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Re: [SabreSailboat] Top Climber, etc.

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  • Dave Evans
    Joe, I ve wondered for years about how to get up the mast without a helper. Usually I ve been torn between going with MastMate type flexible steps and ATN s
    Message 1 of 8 , May 1, 2006
    • 0 Attachment
      Joe,
      I've wondered for years about how to get up the mast without a helper. Usually I've been torn between going with MastMate type flexible steps and ATN's Top Climber or some assemblage of jumars. Today I came across this aluminum version:
       
       
      Anyone know about this one?
      dge
      ----- Original Message -----
      Sent: Monday, May 01, 2006 5:53 PM
      Subject: Re: [SabreSailboat] emergency tiller, Top Climber, etc.

      Ill second the endorsement of the Top Climber.  It does take some getting usto but if you sail mostly with your wife like I do, its the only way to get to the top of the mast in an emergency.  (sometimes even the top of the mast isn't far enough away.)

      jonathan.myers@... wrote:
      If you can't find this stuff in the electrical section, mosey on over to plumbing and pick up a little tub of "Plumber's Putty."  Minimal bucks and it works like a charm, at least for sealing the ring at the bottom of any sink you look at (where the installer knew what he was doing, that is).  After you tighten the lid, ring, whatever down, just trim off the excess and, voila!, you're sealed;  but it'll come apart easily too.
       
      On a different note, I heard a glowing endorsement from a marina mate who had borrowed another's "Mast Steps" to renew his masthead windex.  It's installed up the mainsail track, hauled up by the halyard then tensioned downward, giving an easy-access pathway to the heavens, or at least as far as ones stick.
       
      I went for the Top Climber and Bill's comment about it requiring some "technique" is spot on.  Etienne makes it looks simple at the boat shows and, once you get the knack, it really is.  For me, however, it was a challenge to relax enough to let the mechanical advantage of lifting by leg power work, at first.  Tore up my hands and felt like I had Popeye forearms the first time...but successive trips have been much more comfortable. 
       
      Jon Myers
      S34 MkI #094
      Melusine
      Swan Creek, MD

      -----Original Message-----
      From: Sabresailboat@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Sabresailboat@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of john kalinowski
      Sent: Monday, May 01, 2006 7:37 AM
      To: Sabresailboat@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: Re: [SabreSailboat] Emergency Tiller Access Plate - S34 MkI

      Get a chuck of waterproof putty in the electrical section of any decent hardware store. Even Home Depot has it.  It is a dark grey play-doo stuff that does not glue things together.  Roll a thick string of it, outline the bottom of the lazerette to make a gasket, plop the cover back on and tighten.
       
      The stuff never hardens, never sticks, and will be the least of your worries should you need to get that tiller in there fast..
       
      Cost is ~ $2
       
      john

      Carter Brey <cbrey@...> wrote:
      Greg,

      I'm just about to replace mine and was wondering the same thing. It's
      not the greatest design, is it? Mine had broken at the edges from
      pressure stress at the fasteners as well as the kicking and scraping of
      innumerable boat shoes. On my new one, I'm using finishing washers to
      spread the load a bit, rather than chamfering the screw holes.

      I'm thinking that the simplest solution might be to spread a thin layer
      of silicone on the bottom of the plate as well as in the screw holes.
      Adhesion is not an issue, just sealing against water intrusion. In the
      rare and unlikely event that you need to pop it open, you could just
      re-seal it the same way after scraping off the old silicone.

      I was also considering some sort of thin rubber gasket, but I'm not sure
      such a thing would make as good a seal, considering the molded-in
      nonskid surrounding the hole.

      As someone else on the list has pointed out, it's a darkly funny fact
      that any situation requiring use of the emergency tiller would most
      likely be one in which fumbling for and with a screwdriver would not be
      the helmsman's first priority. Some kind of tool-less release mechanism
      would be a welcome improvement.

      Best regards,
      Carter Brey
      s/v Delphine
      1982 S28 II #532
      City Island, NY

      Greg Allen wrote:

      >Any suggestions for waterproofing the plate over the emergency 
      >tiller.  It was very damp when I removed it and explains where some 
      >water has been getting into the bilge.
      >
      >Should there be a gasket or just caulked with a screw driver handy to 
      >pop it open in a moment of need?
      >
      >
      >Greg Allen
      >gregallen1@...
      >781-639-4688
      >
      >
      >

      >



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    • Lorman, Alvin J.
      I think it is a great system, but what if the reason you have to go up the mast is that your sail is jammed in the track? I have the ATN Top Climber. I m not
      Message 2 of 8 , May 1, 2006
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        Message
        I think it is a great system, but what if the reason you have to go up the mast is that your sail is jammed in the track?
         
        I have the ATN Top Climber.  I'm not especially fond of heights, but I found it so secure (in feeling, at least), that I actually enjoy my time up the mast.  If I had it to do over again, I'd assemble my own system using climbing gear (harness instead of seat, better ascenders, etc.)
         
