Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

RE: [ScoutRadio] FCC 97.113 and summer camp radio merit badge

Expand Messages
  • Wayne W. Santos
    Sounds logical - but then decision aren t always based on logic or facts. Would be good if we could get BSA and the ARRL to finalize that MOU. To:
    Message 1 of 6 , Oct 13, 2009
    • 0 Attachment
      Sounds logical - but then decision aren't always based on logic or facts.
       
      Would be good if we could get BSA and the ARRL to finalize that MOU.
       

      To: ScoutRadio@yahoogroups.com
      CC: wb3fup@...
      From: w2bsa@...
      Date: Tue, 13 Oct 2009 11:57:21 -0400
      Subject: Re: [ScoutRadio] FCC 97.113 and summer camp radio merit badge

       
      That would come under the education exemption, in that the paid person
      who also has a ham radio
      license is teaching the Radio Merit badge class. There is nothing to
      preclude a licensee from doing that.
      The licensee gets no remuneration by virtue of the fact that the
      licensee is a ham.
      The licensee gets remuneration by virtue of the fact that the licensee
      is hired to teach. Most likely
      the licensee was hired to teach other merit badges as well, for example,
      computers and/or electronics and/or
      electricity, if I am remembering my merit badge titles right.

      Bill, W2BSA

      Stephen M. Shearer wrote:
      >
      >
      > The issue of FCC 97.113 has raised discussion in many email groups and
      > web forums. BSA summer camps running radio merit badge could have an
      > issue. "obviously" using ham radio for camp staff communications isn't
      > OK, but will making a radio contact (using paid camp staff) for radio
      > merit badge be an issue? Some camps have a volunteer running the merit
      > badge (lack of a ham in the camp staff). The merit badge communications
      > does "benefit the public" (the scout) and only indirectly the Camp (the
      > camp may get campers because of the merit badge - science camp for
      > example)...
      > Something to think/talk about. What do you think?
      >
      > also see:
      > http://www.arrl. org/news/ files/ARRL_ AppropriateUseGu idelines. pdf
      > <http://www.arrl. org/news/ files/ARRL_ AppropriateUseGu idelines. pdf>
      > <http://www.arrl. org/news/ files/ARRL_ AppropriateUseGu idelines. pdf
      > <http://www.arrl. org/news/ files/ARRL_ AppropriateUseGu idelines. pdf>>
      > and see: http://forums. qrz.com/showthre ad.php?t= 220443
      > <http://forums. qrz.com/showthre ad.php?t= 220443>
      > <http://forums. qrz.com/showthre ad.php?t= 220443
      > <http://forums. qrz.com/showthre ad.php?t= 220443>>
      >
      > steve WB3LGC
      >
      > ___
      >
      >




      Hotmail: Trusted email with Microsoft’s powerful SPAM protection. Sign up now.
    • Brian Mileshosky
      Although an MOU won t affect anything with regard to FCC s 97.113 as it relates to BSA teaching Radio merit badge, the proposed MOU text is on ARRL s Executive
      Message 2 of 6 , Oct 13, 2009
      • 0 Attachment
        Although an MOU won't affect anything with regard to FCC's 97.113 as it
        relates to BSA teaching Radio merit badge, the proposed MOU text is on
        ARRL's Executive Committee's agenda for their upcoming meeting, at which
        point I expect formal interaction with BSA to get it in a mutually
        agreeable form, and ultimately approval.

        73,
        Brian N5ZGT
        Chairman, ARRL ad hoc Committee on Scouting
        ARRL Director, Rocky Mountain Division
        www.RockyMountainDivision.org


        On Tue, 13 Oct 2009, Wayne W. Santos wrote:

