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Re: [SherlineCNC] Anyone modified the motor control for PWM support

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  • Alan Marconett KM6VV
    Hi Mike (?), KB Electronics is where I ve seen the info on the controller before. http://www.kbelectronics.com They don t seem to be coming up for some reason.
    Message 1 of 12 , Oct 6, 2003
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      Hi Mike (?),

      KB Electronics is where I've seen the info on the controller before.

      http://www.kbelectronics.com

      They don't seem to be coming up for some reason. I believe I have a PDF
      on another machine, If this site refuses to work, I can email it to you.

      I was considering using a Dallas Semiconductor "programmable Pot" to
      implement speed control on my machines. I believe it could be the
      "external pot" for the KB controllers. NOTE: must be one of the newer
      mill/lathes, not the much older "light dimmer" version that Sherline
      sold 10+ years ago.

      I'm guessing that's a PWM signal that Mach2 would generate for you? I
      was thinking of sending up/down pulses to one of these "pots" to do the
      job (I'll have to check my notes).

      I think this would be a good addition to CNC'd Sherlines. I never
      guessed how much I would like and use a simple spindle on/off control
      that I've got on my Sherline mill and lathe! I'll bet the speed control
      via an 'S' word (S1000) would be GREAT to have!

      Alan KM6VV

      mszollar wrote:
      >
      > I was thinking about possible modifications to the motor circuit in
      > order to support Mach2 motor speed control. Mach2 is capable of
      > generating a signal that can be converted into voltage (based on
      > pulses per second). I was poking around (with no luck so far) to
      > find the schematic (or information) on the Sherline motor control to
      > help but just in case anyone has ventured into this area I thought
      > I'd ask.
    • Antonius J.M. Groothuizen
      Alan: The part numbers on my lathe and mill are both KBLC-240DS (3375B) which is no longer listed on their site. I d appreciate a copy of the datasheet if you
      Message 2 of 12 , Oct 6, 2003
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        Alan:

        The part numbers on my lathe and mill are both KBLC-240DS (3375B)
        which is no longer listed on their site. I'd appreciate a copy of
        the datasheet if you can locate it.

        You might have a problem with the Dallas One Wire pots. Last time I
        checked these were only available as 100K devices. The pots in my
        controls are both 5K.

        BTW I'll be looking at closed loop spindle speed control and possibly
        position feedback or control via a PIC hanging off of the parallel
        port in the next six months or so. I'll also provide an index pulse
        for threading operations, and am considering using the current pot
        for speed override. Spindle direction and power should probably be
        provided by the PIC as well. I'll want to use the PIC for other
        functions (perhaps control of Joe's tool changer) to offload these
        from the CPU.

        Tony

        --- In SherlineCNC@yahoogroups.com, Alan Marconett KM6VV <KM6VV@a...>
        wrote:
        > Hi Mike (?),
        >
        > KB Electronics is where I've seen the info on the controller
        before.
        >
        > http://www.kbelectronics.com
        >
        > They don't seem to be coming up for some reason. I believe I have
        a PDF
        > on another machine, If this site refuses to work, I can email it to
        you.
        >
        > I was considering using a Dallas Semiconductor "programmable Pot" to
        > implement speed control on my machines. I believe it could be the
        > "external pot" for the KB controllers. NOTE: must be one of the
        newer
        > mill/lathes, not the much older "light dimmer" version that Sherline
        > sold 10+ years ago.
        >
        > I'm guessing that's a PWM signal that Mach2 would generate for
        you? I
        > was thinking of sending up/down pulses to one of these "pots" to do
        the
        > job (I'll have to check my notes).
        >
        > I think this would be a good addition to CNC'd Sherlines. I never
        > guessed how much I would like and use a simple spindle on/off
        control
        > that I've got on my Sherline mill and lathe! I'll bet the speed
        control
        > via an 'S' word (S1000) would be GREAT to have!
        >
        > Alan KM6VV
        >
        > mszollar wrote:
        > >
        > > I was thinking about possible modifications to the motor circuit
        in
        > > order to support Mach2 motor speed control. Mach2 is capable of
        > > generating a signal that can be converted into voltage (based on
        > > pulses per second). I was poking around (with no luck so far) to
        > > find the schematic (or information) on the Sherline motor control
        to
        > > help but just in case anyone has ventured into this area I thought
        > > I'd ask.
      • RichD
        The KB Electronics model KBIC controller is identical to the Sherline except for footprint. An external DC voltage is applied to the supplied connecting pins.
        Message 3 of 12 , Oct 6, 2003
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          The KB Electronics model KBIC controller is identical to the Sherline
          except for footprint. An external DC voltage is applied to the supplied
          connecting pins. Warning: all connections must be isolated as the entire
          circuit is at line voltage. This means some kind of isolation/conversion
          circuit is needed. There is also a disable connection (but still hot to go).
          RichD

