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Re: Signaling Merit Badge Requirements

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  • Gary Wilson
    ... as I recall). ... Correct. Either Semaphore or Wig Wag could be used to meet the First Class requirement in effect until 1972. Semaphore uses two diagonaly
    Message 1 of 24 , Mar 30, 2007
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      --- In ScoutRadio@yahoogroups.com, "Dana McRae" <w6dbm@...> wrote:
      >

      > One a small point - Semaphore is a totally different method of
      > signalling (with it's own "code" (*not* Morse)) than "wigwag", which
      > *does* use Morse Code (to the "wagger's" R = Dot; to the L = Dash,
      as I recall).

      > "Wigwag" used a single, longer pole, usually with a flag at the end,
      > while semaphore required two flags, attached to much shorter poles.

      Correct. Either Semaphore or Wig Wag could be used to meet the First
      Class requirement in effect until 1972.

      Semaphore uses two diagonaly striped flags which are held in each
      hand. The position of the arms (like the hands of a clock) indicate
      the letter. For example, both arms stuck straight out at 9 o'clock
      and 3 o'clock is "R". The flags are just used to increase
      visibility. Navy signalman sometimes "talk" to each other just using
      their hands alone when ships are alongside.

      Wigwag was a way of sending Morse Code using a single flag on a long
      pole. A figure eight twirl to the senders right was a dot and a
      twirl to the left was a dash. Boy Scouts could remember this easily
      by thinking of their patrol emblem as a dot and their community (now
      Council) strip as a dash. The flag was brought to the vertical
      between letters.

      Two flags were available in a wigwag set to maximize the contrast
      against a given background; a white square on a red field and red
      square on white field. Only one would be used in a given situation.
      Th US Army Signal corps emblem consists of these two flags.

      It's still fun for kids to do and gives tham a purpose to build those
      signal towers.

      73

      Gary, K2GW
    • Fred Stevens K2FRD
      ... And we all remember the furor when National announced they were dropping the signaling requirement: • It would cheapen the First Class requirements so
      Message 2 of 24 , Mar 30, 2007
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        At 7:57 PM +0000 30/3/07, Gary Wilson wrote:
        >
        >Correct. Either Semaphore or Wig Wag could be used to meet the First
        >Class requirement in effect until 1972.

        And we all remember the furor when National announced they were dropping the signaling requirement:

        • It would "cheapen" the First Class requirements so that ANYONE could become 1st Class.

        • The "old-timers" felt that the newby 1st Classes would demean those who had earned their ranks the hard way.

        • Morse Code and semaphore would become "dead languages", lost arts.

        • The signaling requirement was part of the tradition for becoming First Class, a tradition lost forever, wiped out with the stroke of a pen.

        • Once the hurdle of signaling was abandoned, everybody would become Eagles.

        • Everyone would want to become a Scout since the requirements were dumbed down. Why, even Girl Scouts would want to become Boy Scouts.

        • Emergency communications would suffer.

        --.../...--//./-//-.--/../...//-.././/

        ..-./.-././-..//-.-/..---/..-./.-./-..///

        :-D :-[ O:-) :-!

        --
        73 and Yours In Scouting de Fred Stevens K2FRD, VO2FS
        Editor-Publisher
        Otschodela Council Amateur Radio Group EAGLE newsletter
        "The only regularly published ham-Scouting newsletter in the world."
        No spam, no cost, no advertisements, no commitments, just ham-Scouting.
        http://ocarg.org Subscribe: mailto:subscribe@...
      • Bill Stewart
        Gee, where have I heard that before?? 73, Bill Stewart, W2BSA
        Message 3 of 24 , Mar 30, 2007
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          Gee, where have I heard that before??

