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34206Re: Hungarian March my Grandfather used to hum

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  • whiteox_nelson
    Nov 24, 2012
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      Dammit! Hungarians have no friends. I'm neither here or there with it and even though I speak the language and understand the history AND the current faction strife between Slovakia and Hungary, I lean not one way or another.
      Closely examining the history of the interaction between the two nations, I blame the Hapsbergs and their policies which forced the Hungarians into Magyarization.
      It was a simple case of either speaking German or Hungarian, where the Hungarians were most put out by the influx of German (and other) immigrants into 'their historical land' after the Ottomans were driven out. All you need to verify this is the frustration of Esterhazy, the owner of large tracts of Slovak lands who saw the disenfranchisement of the Hungarian nation by the new emigrants from Germany and Austria as early as 1710.
      All in all, the Hungarians have always seen the Slovaks and Rusyns as brothers and not 'immigrants'. After all they've been there a long, long time. It's not only the Slovaks, but also the Cumans - the dreaded enemy of the Hungarians who were allowed to settle being driven out of their homeland by the Mongols. Romanians too were asked to settle (with the Teutonic Germans) in Transylvania living with the Szekelys. The history of Hungarian settlement is that of acceptance and not abuse. Even the iconic King of Hungary - St Stephen, married a Germanic Frankish princess and Christianized the Nation, much to the horror of the pagan populace.
      That's hard to believe from today's perspective yet my genealogical studies have shown a remarkable acceptance of Slovaks in the area once known as the Royal Kingdom of Hungary ~ the present day Slovakia. Hungary was never the enemy of Slovaks ~ it was only the protectionism of Magyarization against the Hapsberg Germanic policies that would of forced the Slovaks and all the rest of the 15 or so ethnic groups to speak German within pre 1914 old Hungary. Sure in hindsight it was a mistake and a bad one at that. It could have been handled better, but when a greater power tries to force their language and culture onto a sovereign nation then what can the nation do? Obviously protect itself. No doubt that Hungary's answer was wrong and Magyarization was a knee jerk reaction to a threatening situation.
      I wish I could apologize for the Hungarians yet my family was intensively Magyarized (assimilated) until there was very little left of their Moravian culture. Nowadays a Hungarian is very rarely a Magyar. What I mean by that is much of the populace speak the language but are Slavik, German or Romanian in origin. Not only that, but the (true) Hungarians will disappear gradually as their birthrate is lower than their death rate. So what was a symbiosis for a thousand years will probably disappear in a century. I fear the fate of Hungarians, like the Circassians, they will disappear.
      Sorry about the rant.
      Peter M.
      --- In Slovak-World@yahoogroups.com, LongJohn Wayne <daxthewarrior@...> wrote:
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      > Martin:
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      > Sorry to take so long.  It was requested by another member that my participation here was not beneficial to the group.  While I disagreed, I acquiesced.  While I have been monitoring many threads here, I have refrained from comment.
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      > I did tell this opinionated individual that I would reply once I got an answer to your question.  However, the answer was not helpful or informative.  But I did give you my word to do so.  And I am not the kind of person who breaks his word.
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      > I had mentioned in a prior thread about how Slovaks were subjugated during the Austro-Hungarian empire by being 'forced' [my words, not the words of some members of this group] to sing certain pieces in Hungarian & being punished for singing or speaking in Slovak -- or other native tongues.  Whether any of this is true, it is part of the fabric & folklore that was handed down to me.
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      > You had asked, Martin, if I could get any additional information on the song or the lyrics.  I finally heard back from my Uncle.  Unfortunately, he is unfamiliar of the tale told by my other Uncle.  He passed away some years back, so the tale ends w/ him.  The uncle who does not recall that story is the youngest of the family from ME & is the sole survivor of 11 siblings.
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      > I wish I had better news or information to provide.
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      > I am still here, & wish all members of this informative & useful NewsGroup a very safe & happy Thanksgiving!  And to return to read your posts in silence.
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      > Veselé Vianoce,
      > Chuck W.
      > [Only 1/2 Slovak]
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      > --- On Fri, 11/23/12, votrubam <votrubam@...> wrote:
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      > From: votrubam <votrubam@...>
      > Subject: [Slovak-World] Re: Emigration to AUSTRALIA
      > To: Slovak-World@yahoogroups.com
      > Date: Friday, November 23, 2012, 8:49 AM
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      > > Sorry, but you are incorrect.
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      > No need to be sorry, both preposition are correct.
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      > > The prefix "E" literally means "OUT OF" .. like "EX" in Latin.
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      > > The prefix "IM" (a version of "IN") means 'INTO' ...
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      > Certainly, and the prefixes have nothing to do with the prepositions. In a sentence, each preposition indicates, separately, "the place of departure" and "the place of arrival."
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      > Emigrate means "depart, leave, abandon..." They all go with both "the place of departure" and "the place of arrival": The aircraft departed from Slovakia for America. Jozo Kovac left his garden for the post office.
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      > Immigrate means "come, arrive, enter..." They all go with both "the place of departure" and "the place of arrival": The aircraft came to America from Slovakia. Jozo Kovac entered the room from the hallway.
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      > To say otherwise is like fantasizing that it might be "incorrect" to say, _He entered from the hallway_, "because enter means 'into,' so you mustn't say 'where from.'"
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      > The following sentences are perfectly correct, the difference is one of a perspective -- are we viewing Jozo from his home country (emigrated, emigrant) or are we viewing Jozo from his target country (immigrated, immigrant)? Both the place of departure and the place of arrival can be, correctly, expressed in both instances:
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      > Jozo emigrated from Slovakia to America. (Jozo viewed from SK)
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      > Jozo immigrated from Slovakia to America. (Jozo viewed from the US)
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      > Martin
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