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Re: Jewish Victims in Villages

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  • Ron Matviyak
    Martin, I have not stumbled upon any history of who took over the businesses. On results of this search it was obvious that no Liquidators were named. That
    Message 1 of 12 , Jan 23, 2008
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      Martin,

      I have not stumbled upon any history of who took over the businesses.
      On results of this search it was obvious that no "Liquidators" were
      named. That column of information was consistently empty. When I see
      information like that missing I always wish I had gotten to the data
      base before embarrassing information was cleaned up, although I can
      accept that some information will always be missing from records.

      It must have been 1986 when I was visiting in Germany and was talking
      to German friends. That made it the 50th anniversary of the
      Aryanization of many Jewish businesses in 1936. The friends said many
      businesses wanted to celebrate their 50th year, but could not ...
      because they started with the takeover of Jewish enterprises.

      Oh, I think I confused numbers on Cleveland metro area. At one time
      they had 3 million, not 6 as I stated. Again, this is going by memory.

      Ron

      --- In Slovak-World@yahoogroups.com, "Martin Votruba" <votrubam@...>
      wrote:
      >
      Thousands have taken> possession of businesses that were taken away
      from the Jews during the> same period. I wonder, Ron, whether you
      found any reference to who> got the stores you mentioned. Such
      specific information is also hard> to come by.
      >
      > Among those to be recognized on Jan. 27 is the late Greek Catholic
      > (Byzantine) Bishop Pavol Peter Gojdic [goydeetsh] of the Presov Eparchy:
      >
      > http://tinyurl.com/yryr5m
      >
      > He criticized the deportations before they were carried out and
      issued> baptismal records for some Jews, which might have saved them
      from> deportations.
      >
      >
      > Martin
      >
      > votruba "at" pitt "dot" edu
      >
    • maxine
      And why is it that people do not know that Slovaks helped them- I sincerely believe that the Jewish people should state that because a lot of Eastern Europeans
      Message 2 of 12 , Jan 23, 2008
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        And why is it that people do not know that Slovaks helped them- I sincerely believe that the Jewish people should state that because a lot of Eastern Europeans were killed in mass because of it. Credit should be given when lives were at stake! Also, most Americans think that just the Jewish were killed and this was not true at all. Thousands of other people were killed like the Rusyns, gypsies etc. This should also be noted. For some reason it is always stated that the Jewish people were killed only. Now I am NOT taking anything away from what they did to the Jewish people, they certainly had a very rough time, however, so did many others! maxine sasala


        ----- Original Message -----
        From: William F Brna
        To: Slovak-World@yahoogroups.com
        Sent: Wednesday, January 23, 2008 9:49 AM
        Subject: [Slovak-World] Re: Jewish Victims in Villages


        Bill Tarkulich wrote:

        >Slovakia, unfortunately, within circles, has had a reputation of being
        >anti-Semitic, and the notion persists. It's not talked about much and
        many
        >Jewish researchers are not interested in even setting foot in Slovakia.
        >Sad.

        There were, however, Slovaks who helped Jews escape from the Nazis.
        There are three of my relatives included in the list of Righteous
        Gentiles in the Holocaust Museum in Washington, who helped at least three
        families who eventually emigrated to the States. Perhaps, we Americans
        of Slovak heritage don't do enough to emphasize that there were Slovaks
        who helped.

        Bill Brna

        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • J. Edward Polko
        Hi Maxine, I m not Jewish or black, but I am a member of a minority group. However, having said that, I would also like to say that I don t have the time for
        Message 3 of 12 , Jan 23, 2008
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          Hi Maxine,
          I'm not Jewish or black, but I am a member of a minority group. However,
          having said that, I would also like to say that I don't have the time for
          anti-anybody, except fools (present company excluded).
          Best regards,
          John e. Polko
          -----Original Message-----
          From: Slovak-World@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Slovak-World@yahoogroups.com]On
          Behalf Of maxine
          Sent: January 23, 2008 6:25 PM
          To: Slovak-World@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: Re: [Slovak-World] Re: Jewish Victims in Villages


          And why is it that people do not know that Slovaks helped them- I
          sincerely believe that the Jewish people should state that because a lot of
          Eastern Europeans were killed in mass because of it. Credit should be given
          when lives were at stake! Also, most Americans think that just the Jewish
          were killed and this was not true at all. Thousands of other people were
          killed like the Rusyns, gypsies etc. This should also be noted. For some
          reason it is always stated that the Jewish people were killed only. Now I am
          NOT taking anything away from what they did to the Jewish people, they
          certainly had a very rough time, however, so did many others! maxine sasala

