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Re: [Slovak-World] Re: Eastern European Saint Valentine's Day Windows Wallpaper

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  • Edward T. Surkosky
    Prior to the revision of the Roman Calendar the feast of SS. Cyril & Methodius was celebrated on July 7th in the Universal Roman Church. In the then
    Message 1 of 17 , Feb 4, 2008
      Prior to the revision of the Roman Calendar the feast of SS. Cyril &
      Methodius was celebrated on July 7th in the Universal Roman Church. In the
      'then' Czechoslovakia it was celebrated on July 5th so it would be
      celebrated before the holiday for Jan Hus on July 6th. When Paul VI revised
      the Roman Calendar the feast was transferred to February 14th for the
      universal church. Feasts of local importance could be, by indult, set up by
      National Bishops Conferences. This is apparently what is being done in
      Slovakia and the Czech Republic by retaining the feast on July 5th.

      Ed Surkosky
    • Gerald J. Sabo
      Feb. 14th is the official feastday of Cyril and Methodius in the Catholic Church outside Slovakia; on Feb. 14, 869 Cyril, formerly Constantine before becoming
      Message 2 of 17 , Feb 4, 2008
        Feb. 14th is the official feastday of Cyril and Methodius in the Catholic Church outside Slovakia; on Feb. 14, 869 Cyril, formerly Constantine before becoming a monk, died in Rome on that day.
        In Slovakia during Communist times that date was changed for several reasons to July 5th--better weather so that processions could take place, and it preceded the celebration of Jan Hus day on July 6th celebrated especially in the Czech area, but a national holiday in the former Czecho-Slovakia. This was what I was told in Communist times when I asked why this feastday everywhere else in the Catholic world was Feb. 14th but in Slovakia was on July 5th.
        Jerry Sabo

        ---- Original message ----
        >Date: Sun, 3 Feb 2008 22:11:59 -0500
        >From: "Mark Sabol" <marksabol2@...>
        >Subject: Re: [Slovak-World] Re: Eastern European Saint Valentine's Day Windows Wallpaper
        >To: <Slovak-World@yahoogroups.com>
        >
        > What you remember is the way it used to be. Cyril &
        > Methodius' day on the church calendar was changed
        > about 40 years ago, at the same time St. Christopher
        > was removed, I think.
        >
        > ----- Original Message -----
        > From: Andy Verostko
        > To: Slovak-World@yahoogroups.com
        > Sent: Sunday, February 03, 2008 8:33 PM
        > Subject: [SPAM] Re: [Slovak-World] Re: Eastern
        > European Saint Valentine's Day Windows Wallpaper
        >
        > Martin.... You are right and I am unable to
        > understand why I
        > misremembered it
        >
        > andy v.......
        >
        > Martin Votruba wrote:
        > >
        > > > Feb 14, St Valentines day in this country is in
        > Slovakia
        > > > t
        > >
        > \
        > >
        > > he feast day of Cyril and Methodius
        > >
        > > Feb. 14 is "Valentine's" in Slovakia. Sts. Cyril
        > and Methodius Day is
        > > a national holiday on July 5 in Slovakia:
        > >
        > > http://www.calendar.sk/ <http://www.calendar.sk/>
        > >
        > > Martin
        > >
        > > votruba "at" pitt "dot" edu
        > >
        > >
        >
        > [Non-text portions of this message have been
        > removed]
        >
        >
      • Martin Votruba
        July 5 as Sts. Cyril and Methodius Day started neither with the communists (who celebrated neither C&M Day, nor Jan Hus Day) nor with the creation of
        Message 3 of 17 , Feb 4, 2008
          July 5 as Sts. Cyril and Methodius Day started neither with the
          communists (who celebrated neither C&M Day, nor Jan Hus Day) nor with
          the creation of Czecho-Slovakia in 1918.

          The Archbishop of Olomouc (Moravia) requested the shift from March to
          July before the millennial celebrations of C&M in 1863 (they arrived
          in Great Moravia in 863).

          Although it was likely that he chose the date so close to Hus Day to
          counterbalance Hus's growing cult fostered by the Czech ethnic
          activists, the explicit reason the Archbishop's appeal to Pope Pius IX
          contained was that people could not travel to the planned massive
          festivities as easily, and therefore not in large numbers, in the cold
          and muddy season. An additional practical reason was that C&M Day was
          during the lent and therefore not suitable for a joyful festival.