        >
        > Sounds logical - but then decision aren't always based on logic or facts.
        >
        >
        >
        > Would be good if we could get BSA and the ARRL to finalize that MOU.
        >
        >
        >
        > To: ScoutRadio@yahoogroups.com
        > CC: wb3fup@...
        > From: w2bsa@...
        > Date: Tue, 13 Oct 2009 11:57:21 -0400
        > Subject: Re: [ScoutRadio] FCC 97.113 and summer camp radio merit badge
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > That would come under the education exemption, in that the paid person
        > who also has a ham radio
        > license is teaching the Radio Merit badge class. There is nothing to
        > preclude a licensee from doing that.
        > The licensee gets no remuneration by virtue of the fact that the
        > licensee is a ham.
        > The licensee gets remuneration by virtue of the fact that the licensee
        > is hired to teach. Most likely
        > the licensee was hired to teach other merit badges as well, for example,
        > computers and/or electronics and/or
        > electricity, if I am remembering my merit badge titles right.
        >
        > Bill, W2BSA
        >
        > Stephen M. Shearer wrote:
        >>
        >>
        >> The issue of FCC 97.113 has raised discussion in many email groups and
        >> web forums. BSA summer camps running radio merit badge could have an
        >> issue. "obviously" using ham radio for camp staff communications isn't
        >> OK, but will making a radio contact (using paid camp staff) for radio
        >> merit badge be an issue? Some camps have a volunteer running the merit
        >> badge (lack of a ham in the camp staff). The merit badge communications
        >> does "benefit the public" (the scout) and only indirectly the Camp (the
        >> camp may get campers because of the merit badge - science camp for
        >> example)...
        >> Something to think/talk about. What do you think?
        >>
        >> also see:
        >> http://www.arrl.org/news/files/ARRL_AppropriateUseGuidelines.pdf
        >> <http://www.arrl.org/news/files/ARRL_AppropriateUseGuidelines.pdf>
        >> <http://www.arrl.org/news/files/ARRL_AppropriateUseGuidelines.pdf
        >> <http://www.arrl.org/news/files/ARRL_AppropriateUseGuidelines.pdf>>
        >> and see: http://forums.qrz.com/showthread.php?t=220443
        >> <http://forums.qrz.com/showthread.php?t=220443>
        >> <http://forums.qrz.com/showthread.php?t=220443
        >> <http://forums.qrz.com/showthread.php?t=220443>>
        >>
        >> steve WB3LGC
        >>
        >> ___
        >>
        >>
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > _________________________________________________________________
        > Hotmail: Trusted email with MicrosoftÂ’s powerful SPAM protection.
        > http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/177141664/direct/01/

        ARRL Director, Rocky Mountain Division
        On the web at www.RockyMountainDivision.org
      • Stephen M. Shearer
        I got a chance to actually sit down and read 97.113 and in 97.113c it says A control operator may accept compensation as an incident of a teaching position
        Message 3 of 6 , Oct 26, 2009
        • 0 Attachment
          I got a chance to actually sit down and read 97.113 and in 97.113c it
          says "A control operator may accept compensation as an incident of a
          teaching position during periods of time when an amateur station is used
          by that teacher as a part of classroom instruction at an educational
          institution." -- thanks Bill for the direction. The "ruckus" is more
          related to ECOM and 97.113a. The ability to teach "the art" is also
          covered in 97.1 -- schools (scout camp) would have a difficult time
          teaching without at some point in time getting on the air...

          (on the ECOM side, one could argue the point that 97.1 also wants to
          "... advancing skills in both the communications and technical phases of
          the art." is difficult without having drills and often need to include
          the paid responders too. [yes the local government can ask for an
          exception - what about a local private hospital?] - no answer required,
          just my mumbling.)

