with strong
                                  > >backs.
                                  > >
                                  > >Agreed that many were experienced coal miners from the old country, who
                                  > >could probably be more valuable, but I don't believe that was the thrust of
                                  > >the recruitment. Remember, in the late 19th century, the US was still
                                  > >relatively scarcely populated with an industrial revolution going on that
                                  > >was making huge manpower demands.
                                  > >
                                  > >Jack Gergely
                                  > >Newport News
                                  > >
                                  > >-----Original Message-----
                                  > >From: David [mailto:humblebe@...]
                                  > >Sent: Monday, September 20, 2004 10:37 AM
                                  > >To: Slovak-World@yahoogroups.com
                                  > >Subject: Re: [Slovak-World] Re: Slovak coal miners
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > >Hi: Yes they needed skilled workers along with common laborers. They were
                                  > >opening different mines and they needed people with the skills of mining.
                                  > >Along with the skilled miners they also needed people skilled in the
                                  > >different trades.
                                  > >Dave Kuchta
                                  > >
                                  > >At 05:40 PM 9/20/2004 +0000, you wrote:
                                  > > >Ahoj,
                                  > > >
                                  > > >I've read what Martin, Julia, and Caye said about this. I would
                                  > > >wonder this. Why would anyone need to recruit coal miners? I have
                                  > > >respect for the miners because it is dangerous and important work,
                                  > > >but at that time (19th cen.) was it really skilled work that needed
                                  > > >recruiters?
                                  > > >
                                  > > >Colin
                                  > > >
                                  > > >--- In Slovak-World@yahoogroups.com, charles michlik <cmichlik@s...>
                                  > > >wrote:
                                  > > > > Ahoj,
                                  > > > >
                                  > > > > While constructing my family tree, I found that both my paternal
                                  > > >and maternal grandfathers as well as some of their brothers-in-law
                                  > > >immigrated to the coal fields of Western Pennsylvania. I wondered
                                  > > >how they ended up there--did the coal companies recruit workers in
                                  > > >Slovakia and pay for their passage to the US and Western Pa.? Or was
                                  > > >this word-of-mouth from other Slovaks? Are you aware of any books
                                  > > >that discuss the Slovak coal miners journey? Thank you!
                                  > > > >
                                  > > > > Charles Michlik
                                  > > > >
                                  > > > >
                                  > > > >
                                  > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                  > > >
                                  > > >
                                  > > >
                                  > > >
                                  > > >
                                  > > >Yahoo! Groups Links
                                  > > >
                                  > > >
                                  > > >
                                  > > >
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > >Yahoo! Groups Links
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > >Yahoo! Groups Links
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >Yahoo! Groups Links
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >Yahoo! Groups Links
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                • Barbara Koeller
                                  Since Caye asked about other occupations of immigrants - - my grandfather came to Pennsylvania from Zelenec~ (formerly, Linc~) in Western Slovakia in 1906.
                                  Message 16 of 20 , Sep 22, 2004
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                                    Since Caye asked about other occupations of immigrants - -
                                    my grandfather came to Pennsylvania from Zelenec~ (formerly, Linc~) in
                                    Western Slovakia in 1906. His older brother had already arrived here and
                                    was a butcher. Grandfather was a tailor and had been an intern in
                                    Vienna. He came over a few months before my grandmother and their
                                    children, to get settled and find a home for all of them. He worked for a
                                    tailor shop in Allentown which, according to my aunt, was named Sauerwein,
                                    Kunz and Kirschner. The family later moved to Palmerton, PA, and my mom
                                    was the first of the children to be born in the USA. Sadly, my grandfather
                                    died in 1916 at age 36, of tuberculosis. My grandmother was left a widow
                                    with 8 kids, the youngest only 6 months old, but they managed.


                                    At 01:47 PM 9/21/2004, you wrote:
                                    >Anyone have any other career or skilled labor inpupt?
                                    >Learning more about mining is pretty interesting, at
                                    >least to me, not to mention how an immigrant made a
                                    >living.
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >Caye
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >--- raybravo2000 <colinv@...> wrote:
                                    >
                                    > > Ahoj,
                                    > >
                                    > > I've read what Martin, Julia, and Caye said about
                                    > > this. I would
                                    > > wonder this. Why would anyone need to recruit coal
                                    > > miners? I have
                                    > > respect for the miners because it is dangerous and
                                    > > important work,
                                    > > but at that time (19th cen.) was it really skilled
                                    > > work that needed
                                    > > recruiters?
                                    > >
                                    > > Colin
                                    > >
                                    > > --- In Slovak-World@yahoogroups.com, charles michlik
                                    > > <cmichlik@s...>
                                    > > wrote:
                                    > > > Ahoj,
                                    > > >
                                    > > > While constructing my family tree, I found that
                                    > > both my paternal
                                    > > and maternal grandfathers as well as some of their
                                    > > brothers-in-law
                                    > > immigrated to the coal fields of Western
                                    > > Pennsylvania. I wondered
                                    > > how they ended up there--did the coal companies
                                    > > recruit workers in
                                    > > Slovakia and pay for their passage to the US and
                                    > > Western Pa.? Or was
                                    > > this word-of-mouth from other Slovaks? Are you
                                    > > aware of any books
                                    > > that discuss the Slovak coal miners journey? Thank
                                    > > you!
                                    > > >
                                    > > > Charles Michlik
                                    > > >
                                  • Michelle A Mader
                                    ... able to glean from my research, he was sponsored by his future BIL so he came directly to Cleveland and became a factory worker. We re unable to tell
                                    Message 17 of 20 , Sep 23, 2004
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                                      >My grandfather came over from Basovce in 1903. From what we've been
                                      able to glean from my research, he was sponsored by his future BIL so
                                      he came directly to Cleveland and became a factory worker. We're
                                      unable to tell whether my grandfather knew my grandmother before he
                                      came over or whether he met her here as his sponsor's sister. (My
                                      grandmother and her family came over from Pobedim.) In any case,
                                      they were married here and went on to have six children. They lost the
                                      oldest in a drowning incident when he was 9YO and the youngest in
                                      WWII.