          The Vatican granted the shift to the Margraviate of Moravia and the
          Kingdoms of Bohemia and Croatia for the 1863 festivities.

          Leo XIII then issued the Vatican's definitive decree on this in 1880:

          http://tinyurl.com/36uzpp

          This Vatican-provided English translation of the Papal encyclical
          mistranslates one word: whenever it says "Slovenia," read _Slavs_ (the
          Latin original says _Slavi_).


          Martin

          votruba "at" pitt "dot" edu
        • Edward T. Surkosky
          I didn t mean to imply that it started after 1918. I was referring to its existence prior to the current Czech Republic and Slovakia. I was aware of the Roman
          Message 4 of 17 , Feb 4, 2008
            I didn't mean to imply that it started after 1918. I was referring to its
            existence prior to the current Czech Republic and Slovakia. I was aware of
            the Roman Church's revival of SSC&M by Pius IX Leo XIII's encyclical. I
            didn't realize I had to be that specific. Sorry.

            Ed Surkosky



            ----- Original Message -----
            From: "Martin Votruba" <votrubam@...>
            To: <Slovak-World@yahoogroups.com>
            Sent: Monday, February 04, 2008 12:53 PM
            Subject: [Slovak-World] Re: Eastern European Saint Valentine's Day Windows
            Wallpaper


            > July 5 as Sts. Cyril and Methodius Day started neither with the
            > communists (who celebrated neither C&M Day, nor Jan Hus Day) nor with
            > the creation of Czecho-Slovakia in 1918.
            >
            > The Archbishop of Olomouc (Moravia) requested the shift from March to
            > July before the millennial celebrations of C&M in 1863 (they arrived
            > in Great Moravia in 863).
            >
            > Although it was likely that he chose the date so close to Hus Day to
            > counterbalance Hus's growing cult fostered by the Czech ethnic
            > activists, the explicit reason the Archbishop's appeal to Pope Pius IX
            > contained was that people could not travel to the planned massive
            > festivities as easily, and therefore not in large numbers, in the cold
            > and muddy season. An additional practical reason was that C&M Day was
            > during the lent and therefore not suitable for a joyful festival.
            >
            > The Vatican granted the shift to the Margraviate of Moravia and the
            > Kingdoms of Bohemia and Croatia for the 1863 festivities.
            >
            > Leo XIII then issued the Vatican's definitive decree on this in 1880:
            >
            > http://tinyurl.com/36uzpp
            >
            > This Vatican-provided English translation of the Papal encyclical
            > mistranslates one word: whenever it says "Slovenia," read _Slavs_ (the
            > Latin original says _Slavi_).
            >
            >
            > Martin
            >
            > votruba "at" pitt "dot" edu
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > Yahoo! Groups Links
            >
            >
            >
          • Edward T. Surkosky
            It might be noted that the Roman Church s interest in SSC&M was probalby due to the rise in Pan Slavism and the Russian Czar s desire to be Father of the
            Message 5 of 17 , Feb 4, 2008
              It might be noted that the Roman Church's interest in SSC&M was probalby due
              to the rise in Pan Slavism and the Russian Czar's desire to be "Father of
              the Slavs". Remeber this happened after 1848.

              Ed Surkosky
            • Martin Votruba
              ... That s a good point, Ed. On the one hand, I did find C&M listed together for March 9 in the Roman Martyrology from 1627, so while the holiday was dormant,
              Message 6 of 17 , Feb 4, 2008
                > the Roman Church's interest in SSC&M was probalby due
                > to the rise in Pan Slavism and the Russian Czar's desire
                > to be "Father of the Slavs".

                That's a good point, Ed. On the one hand, I did find C&M listed
                together for March 9 in the Roman Martyrology from 1627, so while the
                holiday was dormant, it was not completely reinvented in the 19th
                century as some discussions of that period seem to imply -- "In
                Morauia of the holy Saints Cyrillus and Methodius Bishops, who
                couerted to the fayth of Christ many Countreyes, togeather with their
                Kinges, in those parts."

                The holiday was not mentioned, however, in the Missals for the Prague
                and Olomouc Dioceses from around 1500, an indication that their
                celebrations by the Roman Catholic Church in the Habsburg monarchy
                really started under pressure from the Slavic ethnic activists,
                especially the Croats and Czechs, and under the Catholic hierarchy's
                disquiet at the anti-Habsburg-Vatican stance of many of the Czech
                activists, mostly from Roman Catholic families themselves, who
                reinvented the cult of Jan Hus as a means to that end.


