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  • hades3030
    Folks, I m back. I have joined and left this Group several times, and each time for a different reason. The last time I was here, something weird killed my
    Message 1 of 16 , Jul 18 8:16 AM
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      Folks,


      I'm back. I have joined and left this Group several times, and each
      time for a different reason. The last time I was here, something
      weird killed my Yahoo account so I couldn't reconnect using that
      account.

      I have started writing a novel about the Orisha and I need some
      feedback from you good people. Mainly, I would like to talk with
      some of you about the mechanics of writing a novel. I also think it
      would be great to have a ready resource of information, feedback,
      and speculation from other writers who are more skilled,
      knowledgable, and experienced than I am. That would be all of you,
      folks.

      So, again, I am here with you, but in a different form this time. I
      a probably not going to get into any debates or arguments over race
      and politics the way I did before. That actually ended up being a
      waste of time and energy when what I should have really been doing
      was writing, writing, writing.

      So, I will begin by giving you the premise of my novel and hopefully
      we can start a dialogue from there...
    • Nora
      ... Hi, Hades (weird to call you that...), I d be happy to talk with you about writing. I don t think there are many other writers here; this list is mainly
      Message 2 of 16 , Jul 18 3:08 PM
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        on 7/18/04 11:16 AM, hades3030 at hades3030@... wrote:
        > So, again, I am here with you, but in a different form this time. I
        > a probably not going to get into any debates or arguments over race
        > and politics the way I did before. That actually ended up being a
        > waste of time and energy when what I should have really been doing
        > was writing, writing, writing.
        >
        > So, I will begin by giving you the premise of my novel and hopefully
        > we can start a dialogue from there...

        Hi, Hades (weird to call you that...),

        I'd be happy to talk with you about writing. I don't think there are many
        other writers here; this list is mainly to talk about books already written
        (as far as I can tell). So welcome (back). =)

        Nora
      • belsidus2000
        I would be happy to give you whatever input I can, also. But I have a suggestion. It might save you a lot of agony if you just went ahead and wrote a draft,
        Message 3 of 16 , Jul 19 8:36 AM
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          I would be happy to give you whatever input I can, also.

          But I have a suggestion. It might save you a lot of agony if you
          just went ahead and wrote a draft, an outline or a synopsis.

          Chris Hayden


          --- In SciFiNoir_Lit@yahoogroups.com, "hades3030" <hades3030@y...>
          wrote:
          > Folks,
          >
          >
          > I'm back. I have joined and left this Group several times, and each
          > time for a different reason. The last time I was here, something
          > weird killed my Yahoo account so I couldn't reconnect using that
          > account.
          >
          > I have started writing a novel about the Orisha and I need some
          > feedback from you good people. Mainly, I would like to talk with
          > some of you about the mechanics of writing a novel. I also think it
          > would be great to have a ready resource of information, feedback,
          > and speculation from other writers who are more skilled,
          > knowledgable, and experienced than I am. That would be all of you,
          > folks.
          >
          > So, again, I am here with you, but in a different form this time. I
          > a probably not going to get into any debates or arguments over race
          > and politics the way I did before. That actually ended up being a
          > waste of time and energy when what I should have really been doing
          > was writing, writing, writing.
          >
          > So, I will begin by giving you the premise of my novel and hopefully
          > we can start a dialogue from there...
        • Lord Hades
          And posted the synopsis on our Group? belsidus2000 wrote:I would be happy to give you whatever input I can, also. But I have a
          Message 4 of 16 , Jul 19 9:42 AM
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            And posted the synopsis on our Group?

            belsidus2000 <Frofidemus@...> wrote:I would be happy to give you whatever input I can, also.

            But I have a suggestion. It might save you a lot of agony if you
            just went ahead and wrote a draft, an outline or a synopsis.