          73,

          Bill Stewart, W2BSA

          Fred Stevens K2FRD wrote:
          >
          > At 7:57 PM +0000 30/3/07, Gary Wilson wrote:
          > >
          > >Correct. Either Semaphore or Wig Wag could be used to meet the First
          > >Class requirement in effect until 1972.
          >
          > And we all remember the furor when National announced they were
          > dropping the signaling requirement:
          >
          > • It would "cheapen" the First Class requirements so that ANYONE could
          > become 1st Class.
          >
          > • The "old-timers" felt that the newby 1st Classes would demean those
          > who had earned their ranks the hard way.
          >
          > • Morse Code and semaphore would become "dead languages", lost arts.
          >
          > • The signaling requirement was part of the tradition for becoming
          > First Class, a tradition lost forever, wiped out with the stroke of a pen.
          >
          > • Once the hurdle of signaling was abandoned, everybody would become
          > Eagles.
          >
          > • Everyone would want to become a Scout since the requirements were
          > dumbed down. Why, even Girl Scouts would want to become Boy Scouts.
          >
          > • Emergency communications would suffer.
          >
          > --.../...--//./-//-.--/../...//-.././/
          >
          > ..-./.-././-..//-.-/..---/..-./.-./-..///
          >
          > :-D :-[ O:-) :-!
          >
          > --
          > 73 and Yours In Scouting de Fred Stevens K2FRD, VO2FS
          > Editor-Publisher
          > Otschodela Council Amateur Radio Group EAGLE newsletter
          > "The only regularly published ham-Scouting newsletter in the world."
          > No spam, no cost, no advertisements, no commitments, just ham-Scouting.
          > http://ocarg.org <http://ocarg.org> Subscribe:
          > mailto:subscribe@... <mailto:subscribe%40ocarg.org>
          >
          >
        • Gary Wilson
          ... Actually, if you think about it, the First Class Scout requirments originally derived from what Baden-Powell determined were essential skills for a turn of
          Message 4 of 24 , Apr 5, 2007
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            --- In ScoutRadio@yahoogroups.com, Fred Stevens K2FRD <k2frd@...> wrote:

            > And we all remember the furor when National announced they were
            dropping the signaling requirement:
            >

            Actually, if you think about it, the First Class Scout requirments
            originally derived from what Baden-Powell determined were essential
            skills for a turn of the century miltary scout to know. Stalking,
            memorization of observations, sketch map making, map and compass,
            campcraft and flag signaling were all derived from this.

            But military technology has moved on. Following the logic to the
            extreme, perhaps our modern First Class Scouts should know the modern
            equivalents used by Rangers and USAF Combat Controllers. That would
            mean adding voice radio procedure, water filters, and GPS to the
            existing skills. Perhaps parachute and helo insertion, using night
            vision goggles, avoiding IED's and calling in precision guided
            munitions using laser designators might be a bit too much. But the
            kids would get a thrill out of it, much as kids in 1907 did with the
            equivalent skills learned from that period.

            Now that's a radical idea, but really no more radical than what kids
            were doing when they first found B-P's "Aids to Scouting" book during
            the Boer War and started playing soldier.

            73

            Gary Wilson, K2GW
            (Also a keen student of Scouting history)
          • Fred Stevens K2FRD
            Fun with a purpose. But when the requirements start including HALO jumps and rappelling out of perfectly good aircraft with us adults leading the way, then I m
            Message 5 of 24 , Apr 5, 2007
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              Fun with a purpose. But when the requirements start including HALO jumps and rappelling out of perfectly good aircraft with us adults leading the way, then I'm out of here! :-D

