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Still following the prayers from MOC Publications - Shame on us

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  • Vatachal Thomas John
    Dear moderators I have on the Good Friday of 2012  heard and seen a programme of Haasaa Geethangal  in the Shalom TV anchored by none other than  H G the
    Message 1 of 5 , Dec 15, 2012
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      Dear moderators

      I have on the Good Friday of 2012  heard and seen a programme of Haasaa Geethangal  in the Shalom TV anchored by none other than  H G the resident metropolitan of our Seminary accompanied by Rev Fr.Swoby Mathew Nalunnakal on  the music key board .It appeared to be very shameful to me  as the prayer songs sung were neither from our Seminary Publications nor from the Dukhavelliyazhcha Namaskaram of LL H G Geevargis Mor Gregorios. They were all from the MOC Publication authored by H.H Vattkkunnel Bava which surname is a combination of VATTAsseril + palaKKUNNEL. The trio were in the forefront at three different periods of the History of our Church fighting against the Holy See of Antioch and  All the East.
       
      Now  that  the Great Lent leading us to the Passion Week of 2013 is fast approaching, will the prelates of our church ensure that  our Churches both in India and abroad follow our own liturgical texts for the ensuing season of penitence and prayers ?
       
      V T John
      ID 3985
    • dhinuus
      Dear V T John, I have a copy of the Hasha Week - prayers published by JSC Publications, Patriarchal Center, Puthencuriz. The hymns are exactly the same as
      Message 2 of 5 , Dec 16, 2012
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        Dear V T John,

        I have a copy of the "Hasha Week - prayers" published by JSC Publications, Patriarchal Center, Puthencuriz. The hymns are exactly the same as those published by MOC Publication. They are not based on the translation of Late Perumpally Thirumeni. This book even has a Kalpana of H.H Ignatius Zakka I and from H.B Baselius Thomas I.

        So this means the translation made by Late Baselious Mathews I Bava and Late C P Chandy has been accepted as official by H.H Zakka I.

        If you really think about it; as long as the theology of the hymn is consistent with the Oriental Orthodox teachings of our Syriac Orthodox Church, it does not matter who translated the hymn. A lot of the old liturgical hymns were translated by Kottarathil Sankunni.

        Mathew G M
        0929
      • Cherian Jacob
        I am wondering does this really matter we use MOC version or another version? Together the experience we are creating is to use all curse words against Jewish
        Message 3 of 5 , Dec 16, 2012
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          I am wondering does this really matter we use MOC version or another version? Together the experience we are creating is to use all curse words against Jewish people during Good Friday service. Using church to abuse another religion. Being the followers of Jesus we should start creating the experience of healing and compassion. Jesus was able to forgive everyone including us who hate our fellow brothers and sisters in Christ. We better start seeing what kind of legacy we are creating for our generations? Start seeing everyone as image of our lord. Then you will be able to reconcile and create extraordinary experience of passion week.

          Thanks
          CHERIAN Jacob
          0951
        • Paul Joshy
          I think there is no problem for using the Hasha week print edition by IOC publication because it is a translated form of the Syriac (however, I dont know
          Message 4 of 5 , Dec 17, 2012
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            I think there is no problem for using the Hasha week print edition by IOC publication because it is a translated form of the Syriac (however, I dont know Whether IOC had watered in the original text) version as the Qurbanakramam used by both the factions which originally translated by Konattu Malapan under the Klapana from HH Abdulla Patriarch. And if HH Zakha I Patriarch has endorsed the Hasha book published by our Chruch then it must have been validated by the HH because we cannot deviate from the Antiochian liturgy for all services.

            --
            Joshy Paul
            New Delhi
            #1040
          • dhinuus
            Dear Cherian, Our Good Friday service is not uttering curse words against the Jewish people. How could we; we are the Jewish people; we are the New Israel. As
            Message 5 of 5 , Dec 17, 2012
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              Dear Cherian,

              Our Good Friday service is not uttering curse words against the Jewish people. How could we; we are the Jewish people; we are the New Israel.

              As St.John the Baptist says in the Gospel : "I tell you that out of these stones God can raise up children for Abraham."

              We are the children of Abraham raised from the stones.

              All that we sing in the Good Friday hymns are to show us; how futile it is to follow the rituals; if we are rejecting God. That is what the Pharasees and Saduccees did.. they were very good at following the rituals; but they rejected God (ie Jesus Christ).

              Read Gospel of Matthew Chapter 23. None of the hymns in Good Friday service use any kind of language more stronger than the words of Jesus in Chapter 23. The unfortunate truth is that if we replace the words "Rabbi" and "Pharasee" to "Thirumeni" and "Bava" in Matthew 23, they are very true even today.

              There is nothing wrong with the liturgy that is handed down to us by the Fathers. The question is how we are practicing Christianity today ?

              Mathew G M
              0929
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