        Al Lorman
         
         
         -----Original Message-----
        From: Sabresailboat@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Sabresailboat@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Dave Evans
        Sent: Monday, May 01, 2006 6:11 PM
        To: Sabresailboat@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: Re: [SabreSailboat] Top Climber, etc.

        Joe,
        I've wondered for years about how to get up the mast without a helper. Usually I've been torn between going with MastMate type flexible steps and ATN's Top Climber or some assemblage of jumars. Today I came across this aluminum version:
         
         
        Anyone know about this one?
        dge
        ----- Original Message -----
        Sent: Monday, May 01, 2006 5:53 PM
        Subject: Re: [SabreSailboat] emergency tiller, Top Climber, etc.

        Ill second the endorsement of the Top Climber.  It does take some getting usto but if you sail mostly with your wife like I do, its the only way to get to the top of the mast in an emergency.  (sometimes even the top of the mast isn't far enough away.)

        jonathan.myers@... wrote:
        If you can't find this stuff in the electrical section, mosey on over to plumbing and pick up a little tub of "Plumber's Putty."  Minimal bucks and it works like a charm, at least for sealing the ring at the bottom of any sink you look at (where the installer knew what he was doing, that is).  After you tighten the lid, ring, whatever down, just trim off the excess and, voila!, you're sealed;  but it'll come apart easily too.
         
        On a different note, I heard a glowing endorsement from a marina mate who had borrowed another's "Mast Steps" to renew his masthead windex.  It's installed up the mainsail track, hauled up by the halyard then tensioned downward, giving an easy-access pathway to the heavens, or at least as far as ones stick.
         
        I went for the Top Climber and Bill's comment about it requiring some "technique" is spot on.  Etienne makes it looks simple at the boat shows and, once you get the knack, it really is.  For me, however, it was a challenge to relax enough to let the mechanical advantage of lifting by leg power work, at first.  Tore up my hands and felt like I had Popeye forearms the first time...but successive trips have been much more comfortable. 
         
        Jon Myers
        S34 MkI #094
        Melusine
        Swan Creek, MD

        -----Original Message-----
        From: Sabresailboat@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Sabresailboat@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of john kalinowski
        Sent: Monday, May 01, 2006 7:37 AM
        To: Sabresailboat@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: Re: [SabreSailboat] Emergency Tiller Access Plate - S34 MkI

        Get a chuck of waterproof putty in the electrical section of any decent hardware store. Even Home Depot has it.  It is a dark grey play-doo stuff that does not glue things together.  Roll a thick string of it, outline the bottom of the lazerette to make a gasket, plop the cover back on and tighten.
         
        The stuff never hardens, never sticks, and will be the least of your worries should you need to get that tiller in there fast..
         
        Cost is ~ $2
         
        john

        Carter Brey <cbrey@...> wrote:
        Greg,

        I'm just about to replace mine and was wondering the same thing. It's
        not the greatest design, is it? Mine had broken at the edges from
        pressure stress at the fasteners as well as the kicking and scraping of
        innumerable boat shoes. On my new one, I'm using finishing washers to
        spread the load a bit, rather than chamfering the screw holes.

        I'm thinking that the simplest solution might be to spread a thin layer
        of silicone on the bottom of the plate as well as in the screw holes.
        Adhesion is not an issue, just sealing against water intrusion. In the
        rare and unlikely event that you need to pop it open, you could just
        re-seal it the same way after scraping off the old silicone.

        I was also considering some sort of thin rubber gasket, but I'm not sure
        such a thing would make as good a seal, considering the molded-in
        nonskid surrounding the hole.

        As someone else on the list has pointed out, it's a darkly funny fact
        that any situation requiring use of the emergency tiller would most
        likely be one in which fumbling for and with a screwdriver would not be
        the helmsman's first priority. Some kind of tool-less release mechanism
        would be a welcome improvement.

        Best regards,
        Carter Brey
        s/v Delphine
        1982 S28 II #532
        City Island, NY

        Greg Allen wrote:

        >Any suggestions for waterproofing the plate over the emergency 
        >tiller.  It was very damp when I removed it and explains where some 
        >water has been getting into the bilge.
        >
        >Should there be a gasket or just caulked with a screw driver handy to 
        >pop it open in a moment of need?
        >
        >
        >Greg Allen
        >gregallen1@...
        >781-639-4688
        >
        >
        >

        >



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        ****************************************************
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        Corporation proprietary information, which is privileged,
        confidential, or subject to copyright belonging to the Exelon
        Corporation family of Companies.
        This e-mail is intended solely for the use of the individual or
        entity to which it is addressed. If you are not the intended
        recipient of this e-mail, you are hereby notified that any
        dissemination, distribution, copying, or action taken in relation
        to the contents of and attachments to this e-mail is strictly
        prohibited and may be unlawful. If you have received this e-mail
        in error, please notify the sender immediately and permanently
        delete the original and any copy of this e-mail and any printout.
        Thank You.
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      • workshoe99
        Al, The PO of my boat was a mountain climber so I have climbing gear like you mentioned to ascend the mast. It works ok once you get the hang of it but it
        Message 3 of 8 , May 1, 2006
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          Al,

          The PO of my boat was a mountain climber so I have climbing gear like
          you mentioned to ascend the mast. It works ok once you get the hang of
          it but it still is work to get my 250 lb butt clear up to the top.

