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Battles of Dunbar and Worcester

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  • SusanG1400@aol.com
    Several persons have asked recently where in the Western Hemisphere Scotsmen taken prisoner at the Battles of Dunbar and Worcester were sent by Oliver
    Message 1 of 9 , Aug 17, 2003
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      Several persons have asked recently where in the Western Hemisphere
      Scotsmen taken prisoner at the Battles of Dunbar and Worcester were sent by Oliver
      Cromwell. Oliver Cromwell sent these Scots prisoners to Massachusetts Bay
      Colony, New Hampshire, Virginia, East New Jersey (Originally New Jersey was two
      colonies: East New Jersey and West New Jersey.) and the British-controlled
      islands of Jamaica and Barbados in the West Indies.
      Someone asked on what other ships besides the John and Sara the prisoners
      were sent to the Western Hemisphere. One other ship was the Henry and Francis
      . It left from Leith Scotland on September 5, 1685. It took prisoners to
      East New Jersey.
      The Scots prisoners were sent to so many different places because the
      English settlers in the American Colonies were afraid that if all these Scots
      were sent to the same place, they might rebel.
      There is a book that lists all the prisoners transported in alphabetical
      order by last name and tells the names of the ship they were sent on, where in
      the Western Hemisphere they were sent, and the date the ships left Great
      Britain and from what port in Great Britain the ships left. I studied this book
      at the Library of Congress in Washington, D.C. You cannot take books out from
      this library. You can probably order this book on Interlibrary Loan from your
      local public library. Your local library can obtain it from another library
      in the United States for you. This book is:

      Directory of Scots Banished to the American Plantations 1650 - 1775 by David
      Dobson, published Baltimore, Maryland: Genealogical Publishing Co., Inc. 1983.

      Mr. Dobson resides in Scotland.
      My 82-year-old mother's great-grandfather, Walter Jackson of Scotland,
      fought at the Battle of Worcester for Charles II. He was not an officer. We
      are trying to find out in what unit he fought. Maybe if we knew this fact,
      we could then find out where in Scotland he was born. Walter Jackson was sent
      in the ship John and Sarah. In 1683 Walter Jackson died in Durham, New
      Hampshire.

      Sincerely,

      Susan M. Grady
      Alexandria, Virginia


      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Larry Highman
      The Battle of Dunbar was fought first. The survivors of that went to Worcester and fought there. It was the last stand, I guess. The prisoners from dunbar
      Message 2 of 9 , Oct 31, 2003
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        The Battle of Dunbar was fought first. The survivors of that went to
        Worcester and fought there. It was the last stand, I guess. The prisoners
        from dunbar were marched quite a distance, I forget where. Many were lost
        along the way and many did not survive their imprisonment. I guess we are
        lucky some survived to come to the colonies.

        Jan

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      • dunbarbill
        I would like to clarify a point about the Dunbar/Worcester prisoners and the cause of their transfer to various places inside and outside of England. Cromwell
        Message 3 of 9 , Mar 14 6:37 PM
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          I would like to clarify a point about the Dunbar/Worcester prisoners
          and the cause of their transfer to various places inside and outside
          of England.

          Cromwell or the English in general did not send the war prisoners
          aywhere except to prison. The government did offer the prisoners to
          various merchants and business ventures for sale. Whoever purchased
          the prisoners determined the final destination within some broad
          guidelines.

          The prisoners ended up in New England and other places, especially
          the
          Caribean, because the merchants that purchased their services
          transported and sold the indentures in open markets in the colonies.
          Those sold in England to work in England were transported to work in
          various types of ventures. If memory serves me these included
          weaving businesses and mines among other businesses.

