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RE: [Slovak-World] Re: illegal immigration

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  • Gregory J Kopchak
    Mr. Baumgarten may be right on track. The laws in force at the time may have been given a blind eye. There was a gap between law and enforcement. Let all those
    Message 1 of 9 , Apr 28 8:11 AM
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      Mr. Baumgarten may be right on track.

      The laws in force at the time may have been given a
      blind eye.

      There was a gap between law and enforcement.

      Let all those who are what we call "Activists" leave and
      what you have left is a population more to your suiting.

      In particular, the "Activists" who settled in the Pittsburgh
      area managed to make a dent in world history over the years.

      Greg Kopchak
      It's All Relative


      -----Original Message-----
      From: Slovak-World@yahoogroups.com
      [mailto:Slovak-World@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Bill Tarkulich
      Sent: Thursday, April 27, 2006 9:20 PM
      To: Slovak-World@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: [Slovak-World] Re: illegal immigration


      I just finished an interesting piece by Vladimir Baumgarten. He
      comments that Magyar authorities knew they had a big problem in Upper
      Hungary - many impovershed people who they really could not/would not
      help rise out of their misery, and by letting them leave, it helped to
      accellerate Magyarization (by a statistical flip.) For those two
      reasons, Baumgarten argues, authorities took a the blind eye of
      tolerance to emigration from these reasons.

      It kind of backfired on them because once in america, immigrants began
      political and social groups to organize pro-Rusyn and pro-Slovak
      activism within their homeland!

      Bill

      --- In Slovak-World@yahoogroups.com, "Gregory J Kopchak" <greg@...> wrote:
      >
      > Bill:
      >
      > Great message.
      >
      > You made a very important point.
      >
      > It was easier to get into America than it was to
      > get out of Upper Hungary (Slovakia).
      >
      > Most questionable documents had to do more with
      > leaving and not arriving.
      >
      > The Magyarization program of the Austro-Hungarian
      > government only increased emigration attempts at
      > the turn of the 20th Century.
      >
      > Greg Kopchak
      > It's All Relative
      >
      >
      >
      > -----Original Message-----
      > From: Slovak-World@yahoogroups.com
      > [mailto:Slovak-World@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Bill Tarkulich
      > Sent: Thursday, April 27, 2006 3:29 AM
      > To: Slovak-World@yahoogroups.com
      > Subject: [Slovak-World] Re: illegal immigration
      >
      >
      > Here are a few points about illegal immigration 100 years ago:
      > 1. Every immigrant followed a somewhat unique path, has a unique story
      > to tell.
      > 2. If there was a rule, somebody along the way broke it. Even in
      > Upper Hungary (Slovakia), most people left the country, especially in
      > Rusyn regions, small villages and poor areas (the majority of
      > immigrants), without an official passport. It was too much of a
      > hassle to get one. Usually they left with some sort of
      > official-looking document that could not be read by the agents in the
      > port of departure. But it looked good.
      > 3. While stories of re-using a passport make great stories, it's been
      > my experience that while this was done, it was only by a very few
      people.
      > 4. There are a lot of myths and stories that have been romanticized
      > over the century; be careful what you believe unless you can
      > corroborate it.
      > 5. Most people were honest and did not want to be jailed or deported.
      > Most people did follow most of the rules.
      > 6. It does not suprise me that most people find very little paperwork,
      > unless your immigrant was a bigshot.
      > 7. Paperwork was much, much less rigorous than today. The notion of
      > "positive identification" photo-IDs, Social security numbers,
      > signature verification cards, etc. were simply not considered
      > necessary or in-use.
      > 8. Coming to America (or whereever) whas a two step process: emigrate
      > (leave a country) and immigrate (arrive in a country)
      > 8a. As long as the US quotas allowed, there was no reason to immigrate
      > "illegally"
      > 8b. Emigration was just something people did, especially the poor and
      > desparate. Your main objective was leaving.
      > 9. Interesting, a good chunk of these people who left with "improper"
      > paperwork, traveled back (pre-ww1) and forth. Once your became a
      > "resident alien" it was fine.
      > 10. Hungary was a vast country with many language and many cultures.
      > It was a nation of nations. This also made governing it quite
      > unwieldly. The union of Austria and Hungary just made the situation
      > worse.
      > 11. Every generalization I have made is just that, a generalization.
      > Exceptions abound.
      >
      >
      >
      > --- In Slovak-World@yahoogroups.com, "Gregory J Kopchak" <greg@> wrote:
      > >
      > >
      > > J. Michutka
      > >
      > > Starting in 1903 it was even illegal to possess information on
      > emmigration
      > > if you lived in Slovakia (Upper Hungary).
      > >
      > > It could be the authorities had targeted the village because of
      > concerns
      > > over excess immigration from the area..
      > >
      > > Greg Kopchak
      > > www.iarelative.com
      > >
      > >
      > > From Joseph Grisak's autobiography:
      > > http://www.saed.kent.edu/~lucak/topica/Grisak.pdf
      > >
      > > (p. 87)When I left the old country, I did not write a letter home
      > from the
      > > waterfront in Bremen as was the custom. However, I did write after
      I got
      > > a job and enclosed the General Pass that I borrowed with my
      letter. The
      > > envelope was rather bulky and apparently it never reached my parents.
      > > Later, I was told that it was good that my letter containing the
      > Pass got
      > > lost. <No explanation of why it was good that it got lost>
      > >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
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