          steve

          Bill Stewart, w2bsa wrote:
          >
          >
          > That would come under the education exemption, in that the paid person
          > who also has a ham radio
          > license is teaching the Radio Merit badge class. There is nothing to
          > preclude a licensee from doing that.
          > The licensee gets no remuneration by virtue of the fact that the
          > licensee is a ham.
          > The licensee gets remuneration by virtue of the fact that the licensee
          > is hired to teach. Most likely
          > the licensee was hired to teach other merit badges as well, for example,
          > computers and/or electronics and/or
          > electricity, if I am remembering my merit badge titles right.
          >
          > Bill, W2BSA
          >
          > Stephen M. Shearer wrote:
          > >
          > >
          > > The issue of FCC 97.113 has raised discussion in many email groups and
          > > web forums. BSA summer camps running radio merit badge could have an
          > > issue. "obviously" using ham radio for camp staff communications isn't
          > > OK, but will making a radio contact (using paid camp staff) for radio
          > > merit badge be an issue? Some camps have a volunteer running the merit
          > > badge (lack of a ham in the camp staff). The merit badge communications
          > > does "benefit the public" (the scout) and only indirectly the Camp (the
          > > camp may get campers because of the merit badge - science camp for
          > > example)...
          > > Something to think/talk about. What do you think?
          > >
          > > also see:
          > > http://www.arrl.org/news/files/ARRL_AppropriateUseGuidelines.pdf
          > <http://www.arrl.org/news/files/ARRL_AppropriateUseGuidelines.pdf>
          > > <http://www.arrl.org/news/files/ARRL_AppropriateUseGuidelines.pdf
          > <http://www.arrl.org/news/files/ARRL_AppropriateUseGuidelines.pdf>>
          > > <http://www.arrl.org/news/files/ARRL_AppropriateUseGuidelines.pdf
          > <http://www.arrl.org/news/files/ARRL_AppropriateUseGuidelines.pdf>
          > > <http://www.arrl.org/news/files/ARRL_AppropriateUseGuidelines.pdf
          > <http://www.arrl.org/news/files/ARRL_AppropriateUseGuidelines.pdf>>>
          > > and see: http://forums.qrz.com/showthread.php?t=220443
          > <http://forums.qrz.com/showthread.php?t=220443>
          > > <http://forums.qrz.com/showthread.php?t=220443
          > <http://forums.qrz.com/showthread.php?t=220443>>
          > > <http://forums.qrz.com/showthread.php?t=220443
          > <http://forums.qrz.com/showthread.php?t=220443>
          > > <http://forums.qrz.com/showthread.php?t=220443
          > <http://forums.qrz.com/showthread.php?t=220443>>>
          > >
          > > steve WB3LGC
          > >
          >
          > .
          >
          >
        • Bill Stewart, w2bsa
          Yes, and there is a petition to revise 97.113 already at FCC to resolve the problem. It has been submitted by WB6NOA and others to actually address the
          Message 4 of 6 , Oct 26, 2009
          • 0 Attachment
            Yes, and there is a petition to revise 97.113 already at FCC to resolve
            the problem.
            It has been submitted by WB6NOA and others to actually address the problems.
            Personally, in the times we live in now, there should be no reason that
            professional
            emergency communicators who are also hams should not be able to drill,
            train, and plan
            for the use of amateur radio in times of emergency.

            Methinks that someone in the FCC staff hath gone overboard when they
            made the earlier
            ruling, since the earlier ruling seems to contradict 97.1.