          mszollar wrote:
          >
          > I was thinking about possible modifications to the motor circuit in
          > order to support Mach2 motor speed control. Mach2 is capable of
          > generating a signal that can be converted into voltage (based on
          > pulses per second). I was poking around (with no luck so far) to
          > find the schematic (or information) on the Sherline motor control to
          > help but just in case anyone has ventured into this area I thought
          > I'd ask.
        • Alan Marconett KM6VV
          Hi Tony, I found and posted a PDF that KB supplied (still can t get to their URL) for the KBIC-240DS in the files section under KBIC. It s not much more then
          Message 4 of 12 , Oct 6, 2003
          • 0 Attachment
            Hi Tony,

            I found and posted a PDF that KB supplied (still can't get to their URL)
            for the KBIC-240DS in the files section under KBIC. It's not much more
            then the hookup and physical data, Hope it helps.

            http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SherlineCNC/files/KBIC/

            It mentions a 5K external pot, and I seem to recall now that I only
            found a 10K (100K??) Dallas pot, as you mention.

            Your PIC work sounds like just what we need! Do you intend to make it
            available in some fashion to list members? I'd be interested in it, and
            I'm sure others would as well!

            Alan KM6VV


            "Antonius J.M. Groothuizen" wrote:
            >
            > Alan:
            >
            > The part numbers on my lathe and mill are both KBLC-240DS (3375B)
            > which is no longer listed on their site. I'd appreciate a copy of
            > the datasheet if you can locate it.
            >
            > You might have a problem with the Dallas One Wire pots. Last time I
            > checked these were only available as 100K devices. The pots in my
            > controls are both 5K.
            >
            > BTW I'll be looking at closed loop spindle speed control and possibly
            > position feedback or control via a PIC hanging off of the parallel
            > port in the next six months or so. I'll also provide an index pulse
            > for threading operations, and am considering using the current pot
            > for speed override. Spindle direction and power should probably be
            > provided by the PIC as well. I'll want to use the PIC for other
            > functions (perhaps control of Joe's tool changer) to offload these
            > from the CPU.
            >
            > Tony
            >
            > --- In SherlineCNC@yahoogroups.com, Alan Marconett KM6VV <KM6VV@a...>
            > wrote:
            > > Hi Mike (?),
            > >
            > > KB Electronics is where I've seen the info on the controller
            > before.
            > >
            > > http://www.kbelectronics.com
            > >
            > > They don't seem to be coming up for some reason. I believe I have
            > a PDF
            > > on another machine, If this site refuses to work, I can email it to
            > you.
            > >
            > > I was considering using a Dallas Semiconductor "programmable Pot" to
            > > implement speed control on my machines. I believe it could be the
            > > "external pot" for the KB controllers. NOTE: must be one of the
            > newer
            > > mill/lathes, not the much older "light dimmer" version that Sherline
            > > sold 10+ years ago.
            > >
            > > I'm guessing that's a PWM signal that Mach2 would generate for
            > you? I
            > > was thinking of sending up/down pulses to one of these "pots" to do
            > the
            > > job (I'll have to check my notes).
            > >
            > > I think this would be a good addition to CNC'd Sherlines. I never
            > > guessed how much I would like and use a simple spindle on/off
            > control
            > > that I've got on my Sherline mill and lathe! I'll bet the speed
            > control
            > > via an 'S' word (S1000) would be GREAT to have!
            > >
            > > Alan KM6VV
            > >
            > > mszollar wrote:
            > > >
            > > > I was thinking about possible modifications to the motor circuit
            > in
            > > > order to support Mach2 motor speed control. Mach2 is capable of
            > > > generating a signal that can be converted into voltage (based on
            > > > pulses per second). I was poking around (with no luck so far) to
            > > > find the schematic (or information) on the Sherline motor control
            > to
            > > > help but just in case anyone has ventured into this area I thought
            > > > I'd ask.
            >
            >
            > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
            > SherlineCNC-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
            >
            >
            >
            > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
          • RichD
            Alan, The actual value of the pot is not important. 5 to 10K is OK. It s just a voltage divider across a V supply. The wiper is the ref voltage for the speed
            Message 5 of 12 , Oct 6, 2003
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              Alan,
              The actual value of the pot is not important. 5 to 10K is OK. It's just
              a voltage divider across a V supply. The wiper is the ref voltage for
              the speed amp.
              Like I said, this board is ALL !!! HOT......Be carefull.
              RichD

