Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Samyojanas

Expand Messages
  • han tun
    Venerable Bhantes, There are two sets of Sa.myojanas: one according to the Suttas and the other according to the Abhidhamma. Suttanta Method: A nguttara
    Message 1 of 2 , Sep 29, 2012
    • 0 Attachment
      Venerable Bhantes,

      There are two sets of Sa.myojanas: one according to the Suttas and the other according to the Abhidhamma.

      Suttanta Method:

      A"nguttara Nikaaya, Dasakanipaatapaa.li, 2. Naathavaggo, 3. Sa.myojanasutta.m

      13. "Dasayimaani, bhikkhave, sa.myojanaani. Katamaani dasa? Pa~ncorambhaagiyaani sa.myojanaani, pa~ncuddhambhaagiyaani sa.myojanaani. Katamaani pa~ncorambhaagiyaani sa.myojanaani? (1) Sakkaayadi.t.thi, (2) vicikicchaa, (3) siilabbataparaamaaso, (4) kaamacchando, (5) byaapaado. Imaani pa~ncorambhaagiyaani sa.myojanaani.

      "Katamaani pa~ncuddhambhaagiyaani sa.myojanaani? (6) Ruuparaago, (7) aruuparaago, (8) maano, (9) uddhacca.m, (10) avijjaa. Imaani pa~ncuddhambhaagiyaani sa.myojanaani. Imaani kho, bhikkhave, dasa sa.myojanaanii"ti.

      ---------------

      Abhidhamma Method:

      Dhammasa"nganiipaa.li, 3. Nikkhepaka.n.da.m, Sa.myojanagocchaka.m

      1118. Katame dhammaa sa.myojanaa? Dasa sa.myojanaani: (1) kaamaraagasa.myojana.m, (2) pa.tighasa.myojana.m,(3) maanasa.myojana.m, (4) di.t.thisa.myojana.m, (5) vicikicchaasa.myojana.m, (6) siilabbataparaamaasasa.myojana.m, (7) bhavaraagasa.myojana.m, (8) issaasa.myojana.m, (9) macchariyasa.myojana.m, (10) avijjaasa.myojana.m.
      ----------
      Vibha"ngapaa.li, 17. Khuddakavatthuvibha"ngo, 10. Dasakaniddeso, (4) Dasa sa.myojanaani

      969. Tattha katamaani dasa sa.myojanaani? (1) Kaamaraagasa.myojana.m, (2) pa.tighasa.myojana.m , (3) maanasa.myojana.m, (4) di.t.thisa.myojana.m, (5) vicikicchaasa.myojana.m, (6) siilabbataparaamaasasa.myojana.m, (7) bhavaraagasa.myojana.m, (8) issaasa.myojana.m, (9) macchariyasa.myojana.m, (10) avijjaasa.myojana.m. Imaani dasa sa.myojanaani.

      ---------------

      Now, there must be a very good reason for including issaa-sa.myojana and macchariya-sa.myojana in the list in Abhidhamma although they are not listed in suttas. I will be grateful to know that reason.

      Secondly, although they are listed in number 8th and 9th positions, I assume that they can be eradicated by anaagaami-magga. Is my assumption correct?

      Thank you very much.

      Respectfully,
      Dr Han Tun
    • Dieter Moeller
      Dear Venerables Sirs, like Dr. Han Tun I stumbled upon the difference between the squence of Samyojana as stated in the Suttas and the version of Abhidhamma. I
      Message 2 of 2 , Oct 3, 2012
      • 0 Attachment
        Dear Venerables Sirs, 
         
        like Dr. Han Tun I stumbled upon the difference between the squence of Samyojana as stated in the Suttas and the version of Abhidhamma.
        I  would appreciate if you could help with an explanation respectively refer to a link the question may be addressed to.
         
