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Re: FRS Radios at Scout Camp

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  • Bob Bruninga
    ... Interesting, yes, I bought eery GMRS radio I could find when Radio Shack closed them out... But I was pretty sure that the rules prohibit one service
    Message 1 of 15 , Oct 26, 1999
      On Mon, 25 Oct 1999, Ray J. Vaughan wrote:

      > Have you thought about an interface to GMRS? If I'm there with my GMRS
      > radio, I can legally talk to FRS users (http://www.rayvaughan.com/gmrs.htm)
      > on the 462 channels we have in common. Would that be a good choice for the
      > camp HQ maybe?

      Interesting, yes, I bought eery GMRS radio I could find when Radio Shack
      closed them out... But I was pretty sure that the "rules" prohibit one
      service from talking to the other... even though we know they are
      identical on the 7 interstitial channels. (but the FRS uses 2.5 KHz
      deviatino and the GMRS uses 5. I find that the GMRS are not frequency
      stable enough to remain in the passband of the FRS, and thus, the FRS
      frequently squleches them out...

      bob
    • TJ-wd4nhh
      GMRS and FRS channels are not the same . FRS channel s are inbetween the GMRS channels and they are called splinter Freq. s . T.J. WD4NHH wd4nhh@netzero.net
      Message 2 of 15 , Oct 26, 1999
        GMRS and FRS channels are not the same . FRS channel's are

        inbetween the GMRS channels and they are called splinter Freq.'s .

        T.J. WD4NHH
        wd4nhh@...
        Pack 301 Den 3 Asst. Den Leader
        -----Original Message-----
        From: Ray J. Vaughan <ray@...>
        To: scoutradio@onelist.com <scoutradio@onelist.com>
        Date: Tuesday, October 26, 1999 3:51 AM
        Subject: Re: [scoutradio] FRS Radios at Scout Camp


        >From: "Ray J. Vaughan" <ray@...>
        >
        >At 05:15 PM 10/25/99 -0400, you wrote:
        >>From: Bob Bruninga <bruninga@...>
        >>I chose 9/9 simply as a parallel to "CB" channel 9, but if there is any
        >>other combination of digits that is "common" in scouting, then I am happy
        >>if we choose that instead. Since many "families" and general public may
        >>also think in terms of choosing the same CH/TONE combos, then 9/9 may have
        >>more QRM from non scouters than if we did something totally off the wall
        >>such as 9/15. (dont go above 15 since many radios only offer the first 15
        >>tones...)
        >
        >Have you thought about an interface to GMRS? If I'm there with my GMRS
        >radio, I can legally talk to FRS users (http://www.rayvaughan.com/gmrs.htm)
        >on the 462 channels we have in common. Would that be a good choice for the
        >camp HQ maybe? Of course, anyone using the radio in the office would need
        >to get their own GMRS license. Active Scout masters might also want to
        >upgrade. 2 watts of "Come back to camp" on a base antenna would be better
        >than milliwatts.
        >
        > Ray J. Vaughan, MS, CBTE
        > KD4BBM PG-7-15266
        > http://www.rayvaughan.com/
        > ray@...
        >
        >>SCOUTING and AMATEUR RADIO - FUN FOR ALL AGES
        >

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      • Bob Bruninga
        ... Sort of. The GMRS had added seven interstitial channels. These then were converted to FRS when the FRS service was enacted. SO you are right that
        Message 3 of 15 , Oct 26, 1999
          On Tue, 26 Oct 1999, TJ-wd4nhh wrote:

          > From: "TJ-wd4nhh" <wd4nhh@...>
          >
          > GMRS and FRS channels are not the same . FRS channel's are
          >
          > inbetween the GMRS channels and they are called splinter Freq.'s .

          Sort of. The GMRS had added seven "interstitial" channels.
          These then were converted to "FRS" when the FRS service was enacted. SO
          you are right that they were not part of the ancient GMRS channels, but
          they were part of the GMRS servicve recently... I guess it depends on
          what you call GMRS...?