              Alan Marconett KM6VV wrote:
              >
              > Hi Tony,
              >
              > I found and posted a PDF that KB supplied (still can't get to their URL)
              > for the KBIC-240DS in the files section under KBIC. It's not much more
              > then the hookup and physical data, Hope it helps.
              >
              > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SherlineCNC/files/KBIC/
              >
              > It mentions a 5K external pot, and I seem to recall now that I only
              > found a 10K (100K??) Dallas pot, as you mention.
              >
              > Your PIC work sounds like just what we need! Do you intend to make it
              > available in some fashion to list members? I'd be interested in it, and
              > I'm sure others would as well!
              >
              > Alan KM6VV
              >
              >
              > "Antonius J.M. Groothuizen" wrote:
              > >
              > > Alan:
              > >
              > > The part numbers on my lathe and mill are both KBLC-240DS (3375B)
              > > which is no longer listed on their site. I'd appreciate a copy of
              > > the datasheet if you can locate it.
              > >
              > > You might have a problem with the Dallas One Wire pots. Last time I
              > > checked these were only available as 100K devices. The pots in my
              > > controls are both 5K.
              > >
              > > BTW I'll be looking at closed loop spindle speed control and possibly
              > > position feedback or control via a PIC hanging off of the parallel
              > > port in the next six months or so. I'll also provide an index pulse
              > > for threading operations, and am considering using the current pot
              > > for speed override. Spindle direction and power should probably be
              > > provided by the PIC as well. I'll want to use the PIC for other
              > > functions (perhaps control of Joe's tool changer) to offload these
              > > from the CPU.
              > >
              > > Tony
              > >
              > > --- In SherlineCNC@yahoogroups.com, Alan Marconett KM6VV <KM6VV@a...>
              > > wrote:
              > > > Hi Mike (?),
              > > >
              > > > KB Electronics is where I've seen the info on the controller
              > > before.
              > > >
              > > > http://www.kbelectronics.com
              > > >
              > > > They don't seem to be coming up for some reason. I believe I have
              > > a PDF
              > > > on another machine, If this site refuses to work, I can email it to
              > > you.
              > > >
              > > > I was considering using a Dallas Semiconductor "programmable Pot" to
              > > > implement speed control on my machines. I believe it could be the
              > > > "external pot" for the KB controllers. NOTE: must be one of the
              > > newer
              > > > mill/lathes, not the much older "light dimmer" version that Sherline
              > > > sold 10+ years ago.
              > > >
              > > > I'm guessing that's a PWM signal that Mach2 would generate for
              > > you? I
              > > > was thinking of sending up/down pulses to one of these "pots" to do
              > > the
              > > > job (I'll have to check my notes).
              > > >
              > > > I think this would be a good addition to CNC'd Sherlines. I never
              > > > guessed how much I would like and use a simple spindle on/off
              > > control
              > > > that I've got on my Sherline mill and lathe! I'll bet the speed
              > > control
              > > > via an 'S' word (S1000) would be GREAT to have!
              > > >
              > > > Alan KM6VV
              > > >
              > > > mszollar wrote:
              > > > >
              > > > > I was thinking about possible modifications to the motor circuit
              > > in
              > > > > order to support Mach2 motor speed control. Mach2 is capable of
              > > > > generating a signal that can be converted into voltage (based on
              > > > > pulses per second). I was poking around (with no luck so far) to
              > > > > find the schematic (or information) on the Sherline motor control
              > > to
              > > > > help but just in case anyone has ventured into this area I thought
              > > > > I'd ask.
              > >
              > >
              > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
              > > SherlineCNC-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
              >
              >
              > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
              > SherlineCNC-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
              >
              >
              >
              > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

              --
              ~ ~~ ~ ~ ~~ ~~____~,~~ ~~~~
              \------/ |00|_[]_[]__||0 C.M.Ry Tenwheeler
              .|_CMRy_|-|__|________|_|, <<<Under construction>>>
              __________''oo__oo__---"0=0=0"=o[]o\\_____________________________
              --=Rich=--=Colorado Midland Railway=-=cmsteam@...=-
              ******************************************************************
              You need only two tools: WD-40 & Duct Tape. If it doesn't move and
              should, use WD-40. If it moves and shouldn't, use the duct tape.
            • Antonius J.M. Groothuizen
              Alan: Thank you, it s enough to get me started. Although I m tackling this for myself, I ve seen that there is a fair amount of interest in this. I haven t
              Message 6 of 12 , Oct 6, 2003
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                Alan:

                Thank you, it's enough to get me started.

