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Re: Facts about the establishment of Catholicate of east

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  • Zacharia Varghese
    Dear Forum, While it is becoming increasing apparant that the IOC/MOSC/MOC is a separate legal and spiritual entity with its on culture and standards, the
    Message 1 of 40 , Oct 24, 2012
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      Dear Forum,

      While it is becoming increasing apparant that the IOC/MOSC/MOC is a
      separate legal and spiritual entity with its on culture and standards, the relationship between the SOC/MSOC seems to further and further blur.

      In my opinion, the erstwhile IOC is perfectly entitled to their version of history. Many religious groups like Mormons, Jehovah's Witness, even Roman Catholics create justifications for their actions or fail to mention key points that detract from their raison d' etre.

      The bottom line is that the SOC is a church with its foundation in New
      Testament times (infact wrote the Bible, Nicene Creed, and foundations of faith). The separatist nature of IOC stems from ethnic pride, nothing more, utilizing St. Thomas' mission work to skip over the rest of Christian history. No justification can be made for promulgating a hundred year old self declared throne and attempting to force churches that do not subscribe to IOC ideology to "convert" or liquidate.

      Let the reader judge. All derivative arguments, at this point, are a waste of time. Let us focus on sharing Christ with a hungry world as sister groups mutually supporting each other- but retaining our own culture and history. God will judge us all in time.

      Fr. Zach Varghese
      ID 903
    • Zach George Arapura
      Dr.Leena and others interested, It is not my job to point out your non sequiturs but I wonder how you inferred that I believe that there won t be any change
      Message 40 of 40 , Nov 3, 2012
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        Dr.Leena and others interested,

        It is not my job to point out your non sequiturs but I wonder how you inferred that I believe "that there won't be any change in policies of an institute as long as it is run by the same sect of people" because I would have thought that it is emphatically clear from my sentence you quoted that "policies do change". What I was merely pointing out was that the nature of the University i.e., ethos remained Protestant. And from your earlier messages I gather that you believe MSOT seminary is "better off being on its own". While I don't entirely agree with that, I believe your opinion stems from the concern over the Protestant nature of University. In the `Kalpana' you quoted in one of your previous messages, HH the Patriarch asked for clarification to Baselios Augen I for "affiliating the Seminary to the Serampore University of Culcutta[sic], which is well known as a protestant university". To me it looks like His Holiness was concerned over the Protestant nature of the University to which a Syriac Orthodox Seminary is affiliated to. And as far as I know their ethos haven't changed.

        I thank you for taking the trouble to contact the proper authorities regarding the syllabus and affiliation. Shri Joshy Pauls clarification was similar. Though what I learnt from my own enquiry was that before the BD course commences a foundation course on our faith, liturgy and addenda is taught to the priests-in-training of our church and after completing that they advance to the regular 4 year BD program with a University prescribed syllabus with no dilutions. So, unless you have categorized everything that is being taught at the MSOT seminary as syllabus my information is inaccurate.

        The Orthodox seminary was affiliated in 1964 and 38 years have passed since His Holiness asked for clarifications in 1974. I do understand that we were pre occupied with the schism for many years. Surely it is time to think, at least, of a Theological University with Orthodox ethos as a long term goal. You asked, "Who told you that they are not planning it?" Well, do you know if there is any long-term vision of that sort? Usually it has been our practice to announce things we plan to do with a lot of hue and cry and I didn't hear about this one. Maybe I wasn't paying attention when it was being announced. I am well aware of our "achievements" as you put it and I am not criticizing any of it rather I congratulate our HB Thomas I, Catholicose of India, and all the associated people on their steadfastness to bring glory to our Church. But I do hope it didn't come at the cost of our spiritual growth.

        Theological studies in India are not easy and the Church has a certain responsibility to make it better. From what I understand MSOT seminary doesn't offer Masters or Doctoral courses. Maybe we can start from there. Maybe my opinion to put Theological University on a higher priority as one of our Church's goals is a minority one and, as you put it, is not one which is passed by the Holy Synod with "two third majorities". But even in a top-down structure like ours I believe the voice of an ordinary faithful do matter and airing opinions on this forum gives me an opportunity to engage in meaningful opinion building process.

        Lastly on a personal note, my query whether you were related to me was to make us not "strangers". Though a simple yes or no might have sufficed, I do understand your reservations for giving out personal information even though I gave out my personal information. But being 22 and a student (oops! I did it again: P) makes me relax over my own privacy concerns.

        Hope I've been polite, courteous and clear.

        Zach George Arapura
        Member# 3083
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