          Take care,

          Bill Budde

          --- In ScottishWarPrisoners@yahoogroups.com, SusanG1400@a... wrote:
          > Several persons have asked recently where in the Western
          Hemisphere
          > Scotsmen taken prisoner at the Battles of Dunbar and Worcester
          were sent by Oliver
          > Cromwell. Oliver Cromwell sent these Scots prisoners to
          Massachusetts Bay
          > Colony, New Hampshire, Virginia, East New Jersey (Originally New
          Jersey was two
          > colonies: East New Jersey and West New Jersey.) and the British-
          controlled
          > islands of Jamaica and Barbados in the West Indies.
          > Someone asked on what other ships besides the John and Sara the
          prisoners
          > were sent to the Western Hemisphere. One other ship was the Henry
          and Francis
          > . It left from Leith Scotland on September 5, 1685. It took
          prisoners to
          > East New Jersey.
          > The Scots prisoners were sent to so many different places
          because the
          > English settlers in the American Colonies were afraid that if all
          these Scots
          > were sent to the same place, they might rebel.
          > There is a book that lists all the prisoners transported in
          alphabetical
          > order by last name and tells the names of the ship they were sent
          on, where in
          > the Western Hemisphere they were sent, and the date the ships left
          Great
          > Britain and from what port in Great Britain the ships left. I
          studied this book
          > at the Library of Congress in Washington, D.C. You cannot take
          books out from
          > this library. You can probably order this book on Interlibrary
          Loan from your
          > local public library. Your local library can obtain it from
          another library
          > in the United States for you. This book is:
          >
          > Directory of Scots Banished to the American Plantations 1650 -
          1775 by David
          > Dobson, published Baltimore, Maryland: Genealogical Publishing
          Co., Inc. 1983.
          >
          > Mr. Dobson resides in Scotland.
          > My 82-year-old mother's great-grandfather, Walter Jackson
          of Scotland,
          > fought at the Battle of Worcester for Charles II. He was not an
          officer. We
          > are trying to find out in what unit he fought. Maybe if we knew
          this fact,
          > we could then find out where in Scotland he was born. Walter
          Jackson was sent
          > in the ship John and Sarah. In 1683 Walter Jackson died in
          Durham, New
          > Hampshire.
          >
          > Sincerely,
          >
          > Susan M. Grady
          > Alexandria, Virginia
          >
          >
          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • dunbarbill
          In my previous reply I forgot to mention one other point. The prisoners transported on the Henry and Francis in 1685 were not prisoners of the English Civil
          Message 4 of 9 , Mar 14 6:42 PM
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            In my previous reply I forgot to mention one other point. The
            prisoners transported on the Henry and Francis in 1685 were not
            prisoners of the English Civil Wars, nor related to the prisoners
            captured at Dunbar and Worcester. The battles of Dunbar (1650) and
            Worcester (1651) took place 35 years earlier.

            Yours aye,

            Bill Budde

            --- In ScottishWarPrisoners@y
            ahoogroups.com, SusanG1400@a... wrote:
            > Several persons have asked recently where in the Western
            Hemisphere
            > Scotsmen taken prisoner at the Battles of Dunbar and Worcester
            were sent by Oliver
            > Cromwell. Oliver Cromwell sent these Scots prisoners to
            Massachusetts Bay
            > Colony, New Hampshire, Virginia, East New Jersey (Originally New
            Jersey was two
            > colonies: East New Jersey and West New Jersey.) and the British-
            controlled
            > islands of Jamaica and Barbados in the West Indies.
            > Someone asked on what other ships besides the John and Sara the
            prisoners
            > were sent to the Western Hemisphere. One other ship was the Henry
            and Francis
            > . It left from Leith Scotland on September 5, 1685. It took
            prisoners to
            > East New Jersey.
            > The Scots prisoners were sent to so many different places
            because the
            > English settlers in the American Colonies were afraid that if all
            these Scots
            > were sent to the same place, they might rebel.
            > There is a book that lists all the prisoners transported in
            alphabetical
            > order by last name and tells the names of the ship they were sent
            on, where in
            > the Western Hemisphere they were sent, and the date the ships left
            Great
            > Britain and from what port in Great Britain the ships left. I
            studied this book
            > at the Library of Congress in Washington, D.C. You cannot take
            books out from
            > this library. You can probably order this book on Interlibrary
            Loan from your
            > local public library. Your local library can obtain it from
            another library
            > in the United States for you. This book is:
            >
            > Directory of Scots Banished to the American Plantations 1650 -
            1775 by David
            > Dobson, published Baltimore, Maryland: Genealogical Publishing
            Co., Inc. 1983.
            >
            > Mr. Dobson resides in Scotland.
            > My 82-year-old mother's great-grandfather, Walter Jackson
            of Scotland,
            > fought at the Battle of Worcester for Charles II. He was not an
            officer. We
            > are trying to find out in what unit he fought. Maybe if we knew
            this fact,
            > we could then find out where in Scotland he was born. Walter
            Jackson was sent
            > in the ship John and Sarah. In 1683 Walter Jackson died in
            Durham, New
            > Hampshire.
            >
            > Sincerely,
            >
            > Susan M. Grady
            > Alexandria, Virginia
            >
            >
            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • J.Gray
            Hello all. My great great.....Grandfather was sent to this country on a ship called Unity in 1650. He worked in a saw mill in Berwick,Me. He was a prisoner of
            Message 5 of 9 , Mar 14 7:55 PM
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              Hello all.
              My great great.....Grandfather was sent to
              this country on a ship called Unity in 1650.
              He worked in a saw mill in Berwick,Me.
              He was a prisoner of the Battle of Dunbar in 1650.
              Thought I might mention this in case someone might be
              trying to follow their relatives steps from Scotland
              to the USA. Not all the prisoners worked at The Saugus
              Iron works. Good luck in your search