                Although I'm tackling this for myself, I've seen that there is a fair
                amount of interest in this. I haven't determined yet how I'm going to
                package or distribute it as there are considerations other than the
                hardware I need to look into.




                RichD:
                Thanks for the Warning: "all connections must be isolated as the
                entire circuit is at line voltage. This means some kind of
                isolation/conversion circuit is needed. There is also a disable
                connection (but still hot to go)."

                Tony





                --- In SherlineCNC@yahoogroups.com, Alan Marconett KM6VV <KM6VV@a...>
                wrote:
                > Hi Tony,
                >
                > I found and posted a PDF that KB supplied (still can't get to their
                URL)
                > for the KBIC-240DS in the files section under KBIC. It's not much
                more
                > then the hookup and physical data, Hope it helps.
                >
                > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SherlineCNC/files/KBIC/
                >
                > It mentions a 5K external pot, and I seem to recall now that I only
                > found a 10K (100K??) Dallas pot, as you mention.
                >
                > Your PIC work sounds like just what we need! Do you intend to make
                it
                > available in some fashion to list members? I'd be interested in
                it, and
                > I'm sure others would as well!
                >
                > Alan KM6VV
                >
                >
                > "Antonius J.M. Groothuizen" wrote:
                > >
                > > Alan:
                > >
                > > The part numbers on my lathe and mill are both KBLC-240DS (3375B)
                > > which is no longer listed on their site. I'd appreciate a copy of
                > > the datasheet if you can locate it.
                > >
                > > You might have a problem with the Dallas One Wire pots. Last
                time I
                > > checked these were only available as 100K devices. The pots in my
                > > controls are both 5K.
                > >
                > > BTW I'll be looking at closed loop spindle speed control and
                possibly
                > > position feedback or control via a PIC hanging off of the parallel
                > > port in the next six months or so. I'll also provide an index
                pulse
                > > for threading operations, and am considering using the current pot
                > > for speed override. Spindle direction and power should probably
                be
                > > provided by the PIC as well. I'll want to use the PIC for other
                > > functions (perhaps control of Joe's tool changer) to offload these
                > > from the CPU.
                > >
                > > Tony
                > >
                > > --- In SherlineCNC@yahoogroups.com, Alan Marconett KM6VV
                <KM6VV@a...>
                > > wrote:
                > > > Hi Mike (?),
                > > >
                > > > KB Electronics is where I've seen the info on the controller
                > > before.
                > > >
                > > > http://www.kbelectronics.com
                > > >
                > > > They don't seem to be coming up for some reason. I believe I
                have
                > > a PDF
                > > > on another machine, If this site refuses to work, I can email
                it to
                > > you.
                > > >
                > > > I was considering using a Dallas Semiconductor "programmable
                Pot" to
                > > > implement speed control on my machines. I believe it could be
                the
                > > > "external pot" for the KB controllers. NOTE: must be one of the
                > > newer
                > > > mill/lathes, not the much older "light dimmer" version that
                Sherline
                > > > sold 10+ years ago.
                > > >
                > > > I'm guessing that's a PWM signal that Mach2 would generate for
                > > you? I
                > > > was thinking of sending up/down pulses to one of these "pots"
                to do
                > > the
                > > > job (I'll have to check my notes).
                > > >
                > > > I think this would be a good addition to CNC'd Sherlines. I
                never
                > > > guessed how much I would like and use a simple spindle on/off
                > > control
                > > > that I've got on my Sherline mill and lathe! I'll bet the speed
                > > control
                > > > via an 'S' word (S1000) would be GREAT to have!
                > > >
                > > > Alan KM6VV
                > > >
                > > > mszollar wrote:
                > > > >
                > > > > I was thinking about possible modifications to the motor
                circuit
                > > in
                > > > > order to support Mach2 motor speed control. Mach2 is capable
                of
                > > > > generating a signal that can be converted into voltage (based
                on
                > > > > pulses per second). I was poking around (with no luck so
                far) to
                > > > > find the schematic (or information) on the Sherline motor
                control
                > > to
                > > > > help but just in case anyone has ventured into this area I
                thought
                > > > > I'd ask.
                > >
                > >
                > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                > > SherlineCNC-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
                http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
              • Alan Marconett KM6VV
                Thanks Rich, Good idea! Alan KM6VV
                Message 7 of 12 , Oct 6, 2003
                • 0 Attachment
                  Thanks Rich,

                  Good idea!