          Jan


          --- In Sabresailboat@yahoogroups.com, "Lorman, Alvin J."
          <ajlorman@...> wrote:
          >
          > I think it is a great system, but what if the reason you have to go
          up the mast is that your sail is jammed in the track?
          >
          > I have the ATN Top Climber. I'm not especially fond of heights, but
          I found it so secure (in feeling, at least), that I actually enjoy my
          time up the mast. If I had it to do over again, I'd assemble my own
          system using climbing gear (harness instead of seat, better ascenders,
          etc.)
          >
          > Al Lorman
          >
          >
          > -----Original Message-----
          > From: Sabresailboat@yahoogroups.com
          [mailto:Sabresailboat@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Dave Evans
          > Sent: Monday, May 01, 2006 6:11 PM
          > To: Sabresailboat@yahoogroups.com
          > Subject: Re: [SabreSailboat] Top Climber, etc.
          >
          >
          > Joe,
          > I've wondered for years about how to get up the mast without a
          helper. Usually I've been torn between going with MastMate type
          flexible steps and ATN's Top Climber or some assemblage of jumars.
          Today I came across this aluminum version:
          >
          > http://www.prime-climb.com/photos.htm
          >
          > Anyone know about this one?
          > dge
          >
          > ----- Original Message -----
          > From: Joe Murphy <mailto:jay4868@...>
          > To: Sabresailboat@yahoogroups.com
          > Sent: Monday, May 01, 2006 5:53 PM
          > Subject: Re: [SabreSailboat] emergency tiller, Top Climber, etc.
          >
          > Ill second the endorsement of the Top Climber. It does take some
          getting usto but if you sail mostly with your wife like I do, its the
          only way to get to the top of the mast in an emergency. (sometimes
          even the top of the mast isn't far enough away.)
          >
          > jonathan.myers@... wrote:
          >
          > If you can't find this stuff in the electrical section, mosey on
          over to plumbing and pick up a little tub of "Plumber's Putty."
          Minimal bucks and it works like a charm, at least for sealing the ring
          at the bottom of any sink you look at (where the installer knew what
          he was doing, that is). After you tighten the lid, ring, whatever
          down, just trim off the excess and, voila!, you're sealed; but it'll
          come apart easily too.
          >
          > On a different note, I heard a glowing endorsement from a marina
          mate who had borrowed another's "Mast Steps" to renew his masthead
          windex. It's installed up the mainsail track, hauled up by the
          halyard then tensioned downward, giving an easy-access pathway to the
          heavens, or at least as far as ones stick.
          >
          > I went for the Top Climber and Bill's comment about it requiring
          some "technique" is spot on. Etienne makes it looks simple at the
          boat shows and, once you get the knack, it really is. For me,
          however, it was a challenge to relax enough to let the mechanical
          advantage of lifting by leg power work, at first. Tore up my hands
          and felt like I had Popeye forearms the first time...but successive
          trips have been much more comfortable.
          >
          > Jon Myers
          > S34 MkI #094
          > Melusine
          > Swan Creek, MD
          >
          > -----Original Message-----
          > From: Sabresailboat@yahoogroups.com
          [mailto:Sabresailboat@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of john kalinowski
          > Sent: Monday, May 01, 2006 7:37 AM
          > To: Sabresailboat@yahoogroups.com
          > Subject: Re: [SabreSailboat] Emergency Tiller Access Plate - S34 MkI
          >
          >
          >
          > Get a chuck of waterproof putty in the electrical section of any
          decent hardware store. Even Home Depot has it. It is a dark grey
          play-doo stuff that does not glue things together. Roll a thick
          string of it, outline the bottom of the lazerette to make a gasket,
          plop the cover back on and tighten.
          >
          > The stuff never hardens, never sticks, and will be the least of
          your worries should you need to get that tiller in there fast..
          >
          > Cost is ~ $2
          >
          > john
          >
          > Carter Brey <cbrey@...> wrote:
          >
          > Greg,
          >
          > I'm just about to replace mine and was wondering the same thing.
          It's
          > not the greatest design, is it? Mine had broken at the edges from
          > pressure stress at the fasteners as well as the kicking and
          scraping of
          > innumerable boat shoes. On my new one, I'm using finishing
          washers to
          > spread the load a bit, rather than chamfering the screw holes.
          >
          > I'm thinking that the simplest solution might be to spread a
          thin layer
          > of silicone on the bottom of the plate as well as in the screw
          holes.
          > Adhesion is not an issue, just sealing against water intrusion.
          In the
          > rare and unlikely event that you need to pop it open, you could
          just
          > re-seal it the same way after scraping off the old silicone.
          >
          > I was also considering some sort of thin rubber gasket, but I'm
          not sure
          > such a thing would make as good a seal, considering the molded-in
          > nonskid surrounding the hole.
          >
          > As someone else on the list has pointed out, it's a darkly funny
          fact
          > that any situation requiring use of the emergency tiller would most
          > likely be one in which fumbling for and with a screwdriver would
          not be
          > the helmsman's first priority. Some kind of tool-less release
          mechanism
          > would be a welcome improvement.
          >
          > Best regards,
          > Carter Brey
          > s/v Delphine
          > 1982 S28 II #532
          > City Island, NY
          >
          > Greg Allen wrote:
          >
          > >Any suggestions for waterproofing the plate over the emergency
          > >tiller. It was very damp when I removed it and explains where
          some
          > >water has been getting into the bilge.
          > >
          > >Should there be a gasket or just caulked with a screw driver
          handy to
          > >pop it open in a moment of need?
          > >
          > >
          > >Greg Allen
          > >gregallen1@...
          > >781-639-4688
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          >
          >
          >
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          Brown, Rowe & Maw LLP to be used and cannot be used by any taxpayer
          for the purpose of avoiding tax penalties that may be imposed under
          U.S. tax law. If any person uses or refers to any such tax advice in
          promoting, marketing or recommending a partnership or other entity,
          investment plan or arrangement to any taxpayer, then (i) the advice
          was written to support the promotion or marketing (by a person other
          than Mayer, Brown, Rowe & Maw LLP) of that transaction or matter, and
          (ii) such taxpayer should seek advice based on the taxpayers
          particular circumstances from an independent tax advisor
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        • Joe Murphy
          I think I would probably use the jib halyard to raise the climber rope Lorman, Alvin J. wrote: I think it is a great
          Message 4 of 8 , May 2, 2006
          • 0 Attachment
            I think I would probably use the jib halyard to raise the climber rope

