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Re: Guide help please

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  • prairiesfran
    Loving the replies. Thx to all. (and any future!) Fran -Regina
    Message 1 of 12 , Jan 4, 2012
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      Loving the replies. Thx to all. (and any future!)
      Fran -Regina

      --- In Saskbirds@yahoogroups.com, "Jack Monteith" <jmonteith@...> wrote:
      >
      > When I ordered my Sibley I was well aware of the limitations of my old second edition 1961 Peterson's Western guide. It's good for Saskatchewan, most of time time. However, suppose you see a TV special on Atlantic seabirds. In the pre-internet days I would have assumed that both Puffins and Gannets were the size of Mallards and there are those exceptional strays like the recent Frigatebird. So I got the big Sibley. It's good, although the color is bad on some pages and a few illustrations are too small.
      >
      > My go-to book is still my old 1966 Golden. The illustrations are superb and the maps are right there. The old species names are a bit of a problem. My fourth book is Godfrey's The Birds of Canada. A bit dated, and way too big for a field guide, but far more detailed than the others.
      >
    • Jack Monteith
      I should add that I d give all four of my books a 4+ rating, but not a 5 on Amazon s 1 to 5 star rating system. Each has it own strengths and weaknesses. Both
      Message 2 of 12 , Jan 4, 2012
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        I should add that I'd give all four of my books a 4+ rating, but not a 5 on Amazon's 1 to 5 star rating system. Each has it own strengths and weaknesses. Both Peterson's and Golden have been published for over 40 years, so check out the used bookstores. Apparently, going by Amazon reviews, the paintings in the latest Golden aren't as good as in the older editions.
      • Bruce Wilson
        ... I have Peterson (several editions), Sibley (pocket and full size), Golden, Crossley and others but my favourite is the National Geographic Guide of which I
        Message 3 of 12 , Jan 4, 2012
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          At 20:44 1/4/2012, you wrote:
          >I should add that I'd give all four of my books a 4+ rating, but not
          >a 5 on Amazon's 1 to 5 star rating system. Each has it own strengths
          >and weaknesses. Both Peterson's and Golden have been published for
          >over 40 years, so check out the used bookstores. Apparently, going
          >by Amazon reviews, the paintings in the latest Golden aren't as good
          >as in the older editions.


          I have Peterson (several editions), Sibley (pocket and full size),
          Golden, Crossley and others but my favourite is the National
          Geographic Guide of which I now have three editions including the latest.

          -
          Bruce Wilson
          Barrie, Ontario
          Life Member NMRA Member Gauge 0 Guild
          Member Scale 7 Group Member 7mm NGA
          Member Bird Studies Canada Member Ontario Bird Banding Association
        • tsb2001@sasktel.net
          Hi The Eastern and Western Peterson Guide series created issues for Saskatchewan birders and others living in middle regions requiring us to have both
          Message 4 of 12 , Jan 5, 2012
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            Hi
            The Eastern and Western Peterson Guide series created issues for Saskatchewan birders and others living in middle regions requiring us to have both editions. We typically have a representative sample of species from both regions. The two Sibley Guides resolve that issue because 'each' guide overlaps with an almost complete coverage of Eastern and Western Birds. Each one does have some missing species which may stray into this area;however, in the main each provides great coverage for this area.

            For example, the Western Guide does not include a few Eastern species such as Kirtland's Warbler, Prairie Warbler, Florida Scrub Jay, Black-whiskered Vireo, Spot-breasted Oriole and a few other eastern species. However, It does contain the majority of examples of Eastern Birds which maybe possible as strays or vagrants-Protonotary Warbler, Painted Bunting, Glossy Ibis and many others.

            I still prefer to have the large Sibley which includes the songs . This is also available as an application on an Iphone or Blackberry. Although, either guide is fine as mentioned. I do prefer the Western one slightly for this area if you do not have the larger Sibley Guide or an App. This App is now the guide that I carry in the field for its portability. More about that later.

            As mentioned, previously there are two types of guides available, those with photographs/images and those such as the Sibley's and the National Geographic Guides which as mentioned previously BOTH utilise illustrations in presenting the birds.