        The different definition of the 10 fetters in the Suttas and Abhidhamma according to Venerable  Nyanatiloka's Buddhist Dictionary :
         
        (A.IX.67-68; A.X.13; D.33, etc.)
        • (1) personality-belief (sakkāya-ditthi)
        • (2) sceptical doubt (vicikicchā)
        • (3) clinging to mere rules and ritual (sīlabbata-parāmāsa; s. upādāna)
        • (4) sensuous craving (kāma-rāga)
        • (5) ill-will (vyāpāda)
        • (6) craving for fine-material existence (rūpa-rāga)
        • (7) craving for immaterial existence (arūpa-rāga)
        • (8) conceit (māna)
        • (9) restlessness (uddhacca)
        • (10) ignorance (avijjā)

        The 10 fetters as enumerated in the Abhidhamma, e.g. Vibh. XVII, are:

        1. sensuous craving,
        2. ill-will,
        3. conceit,
        4. wrong views,
        5. sceptical doubt,
        6. clinging to mere rules and ritual,
        7. craving for existence,
        8. envy,
        9. stinginess,
        10. ignorance.
        unquote
         
          I assume that the sequence of both versions  refer to Ariya Puggala , the different types of the Noble Ones , which-I.M.H.O.- excludes different schemes . 
         
        Thank you for your attention,
         
        with Metta Dieter 
         
         
         
         
         
        ----- Original Message -----
        From: han tun
        Sent: Saturday, September 29, 2012 11:01 PM
        Subject: [SanghaOnline] Samyojanas

         

        Venerable Bhantes,

        There are two sets of Sa.myojanas: one according to the Suttas and the other according to the Abhidhamma.

        Suttanta Method:

        A"nguttara Nikaaya, Dasakanipaatapaa.li, 2. Naathavaggo, 3. Sa.myojanasutta.m

        13. "Dasayimaani, bhikkhave, sa.myojanaani. Katamaani dasa? Pa~ncorambhaagiyaani sa.myojanaani, pa~ncuddhambhaagiyaani sa.myojanaani. Katamaani pa~ncorambhaagiyaani sa.myojanaani? (1) Sakkaayadi.t.thi, (2) vicikicchaa, (3) siilabbataparaamaaso, (4) kaamacchando, (5) byaapaado. Imaani pa~ncorambhaagiyaani sa.myojanaani.

        "Katamaani pa~ncuddhambhaagiyaani sa.myojanaani? (6) Ruuparaago, (7) aruuparaago, (8) maano, (9) uddhacca.m, (10) avijjaa. Imaani pa~ncuddhambhaagiyaani sa.myojanaani. Imaani kho, bhikkhave, dasa sa.myojanaanii"ti.

        ---------------

        Abhidhamma Method:

        Dhammasa"nganiipaa.li, 3. Nikkhepaka.n.da.m, Sa.myojanagocchaka.m

        1118. Katame dhammaa sa.myojanaa? Dasa sa.myojanaani: (1) kaamaraagasa.myojana.m, (2) pa.tighasa.myojana.m,(3) maanasa.myojana.m, (4) di.t.thisa.myojana.m, (5) vicikicchaasa.myojana.m, (6) siilabbataparaamaasasa.myojana.m, (7) bhavaraagasa.myojana.m, (8) issaasa.myojana.m, (9) macchariyasa.myojana.m, (10) avijjaasa.myojana.m.
        ----------
        Vibha"ngapaa.li, 17. Khuddakavatthuvibha"ngo, 10. Dasakaniddeso, (4) Dasa sa.myojanaani

        969. Tattha katamaani dasa sa.myojanaani? (1) Kaamaraagasa.myojana.m, (2) pa.tighasa.myojana.m , (3) maanasa.myojana.m, (4) di.t.thisa.myojana.m, (5) vicikicchaasa.myojana.m, (6) siilabbataparaamaasasa.myojana.m, (7) bhavaraagasa.myojana.m, (8) issaasa.myojana.m, (9) macchariyasa.myojana.m, (10) avijjaasa.myojana.m. Imaani dasa sa.myojanaani.

        ---------------

        Now, there must be a very good reason for including issaa-sa.myojana and macchariya-sa.myojana in the list in Abhidhamma although they are not listed in suttas. I will be grateful to know that reason.

        Secondly, although they are listed in number 8th and 9th positions, I assume that they can be eradicated by anaagaami-magga. Is my assumption correct?

        Thank you very much.

        Respectfully,
        Dr Han Tun

      Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.