                  Alan KM6VV

                  RichD wrote:
                  >
                  > Alan,
                  > The actual value of the pot is not important. 5 to 10K is OK. It's just
                  > a voltage divider across a V supply. The wiper is the ref voltage for
                  > the speed amp.
                  > Like I said, this board is ALL !!! HOT......Be carefull.
                  > RichD
                  >
                  > Alan Marconett KM6VV wrote:
                  > >
                  > > Hi Tony,
                  > >
                  > > I found and posted a PDF that KB supplied (still can't get to their URL)
                  > > for the KBIC-240DS in the files section under KBIC. It's not much more
                  > > then the hookup and physical data, Hope it helps.
                  > >
                  > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SherlineCNC/files/KBIC/
                  > >
                  > > It mentions a 5K external pot, and I seem to recall now that I only
                  > > found a 10K (100K??) Dallas pot, as you mention.
                  > >
                  > > Your PIC work sounds like just what we need! Do you intend to make it
                  > > available in some fashion to list members? I'd be interested in it, and
                  > > I'm sure others would as well!
                  > >
                  > > Alan KM6VV
                • Flosi Gudmundsson
                  Hi all, I don t know if you have or need the diagram of the controller, here is a link to it anyway: http://www.pwm.pe.kr/images/sherlinemotor.jpg Regards,
                  Message 8 of 12 , Oct 7, 2003
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                    Hi all,

                    I don't know if you have or need the diagram of the controller, here
                    is a link to it anyway:
                    http://www.pwm.pe.kr/images/sherlinemotor.jpg