            Each type though has its strengths. Now with many more stock bird images available the photographic guides are much improved because of a better images presenting the birds in a manner which allows key field marks to be available. Illustrations allow the author to position the birds to display key features with the possible downfall that these may not capture the proportion and actual presentation of the species in a way that an excellent photo may.

            For me, the guides which provide the "most comprehensive" array of various plumages which also include flight views are the "best." This is why I still rank Sibley including Apps as my favourite with the National Geographic Field Guide to the Birds of North America (6th Edition) as a close second. Both of these as mentioned happen to utilise illustrations.

            Others ,which I think are excellent, utilise images/photos such as "The Stokes Field Guide to Birds of North America" and "Smithsonian Field Guide to the Birds of North America". I do not own the Crossley book, yet. In some instances, these do not cover all subspecies or enough typical plumages. Otherwise, these are excellent

            All of the newer guides have updated distribution maps. That for me is an important consideration. The size of these guides can impact whether these are for study at home, use in the car or 'usability' in the field. That, too, is a factor when making a selection.

            In the end, people will select what serves them best depending upon their needs. That never changes.

            My two original guides included the Peterson series and the oft mentioned Golden Guide, which included all of the species in one smaller book. The Peterson series with their arrows pointing out key id aspects does make it a favourite for some. The binding on the Golden Guides was always an issue rendering it a "loose leaf" binder after hard use in the field.


            Enjoy your birding
            Bob L
            Regina


            ----- Original Message -----
            From: Kevin
            To: Saskbirds@yahoogroups.com
            Sent: Wednesday, January 04, 2012 7:45 AM
            Subject: [Saskbirds] Re: Guide help please



            Guides very so much as to a person's personal preference and also if you want to specialize or focus on one group. Bob gave good reasons to buy the Stokes guide which I did and carry it in my car and it has helped me several times when other guides haven't.

            I personally still like the Peterson series. I like the fact the reference the key points to look for and when for most species, esp adult males in breeding plummage, that is all you need. The older Peterson's could still fit in your pocket too.

            Every now and then I'll still dig out my old Golden Guide and I still recommend that for anyone who wants just ONE guide. While it tries to include all of North America, the map is right there with the listing to fix that. But for many birds they contained the sonogram of the bird's call. I found that very useful in the field especially for birds whose call can't easily be described in English.

            KEvin

            --- In Saskbirds@yahoogroups.com, "prairiesfran" <prairiesfran@...> wrote:
            >
            > Hi! I checked into getting a Sibley's guide (book not eguide) as I've been using about 5 other birding books but not Sibley's. (Al Smith's, Audobon, etc)
            >
            > So I found some available on Amazon and purchased a Western (thinking Ont and East are East, or maybe Manitoba, Ont etc are E) and that Sask and West are the Western guide.
            >
            > Received it and it indicates within the first few pgs that this Western guide isn't for Sk! I suppose I should grab an Eastern one now.
            >
            > Just wondering, which do people use, I take it the Eastern? Will I get "good enough" info from this Western guide? or is "good enough" NOT good enough and I really sh/purchase an Eastern?
            >
            > Appreciate any comments. Thx
            >
            > Fran in Regina
            >





            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • prairiesfran
            Thanks, Bob; I think, then that I won t bother purchasing the Eastern Sibley s. I ve had emails about the large Sibleys - but for now I ll use the Western,
            Message 5 of 12 , Jan 5, 2012
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              Thanks, Bob; I think, then that I won't bother purchasing the Eastern Sibley's.

              I've had emails about the large Sibleys - but for now I'll use the Western, along with the old Peterson, Al's book, an Audubon Western (photos), the Nat Geo 2nd Edition (lots of drawings) and the Golden. Should help me a lot.

              And yes - found a lot in a 2nd hand book shop, I think I cleaned out Parksville, Vanc Island's used bookstore of what they had when I was out there!