            "Lorman, Alvin J." <ajlorman@...> wrote:
            I think it is a great system, but what if the reason you have to go up the mast is that your sail is jammed in the track?
             
            I have the ATN Top Climber.  I'm not especially fond of heights, but I found it so secure (in feeling, at least), that I actually enjoy my time up the mast.  If I had it to do over again, I'd assemble my own system using climbing gear (harness instead of seat, better ascenders, etc.)
             
            Al Lorman
             
             
             -----Original Message-----
            From: Sabresailboat@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Sabresailboat@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Dave Evans
            Sent: Monday, May 01, 2006 6:11 PM
            To: Sabresailboat@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: Re: [SabreSailboat] Top Climber, etc.

            Joe,
            I've wondered for years about how to get up the mast without a helper. Usually I've been torn between going with MastMate type flexible steps and ATN's Top Climber or some assemblage of jumars. Today I came across this aluminum version:
             
             
            Anyone know about this one?
            dge
            ----- Original Message -----
            Sent: Monday, May 01, 2006 5:53 PM
            Subject: Re: [SabreSailboat] emergency tiller, Top Climber, etc.

            Ill second the endorsement of the Top Climber.  It does take some getting usto but if you sail mostly with your wife like I do, its the only way to get to the top of the mast in an emergency.  (sometimes even the top of the mast isn't far enough away.)

            jonathan.myers@... wrote:
            If you can't find this stuff in the electrical section, mosey on over to plumbing and pick up a little tub of "Plumber's Putty."  Minimal bucks and it works like a charm, at least for sealing the ring at the bottom of any sink you look at (where the installer knew what he was doing, that is).  After you tighten the lid, ring, whatever down, just trim off the excess and, voila!, you're sealed;  but it'll come apart easily too.
             
            On a different note, I heard a glowing endorsement from a marina mate who had borrowed another's "Mast Steps" to renew his masthead windex.  It's installed up the mainsail track, hauled up by the halyard then tensioned downward, giving an easy-access pathway to the heavens, or at least as far as ones stick.
             
            I went for the Top Climber and Bill's comment about it requiring some "technique" is spot on.  Etienne makes it looks simple at the boat shows and, once you get the knack, it really is.  For me, however, it was a challenge to relax enough to let the mechanical advantage of lifting by leg power work, at first.  Tore up my hands and felt like I had Popeye forearms the first time...but successive trips have been much more comfortable. 
             
            Jon Myers
            S34 MkI #094
            Melusine
            Swan Creek, MD

            -----Original Message-----
            From: Sabresailboat@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Sabresailboat@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of john kalinowski
            Sent: Monday, May 01, 2006 7:37 AM
            To: Sabresailboat@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: Re: [SabreSailboat] Emergency Tiller Access Plate - S34 MkI

            Get a chuck of waterproof putty in the electrical section of any decent hardware store. Even Home Depot has it.  It is a dark grey play-doo stuff that does not glue things together.  Roll a thick string of it, outline the bottom of the lazerette to make a gasket, plop the cover back on and tighten.
             
            The stuff never hardens, never sticks, and will be the least of your worries should you need to get that tiller in there fast..
             