            Chris Hayden


            --- In SciFiNoir_Lit@yahoogroups.com, "hades3030" <hades3030@y...>
            wrote:
            > Folks,
            >
            >
            > I'm back. I have joined and left this Group several times, and each
            > time for a different reason. The last time I was here, something
            > weird killed my Yahoo account so I couldn't reconnect using that
            > account.
            >
            > I have started writing a novel about the Orisha and I need some
            > feedback from you good people. Mainly, I would like to talk with
            > some of you about the mechanics of writing a novel. I also think it
            > would be great to have a ready resource of information, feedback,
            > and speculation from other writers who are more skilled,
            > knowledgable, and experienced than I am. That would be all of you,
            > folks.
            >
            > So, again, I am here with you, but in a different form this time. I
            > a probably not going to get into any debates or arguments over race
            > and politics the way I did before. That actually ended up being a
            > waste of time and energy when what I should have really been doing
            > was writing, writing, writing.
            >
            > So, I will begin by giving you the premise of my novel and hopefully
            > we can start a dialogue from there...



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          • belsidus2000
            However you thought it best to disseminate it Chris
            Message 5 of 16 , Jul 19 12:45 PM
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              However you thought it best to disseminate it

              Chris

              --- In SciFiNoir_Lit@yahoogroups.com, Lord Hades <hades3030@y...>
              wrote:
              > And posted the synopsis on our Group?
              >
              >
            • cecilwashington
              You d be better off writing the work then editing it later. You need something to work with. Go ahead and finish one complete draft, THEN tear it apart. If
              Message 6 of 16 , Jul 19 1:17 PM
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                You'd be better off writing the work then editing it later. You need
                something to work with.

                Go ahead and finish one complete draft, THEN tear it apart. If you
                edit while you write you won't even get that far.
              • Lord Hades
                Basically, this is what the back cover would read... When December Rene, a young bi-racial woman living in Pitt City, discovers ancient magic from African
                Message 7 of 16 , Jul 20 6:12 AM
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                  Basically, this is what the back cover would read...

                  "When December Rene, a young bi-racial woman living in Pitt City, discovers ancient magic from African mythology inside a derelict house, her directionless life suddenly becomes filled with mystical danger and blossoming powers. Anansi, once a benevolent Trickster spirit and now insane with bitterness over her primordial banishment to earth, has been seeking a way to play her last, terrible trick on creation and the magic that December uncovers is the key to the malevolent gods dream of apocalypse. With the friendship of a mysterious drifter who claims to be a warrior and descendant of Obatala, the First King of the First City, and the benefit of her developing magical power, December finds herself in a deadly game of cat and mouse as Anasi pursues her across America with evil spirits and baleful mysticism. The final battle will take place in the deep, rural south, surrounded by the magic of Vodoun, and will decide the fate of our creation. Can December, a wayward orphan and street
                  urchin, stand against the mighty rage of Anansi, the Trickster, or will both her soul and the world be crushed in the last Anasasem?"

                  belsidus2000 <Frofidemus@...> wrote:
                  However you thought it best to disseminate it

                  Chris

                  --- In SciFiNoir_Lit@yahoogroups.com, Lord Hades <hades3030@y...>
                  wrote:
                  > And posted the synopsis on our Group?
                  >
                  >



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                • Lord Hades
                  I used to believe that until I wrote a novel in college without doing any editing. I whizzed through it and finished in a few months. Then I started editing
                  Message 8 of 16 , Jul 20 6:21 AM
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                    I used to believe that until I wrote a novel in college without doing any editing. I whizzed through it and finished in a few months. Then I started editing and, after about a month, got burned out. There were so many errors, inconsistencies, and knots in it that the work of editing became almost impossible to endure. Now I have learned that, yes, I do not edit too much while writing but I try to make sure each chapter is as clean and solid as possible before moving on. I keep a second file open on my PC called EDITING NOTES where I jot down notes to myself as I write. I also think that, like a house, the novel is built in Chapters that rest on the foundations of all the ones that came before, I want to have a solid foundation the first time I build it. I don't think that editing should turn into a complete rewrite (rebuilding the entire house) but that it should be like polishing, trouble-shooting, and tweaking the final product (adding drain spouts, putting varnish and weather
                    protection on the wooden shutters, fixing some weak areas in the roof). When I am able to move away from a Chapter and feel that its pretty close to being perfect, I get excited about writing the next Chapter, and so on. There is no time limit for me, and I am writing everyday for several hours of time - sometimes even at work. Just the act of writing a long project like this feels really good, and I already have all the notes and outlines ready to go because its an idea that has been building for a few years now.