              Fran - Regina

              --- In Saskbirds@yahoogroups.com, tsb2001@... wrote:
              >
              > Hi
              > The Eastern and Western Peterson Guide series created issues for Saskatchewan birders and others living in middle regions requiring us to have both editions. We typically have a representative sample of species from both regions. The two Sibley Guides resolve that issue because 'each' guide overlaps with an almost complete coverage of Eastern and Western Birds. Each one does have some missing species which may stray into this area;however, in the main each provides great coverage for this area.
              >
              > For example, the Western Guide does not include a few Eastern species such as Kirtland's Warbler, Prairie Warbler, Florida Scrub Jay, Black-whiskered Vireo, Spot-breasted Oriole and a few other eastern species. However, It does contain the majority of examples of Eastern Birds which maybe possible as strays or vagrants-Protonotary Warbler, Painted Bunting, Glossy Ibis and many others.
              >
              > I still prefer to have the large Sibley which includes the songs . This is also available as an application on an Iphone or Blackberry. Although, either guide is fine as mentioned. I do prefer the Western one slightly for this area if you do not have the larger Sibley Guide or an App. This App is now the guide that I carry in the field for its portability. More about that later.
              >
              > As mentioned, previously there are two types of guides available, those with photographs/images and those such as the Sibley's and the National Geographic Guides which as mentioned previously BOTH utilise illustrations in presenting the birds.
              >
              > Each type though has its strengths. Now with many more stock bird images available the photographic guides are much improved because of a better images presenting the birds in a manner which allows key field marks to be available. Illustrations allow the author to position the birds to display key features with the possible downfall that these may not capture the proportion and actual presentation of the species in a way that an excellent photo may.
              >
              > For me, the guides which provide the "most comprehensive" array of various plumages which also include flight views are the "best." This is why I still rank Sibley including Apps as my favourite with the National Geographic Field Guide to the Birds of North America (6th Edition) as a close second. Both of these as mentioned happen to utilise illustrations.
              >
              > Others ,which I think are excellent, utilise images/photos such as "The Stokes Field Guide to Birds of North America" and "Smithsonian Field Guide to the Birds of North America". I do not own the Crossley book, yet. In some instances, these do not cover all subspecies or enough typical plumages. Otherwise, these are excellent
              >
              > All of the newer guides have updated distribution maps. That for me is an important consideration. The size of these guides can impact whether these are for study at home, use in the car or 'usability' in the field. That, too, is a factor when making a selection.
              >
              > In the end, people will select what serves them best depending upon their needs. That never changes.
              >
              > My two original guides included the Peterson series and the oft mentioned Golden Guide, which included all of the species in one smaller book. The Peterson series with their arrows pointing out key id aspects does make it a favourite for some. The binding on the Golden Guides was always an issue rendering it a "loose leaf" binder after hard use in the field.
              >
              >
              > Enjoy your birding
              > Bob L
              > Regina
              >
              >
              > ----- Original Message -----
              > From: Kevin
              > To: Saskbirds@yahoogroups.com
              > Sent: Wednesday, January 04, 2012 7:45 AM
              > Subject: [Saskbirds] Re: Guide help please
              >
              >
              >
              > Guides very so much as to a person's personal preference and also if you want to specialize or focus on one group. Bob gave good reasons to buy the Stokes guide which I did and carry it in my car and it has helped me several times when other guides haven't.
              >
              > I personally still like the Peterson series. I like the fact the reference the key points to look for and when for most species, esp adult males in breeding plummage, that is all you need. The older Peterson's could still fit in your pocket too.
              >
              > Every now and then I'll still dig out my old Golden Guide and I still recommend that for anyone who wants just ONE guide. While it tries to include all of North America, the map is right there with the listing to fix that. But for many birds they contained the sonogram of the bird's call. I found that very useful in the field especially for birds whose call can't easily be described in English.
              >
              > KEvin
              >
              > --- In Saskbirds@yahoogroups.com, "prairiesfran" <prairiesfran@> wrote:
              > >
              > > Hi! I checked into getting a Sibley's guide (book not eguide) as I've been using about 5 other birding books but not Sibley's. (Al Smith's, Audobon, etc)
              > >
              > > So I found some available on Amazon and purchased a Western (thinking Ont and East are East, or maybe Manitoba, Ont etc are E) and that Sask and West are the Western guide.
              > >
              > > Received it and it indicates within the first few pgs that this Western guide isn't for Sk! I suppose I should grab an Eastern one now.
              > >
              > > Just wondering, which do people use, I take it the Eastern? Will I get "good enough" info from this Western guide? or is "good enough" NOT good enough and I really sh/purchase an Eastern?
              > >
              > > Appreciate any comments. Thx
              > >
              > > Fran in Regina
              > >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >
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