            Cost is ~ $2
             
            john

            Carter Brey <cbrey@...> wrote:
            Greg,

            I'm just about to replace mine and was wondering the same thing. It's
            not the greatest design, is it? Mine had broken at the edges from
            pressure stress at the fasteners as well as the kicking and scraping of
            innumerable boat shoes. On my new one, I'm using finishing washers to
            spread the load a bit, rather than chamfering the screw holes.

            I'm thinking that the simplest solution might be to spread a thin layer
            of silicone on the bottom of the plate as well as in the screw holes.
            Adhesion is not an issue, just sealing against water intrusion. In the
            rare and unlikely event that you need to pop it open, you could just
            re-seal it the same way after scraping off the old silicone.

            I was also considering some sort of thin rubber gasket, but I'm not sure
            such a thing would make as good a seal, considering the molded-in
            nonskid surrounding the hole.

            As someone else on the list has pointed out, it's a darkly funny fact
            that any situation requiring use of the emergency tiller would most
            likely be one in which fumbling for and with a screwdriver would not be
            the helmsman's first priority. Some kind of tool-less release mechanism
            would be a welcome improvement.

            Best regards,
            Carter Brey
            s/v Delphine
            1982 S28 II #532
            City Island, NY

            Greg Allen wrote:

            >Any suggestions for waterproofing the plate over the emergency 
            >tiller.  It was very damp when I removed it and explains where some 
            >water has been getting into the bilge.
            >
            >Should there be a gasket or just caulked with a screw driver handy to 
            >pop it open in a moment of need?
            >
            >
            >Greg Allen
            >gregallen1@...
            >781-639-4688
            >
            >
            >

            >



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          • Lorman, Alvin J.
            If you have a masthead, rather than a fractional, rig. ... From: Sabresailboat@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Sabresailboat@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Joe Murphy
            Message 5 of 8 , May 2, 2006
            • 0 Attachment
              Message
              If you have a masthead, rather than a fractional, rig.
               
              -----Original Message-----
              From: Sabresailboat@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Sabresailboat@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Joe Murphy
              Sent: Tuesday, May 02, 2006 10:02 AM
              To: Sabresailboat@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: RE: [SabreSailboat] Top Climber, etc.

              I think I would probably use the jib halyard to raise the climber rope

              "Lorman, Alvin J." <ajlorman@...> wrote:
              I think it is a great system, but what if the reason you have to go up the mast is that your sail is jammed in the track?
               
              I have the ATN Top Climber.  I'm not especially fond of heights, but I found it so secure (in feeling, at least), that I actually enjoy my time up the mast.  If I had it to do over again, I'd assemble my own system using climbing gear (harness instead of seat, better ascenders, etc.)
               
              Al Lorman
               
               
               -----Original Message-----
              From: Sabresailboat@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Sabresailboat@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Dave Evans
              Sent: Monday, May 01, 2006 6:11 PM
              To: Sabresailboat@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: Re: [SabreSailboat] Top Climber, etc.

              Joe,
              I've wondered for years about how to get up the mast without a helper. Usually I've been torn between going with MastMate type flexible steps and ATN's Top Climber or some assemblage of jumars. Today I came across this aluminum version:
               
               
              Anyone know about this one?
              dge
              ----- Original Message -----
              Sent: Monday, May 01, 2006 5:53 PM
              Subject: Re: [SabreSailboat] emergency tiller, Top Climber, etc.

              Ill second the endorsement of the Top Climber.  It does take some getting usto but if you sail mostly with your wife like I do, its the only way to get to the top of the mast in an emergency.  (sometimes even the top of the mast isn't far enough away.)

              jonathan.myers@... wrote:
              If you can't find this stuff in the electrical section, mosey on over to plumbing and pick up a little tub of "Plumber's Putty."  Minimal bucks and it works like a charm, at least for sealing the ring at the bottom of any sink you look at (where the installer knew what he was doing, that is).  After you tighten the lid, ring, whatever down, just trim off the excess and, voila!, you're sealed;  but it'll come apart easily too.
               
              On a different note, I heard a glowing endorsement from a marina mate who had borrowed another's "Mast Steps" to renew his masthead windex.  It's installed up the mainsail track, hauled up by the halyard then tensioned downward, giving an easy-access pathway to the heavens, or at least as far as ones stick.
               
              I went for the Top Climber and Bill's comment about it requiring some "technique" is spot on.  Etienne makes it looks simple at the boat shows and, once you get the knack, it really is.  For me, however, it was a challenge to relax enough to let the mechanical advantage of lifting by leg power work, at first.  Tore up my hands and felt like I had Popeye forearms the first time...but successive trips have been much more comfortable. 
               
              Jon Myers
              S34 MkI #094
              Melusine
              Swan Creek, MD

              -----Original Message-----
              From: Sabresailboat@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Sabresailboat@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of john kalinowski
              Sent: Monday, May 01, 2006 7:37 AM
              To: Sabresailboat@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: Re: [SabreSailboat] Emergency Tiller Access Plate - S34 MkI

              Get a chuck of waterproof putty in the electrical section of any decent hardware store. Even Home Depot has it.  It is a dark grey play-doo stuff that does not glue things together.  Roll a thick string of it, outline the bottom of the lazerette to make a gasket, plop the cover back on and tighten.
               
