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Re: Swedish jamboree station SC7J

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  • Jon Pellant
    Torkil, Do you have an operating schedule? Tack så mycket. Hej då, Jon w1jp
    Message 1 of 13 , Jul 11, 2007
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      Torkil,

      Do you have an operating schedule?

      Tack så mycket.

      Hej då,
      Jon
      w1jp

      --- In ScoutRadio@yahoogroups.com, "oz2kil" <oz2kil@...> wrote:
      >
      > Next week July 14th - 21th. The Jamboree station SC7J will be active
      > on most bands and modes, from the Jiingijamborii camp in the southern
      > part of Sweeden.
      >
      > Reed more about the station at
      > http://sc7j.se/
      > and the camp at
      > http://www.jiingijamborii.se/
      >
      > I'll be one of the operatores together with 15-20 swedish Scouthams.
      >
      > Let's hear from you
      >
      > OZ2KIL, Torkil Bladt, Denmark
      >
    • oz2kil
      ... All that I know at the moment is from post number 7 in the guest book on http://sc7j.se/ Feel free to ask for more info in the guest book, I am not sure
      Message 2 of 13 , Jul 11, 2007
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        --- In ScoutRadio@yahoogroups.com, "Jon Pellant" <w1jp@...> wrote:

        > Torkil,
        >
        > Do you have an operating schedule?

        All that I know at the moment is from post number 7 in the guest book
        on http://sc7j.se/
        Feel free to ask for more info in the guest book, I am not sure that
        the swedish hams that are in charge of the station, are following
        this newsgroup.
      • rahwayflynn
        I have an antenna that s ~150 LOA. I have insulators up to the load. However, so far the wire keeps failing mid span The antenna is 1/4 phosphor bronze rope
        Message 3 of 13 , Oct 12, 2008
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          I have an antenna that's ~150 LOA. I have insulators up to the load.
          However, so far the wire keeps failing mid span

          The antenna is 1/4" phosphor bronze rope laid wire terminated
          with epoxy fastened spelter sockets. The wire is rated #1500.

          Anyone have a source for better antenna wire that can take the load?

          PS - this is Calculator for wire sag & load
          http://www.vk1od.net/rigging/sag.htm.

          Martin
        • Bill Stewart
          Martin, My suggestion is to support the center as you would an inverted-v antenna. Let rope that you would use there take the load. Bill, W2BSA
          Message 4 of 13 , Oct 13, 2008
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            Martin,
            My suggestion is to support the center as you would an inverted-v antenna. Let rope that you would use there take the load.

            Bill, W2BSA

            rahwayflynn wrote:

            I have an antenna that's ~150 LOA. I have insulators up to the load.
            However, so far the wire keeps failing mid span

            The antenna is 1/4" phosphor bronze rope laid wire terminated
            with epoxy fastened spelter sockets. The wire is rated #1500.

            Anyone have a source for better antenna wire that can take the load?

            PS - this is Calculator for wire sag & load
            http://www.vk1od. net/rigging/ sag.htm.

            Martin

          • Brian Mileshosky
            Martin -- Take a look at http://hamcall.net/7bandocf.html. I don t mean the OCF dipole that s being peddled on the site, but take a look at the wire they use.
            Message 5 of 13 , Oct 13, 2008
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              Martin --

              Take a look at http://hamcall.net/7bandocf.html. I don't mean the OCF
              dipole that's being peddled on the site, but take a look at the wire they
              use. It's what was once known as Quiet-Flex, among other names.

              I've built many antennas (including 135+ foot dipoles) with this material
              and it's simply awesome. It's stranded and insulated, yet not anywhere
              as stiff as regular stranded copper. It won't kink, rolls up nicely, and
              will last a good long time. I had one such 135 foot dipole in the air for
              over a decade with no issues, and it was not supported in the middle.

              You might contact the HamCall folks
              (http://hamcall.net/aboutHamCall.html#contact) and ask what their source
              is for this wire -- or if they will sell you a length of it.

              Then the next thing for you to work on is the interface at the center of
              the dipole. Depending on how you mount it there is tremendous stress in
              that area. I agree with Bill that you should use an antenna like this in
              an inverted-vee fashion if you have a way to support it in the center
              along with the ends.

              If you have no luck with the HamCall folks, contact me (my callsign at
              arrl dot net)...I believe a ham in my town sells this stuff, too.