                    Regards,
                    Flosi in Iceland

                    --- In SherlineCNC@yahoogroups.com, "Antonius J.M. Groothuizen"
                    <agroot@s...> wrote:
                    >
                    > Alan:
                    >
                    > Thank you, it's enough to get me started.
                    >
                    > Although I'm tackling this for myself, I've seen that there is a
                    fair
                    > amount of interest in this. I haven't determined yet how I'm going
                    to
                    > package or distribute it as there are considerations other than the
                    > hardware I need to look into.
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > RichD:
                    > Thanks for the Warning: "all connections must be isolated as the
                    > entire circuit is at line voltage. This means some kind of
                    > isolation/conversion circuit is needed. There is also a disable
                    > connection (but still hot to go)."
                    >
                    > Tony
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > --- In SherlineCNC@yahoogroups.com, Alan Marconett KM6VV
                    <KM6VV@a...>
                    > wrote:
                    > > Hi Tony,
                    > >
                    > > I found and posted a PDF that KB supplied (still can't get to
                    their
                    > URL)
                    > > for the KBIC-240DS in the files section under KBIC. It's not
                    much
                    > more
                    > > then the hookup and physical data, Hope it helps.
                    > >
                    > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SherlineCNC/files/KBIC/
                    > >
                    > > It mentions a 5K external pot, and I seem to recall now that I
                    only
                    > > found a 10K (100K??) Dallas pot, as you mention.
                    > >
                    > > Your PIC work sounds like just what we need! Do you intend to
                    make
                    > it
                    > > available in some fashion to list members? I'd be interested in
                    > it, and
                    > > I'm sure others would as well!
                    > >
                    > > Alan KM6VV
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > "Antonius J.M. Groothuizen" wrote:
                    > > >
                    > > > Alan:
                    > > >
                    > > > The part numbers on my lathe and mill are both KBLC-240DS
                    (3375B)
                    > > > which is no longer listed on their site. I'd appreciate a copy
                    of
                    > > > the datasheet if you can locate it.
                    > > >
                    > > > You might have a problem with the Dallas One Wire pots. Last
                    > time I
                    > > > checked these were only available as 100K devices. The pots in
                    my
                    > > > controls are both 5K.
                    > > >
                    > > > BTW I'll be looking at closed loop spindle speed control and
                    > possibly
                    > > > position feedback or control via a PIC hanging off of the
                    parallel
                    > > > port in the next six months or so. I'll also provide an index
                    > pulse
                    > > > for threading operations, and am considering using the current
                    pot
                    > > > for speed override. Spindle direction and power should
                    probably
                    > be
                    > > > provided by the PIC as well. I'll want to use the PIC for other
                    > > > functions (perhaps control of Joe's tool changer) to offload
                    these
                    > > > from the CPU.
                    > > >
                    > > > Tony
                    > > >
                    > > > --- In SherlineCNC@yahoogroups.com, Alan Marconett KM6VV
                    > <KM6VV@a...>
                    > > > wrote:
                    > > > > Hi Mike (?),
                    > > > >
                    > > > > KB Electronics is where I've seen the info on the controller
                    > > > before.
                    > > > >
                    > > > > http://www.kbelectronics.com
                    > > > >
                    > > > > They don't seem to be coming up for some reason. I believe I
                    > have
                    > > > a PDF
                    > > > > on another machine, If this site refuses to work, I can email
                    > it to
                    > > > you.
                    > > > >
                    > > > > I was considering using a Dallas Semiconductor "programmable
                    > Pot" to
                    > > > > implement speed control on my machines. I believe it could
                    be
                    > the
                    > > > > "external pot" for the KB controllers. NOTE: must be one of
                    the
                    > > > newer
                    > > > > mill/lathes, not the much older "light dimmer" version that
                    > Sherline
                    > > > > sold 10+ years ago.
                    > > > >
                    > > > > I'm guessing that's a PWM signal that Mach2 would generate for
                    > > > you? I
                    > > > > was thinking of sending up/down pulses to one of these "pots"
                    > to do
                    > > > the
                    > > > > job (I'll have to check my notes).
                    > > > >