              The stuff never hardens, never sticks, and will be the least of your worries should you need to get that tiller in there fast..
               
              Cost is ~ $2
               
              john

              Carter Brey <cbrey@...> wrote:
              Greg,

              I'm just about to replace mine and was wondering the same thing. It's
              not the greatest design, is it? Mine had broken at the edges from
              pressure stress at the fasteners as well as the kicking and scraping of
              innumerable boat shoes. On my new one, I'm using finishing washers to
              spread the load a bit, rather than chamfering the screw holes.

              I'm thinking that the simplest solution might be to spread a thin layer
              of silicone on the bottom of the plate as well as in the screw holes.
              Adhesion is not an issue, just sealing against water intrusion. In the
              rare and unlikely event that you need to pop it open, you could just
              re-seal it the same way after scraping off the old silicone.

              I was also considering some sort of thin rubber gasket, but I'm not sure
              such a thing would make as good a seal, considering the molded-in
              nonskid surrounding the hole.

              As someone else on the list has pointed out, it's a darkly funny fact
              that any situation requiring use of the emergency tiller would most
              likely be one in which fumbling for and with a screwdriver would not be
              the helmsman's first priority. Some kind of tool-less release mechanism
              would be a welcome improvement.

              Best regards,
              Carter Brey
              s/v Delphine
              1982 S28 II #532
              City Island, NY

              Greg Allen wrote:

              >Any suggestions for waterproofing the plate over the emergency 
              >tiller.  It was very damp when I removed it and explains where some 
              >water has been getting into the bilge.
              >
              >Should there be a gasket or just caulked with a screw driver handy to 
              >pop it open in a moment of need?
              >
              >
              >Greg Allen
              >gregallen1@...
              >781-639-4688
              >
              >
              >

              >



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              confidential, or subject to copyright belonging to the Exelon
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              This e-mail is intended solely for the use of the individual or
              entity to which it is addressed. If you are not the intended
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              IRS CIRCULAR 230 NOTICE. Any advice expressed above as to tax matters was neither written nor intended by the sender or Mayer, Brown, Rowe & Maw LLP to be used and cannot be used by any taxpayer for the purpose of avoiding tax penalties that may be imposed under U.S. tax law. If any person uses or refers to any such tax advice in promoting, marketing or recommending a partnership or other entity, investment plan or arrangement to any taxpayer, then (i) the advice was written to support the promotion or marketing (by a person other than Mayer, Brown, Rowe & Maw LLP) of that transaction or matter, and (ii) such taxpayer should seek advice based on the taxpayers particular circumstances from an independent tax advisor




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            • John Kalinowski
              I find myself going up the mast 1-2 times a year to pull atteneta and wind instruments for dropping the mast, maintenence (changing bulbs), or just to check
              Message 6 of 8 , Jul 23, 2007
              • 0 Attachment
                I find myself going up the mast 1-2 times a year to pull atteneta and
                wind instruments for dropping the mast, maintenence (changing bulbs),
                or just to check all the swages.

                The old geazers who crew for me have been complaining of problems
                winching me to the mast head. Having enough of their whining but not
                wishing to toss them all for some yound guns, I set about how to
                resolve this.

                This spring I picked up an ATN top climber on sale at Defender (saved
                about $100). I then needed to get a line for it. They spec a 9/16"
                line and they sugguest you get a dedicated line. I bought a lightly
                used halyard from a fellow Sabre owner on this board for short money.

                Basically, it is a modifed rock climbing rig with a seat and 1 way
                rope lock, and 2 foot slings with a rope lock. You stand up, slide
                the upper rope lock up as far as you can, sit down, bend you knees
                and the slide the bottom rope lock up. Repeat until you up the top.
                Check the ATN web site for a video. You do the opposite to get down.

                Now that I have had a couple times to use it, I thought I would add a
                couple additional instructions to their rather lightweight
                documentation.

                1. Do use a different line and not a halyard. I can see where the
                rope lock is wearing on the line. Hate that to be some expensive
                halyard. And do use the 9/16" line, as anything bigger will not fit,
                and anything smaller does not lock correctly. I also keep the seat on
                the line where I will ascend so set up is a lot faster. I have twice
                the length rope I need but this allows me to share my unit with
                anyone up to a 70' sailboat. I put the spare line in canvas bag I
                carry with the ATN self storing bag.

                2. When you attach the 2 lines, use two bowlines. As small as
                possible. Do the one on your halyard first. Side the ATN line though
                the loop and then tighten the top bowline as small as possible. Now
                build a small bowline for the ATN line. The smaller you make these 2
                bowlines, the higher up the the mast you can get. The webstrap for
                the seat seems to be too long which makes it hard to sit and work on
                the mast top. And this stops the leg rope lock from going higher. So
                anything you can to make the knots small will get you higher.