          ----- Original Message -----
          From: William F Brna
          To: Slovak-World@yahoogroups.com
          Sent: Wednesday, January 23, 2008 9:49 AM
          Subject: [Slovak-World] Re: Jewish Victims in Villages

          Bill Tarkulich wrote:

          >Slovakia, unfortunately, within circles, has had a reputation of being
          >anti-Semitic, and the notion persists. It's not talked about much and
          many
          >Jewish researchers are not interested in even setting foot in Slovakia.
          >Sad.

          There were, however, Slovaks who helped Jews escape from the Nazis.
          There are three of my relatives included in the list of Righteous
          Gentiles in the Holocaust Museum in Washington, who helped at least three
          families who eventually emigrated to the States. Perhaps, we Americans
          of Slovak heritage don't do enough to emphasize that there were Slovaks
          who helped.

          Bill Brna

          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]






          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Nick Holcz
          The same thing happened in 1948. Our family had to leave, my father over the border to Germany,my mother and I were allowed to leave, returning to England,
          Message 4 of 12 , Jan 23, 2008
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            The same thing happened in 1948. Our family had to leave, my father
            over the border to Germany,my mother and I were allowed to leave,
            returning to England, losing all possessions except for one silver
            teaspoon that my mother hid on her person. Someone profited from our
            misfortune.What would you expect? There is nothing unusual in that.

            My father was really unlucky he had to escape his homeland twice,once
            to avoid nearly certain death from the Nazi concentration camp system
            and secondly to avoid the same fate from the communists.

            Czechoslovakia was not alone in those troubled times and now
            fortunately seems to be on the way back.

            Nick
          • Nick Holcz
            Maxine, there were not thousands there were millions of Jews,Gypsies,Homosexuals,cripples and so on. I think the thrust of your message is totally unfair. Why
            Message 5 of 12 , Jan 23, 2008
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              Maxine, there were not thousands there were millions of
              Jews,Gypsies,Homosexuals,cripples and so on.

              I think the thrust of your message is totally unfair.

              Why blame the Jewish people for the lack of knowledge other people
              have of the history of Europe in WW2.

              Nick
            • maxine
              Nick, I do NOT blame anyone, however, on all the sites, history books and whatever, I have never seen it told that the Jewish people were helped by many people
              Message 6 of 12 , Jan 24, 2008
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                Nick, I do NOT blame anyone, however, on all the sites, history books and whatever, I have never seen it told that the Jewish people were helped by many people and suffered for it! Whole villages were put in barns, churches, etc and burned for helping. I just believe that this should be know by ALL. These people gave up their lives to help. Is there any site, which I missed, that states that many people tried to help and suffered for it? I would like to read it.
                Once again, I AM NOT BLAMING anyone, however, credit is due to many killed who helped, whether Poles, Slovaks, Rusyn or whoever. You bet the Jewish people suffered a great deal, however, so did many others. I know for a fact that many Rusyns were killed because they were thought of "as useless"! We ALL should know the facts and NEVER FORGET what happened! maxine




                ----- Original Message -----
                From: Nick Holcz
                To: Slovak-World@yahoogroups.com
                Sent: Wednesday, January 23, 2008 9:47 PM
                Subject: Re: [Slovak-World] Re: Jewish Victims in Villages


                Maxine, there were not thousands there were millions of
                Jews,Gypsies,Homosexuals,cripples and so on.

                I think the thrust of your message is totally unfair.

                Why blame the Jewish people for the lack of knowledge other people
                have of the history of Europe in WW2.

                Nick




                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • J Michutka
                Didn t we have this discussion last year? Honestly, the information is out there; I ve been coming across it without effort since 1975. If you are waiting for
                Message 7 of 12 , Jan 24, 2008
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                  Didn't we have this discussion last year?

                  Honestly, the information is out there; I've been coming across it
                  without effort since 1975. If you are waiting for a bibliography and
                  list of URLs to be personally handed to you, you're going to have a
                  long wait.

                  If your complaint is that you have not found enough information,
                  please spend half an hour googling; you'll get sites such as http://
                  www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/Holocaust/righteous1.html and
                  www.yadvashem.org. Then visit your friendly local reference
                  librarian and spend half an hour with her. If your complaint is that
                  you have enough knowledge but think others do not, or it should all
                  be spelled out in one place, please feel free to make a website (many
                  ways to do it for free) and publish your info.