              73,
              Brian N5ZGT
              Albuquerque, NM
              Chairman, ARRL ad-hoc Committee on Scouting
              ARRL Director, Rocky Mountain Division
              www.rockymountaindivision.org

              On Mon, 13 Oct 2008, Bill Stewart wrote:

              > Martin,
              > My suggestion is to support the center as you would an inverted-v antenna.
              > Let rope that you would use there take the load.
              >
              > Bill, W2BSA
              >
              > rahwayflynn wrote:
              >>
              >> I have an antenna that's ~150 LOA. I have insulators up to the load.
              >> However, so far the wire keeps failing mid span
              >>
              >> The antenna is 1/4" phosphor bronze rope laid wire terminated
              >> with epoxy fastened spelter sockets. The wire is rated #1500.
              >>
              >> Anyone have a source for better antenna wire that can take the load?
              >>
              >> PS - this is Calculator for wire sag & load
              >> http://www.vk1od.net/rigging/sag.htm.
              >> <http://www.vk1od.net/rigging/sag.htm.>
              >>
              >> Martin
              >>
              >>

              ARRL Director, Rocky Mountain Division
              On the web at www.RockyMountainDivision.org
            • Jim Stafford
              I have an Extended Double Zepp that is 178 feet long at 55 feet up. It is fed in the middle with ladder line and coax (similar to a G5RV). I am using a piece
              Message 6 of 13 , Oct 13, 2008
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                I have an Extended Double Zepp that is 178 feet long at 55 feet up.  It is fed in the middle with ladder line and coax (similar to a G5RV).  I am using a piece of 3/4" PVC pipe center as an insulator about 6 inches long.  The antenna has a bit of sag, perhaps 15' in the middle so that the trees blowing away from each other do not break it(never has broken in 2 years of service).  It is made of #18 copperweld - copper coated steel. 

                I also have an 80M loop which is 70' on a side.  That is made from #16 single strand electrical wire.  It is at 45' and in 12 years it has broken only twice due to wind.  I do not use weights and pullies on the ropes on either antenna.  Rope is tied directly to the tree supports.

                Why would you want/desire a 1/4" diameter wire for such an antenna?  I can't imagine it unless you are running several kilowatts.  I have worked about 75 countries on mine since putting it up.  That's on QRP at 5 watts on 40M (the band it has low SWR on) and on the higher and lower bands with a tuner.

                Can you tell me?  What is LOA?  I am not familiar with that term.

                jim/w4qo from Atlanta, GA
                 
                -------------- Original message from "rahwayflynn" <maflynn@...>: --------------

                I have an antenna that's ~150 LOA. I have insulators up to the load.
                However, so far the wire keeps failing mid span

                The antenna is 1/4" phosphor bronze rope laid wire terminated
                with epoxy fastened spelter sockets. The wire is rated #1500.

                 
                 
              • Martin A Flynn
                Folks, The basic issue this is a single long wire, ~150 feet length over all. It s supported at the end points by 2 power line insulators (see
                Message 7 of 13 , Oct 13, 2008
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                  Folks,
                  The basic issue this is a single long wire, ~150 feet length over all.
                  It's supported at the end points by 2 power line insulators (see
                  http://hamcall.net/insulator.html for a similar unit). Mountings are
                  buildings (zero flex) It's end fed with an SCG-230 turner.

                  As to why, It was free. The wire is far more conductive then
                  galvanized, and on paper, should perform better then copperweld. It
                  should also be able to survive the worst weather the northeast can dish
                  out . My basic problem is the wire keeps breaking despite the numbers
                  stating it should not.

                  Suggestions?

                  Martin W2RWJ
                  -------------------------------

                  Jim Stafford wrote:
                  > I have an Extended Double Zepp that is 178 feet long at 55 feet up.
                  > It is fed in the middle with ladder line and coax (similar to a
                  > G5RV). I am using a piece of 3/4" PVC pipe center as an insulator
                  > about 6 inches long. The antenna has a bit of sag, perhaps 15' in the
                  > middle so that the trees blowing away from each other do not break
                  > it(never has broken in 2 years of service). It is made of #18
                  > copperweld - copper coated steel.
                  >
                  > I also have an 80M loop which is 70' on a side. That is made from #16
                  > single strand electrical wire. It is at 45' and in 12 years it has
                  > broken only twice due to wind. I do not use weights and pullies on
                  > the ropes on either antenna. Rope is tied directly to the tree supports.
                  >
                  > Why would you want/desire a 1/4" diameter wire for such an antenna? I
                  > can't imagine it unless you are running several kilowatts. I have
                  > worked about 75 countries on mine since putting it up. That's on QRP
                  > at 5 watts on 40M (the band it has low SWR on) and on the higher and
                  > lower bands with a tuner.
                  >
                  > Can you tell me? What is LOA? I am not familiar with that term.
                  >
                  > jim/w4qo from Atlanta, GA
                  >
                  >
                  > -------------- Original message from "rahwayflynn"
                  > <maflynn@...>: --------------
                  >
                  > I have an antenna that's ~150 LOA. I have insulators up to the load.
                  > However, so far the wire keeps failing mid span
                  >
                  > The antenna is 1/4" phosphor bronze rope laid wire terminated
                  > with epoxy fastened spelter sockets. The wire is rated #1500.
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ScoutRadio/post;_ylc=X3oDMTJvdnQ0dGlmBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzExNTgxNQRncnBzcElkAzE3MDUwNjYxNjIEbXNnSWQDMzA4NQRzZWMDZnRyBHNsawNycGx5BHN0aW1lAzEyMjM4NjAwNDI-?act=reply&messageNum=3085>
                  >
                • Bill Stewart
                  Martin, Did you say that it was breaking in the middle??? If so, then you need some sort of support in the middle to take the load. Bill, W2BSA
                  Message 8 of 13 , Oct 13, 2008
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                    Martin,
                    Did you say that it was breaking in the middle??? If so, then you need some sort of support in the middle to take the load.