                Martin

                votruba "at" pitt "dot" edu
              • Edward T. Surkosky
                There has been a long standing devotion to St. Cyril at his tomb at St. Clement s in Rome. At least we know where he is, but not his long lost brother. About
                Message 7 of 17 , Feb 5, 2008
                  There has been a long standing devotion to St. Cyril at his tomb at St.
                  Clement's in Rome. At least we know where he is, but not his long lost
                  brother. About 30 yrs. ago there were several articles in the L'Osservatore
                  Romano about the search for St. Methodius' tomb. I haven't read anything
                  since.

                  Ed Surkosky
                • Martin Votruba
                  ... Thank you for the reminder, Ed. You mentioned July 7 as the day of celebration in the past. Could you add some details, please, when and to whom/where
                  Message 8 of 17 , Feb 5, 2008
                    > There has been a long standing devotion to St. Cyril at his tomb
                    > at St. Clement's in Rome.

                    Thank you for the reminder, Ed. You mentioned July 7 as the day of
                    celebration in the past. Could you add some details, please, when and
                    to whom/where that date applied? I only know of it being moved from
                    March 9 to July 5 (approved in 1863-1880) for the sake of the Croats,
                    Czechs, and eventually Slovaks.


                    Martin

                    votruba "at" pitt "dot" edu
                  • Edward T. Surkosky
                    The sources in my possession are: 1952 Marian Missal, I purchased this in 5th grade at SS.C.&M. Parochial School, has the date July 7th and contains the
                    Message 9 of 17 , Feb 5, 2008
                      The sources in my possession are:

                      1952 Marian Missal, I purchased this in 5th grade at SS.C.&M. Parochial
                      School, has the date July 7th and contains the readings for that feast and a
                      short biography.

                      1941 National Catholic Almanac, calendar lists list July 7th SSC&M, bps.

                      When it was moved from July 5th to July 7th I don't know.

                      Ed Surkosky

                      ----- Original Message -----
                      From: "Martin Votruba" <votrubam@...>
                      To: <Slovak-World@yahoogroups.com>
                      Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 11:18 AM
                      Subject: [Slovak-World] Re: Eastern European Saint Valentine's Day Windows
                      Wallpaper


                      >> There has been a long standing devotion to St. Cyril at his tomb
                      >> at St. Clement's in Rome.
                      >
                      > Thank you for the reminder, Ed. You mentioned July 7 as the day of
                      > celebration in the past. Could you add some details, please, when and
                      > to whom/where that date applied? I only know of it being moved from
                      > March 9 to July 5 (approved in 1863-1880) for the sake of the Croats,
                      > Czechs, and eventually Slovaks.
                      >
                      >
                      > Martin
                      >
                      > votruba "at" pitt "dot" edu
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > Yahoo! Groups Links
                      >
                      >
                      >
                    • Martin Votruba
                      ... Thank you Ed. It s useful to have that information. It s interesting that they used a different date from what the Pope decreed in 1880. Martin votruba
                      Message 10 of 17 , Feb 6, 2008
                        > 1952 Marian Missal
                        >
                        > 1941 National Catholic Almanac

                        Thank you Ed. It's useful to have that information. It's interesting
                        that they used a different date from what the Pope decreed in 1880.


                        Martin

                        votruba "at" pitt "dot" edu
                      • Edward T. Surkosky
                        I know. Leo XIII made additional changes after 1880, as did Pius X and subsequent popes. I was unable to find out who moved it to July 5th. Ed Surkosky ...
                        Message 11 of 17 , Feb 6, 2008
                          I know. Leo XIII made additional changes after 1880, as did Pius X and
                          subsequent popes. I was unable to find out who moved it to July 5th.

                          Ed Surkosky

                          ----- Original Message -----
                          From: "Martin Votruba" <votrubam@...>
                          To: <Slovak-World@yahoogroups.com>
                          Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2008 10:47 AM
                          Subject: [Slovak-World] Re: Eastern European Saint Valentine's Day Windows
                          Wallpaper


                          >> 1952 Marian Missal
                          >>
                          >> 1941 National Catholic Almanac
                          >
                          > Thank you Ed. It's useful to have that information. It's interesting
                          > that they used a different date from what the Pope decreed in 1880.
                          >
                          >
                          > Martin
                          >
                          > votruba "at" pitt "dot" edu
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > Yahoo! Groups Links
                          >
                          >
                          >
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