                                      Michelle Maco Mader
                                      Cleveland, Ohio USA
                                    • Caye Caswick
                                      Michelle, do you happen to know which factory? The Encyclopedia of Cleveland has a great history of National Acme, the factory my grandfather worked in.
                                      Message 18 of 20 , Sep 23, 2004
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                                        Michelle, do you happen to know which factory? The
                                        Encyclopedia of Cleveland has a great history of
                                        National Acme, the factory my grandfather worked in.
                                        Thanks for your posting.


                                        Caye


                                        --- Michelle A Mader <Michelle.A.Mader@...>
                                        wrote:

                                        >
                                        > >My grandfather came over from Basovce in 1903.
                                        > From what we've been
                                        > able to glean from my research, he was sponsored by
                                        > his future BIL so
                                        > he came directly to Cleveland and became a factory
                                        > worker. We're
                                        > unable to tell whether my grandfather knew my
                                        > grandmother before he
                                        > came over or whether he met her here as his
                                        > sponsor's sister. (My
                                        > grandmother and her family came over from Pobedim.)
                                        > In any case,
                                        > they were married here and went on to have six
                                        > children. They lost the
                                        > oldest in a drowning incident when he was 9YO and
                                        > the youngest in
                                        > WWII.
                                        >
                                        >
                                        > Michelle Maco Mader
                                        > Cleveland, Ohio USA
                                        >
                                        >




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                                      • Caye Caswick
                                        Thanks Barb . . . a tailor, now that s pretty skilled -- do you sew much yourself? Caye ... _______________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Declare Yourself -
                                        Message 19 of 20 , Sep 23, 2004
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                                          Thanks Barb . . . a tailor, now that's pretty skilled
                                          -- do you sew much yourself?


                                          Caye


                                          --- Barbara Koeller <bkoeller@...> wrote:

                                          > Since Caye asked about other occupations of
                                          > immigrants - -
                                          > my grandfather came to Pennsylvania from Zelenec~
                                          > (formerly, Linc~) in
                                          > Western Slovakia in 1906. His older brother had
                                          > already arrived here and
                                          > was a butcher. Grandfather was a tailor and had
                                          > been an intern in
                                          > Vienna. He came over a few months before my
                                          > grandmother and their
                                          > children, to get settled and find a home for all of
                                          > them. He worked for a
                                          > tailor shop in Allentown which, according to my
                                          > aunt, was named Sauerwein,
                                          > Kunz and Kirschner. The family later moved to
                                          > Palmerton, PA, and my mom
                                          > was the first of the children to be born in the USA.
                                          > Sadly, my grandfather
                                          > died in 1916 at age 36, of tuberculosis. My
                                          > grandmother was left a widow
                                          > with 8 kids, the youngest only 6 months old, but
                                          > they managed.
                                          >
                                          >
                                          > At 01:47 PM 9/21/2004, you wrote:
                                          > >Anyone have any other career or skilled labor
                                          > inpupt?
                                          > >Learning more about mining is pretty interesting,
                                          > at
                                          > >least to me, not to mention how an immigrant made a
                                          > >living.
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > >Caye
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > >--- raybravo2000 <colinv@...> wrote:
                                          > >
                                          > > > Ahoj,
                                          > > >
                                          > > > I've read what Martin, Julia, and Caye said
                                          > about
                                          > > > this. I would
                                          > > > wonder this. Why would anyone need to recruit
                                          > coal
                                          > > > miners? I have
                                          > > > respect for the miners because it is dangerous
                                          > and
                                          > > > important work,
                                          > > > but at that time (19th cen.) was it really
                                          > skilled
                                          > > > work that needed
                                          > > > recruiters?
                                          > > >
                                          > > > Colin
                                          > > >
                                          > > > --- In Slovak-World@yahoogroups.com, charles
                                          > michlik
                                          > > > <cmichlik@s...>
                                          > > > wrote:
                                          > > > > Ahoj,
                                          > > > >
                                          > > > > While constructing my family tree, I found
                                          > that
                                          > > > both my paternal
                                          > > > and maternal grandfathers as well as some of
                                          > their
                                          > > > brothers-in-law
                                          > > > immigrated to the coal fields of Western
                                          > > > Pennsylvania. I wondered
                                          > > > how they ended up there--did the coal companies
                                          > > > recruit workers in
                                          > > > Slovakia and pay for their passage to the US and
                                          > > > Western Pa.? Or was
                                          > > > this word-of-mouth from other Slovaks? Are you
                                          > > > aware of any books
                                          > > > that discuss the Slovak coal miners journey?
                                          > Thank
                                          > > > you!
                                          > > > >
                                          > > > > Charles Michlik
                                          > > > >
                                          >
                                          >




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                                        • Michelle A Mader
                                          ... Caye, No, I don t know which factory it was. In every document he filled out in which an occupation is requried he listed factory worker . My mother
                                          Message 20 of 20 , Sep 23, 2004
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                                            Caye wrote:


                                            >Michelle, do you happen to know which factory? The
                                            >Encyclopedia of Cleveland has a great history of
                                            >National Acme, the factory my grandfather worked in.
                                            >Thanks for your posting.

                                            Caye,

                                            No, I don't know which factory it was. In every document
                                            he filled out in which an occupation is requried he listed
                                            'factory worker'.

                                            My mother worked for National Acme in the 1960s.


                                            Michelle Maco Mader
                                            Cleveland, Ohio USA
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