                3. When you watch the photos, the guy is attached to the stern of the
                boat. You will say "Gee that is dumb, why not go straight up and
                down?". The reason is that you will get the crap beat out of you as
                you are too close to the mast. I run the bottom of the line to a
                genoa block on my outter track about 2' aft of the side stays. The
                line then goes up to another cabin winch and then to a a cleat. This
                keeps you far enough away until you get to the very top.

                4. The tighter you get that line, the faster you accend, as any slop
                is multiplied on every routine as the line gives instead of holding
                firm so the rope lock can move up further. I suggest you crank your
                halyard in hard with a winch and then to a cleat (more on this later).

                5. Make sure the backstay is on. Do on need that stick moving about.

                6. Now tighten the ATN line. Use the winch and again as tight as
                possible to get the slop out.

                7. When you go up, wear long pants and shirt. I have bruises all over
                my legs and arms from banging into the mast and spreaders. Long
                clothes stop a lot of this. Also wear sailing gloves so as not to
                worry about rope burns.

                8. You will instintively want to face inward toward the mast. DON'T.
                Face outward as it it easier to go up and keeps you away from the
                mast and wires that want to bruise you.

                9. Wear shoes that do not slip off easily.

                10. Go up the mast when the boat is not moving around a lot. I tried
                a dock yesterday and it worked well, but the boat traffic was keeping
                their speed down so there was no wakes.

                11. If you can swing it, have a crew ready to bring you down by
                slowly dropping the halyard. If you get sick from the bouncing
                around at the top of the mast, there is no fast way to decend without
                a crewmember dropping that halyard. At that point, it is just like
                coming down a bosum's chair.

                12. When you are decending, sometimes you come down a bit too far on
                the seat. You cannot get your legs to bend up high enough to unlock
                the rope lock. you could go back up 1 length and retry, or you can
                kick you feet out which will get you the extra 3" you need to undo
                the lower rope lock.

                13. Practice. 1st time up I was like a monkey screwing a football.
                Once I understood the basics they do not talk about and adjusted my
                technique, I could get up and down the mast quickly. I do 2 reps,
                break 15 seconds while sitting on the chair and start again. You
                will work up a bit of a sweat, but your legs will do all the work.

                14. The nuts on the rope locks have platic nut covers. 1 or 2 bangs
                into the mast and they fall off and now you start to scratch the
                paint. Sugguest you silicone them on to protect your spar paint.

                15. They say you can use the carry bag as a work bag. It is totally
                useless as it narrow and deep. I find a canvas bucket or a canvas bag
                attached to a carbiner on the side loop works best. When taking down
                the wind instrucments, I attached the bag to just above the 2 bowline
                knots and then pulled the bag down after I got to the bottom. This
                way I did not have to worry about crushing the unit on the way down.

                Pricey and some work. But if you find yourself needing to get up a
                mast and nobody around to do the job, it really is a nice setup.

                john
              • Bill B
                Good stuff, John. I use my Petzel ascenders and a rock climbing harness, and it winds up being the same thing as ATN s climber. The one thing that I do
                Message 7 of 8 , Jul 23, 2007
                • 0 Attachment
                  Good stuff, John.  I use my Petzel ascenders and a rock climbing harness, and it winds up being the same thing as ATN's climber.  The one thing that I do different is to leave all the tools and parts on deck in a canvas bag with a line tied to it until I get up the mast.  Climbing is hard enough without dragging and banging all that crap around.  Once I'm up and secure, I pull up the bag and tools.  Also works great for sending down for stuff if The Admiral or a neighbor is around.
                  Bill B
                  ----- Original Message -----
                  Sent: Monday, July 23, 2007 10:45 AM
                  Subject: [SabreSailboat] Re: Top Climber, etc.

                  I find myself going up the mast 1-2 times a year to pull atteneta and
                  wind instruments for dropping the mast, maintenence (changing bulbs),
                  or just to check all the swages.

                  The old geazers who crew for me have been complaining of problems
                  winching me to the mast head. Having enough of their whining but not
                  wishing to toss them all for some yound guns, I set about how to
                  resolve this.

                  This spring I picked up an ATN top climber on sale at Defender (saved
                  about $100). I then needed to get a line for it. They spec a 9/16"
                  line and they sugguest you get a dedicated line. I bought a lightly
                  used halyard from a fellow Sabre owner on this board for short money.

                  Basically, it is a modifed rock climbing rig with a seat and 1 way
                  rope lock, and 2 foot slings with a rope lock. You stand up, slide
                  the upper rope lock up as far as you can, sit down, bend you knees
                  and the slide the bottom rope lock up. Repeat until you up the top.
                  Check the ATN web site for a video. You do the opposite to get down.

                  Now that I have had a couple times to use it, I thought I would add a
                  couple additional instructions to their rather lightweight
                  documentation.

                  1. Do use a different line and not a halyard. I can see where the
                  rope lock is wearing on the line. Hate that to be some expensive
                  halyard. And do use the 9/16" line, as anything bigger will not fit,
                  and anything smaller does not lock correctly. I also keep the seat on
                  the line where I will ascend so set up is a lot faster. I have twice
                  the length rope I need but this allows me to share my unit with
                  anyone up to a 70' sailboat. I put the spare line in canvas bag I
                  carry with the ATN self storing bag.