                    Related to issues of editing and time, I read S.K.'s "On Writing" and that was one of the most beneficial books about the craft that I could have picked up. I highly recommend it if any of you writers have not yet read it.



                    cecilwashington <cecilwashington@...> wrote:
                    You'd be better off writing the work then editing it later. You need
                    something to work with.

                    Go ahead and finish one complete draft, THEN tear it apart. If you
                    edit while you write you won't even get that far.



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                  • Nora
                    ... I d second that, though SK s book is a little rambly and a bit too focused on himself. I prefer Orson Scott Card s HOW TO WRITE SCIENCE FICTION AND
                    Message 9 of 16 , Jul 20 9:43 AM
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                      > -----Original Message-----
                      > From: Lord Hades [mailto:hades3030@...]
                      > Related to issues of editing and time, I read S.K.'s "On
                      > Writing" and that was one of the most beneficial books about
                      > the craft that I could have picked up. I highly recommend it
                      > if any of you writers have not yet read it.

                      I'd second that, though SK's book is a little rambly and a bit too focused
                      on himself. I prefer Orson Scott Card's HOW TO WRITE SCIENCE FICTION AND
                      FANTASY. He gets into the nitty-gritty of building the elements of a story,
                      including those elements unique to this genre such as worldbuilding and
                      futurism (although he doesn't call it that). I also love that he uses
                      Octavia Butler's work as an example for many of his points.

                      Nora
                    • Nora
                      ... [snip] It sounds interesting, although it s hard to tell from such a brief blurb. Have you outlined it, if you use outlines? How far along are you? What
                      Message 10 of 16 , Jul 20 9:43 AM
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                        > -----Original Message-----
                        > From: Lord Hades [mailto:hades3030@...]
                        >
                        > Basically, this is what the back cover would read...

                        [snip]

                        It sounds interesting, although it's hard to tell from such a brief blurb.
                        Have you outlined it, if you use outlines? How far along are you? What
                        were the questions you wanted to ask about this?

                        Nora
                      • Lord Hades
                        Yes, I have a full outline but I am more hesitant to put that out in the world, right now. I am on Chapter 5. There will be about 25 Chapters, I think. Maybe
                        Message 11 of 16 , Jul 20 10:54 AM
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                          Yes, I have a full outline but I am more hesitant to put that out in the world, right now. I am on Chapter 5. There will be about 25 Chapters, I think. Maybe more. Probably more.

                          Mainly, my first question is about exposition. How much is enough? How much is too much? Sometimes, it seems, I HAVE to tell because I cannot show, although the golden rule seems to be SHOW do not TELL. Any rules of thumb you follow for this?

                          Nora <njem@...> wrote:
                          > -----Original Message-----
                          > From: Lord Hades [mailto:hades3030@...]
                          >
                          > Basically, this is what the back cover would read...

                          [snip]

                          It sounds interesting, although it's hard to tell from such a brief blurb.
                          Have you outlined it, if you use outlines? How far along are you? What
                          were the questions you wanted to ask about this?

                          Nora



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                        • Nora
                          ... Sometimes you have to tell. You try to avoid it, but as you say sometimes there s no other way to get the idea across. So go ahead and write it the way
                          Message 12 of 16 , Jul 20 3:03 PM
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                            on 7/20/04 1:54 PM, Lord Hades at hades3030@... wrote:

                            > Yes, I have a full outline but I am more hesitant to put that out in the
                            > world, right now. I am on Chapter 5. There will be about 25 Chapters, I think.
                            > Maybe more. Probably more.
                            >
                            > Mainly, my first question is about exposition. How much is enough? How much is
                            > too much? Sometimes, it seems, I HAVE to tell because I cannot show, although
                            > the golden rule seems to be SHOW do not TELL. Any rules of thumb you follow
                            > for this?