                  "For some reason it is always stated that the Jewish people were
                  killed only": This is simply false; any small amount of reading on
                  the topic will produce the information that groups and individuals
                  other than Jews were murdered.

                  On Jan 24, 2008, at 10:14 AM, maxine wrote:
                  > ! Whole villages were put in barns, churches, etc and burned for
                  > helping.

                  Which villages, where, and your source of information, please?

                  > You bet the Jewish people suffered a great deal, however, so did
                  > many others. I know for a fact that many Rusyns were killed because
                  > they were thought of "as useless"!

                  Perhaps I'm reading 'way too much into this...but maybe one of your
                  complaints is that your ethnic group also suffered horrific losses
                  and you feel that that fact is not widely enough known. In which
                  case, you may well have a legitimate complaint, but unfortunately the
                  only real solution may be to solve the problem yourself--research,
                  publish (see website info above). This is what many people on this
                  list have done, albeit for less tragic events than mass murder.

                  Julie Michutka
                  jmm@...
                • maxine
                  First of all, I did not bring up the subject, William Brna on 1/23 did. However, you must understand the following: Perhaps many people were not on the site
                  Message 8 of 12 , Jan 24, 2008
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                    First of all, I did not bring up the subject, William Brna on 1/23 did. However, you must understand the following:
                    Perhaps many people were not on the site last year.
                    Perhaps many people do not have your experience on the computer.
                    Perhaps and most important, this subject should be brought up many times over since it is very important and little credit is given to the people who were killed because of helping, no matter where they are from. Their lives and their family lives are important to me and I am sure others.
                    They also should be remembered and honored. I sincerely believe that not too many people are aware of the fact that others died in helping the Jewish people. And once again I state-none of this should have happened in the first place, but it did! Honor these people and do not forget them. maxine


                    ----- Original Message -----
                    From: J Michutka
                    To: Slovak-World@yahoogroups.com
                    Sent: Thursday, January 24, 2008 4:20 PM
                    Subject: [Slovak-World] Re: Jewish Victims in Villages


                    Didn't we have this discussion last year?

                    Honestly, the information is out there; I've been coming across it
                    without effort since 1975. If you are waiting for a bibliography and
                    list of URLs to be personally handed to you, you're going to have a
                    long wait.

                    If your complaint is that you have not found enough information,
                    please spend half an hour googling; you'll get sites such as http://
                    www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/Holocaust/righteous1.html and
                    www.yadvashem.org. Then visit your friendly local reference
                    librarian and spend half an hour with her. If your complaint is that
                    you have enough knowledge but think others do not, or it should all
                    be spelled out in one place, please feel free to make a website (many
                    ways to do it for free) and publish your info.

                    "For some reason it is always stated that the Jewish people were
                    killed only": This is simply false; any small amount of reading on
                    the topic will produce the information that groups and individuals
                    other than Jews were murdered.

                    On Jan 24, 2008, at 10:14 AM, maxine wrote:
                    > ! Whole villages were put in barns, churches, etc and burned for
                    > helping.

                    Which villages, where, and your source of information, please?

                    > You bet the Jewish people suffered a great deal, however, so did
                    > many others. I know for a fact that many Rusyns were killed because
                    > they were thought of "as useless"!

                    Perhaps I'm reading 'way too much into this...but maybe one of your
                    complaints is that your ethnic group also suffered horrific losses
                    and you feel that that fact is not widely enough known. In which
                    case, you may well have a legitimate complaint, but unfortunately the
                    only real solution may be to solve the problem yourself--research,
                    publish (see website info above). This is what many people on this
                    list have done, albeit for less tragic events than mass murder.

                    Julie Michutka
                    jmm@...




                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • LongJohn Wayne
                    This American is aware. ... ____________________________________________________________________________________ Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all
                    Message 9 of 12 , Jan 26, 2008
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                      This American is aware.