              73 de Fred K2FRD

              At 3:28 PM +0000 5/4/07, Gary Wilson wrote:
              >--- In ScoutRadio@yahoogroups.com, Fred Stevens K2FRD <k2frd@...> wrote:
              >
              >> And we all remember the furor when National announced they were
              >dropping the signaling requirement:
              >>
              >
              >Actually, if you think about it, the First Class Scout requirments
              >originally derived from what Baden-Powell determined were essential
              >skills for a turn of the century miltary scout to know. Stalking,
              >memorization of observations, sketch map making, map and compass,
              >campcraft and flag signaling were all derived from this.
              >
              >But military technology has moved on. Following the logic to the
              >extreme, perhaps our modern First Class Scouts should know the modern
              >equivalents used by Rangers and USAF Combat Controllers. That would
              >mean adding voice radio procedure, water filters, and GPS to the
              >existing skills. Perhaps parachute and helo insertion, using night
              >vision goggles, avoiding IED's and calling in precision guided
              >munitions using laser designators might be a bit too much. But the
              >kids would get a thrill out of it, much as kids in 1907 did with the
              >equivalent skills learned from that period.
              >
              >Now that's a radical idea, but really no more radical than what kids
              >were doing when they first found B-P's "Aids to Scouting" book during
              >the Boer War and started playing soldier.
              >
              >73
              >
              >Gary Wilson, K2GW
              >(Also a keen student of Scouting history)

              --
              73 and Yours In Scouting de Fred Stevens K2FRD, VO2FS
              Editor-Publisher
              Otschodela Council Amateur Radio Group EAGLE newsletter
              "The only regularly published ham-Scouting newsletter in the world."
              No spam, no cost, no advertisements, no commitments, just ham-Scouting.
              http://ocarg.org Subscribe: mailto:subscribe@...
            • J. Gordon Beattie, Jr., W2TTT
              Gary and Fred, Seems to me that we could have both the old and new requirements in a mix to obtain the desired results including some basic climbing and
              Message 6 of 24 , Apr 8, 2007
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                Gary and Fred,

                Seems to me that we could have both the old and new requirements in a mix to obtain the desired results including some  basic climbing and rappelling, but of course we can leave out the HALO jumps!

                J

                Many of our Troop’s Scout do these things out of curiosity anyway!

                We just need to keep them in line with Guide to Safe Scouting!

                YIS,

                Gordon Beattie, W2TTT

                201.314.6964

                 

                From: ScoutRadio@yahoogroups.com [mailto:ScoutRadio@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Fred Stevens K2FRD
                Sent: Friday, April 06, 2007 3:21 AM
                To: ScoutRadio@yahoogroups.com
                Subject: [ScoutRadio] Re: Signaling Merit Badge Requirements

                 

                Fun with a purpose. But when the requirements start including HALO jumps and rappelling out of perfectly good aircraft with us adults leading the way, then I'm out of here! :-D

                73 de Fred K2FRD

                At 3:28 PM +0000 5/4/07, Gary Wilson wrote:

                >--- In ScoutRadio@yahoogroups.com,
                Fred Stevens K2FRD <k2frd@...> wrote:
                >
                >> And we all remember the furor when National announced they were
                >dropping the signaling requirement:
                >>
                >
                >Actually, if you think about it, the First Class Scout requirments
                >originally derived from what Baden-Powell determined were essential
                >skills for a turn of the century miltary scout to know. Stalking,
                >memorization of observations, sketch map making, map and compass,
                >campcraft and flag signaling were all derived from this.
                >
                >But military technology has moved on. Following the logic to the
                >extreme, perhaps our modern First Class Scouts should know the modern
                >equivalents used by Rangers and USAF Combat Controllers. That would
                >mean adding voice radio procedure, water filters, and GPS to the
                >existing skills. Perhaps parachute and helo insertion, using night
                >vision goggles, avoiding IED's and calling in precision guided
                >munitions using laser designators might be a bit too much. But the
                >kids would get a thrill out of it, much as kids in 1907 did with the
                >equivalent skills learned from that period.
                >
                >Now that's a radical idea, but really no more radical than what kids
                >were doing when they first found B-P's "Aids to Scouting" book
                during
                >the Boer War and started playing soldier.
                >
                >73
                >
                >Gary Wilson, K2GW
                >(Also a keen student of Scouting history)

                --
                73 and Yours In Scouting de Fred Stevens K2FRD, VO2FS
                Editor-Publisher
                Otschodela Council Amateur Radio Group EAGLE newsletter
                "The only regularly published ham-Scouting newsletter in the world."
                No spam, no cost, no advertisements, no commitments, just ham-Scouting.
                http://ocarg.org Subscribe: mailto:subscribe@...

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