                            Sometimes you have to tell. You try to avoid it, but as you say sometimes
                            there's no other way to get the idea across. So go ahead and write it the
                            way you need to, then when you get it critiqued and revised, see what people
                            say. If they don't like the telling, then ask for their suggestions on
                            changing it to showing, and then change it. The bottom line is to go ahead
                            and finish. You can spend a lot of time fretting about chapters 1-5 and
                            trying to make them perfect, but if you never get to chapter 25 (or the end)
                            then no one will want to see the manuscript but you. I wouldn't call that
                            wasted effort since I believe that all writing, even the crap that ends up
                            in our trashbins, contributes to our skill and experience... but if you want
                            to get published and you never produce anything publishable, that does sort
                            of defeat the purpose. =)

                            Nora
                          • Lord Hades
                            Excellent feedback, Nora. Where can I find more people like you? Critters? ... Sometimes you have to tell. You try to avoid it, but as you say sometimes
                            Message 13 of 16 , Jul 20 6:51 PM
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                              Excellent feedback, Nora. Where can I find more people like you? Critters?

                              Nora <njem@...> wrote:on 7/20/04 1:54 PM, Lord Hades at hades3030@... wrote:

                              > Yes, I have a full outline but I am more hesitant to put that out in the
                              > world, right now. I am on Chapter 5. There will be about 25 Chapters, I think.
                              > Maybe more. Probably more.
                              >
                              > Mainly, my first question is about exposition. How much is enough? How much is
                              > too much? Sometimes, it seems, I HAVE to tell because I cannot show, although
                              > the golden rule seems to be SHOW do not TELL. Any rules of thumb you follow
                              > for this?

                              Sometimes you have to tell. You try to avoid it, but as you say sometimes
                              there's no other way to get the idea across. So go ahead and write it the
                              way you need to, then when you get it critiqued and revised, see what people
                              say. If they don't like the telling, then ask for their suggestions on
                              changing it to showing, and then change it. The bottom line is to go ahead
                              and finish. You can spend a lot of time fretting about chapters 1-5 and
                              trying to make them perfect, but if you never get to chapter 25 (or the end)
                              then no one will want to see the manuscript but you. I wouldn't call that
                              wasted effort since I believe that all writing, even the crap that ends up
                              in our trashbins, contributes to our skill and experience... but if you want
                              to get published and you never produce anything publishable, that does sort
                              of defeat the purpose. =)

                              Nora



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                            • Nora
                              ... Just writers in general. Most of what I m saying is something I ve learned from other writers. They re out there, easy to find. You just have to go talk
                              Message 14 of 16 , Jul 20 8:53 PM
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                                > Excellent feedback, Nora. Where can I find more people like you? Critters?

                                Just writers in general. Most of what I'm saying is something I've learned
                                from other writers. They're out there, easy to find. You just have to go
                                talk to them. =) Critters is a good place to start. Check their
                                "resources" page for links to other places where you can meet writers.

                                Nora
                              • nita price
                                HI LORD HADES! THANKS FOR SHARING A SYNOPSIS OF YOUR UPCOMING NOVEL. IT SOUNDS GOOD. CAN T WAIT FOR IT TO BE PUBLISHED. GOOD LUCK TO YOU IN CREATING WHAT
                                Message 15 of 16 , Jul 30 9:40 AM
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                                  HI LORD HADES!
                                  THANKS FOR SHARING A SYNOPSIS OF YOUR UPCOMING NOVEL. IT SOUNDS GOOD. CAN'T WAIT FOR IT TO BE PUBLISHED. GOOD LUCK TO YOU IN CREATING WHAT SOUNDS TO BE AN EXCELLENT READ.
                                  BLESSED BE...QUEEN NITA

                                  Lord Hades <hades3030@...> wrote:
                                  Basically, this is what the back cover would read...