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            • Tom Cone
              I believe that an ancestor of mine, Acey Cone, had a father on the John and Sara, Neil Mackhoe (or something). He landed in Virginia, and that s about all I
              Message 6 of 9 , Mar 14 8:11 PM
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                I believe that an ancestor of mine, "Acey" Cone, had a
                father on the John and Sara, Neil Mackhoe (or
                something). He landed in Virginia, and that's about
                all I "know"

                Any help would be appreciated.

                =====
                "Dot is the reason Karadon kills clones!"
                - The cast of ANOA:Enclaves

                "Can Suhuy and I go back to creating balance now?"
                -Dot

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              • Amraff@aol.com
                Who was your great great ,,,,grandfather? I have two connections to Berwick s Unity section through the war prisoners. Mine are George Gray and William
                Message 7 of 9 , Mar 17 7:51 AM
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                  Who was your great great ,,,,grandfather? I have two connections to
                  Berwick's Unity section through the war prisoners. Mine are George Gray and William
                  Gowen, possibly others like Lewis Bean and Thomas Holmes. Anne


                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • J.Gray
                  My great,great...grandfather is also George Gray. Looking to find out more about him. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - More
                  Message 8 of 9 , Mar 18 2:14 PM
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                    My great,great...grandfather is also George Gray.
                    Looking to find out more about him.

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                    Yahoo! Mail - More reliable, more storage, less spam
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                  • Dave Fisher
                    I too am a direct relative of George Gray on my mother s side (grandmother Myrtle Gray (decd.) of Georgetown, MA). I realize that the early affairs of G.G.
                    Message 9 of 9 , Nov 8, 2005
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                      I too am a direct relative of George Gray on my mother's side
                      (grandmother Myrtle Gray (decd.) of Georgetown, MA). I realize that
                      the early affairs of G.G. are a bit hazy (gray!?). While poking
                      about for information, I came up on the comprehensive Cederman
                      geneology ( http://www.cederman.com/genealogy/ ) with notations of a
                      (the?) Gray family. Within it I note that a Lord Patrick Gray was
                      born in the Dundee/Perthshire area in 1538. His son, William is also
                      noted as being in the area as Sheriff of Forfar and then Burgess of
                      Dundee 1589-1590. No dates of birth or death in given. William's
                      son was Andrew, who also died in the area (at Pitscandly, near
                      Forfar), no date given. Andrew had one son, GEORGE. No other
                      information is noted for George, and there are no other George Grays
                      listed in any near period. If you allow a standard of 25 years
                      between generations beginning with Lord Patrick G., George G. would
                      have been born in the first quarter of the 1600s, and in his mid-30s
                      at the time of the Battle of Dunbar. That George left no progeny,
                      and is not listed as dying in Scotland. Maybe sent off in the
                      UNITY? Who knows?

                      The Grays have been claimed as a sept of the Southerland clan (far
                      northeast Scotland), but the history of the Battle of Dunbar is that
                      the highland clans did not participate, and that General Lesley
                      raised his Covenenter Army in the lowlands - Dundee and Perthshire
                      being quite close to the north across the River Tay.

                      So, it is not unreasonable to speculate that Cederman's George G.
                      could have been the one in the right place at the right time. Maybe
                      there is a paper-trail somewhere in the Forfar/Pitscandly area.

                      Dave Fisher

                      --- In ScottishWarPrisoners@yahoogroups.com, "J.Gray" <graysnh@y...>
                      wrote:
                      >
                      > My great,great...grandfather is also George Gray.
                      > Looking to find out more about him.
                      >
                      > __________________________________
                      > Do you Yahoo!?
                      > Yahoo! Mail - More reliable, more storage, less spam
                      > http://mail.yahoo.com
                      >
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