          Or at least that was the way I understood it. My GMRS radios talk fine on
          the "interstitial" channels with FRS units (except for the difference in
          deviation and frequency stability...

          bob
        • Ray Vaughan
          ... True, but GMRS licensees are permitted to use the seven 462 MHz splinters also. And at more power than the FRS users on the same channels. (but not as
          Message 4 of 15 , Oct 26, 1999
            At 12:29 PM 10/26/99 -0000, you wrote:
            >From: "TJ-wd4nhh" <wd4nhh@...>
            >
            >GMRS and FRS channels are not the same . FRS channel's are
            >
            >inbetween the GMRS channels and they are called splinter Freq.'s .
            >
            >T.J. WD4NHH
            >wd4nhh@...

            True, but GMRS licensees are permitted to use the seven 462 MHz splinters
            also. And at more power than the FRS users on the same channels. (but not
            as much as on the regular GMRS channels) There was some question as to
            GMRS <-> FRS traffic being legal, but there's a Opinion and Order from the
            FCC approving it. To see this, go to this page:

            http://www.rayvaughan.com/gmrs.htm

            So, as I read it, GMRS licensees CAN communicate with FRS users, but on
            only 7 channels. The selection of Scout channels might want to take those
            7 into consideration.




            Ray J. Vaughan, MS, CBTE
            KD4BBM
            ray@...
            http://www.rayvaughan.com/
          • Ray Vaughan
            ... To follow up on this a bit more: http://www.dougweb.com/gmrsinter.html This shows the GMRS Interstitial and FRS channels side by side. It looks like FRS
            Message 5 of 15 , Oct 26, 1999
              At 01:47 PM 10/26/99 -0400, you wrote:
              >From: Bob Bruninga <bruninga@...>
              >Sort of. The GMRS had added seven "interstitial" channels.
              >These then were converted to "FRS" when the FRS service was enacted. SO
              >you are right that they were not part of the ancient GMRS channels, but
              >they were part of the GMRS servicve recently... I guess it depends on
              >what you call GMRS...?

              To follow up on this a bit more:

              http://www.dougweb.com/gmrsinter.html

              This shows the GMRS Interstitial and FRS channels side by side. It looks
              like FRS users on channels 1-7 get to talk to GMRS licensees, they're on
              their own on channels 8-14. So the 9-9 suggestion for Emergencies might
              need to be reconsidered if you would want to have GMRS as part of your
              camp's plan.


              Ray J. Vaughan, MS, CBTE
              KD4BBM
              ray@...
              http://www.rayvaughan.com/
            • Bob Bruninga
              2-channel FRS radios on sale this and next week at Best Buy for $49 a PAIR! Brand name VOX-BOX (do not have VOX circuits). No PL. Run on 4 AAA s. 500 mw...
              Message 6 of 15 , Oct 26, 1999
                2-channel FRS radios on sale this and next week at Best Buy for $49
                a PAIR! Brand name VOX-BOX (do not have VOX circuits).

                No PL. Run on 4 AAA's. 500 mw... (max legal power)

                Not a bad radio for $25 each...

                Not exactly APRS, but still useful at a special event...

                de WB4APR, Bob
              • Bob Bruninga
                ... Good point. I guess then channel 7? Who cares about channel-9 anyway... it was only a vague reeerence to CB... and I am happy to distance ourselves
                Message 7 of 15 , Oct 28, 1999
                  On Tue, 26 Oct 1999, Ray Vaughan wrote:

                  > This shows the GMRS Interstitial and FRS channels side by side. It looks
                  > like FRS users on channels 1-7 get to talk to GMRS licensees, they're on
                  > their own on channels 8-14. So the 9-9 suggestion for Emergencies might
                  > need to be reconsidered if you would want to have GMRS as part of your
                  > camp's plan.

                  Good point. I guess then channel 7? Who cares about "channel-9"
                  anyway... it was only a vague reeerence to CB... and I am happy to
                  distance ourselves from CB as much as possible.

                  ALSO, I find it bad that all the documents in the FRS packages offer
                  NOTHING IN THE WAY OF USER EDUCATION about how to use a radio and proper
                  radiotelephone technique...

                  At the beach, you hear "DADDY", then "DADDY! WHere are you !"
                  Ie, no callsigns....

                  I think the docs shouls "suggest to users the use of personal callsigns"

                  bob
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