                                  "When December Rene, a young bi-racial woman living in Pitt City, discovers ancient magic from African mythology inside a derelict house, her directionless life suddenly becomes filled with mystical danger and blossoming powers. Anansi, once a benevolent Trickster spirit and now insane with bitterness over her primordial banishment to earth, has been seeking a way to play her last, terrible trick on creation and the magic that December uncovers is the key to the malevolent gods dream of apocalypse. With the friendship of a mysterious drifter who claims to be a warrior and descendant of Obatala, the First King of the First City, and the benefit of her developing magical power, December finds herself in a deadly game of cat and mouse as Anasi pursues her across America with evil spirits and baleful mysticism. The final battle will take place in the deep, rural south, surrounded by the magic of Vodoun, and will decide the fate of our creation. Can December, a wayward orphan and street
                                  urchin, stand against the mighty rage of Anansi, the Trickster, or will both her soul and the world be crushed in the last Anasasem?"

                                  belsidus2000 <Frofidemus@...> wrote:
                                  However you thought it best to disseminate it

                                  Chris

                                  --- In SciFiNoir_Lit@yahoogroups.com, Lord Hades <hades3030@y...>
                                  wrote:
                                  > And posted the synopsis on our Group?
                                  >
                                  >



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                                  Well, the Queen has spoken, not with conceit, but with love....Peace & Blessed Be.....Queen Nita

                                  The past makes us who we are; don't make it your burden.....Jet Li in Twin Warriors

                                  Today is a gift, tomorrow is a blessing & Live without worry for tomorrow or fear for today......Colleen Shannon's "The Trelayne Inheritance"

                                  Let your LIFE preach more LOUDLY than your LIPS.........E. Lynn Harris' "Abide With Me"

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                                • Lord Hades
                                  Thanks Nita. I am enjoying writing it. Your positive words are encouraging! nita price wrote:HI LORD HADES! THANKS FOR SHARING
                                  Message 16 of 16 , Jul 31 9:38 AM
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                                    Thanks Nita. I am enjoying writing it. Your positive words are encouraging!

                                    nita price <queennefertiti19154@...> wrote:HI LORD HADES!
                                    THANKS FOR SHARING A SYNOPSIS OF YOUR UPCOMING NOVEL. IT SOUNDS GOOD. CAN'T WAIT FOR IT TO BE PUBLISHED. GOOD LUCK TO YOU IN CREATING WHAT SOUNDS TO BE AN EXCELLENT READ.
                                    BLESSED BE...QUEEN NITA

                                    Lord Hades <hades3030@...> wrote:
                                    Basically, this is what the back cover would read...

                                    "When December Rene, a young bi-racial woman living in Pitt City, discovers ancient magic from African mythology inside a derelict house, her directionless life suddenly becomes filled with mystical danger and blossoming powers. Anansi, once a benevolent Trickster spirit and now insane with bitterness over her primordial banishment to earth, has been seeking a way to play her last, terrible trick on creation and the magic that December uncovers is the key to the malevolent gods dream of apocalypse. With the friendship of a mysterious drifter who claims to be a warrior and descendant of Obatala, the First King of the First City, and the benefit of her developing magical power, December finds herself in a deadly game of cat and mouse as Anasi pursues her across America with evil spirits and baleful mysticism. The final battle will take place in the deep, rural south, surrounded by the magic of Vodoun, and will decide the fate of our creation. Can December, a wayward orphan and street
                                    urchin, stand against the mighty rage of Anansi, the Trickster, or will both her soul and the world be crushed in the last Anasasem?"

                                    belsidus2000 <Frofidemus@...> wrote:
                                    However you thought it best to disseminate it

                                    Chris

                                    --- In SciFiNoir_Lit@yahoogroups.com, Lord Hades <hades3030@y...>
                                    wrote:
                                    > And posted the synopsis on our Group?
                                    >
                                    >



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                                    Well, the Queen has spoken, not with conceit, but with love....Peace & Blessed Be.....Queen Nita

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