                    > > > > I think this would be a good addition to CNC'd Sherlines. I
                    > never
                    > > > > guessed how much I would like and use a simple spindle on/off
                    > > > control
                    > > > > that I've got on my Sherline mill and lathe! I'll bet the
                    speed
                    > > > control
                    > > > > via an 'S' word (S1000) would be GREAT to have!
                    > > > >
                    > > > > Alan KM6VV
                    > > > >
                    > > > > mszollar wrote:
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > > I was thinking about possible modifications to the motor
                    > circuit
                    > > > in
                    > > > > > order to support Mach2 motor speed control. Mach2 is
                    capable
                    > of
                    > > > > > generating a signal that can be converted into voltage
                    (based
                    > on
                    > > > > > pulses per second). I was poking around (with no luck so
                    > far) to
                    > > > > > find the schematic (or information) on the Sherline motor
                    > control
                    > > > to
                    > > > > > help but just in case anyone has ventured into this area I
                    > thought
                    > > > > > I'd ask.
                    > > >
                    > > >
                    > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                    > > > SherlineCNC-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                    > > >
                    > > >
                    > > >
                    > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
                    > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                  • ballendo
                    Hello, It might be clunky , but a size 11 or 17 stepper(from a disk drive) could be used to turn the existing pot (perhaps with a piece of rubber tubing on
                    Message 9 of 12 , Oct 7, 2003
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                      Hello,

                      It might be "clunky", but a size 11 or 17 stepper(from a disk drive)
                      could be used to turn the existing pot (perhaps with a piece of
                      rubber tubing on its shaft, by friction). Use a 4th axis to set
                      speed; with Mach2 this could be "macro'd"...

                      Hope this helps,

                      Ballendo

                      P.S. Yes, I know it would make more sense to find the "right" spot on
                      the KB bd... (why not just use the pot connections themselves; it's
                      very likely the pot is providing a "voltage" to some part of the
                      circuit;which you can get from your PWM)

                      --- In SherlineCNC@yahoogroups.com, Alan Marconett KM6VV <KM6VV@a...>
                      wrote:
                      > Hi Mike (?),
                      >
                      > KB Electronics is where I've seen the info on the controller
                      before.
                      >
                      > http://www.kbelectronics.com
                      >
                      > They don't seem to be coming up for some reason. I believe I have
                      a PDF
                      > on another machine, If this site refuses to work, I can email it to
                      you.
                      >
                      > I was considering using a Dallas Semiconductor "programmable Pot" to
                      > implement speed control on my machines. I believe it could be the
                      > "external pot" for the KB controllers. NOTE: must be one of the
                      newer
                      > mill/lathes, not the much older "light dimmer" version that Sherline
                      > sold 10+ years ago.
                      >
                      > I'm guessing that's a PWM signal that Mach2 would generate for
                      you? I
                      > was thinking of sending up/down pulses to one of these "pots" to do
                      the
                      > job (I'll have to check my notes).
                      >
                      > I think this would be a good addition to CNC'd Sherlines. I never
                      > guessed how much I would like and use a simple spindle on/off
                      control
                      > that I've got on my Sherline mill and lathe! I'll bet the speed
                      control
                      > via an 'S' word (S1000) would be GREAT to have!
                      >
                      > Alan KM6VV
                      >
                      > mszollar wrote:
                      > >
                      > > I was thinking about possible modifications to the motor circuit
                      in
                      > > order to support Mach2 motor speed control. Mach2 is capable of
                      > > generating a signal that can be converted into voltage (based on
                      > > pulses per second). I was poking around (with no luck so far) to
                      > > find the schematic (or information) on the Sherline motor control
                      to
                      > > help but just in case anyone has ventured into this area I thought
                      > > I'd ask.
                    • Antonius J.M. Groothuizen
                      Thanks Flosi, I d like to make some comments before I put this away for a few months... RichD is VERY right in his warning. This circuit incorporates a
                      Message 10 of 12 , Oct 7, 2003
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                        Thanks Flosi,