                    Bill, W2BSA

                    Martin A Flynn wrote:

                    Folks,
                    The basic issue this is a single long wire, ~150 feet length over all.
                    It's supported at the end points by 2 power line insulators (see
                    http://hamcall. net/insulator. html for a similar unit). Mountings are
                    buildings (zero flex) It's end fed with an SCG-230 turner.

                    As to why, It was free. The wire is far more conductive then
                    galvanized, and on paper, should perform better then copperweld. It
                    should also be able to survive the worst weather the northeast can dish
                    out . My basic problem is the wire keeps breaking despite the numbers
                    stating it should not.

                    Suggestions?

                    Martin W2RWJ
                    ------------ --------- --------- -

                    Jim Stafford wrote:
                    > I have an Extended Double Zepp that is 178 feet long at 55 feet up.
                    > It is fed in the middle with ladder line and coax (similar to a
                    > G5RV). I am using a piece of 3/4" PVC pipe center as an insulator
                    > about 6 inches long. The antenna has a bit of sag, perhaps 15' in the
                    > middle so that the trees blowing away from each other do not break
                    > it(never has broken in 2 years of service). It is made of #18
                    > copperweld - copper coated steel.
                    >
                    > I also have an 80M loop which is 70' on a side. That is made from #16
                    > single strand electrical wire. It is at 45' and in 12 years it has
                    > broken only twice due to wind. I do not use weights and pullies on
                    > the ropes on either antenna. Rope is tied directly to the tree supports.
                    >
                    > Why would you want/desire a 1/4" diameter wire for such an antenna? I
                    > can't imagine it unless you are running several kilowatts. I have
                    > worked about 75 countries on mine since putting it up. That's on QRP
                    > at 5 watts on 40M (the band it has low SWR on) and on the higher and
                    > lower bands with a tuner.
                    >
                    > Can you tell me? What is LOA? I am not familiar with that term.
                    >
                    > jim/w4qo from Atlanta, GA
                    >
                    >
                    > ------------ -- Original message from "rahwayflynn"
                    > <maflynn@worldnet. att.net>: ------------ --
                    >
                    > I have an antenna that's ~150 LOA. I have insulators up to the load.
                    > However, so far the wire keeps failing mid span
                    >
                    > The antenna is 1/4" phosphor bronze rope laid wire terminated
                    > with epoxy fastened spelter sockets. The wire is rated #1500.
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > <http://groups. yahoo.com/ group/ScoutRadio /post;_ylc= X3oDMTJvdnQ0dGlm BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0 BGdycElkAzExNTgx NQRncnBzcElkAzE3 MDUwNjYxNjIEbXNn SWQDMzA4NQRzZWMD ZnRyBHNsawNycGx5 BHN0aW1lAzEyMjM4 NjAwNDI-? act=reply& messageNum= 3085>
                    >

                  • Malcolm - G4CXT
                    ... Which is a pretty average length, so normal rules and experience from the ham community will apply. ... Can t argue with that :-) ... At DC then yes, but
                    Message 9 of 13 , Oct 14, 2008
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                      Martin A Flynn wrote:

                      Folks,
                      The basic issue this is a single long wire, ~150 feet length over all.

                      Which is a pretty average length, so "normal" rules and experience from the ham community will apply.


                      It's supported at the end points by 2 power line insulators (see
                      http://hamcall. net/insulator. html for a similar unit). Mountings are
                      buildings (zero flex) It's end fed with an SCG-230 turner.

                      As to why, It was free.

                      Can't argue with that :-)

                      The wire is far more conductive then
                      galvanized, and on paper, should perform better then copperweld.