            73,

            Bill, W2BSA

            Stephen M. Shearer wrote:
            >
            >
            > I got a chance to actually sit down and read 97.113 and in 97.113c it
            > says "A control operator may accept compensation as an incident of a
            > teaching position during periods of time when an amateur station is used
            > by that teacher as a part of classroom instruction at an educational
            > institution." -- thanks Bill for the direction. The "ruckus" is more
            > related to ECOM and 97.113a. The ability to teach "the art" is also
            > covered in 97.1 -- schools (scout camp) would have a difficult time
            > teaching without at some point in time getting on the air...
            >
            > (on the ECOM side, one could argue the point that 97.1 also wants to
            > "... advancing skills in both the communications and technical phases of
            > the art." is difficult without having drills and often need to include
            > the paid responders too. [yes the local government can ask for an
            > exception - what about a local private hospital?] - no answer required,
            > just my mumbling.)
            >
            > steve
            >
            > Bill Stewart, w2bsa wrote:
            > >
            > >
            > > That would come under the education exemption, in that the paid person
            > > who also has a ham radio
            > > license is teaching the Radio Merit badge class. There is nothing to
            > > preclude a licensee from doing that.
            > > The licensee gets no remuneration by virtue of the fact that the
            > > licensee is a ham.
            > > The licensee gets remuneration by virtue of the fact that the licensee
            > > is hired to teach. Most likely
            > > the licensee was hired to teach other merit badges as well, for example,
            > > computers and/or electronics and/or
            > > electricity, if I am remembering my merit badge titles right.
            > >
            > > Bill, W2BSA
            > >
            > > Stephen M. Shearer wrote:
            > > >
            > > >
            > > > The issue of FCC 97.113 has raised discussion in many email groups and
            > > > web forums. BSA summer camps running radio merit badge could have an
            > > > issue. "obviously" using ham radio for camp staff communications isn't
            > > > OK, but will making a radio contact (using paid camp staff) for radio
            > > > merit badge be an issue? Some camps have a volunteer running the merit
            > > > badge (lack of a ham in the camp staff). The merit badge
            > communications
            > > > does "benefit the public" (the scout) and only indirectly the Camp
            > (the
            > > > camp may get campers because of the merit badge - science camp for
            > > > example)...
            > > > Something to think/talk about. What do you think?
            > > >
            > > > also see:
            > > > http://www.arrl.org/news/files/ARRL_AppropriateUseGuidelines.pdf
            > <http://www.arrl.org/news/files/ARRL_AppropriateUseGuidelines.pdf>
            > > <http://www.arrl.org/news/files/ARRL_AppropriateUseGuidelines.pdf
            > <http://www.arrl.org/news/files/ARRL_AppropriateUseGuidelines.pdf>>
            > > > <http://www.arrl.org/news/files/ARRL_AppropriateUseGuidelines.pdf
            > <http://www.arrl.org/news/files/ARRL_AppropriateUseGuidelines.pdf>
            > > <http://www.arrl.org/news/files/ARRL_AppropriateUseGuidelines.pdf
            > <http://www.arrl.org/news/files/ARRL_AppropriateUseGuidelines.pdf>>>
            > > > <http://www.arrl.org/news/files/ARRL_AppropriateUseGuidelines.pdf
            > <http://www.arrl.org/news/files/ARRL_AppropriateUseGuidelines.pdf>
            > > <http://www.arrl.org/news/files/ARRL_AppropriateUseGuidelines.pdf
            > <http://www.arrl.org/news/files/ARRL_AppropriateUseGuidelines.pdf>>
            > > > <http://www.arrl.org/news/files/ARRL_AppropriateUseGuidelines.pdf
            > <http://www.arrl.org/news/files/ARRL_AppropriateUseGuidelines.pdf>
            > > <http://www.arrl.org/news/files/ARRL_AppropriateUseGuidelines.pdf
            > <http://www.arrl.org/news/files/ARRL_AppropriateUseGuidelines.pdf>>>>
            > > > and see: http://forums.qrz.com/showthread.php?t=220443
            > <http://forums.qrz.com/showthread.php?t=220443>
            > > <http://forums.qrz.com/showthread.php?t=220443
            > <http://forums.qrz.com/showthread.php?t=220443>>
            > > > <http://forums.qrz.com/showthread.php?t=220443
            > <http://forums.qrz.com/showthread.php?t=220443>
            > > <http://forums.qrz.com/showthread.php?t=220443
            > <http://forums.qrz.com/showthread.php?t=220443>>>
            > > > <http://forums.qrz.com/showthread.php?t=220443
            > <http://forums.qrz.com/showthread.php?t=220443>
            > > <http://forums.qrz.com/showthread.php?t=220443
            > <http://forums.qrz.com/showthread.php?t=220443>>
            > > > <http://forums.qrz.com/showthread.php?t=220443
            > <http://forums.qrz.com/showthread.php?t=220443>
            > > <http://forums.qrz.com/showthread.php?t=220443
            > <http://forums.qrz.com/showthread.php?t=220443>>>>
            > > >
            > > > steve WB3LGC
            > > >
            > >
            > > .
            > >
            > >
            >
            >
          Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.