                      --- maxine <maxine96@...> wrote:

                      > And why is it that people do not know that Slovaks
                      > helped them- I sincerely believe that the Jewish
                      > people should state that because a lot of Eastern
                      > Europeans were killed in mass because of it. Credit
                      > should be given when lives were at stake! Also, most
                      > Americans think that just the Jewish were killed and
                      > this was not true at all. Thousands of other people
                      > were killed like the Rusyns, gypsies etc. This
                      > should also be noted. For some reason it is always
                      > stated that the Jewish people were killed only. Now
                      > I am NOT taking anything away from what they did to
                      > the Jewish people, they certainly had a very rough
                      > time, however, so did many others! maxine sasala
                      >
                      >
                      > ----- Original Message -----
                      > From: William F Brna
                      > To: Slovak-World@yahoogroups.com
                      > Sent: Wednesday, January 23, 2008 9:49 AM
                      > Subject: [Slovak-World] Re: Jewish Victims in
                      > Villages
                      >
                      >
                      > Bill Tarkulich wrote:
                      >
                      > >Slovakia, unfortunately, within circles, has had
                      > a reputation of being
                      > >anti-Semitic, and the notion persists. It's not
                      > talked about much and
                      > many
                      > >Jewish researchers are not interested in even
                      > setting foot in Slovakia.
                      > >Sad.
                      >
                      > There were, however, Slovaks who helped Jews
                      > escape from the Nazis.
                      > There are three of my relatives included in the
                      > list of Righteous
                      > Gentiles in the Holocaust Museum in Washington,
                      > who helped at least three
                      > families who eventually emigrated to the States.
                      > Perhaps, we Americans
                      > of Slovak heritage don't do enough to emphasize
                      > that there were Slovaks
                      > who helped.
                      >
                      > Bill Brna
                      >
                      > [Non-text portions of this message have been
                      > removed]
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > [Non-text portions of this message have been
                      > removed]
                      >
                      >



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                    • LongJohn Wayne
                      Martin: Thank you for your scholarly research! Chuck ... http://www1.yadvashem.org/righteous/bycountry/slovakia.html ...
                      Message 10 of 12 , Jan 26, 2008
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                        Martin:

                        Thank you for your scholarly research!

                        Chuck


                        --- Martin Votruba <votrubam@...> wrote:

                        > > There were, however, Slovaks who helped Jews
                        > escape from the Nazis.
                        > > There are three of my relatives included in the
                        > list of Righteous
                        > > Gentiles in the Holocaust Museum in Washington,
                        > who helped at least
                        > > [...]
                        > > Perhaps, we Americans of Slovak heritage don't do
                        > enough to
                        > > emphasize that there were Slovaks who helped.
                        >
                        > The Slovaks in Slovakia don't do much, either. Most
                        > of these
                        > instances are brought to light by the Jews and their
                        > descendants who
                        > have been saved rather than by Slovaks trying to
                        > discover that part of
                        > their history. The list is compiled and maintained
                        > by The Holocaust
                        > Martyrs' and Heroes' Remembrance Authority in
                        > Israel. What's in
                        > Washington is its "mirror site."
                        >
                        > Here's a story from the Yad Vashem site about a
                        > lawyer and his teacher
                        > wife from Zilina who saved a neighbors' daughter by
                        > hiding her in the
                        > crib under their own 6-month-old daughter:
                        >
                        >
                        http://www1.yadvashem.org/righteous/bycountry/slovakia.html
                        >
                        > Reports have been saying for years that Slovakia has
                        > the highest
                        > per-capita ratio of people listed as "The Righteous
                        > Among the
                        > Nations," and I reposted that information here a
                        > couple of years ago.
                        > I have since found out that the reports are wrong.
                        > Slovakia has a
                        > higher percentage than, e.g., Hungary, the Czech R.,
                        > Austria, but
                        > lower than, e.g., Poland, the Netherlands, Belgium.
                        >
                        > Nine more names from Slovakia are to be added this
                        > coming Sunday, so
                        > 474 people from Slovakia will be listed. Thousands
                        > have taken
                        > possession of businesses that were taken away from
                        > the Jews during the
                        > same period. I wonder, Ron, whether you found any
                        > reference to who
                        > got the stores you mentioned. Such specific
                        > information is also hard
                        > to come by.
                        >
                        > Among those to be recognized on Jan. 27 is the late
                        > Greek Catholic
                        > (Byzantine) Bishop Pavol Peter Gojdic [goydeetsh] of
                        > the Presov Eparchy:
                        >
                        > http://tinyurl.com/yryr5m
                        >
                        > He criticized the deportations before they were
                        > carried out and issued
                        > baptismal records for some Jews, which might have
                        > saved them from
                        > deportations.
                        >
                        >
                        > Martin
                        >
                        > votruba "at" pitt "dot" edu
                        >
                        >
                        >



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