                        I'd like to make some comments before I put this away for a few
                        months...

                        RichD is VERY right in his warning. This circuit incorporates a
                        floating ground, meaning it's somewhere between L1 and L2. Safe
                        under normal operating conditions, but a 2' X 5' screen made of 18
                        guage steel wire on 1/4" centers still bears the the 1.5" deep
                        impression of a trained technician I saw get distracted while working
                        in a similar circuit.

                        The controller is an SCR based device. PWM control can be
                        implemented, but will involve conversion to 0-22V You'd probably
                        have to give up the internal min/max speed settings when you do this.


                        The Maxim (Dallas Semiconductor) DS2890 can probably be used in a
                        closed loop control system. Maximum value between the 'resistor'
                        terminals and ground is only 11V, so signal conditioning circuitry
                        will be required. I'd insist on the use of opto-isolators for ALL of
                        its connections to other interface circuitry due to the floating
                        ground. This is a linear 256 step device so with a closed loop I'd
                        expect to be able to control the spindle (10K pulley installed) + or -
                        10 RPM over its entire operating range (depends on feedback rate).

                        If anyone gets to this before I do, I'd be very interested in your
                        results. Design and testing of this circuit is NOT recommended for
                        those lacking electronic experience.

                        Tony

                        --- In SherlineCNC@yahoogroups.com, "Flosi Gudmundsson"
                        <flosigud@s...> wrote:
                        > Hi all,
                        >
                        > I don't know if you have or need the diagram of the controller,
                        here
                        > is a link to it anyway:
                        > http://www.pwm.pe.kr/images/sherlinemotor.jpg
                        >
                        > Regards,
                        > Flosi in Iceland
                        >
                        > --- In SherlineCNC@yahoogroups.com, "Antonius J.M. Groothuizen"
                        > <agroot@s...> wrote:
                        > >
                        > > Alan:
                        > >
                        > > Thank you, it's enough to get me started.
                        > >
                        > > Although I'm tackling this for myself, I've seen that there is a
                        > fair
                        > > amount of interest in this. I haven't determined yet how I'm
                        going
                        > to
                        > > package or distribute it as there are considerations other than
                        the
                        > > hardware I need to look into.
                        > >
                        > >
                        > >
                        > >
                        > > RichD:
                        > > Thanks for the Warning: "all connections must be isolated as the
                        > > entire circuit is at line voltage. This means some kind of
                        > > isolation/conversion circuit is needed. There is also a disable
                        > > connection (but still hot to go)."
                        > >
                        > > Tony
                        > >
                        > >
                        > >
                        > >
                        > >
                        > > --- In SherlineCNC@yahoogroups.com, Alan Marconett KM6VV
                        > <KM6VV@a...>
                        > > wrote:
                        > > > Hi Tony,
                        > > >
                        > > > I found and posted a PDF that KB supplied (still can't get to
                        > their
                        > > URL)
                        > > > for the KBIC-240DS in the files section under KBIC. It's not
                        > much
                        > > more
                        > > > then the hookup and physical data, Hope it helps.
                        > > >
                        > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SherlineCNC/files/KBIC/
                        > > >
                        > > > It mentions a 5K external pot, and I seem to recall now that I
                        > only
                        > > > found a 10K (100K??) Dallas pot, as you mention.
                        > > >
                        > > > Your PIC work sounds like just what we need! Do you intend to
                        > make
                        > > it
                        > > > available in some fashion to list members? I'd be interested
                        in
                        > > it, and
                        > > > I'm sure others would as well!
                        > > >
                        > > > Alan KM6VV
                        > > >
                        > > >
                        > > > "Antonius J.M. Groothuizen" wrote:
                        > > > >
                        > > > > Alan:
                        > > > >
                        > > > > The part numbers on my lathe and mill are both KBLC-240DS
                        > (3375B)
                        > > > > which is no longer listed on their site. I'd appreciate a
                        copy
                        > of
                        > > > > the datasheet if you can locate it.
                        > > > >
                        > > > > You might have a problem with the Dallas One Wire pots. Last
                        > > time I
                        > > > > checked these were only available as 100K devices. The pots
                        in
                        > my
                        > > > > controls are both 5K.
                        > > > >
                        > > > > BTW I'll be looking at closed loop spindle speed control and
                        > > possibly
                        > > > > position feedback or control via a PIC hanging off of the
                        > parallel
                        > > > > port in the next six months or so. I'll also provide an index
                        > > pulse
                        > > > > for threading operations, and am considering using the
                        current
                        > pot
                        > > > > for speed override. Spindle direction and power should
                        > probably
                        > > be
                        > > > > provided by the PIC as well. I'll want to use the PIC for
                        other
                        > > > > functions (perhaps control of Joe's tool changer) to offload
                        > these
                        > > > > from the CPU.
                        > > > >
                        > > > > Tony
                        > > > >
                        > > > > --- In SherlineCNC@yahoogroups.com, Alan Marconett KM6VV
                        > > <KM6VV@a...>
                        > > > > wrote:
                        > > > > > Hi Mike (?),
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > KB Electronics is where I've seen the info on the controller
                        > > > > before.
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > http://www.kbelectronics.com
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > They don't seem to be coming up for some reason. I believe
                        I
                        > > have
                        > > > > a PDF
                        > > > > > on another machine, If this site refuses to work, I can
                        email
                        > > it to
                        > > > > you.
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > I was considering using a Dallas
                        Semiconductor "programmable
                        > > Pot" to
                        > > > > > implement speed control on my machines. I believe it could
                        > be
                        > > the
                        > > > > > "external pot" for the KB controllers. NOTE: must be one
                        of
                        > the
                        > > > > newer
                        > > > > > mill/lathes, not the much older "light dimmer" version that
                        > > Sherline
                        > > > > > sold 10+ years ago.
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > I'm guessing that's a PWM signal that Mach2 would generate
                        for
                        > > > > you? I
                        > > > > > was thinking of sending up/down pulses to one of
                        these "pots"
                        > > to do
                        > > > > the
                        > > > > > job (I'll have to check my notes).
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > I think this would be a good addition to CNC'd Sherlines.
                        I
                        > > never
                        > > > > > guessed how much I would like and use a simple spindle
                        on/off
                        > > > > control
                        > > > > > that I've got on my Sherline mill and lathe! I'll bet the
                        > speed
                        > > > > control
                        > > > > > via an 'S' word (S1000) would be GREAT to have!
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > Alan KM6VV
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > mszollar wrote:
                        > > > > > >
                        > > > > > > I was thinking about possible modifications to the motor
                        > > circuit
                        > > > > in
                        > > > > > > order to support Mach2 motor speed control. Mach2 is
                        > capable
                        > > of
                        > > > > > > generating a signal that can be converted into voltage
                        > (based
                        > > on
                        > > > > > > pulses per second). I was poking around (with no luck so
                        > > far) to
                        > > > > > > find the schematic (or information) on the Sherline motor
                        > > control
                        > > > > to
                        > > > > > > help but just in case anyone has ventured into this area
                        I
                        > > thought
                        > > > > > > I'd ask.
                        > > > >
                        > > > >
                        > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                        > > > > SherlineCNC-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                        > > > >
                        > > > >
                        > > > >
                        > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
                        > > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                      • mszollar
                        The schematic clearly helps a lot (if it checks out). If the pot is as shown and part of a voltage divider circuit that would mean that a frequency to voltage
                        Message 11 of 12 , Oct 12, 2003
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                          The schematic clearly helps a lot (if it checks out). If the pot is
                          as shown and part of a voltage divider circuit that would mean that
                          a frequency to voltage circuit would work quite well. The LM2907 is
                          a FtoV chip that can output 1-28vdc based on a frequency input and
                          using Mach2 (which supports such a mechanism) would drive the
                          circuit quite well. There are a number of these circuits on the
                          mach1mach2cnc group (mostly 0-12vdc) but the correct chip selection
                          can get past this.

                          Thanks all for the help and I'll let you know how it works out.
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