                      At DC then yes, but as RF currents flow in the "skin" then arguably this may not be true

                      It
                      should also be able to survive the worst weather the northeast can dish
                      out . My basic problem is the wire keeps breaking despite the numbers
                      stating it should not.

                      I'm not familiar with the type of wire, but 1/4 inch is almost a rod, not a wire.  Is it actually too inflexible to the weather perhaps?  Its a guess but perhaps the effect of stresses from wind, rain & snow actually cause the wire to fracture because it can't bend?

                      Suggestions?

                      My personal experience is that plastic coated multi-strand wire is pretty reliable.  I virtually always use a centre support, which helps, but equally I try to minimise the weight of the central insulator by using simple home made devices.  A 6 inch length of fibreglass with holes into which the conductors are weaved works for me and I use light weight junction blocks filled with bath sealant for the connection between the feeder & the elements.  These only provide mechanical support though - to achieve electrical connection I wrap the two wires together for at least a inch then fold it up before poking it into a choc block.




                      Martin W2RWJ
                      ------------ --------- --------- -


                    • rahwayflynn
                      ... It s a rope laid cable with many fine strands (~30 AWG). One of my Scouts parents is of the opinion that wire itself is defective or the load rating is
                      Message 10 of 13 , Oct 14, 2008
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                        --- In ScoutRadio@yahoogroups.com, Malcolm - G4CXT <g4cxt@...> wrote:

                        >I'm not familiar with the type of wire, but
                        >1/4 inch is almost a rod, not a wire. Is it
                        >actually too inflexible to the weather perhaps?
                        >Its a guess but perhaps the effect of stresses from
                        >wind, rain & snow actually cause the wire to fracture >
                        >because it can't bend?

                        It's a rope laid cable with many fine strands (~30 AWG). One of my
                        Scouts parents is of the opinion that wire itself is defective or the
                        load rating is incorrect. At this point I'm inclined to agree.

                        Martin W2RWJ
                      • Jim Stafford
                        Martin, Here is a deal for you -- is your Callbook Address good? If so, I m mailing you at my expense up to 180 of vinyl covered wire, you tell me how much,
                        Message 11 of 13 , Oct 14, 2008
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                          Martin, 

                          Here is a deal for you -- is your Callbook Address good?  If so, I'm mailing you at my expense up to 180' of vinyl covered wire, you tell me how much, and then you can toss (or sell at salvage) the stuff you have.    Or I may send copperweld, I'll see what I have laying around.  And I'll send center insulators along the lines of G4ZXT...

                          It's FREE, so there goes that argument ... 

                          Spending way too much time on this... you should be making contacts and doing JOTA.  hi hi

                          jim/w4qo at JOTA station W4S from 1300Z to 1900Z on Saturday

                          PS you may reply directly to me via email at the one listed on QRZ.com with details.
                           
                          -------------- Original message from "rahwayflynn" <maflynn@...>: --------------

                          --- In ScoutRadio@yahoogro ups.com, Malcolm - G4CXT <g4cxt@...> wrote:

                          >I'm not familiar with the type of wire, but
                          >1/4 inch is almost a rod, not a wire. Is it
                          >actually too inflexible to the weather perhaps?
                          >Its a guess but perhaps the effect of stresses from
                          >wind, rain & snow actually cause the wire to fracture >
                          >because it can't bend?

                          It's a rope laid cable with many fine strands (~30 AWG). One of my
                          Scouts parents is of the opinion that wire itself is defective or the
                          load rating is incorrect. At this point I'm inclined to agree.

                          Martin W2RWJ

                        • Jon Pearl - W4ABC
                          Boy, there s some Scout spirit at work! Jon Pearl - W4ABC ... From: Jim Stafford To: ScoutRadio@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, October 14, 2008 8:55 AM
                          Message 12 of 13 , Oct 14, 2008
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                            Boy, there's some Scout spirit at work!
                             
                             
                             
                            Jon Pearl - W4ABC
                            ----- Original Message -----
                            Sent: Tuesday, October 14, 2008 8:55 AM
                            Subject: Re: [ScoutRadio] Re: Extreme Duty Long Wire

                            Martin, 

                            Here is a deal for you -- is your Callbook Address good?  If so, I'm mailing you at my expense up to 180' of vinyl covered wire, you tell me how much, and then you can toss (or sell at salvage) the stuff you have.    Or I may send copperweld, I'll see what I have laying around.  And I'll send center insulators along the lines of G4ZXT...

                            It's FREE, so there goes that argument ... 

                            Spending way too much time on this... you should be making contacts and doing JOTA.  hi hi

                            jim/w4qo at JOTA station W4S from 1300Z to 1900Z on Saturday

                            PS you may reply directly to me via email at the one listed on QRZ.com with details.
                             
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