                  2. When you attach the 2 lines, use two bowlines. As small as
                  possible. Do the one on your halyard first. Side the ATN line though
                  the loop and then tighten the top bowline as small as possible. Now
                  build a small bowline for the ATN line. The smaller you make these 2
                  bowlines, the higher up the the mast you can get. The webstrap for
                  the seat seems to be too long which makes it hard to sit and work on
                  the mast top. And this stops the leg rope lock from going higher. So
                  anything you can to make the knots small will get you higher.

                  3. When you watch the photos, the guy is attached to the stern of the
                  boat. You will say "Gee that is dumb, why not go straight up and
                  down?". The reason is that you will get the crap beat out of you as
                  you are too close to the mast. I run the bottom of the line to a
                  genoa block on my outter track about 2' aft of the side stays. The
                  line then goes up to another cabin winch and then to a a cleat. This
                  keeps you far enough away until you get to the very top.

                  4. The tighter you get that line, the faster you accend, as any slop
                  is multiplied on every routine as the line gives instead of holding
                  firm so the rope lock can move up further. I suggest you crank your
                  halyard in hard with a winch and then to a cleat (more on this later).

                  5. Make sure the backstay is on. Do on need that stick moving about.

                  6. Now tighten the ATN line. Use the winch and again as tight as
                  possible to get the slop out.

                  7. When you go up, wear long pants and shirt. I have bruises all over
                  my legs and arms from banging into the mast and spreaders. Long
                  clothes stop a lot of this. Also wear sailing gloves so as not to
                  worry about rope burns.

                  8. You will instintively want to face inward toward the mast. DON'T.
                  Face outward as it it easier to go up and keeps you away from the
                  mast and wires that want to bruise you.

                  9. Wear shoes that do not slip off easily.

                  10. Go up the mast when the boat is not moving around a lot. I tried
                  a dock yesterday and it worked well, but the boat traffic was keeping
                  their speed down so there was no wakes.

                  11. If you can swing it, have a crew ready to bring you down by
                  slowly dropping the halyard. If you get sick from the bouncing
                  around at the top of the mast, there is no fast way to decend without
                  a crewmember dropping that halyard. At that point, it is just like
                  coming down a bosum's chair.

                  12. When you are decending, sometimes you come down a bit too far on
                  the seat. You cannot get your legs to bend up high enough to unlock
                  the rope lock. you could go back up 1 length and retry, or you can
                  kick you feet out which will get you the extra 3" you need to undo
                  the lower rope lock.

                  13. Practice. 1st time up I was like a monkey screwing a football.
                  Once I understood the basics they do not talk about and adjusted my
                  technique, I could get up and down the mast quickly. I do 2 reps,
                  break 15 seconds while sitting on the chair and start again. You
                  will work up a bit of a sweat, but your legs will do all the work.

                  14. The nuts on the rope locks have platic nut covers. 1 or 2 bangs
                  into the mast and they fall off and now you start to scratch the
                  paint. Sugguest you silicone them on to protect your spar paint.

                  15. They say you can use the carry bag as a work bag. It is totally
                  useless as it narrow and deep. I find a canvas bucket or a canvas bag
                  attached to a carbiner on the side loop works best. When taking down
                  the wind instrucments, I attached the bag to just above the 2 bowline
                  knots and then pulled the bag down after I got to the bottom. This
                  way I did not have to worry about crushing the unit on the way down.

                  Pricey and some work. But if you find yourself needing to get up a
                  mast and nobody around to do the job, it really is a nice setup.

                  john

                • Carter Brey
                  John, Good exegesis on the Topclimber. I ve been a user of another approach for some years. There are of course a number of mast-climbing solutions for the
                  Message 8 of 8 , Jul 23, 2007
                  • 0 Attachment
                    John,

                    Good exegesis on the Topclimber.

                    I've been a user of another approach for some years. There are of course
                    a number of mast-climbing solutions for the solo sailor, each with its
                    strengths, but I'm partial to the flexible ladder concept.

                    The Get Up mast ladder, despite its risable name, is a really excellent
                    product which I used for years until I sold it with the boat I had at
                    the time:

                    http://www.hurst-marine.co.uk/

                    It's a one-man operation but Gerry is very responsive to email and phone
                    enquiries.

                    The product I use now, identical in many respects, is the Mast Mate:

                    http://www.mastmate.com/

                    Despite the weak dollar and the fact that it is shipped from the U.K.,
                    the Get Up ladder is still actually the better deal. With the Mast Mate
                    you have to buy and install the mast track slides yourself.
                    Additionally, the safety/work belt is optional. The Get Up ladder comes
                    with the track slides already installed (you specify the style) and the
                    safety belt is integral to the design.

                    I like the simplicity and easy stowage of the flexible ladder. The main
                    disadvantage, I suppose, is the fact that the mainsail has to be removed
                    from the track.

                    CB
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