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Re: How do we address the EX-COMMUNICATED persons ?

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  • Bobby Kuriakose
    Dear Moderators: I am writing this as a continuation to the ongoing discussion in this forum on how to address `excommunicated clergies. This discussion
    Message 1 of 8 , Oct 28, 2009
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      Dear Moderators:

      I am writing this as a continuation to the ongoing discussion in this forum on how to address `excommunicated' clergies.

      This discussion started with one of the members of this forum correcting another member on his posting addressing an excommunicated clergy as "Fr. Paulose Peter". This was followed by a response post from the same excommunicated clergy. However, his response sounded more like a personal attack with stand out phrases such as – "I do not know who you are, where you are from or what your profession is, but one thing I am pretty sure about is that you are very poorly educated and your intelligence is way below average". A total display of pride and arrogance by looking down on a fellow being? The response also implied that the ex-clergy, even after betraying the Holy Church and breaking the Amologya that was repeated standing inside the Holy Altar of the living God during his ordination, still takes pride in being a former priest (former Vicar ??) of the Syrian Orthodox Church. It sounded like an idiosyncrasy that regardless of the severe aftermath of his defection, he demanded respect for the position he once held.

      I am sure that myself being a weak and sinful layman has no right to judge this excommunicated clergy. However, I would like to point out some facts on how the American Archdiocese and the faithful of White Plains Church were affected by the defection of this and other individuals who betrayed the Holy Church and jumped the boat to safeguard their vested interests. St. Mary's SOC, White Plains was one of the biggest churches of the SOC in New York. The Church was formed as a result of selfless dedication and effort of a number of SOC faithful. However, after his defection, this excommunicated priest along with excommunicated Bishop filed Court Cases against His Holiness the Patriarch and the SOC faithful and was able to win favorable court verdicts claiming the Church building to be a `Center' and not a church under the Patriarchate. He took initiative to kick out the SOC faithful who had put in a lot of effort, money and tears to build the Church. Now the church is affiliated as St. Mary's Malankara Orthodox Church, White Plains under the Devalokam Catholicos. For any true SOC faithful, it hurts to see Devalokam Catholicos and company performing services at the Church that was dedicated by Late Lamented Catholicos Baselius Paulose II. The irony is that majority of the supporters of this excommunicated clergy (members of the NEW St. Mary's MOC, White Plains) hail from Jacobite families from Malankara who still claim to be JACOBITES under the Patriarch. It is strange that they still have the privilege of receiving the Holy Sacraments from their Jacobite parishes in India.

      I have also noticed another posting on this forum comparing this excommunicated clergy to Shashi Tharoor. It is to be noted that the forum Moderators have an open door policy to another excommunicated clergy also who is a regular writer in this forum. This is the same individual who had openly challenged His Holiness, the Patriarch through emails and letters. Both these individuals are in the company of the excommunicated bishops, who are still running the mission to inflict damages on our Syrian Orthodox Church.

      It is obvious that there are a lot of Jacobite faithful still associated with these excommunicated clergies due to a number of reasons. Well, it is their personal choice. But, to still hail these individual in this Jacobite forum doesn't sound fair enough to the Holy Church, the hierarchs and the faithful affected by their acts. It is indeed disrespect to His Holiness. I would like to reiterate a line from Moran's bull that was sent to the excommunicated Fr. Eldhose – quote - any clergy or laity associating with you or participating in such wicked acts, also will become automatically accursed and expelled from the primary membership of the Syrian Orthodox church – unquote.

      To conclude, it is to be noted that respect is earned not demanded, not commanded. So, regardless of if we address these individuals as Mr. or Fr., we cannot defy the fact that they have betrayed the Holy Church and as a result have been expelled and stripped off from Priesthood and are banned from using the priestly vestments and from offering the Holy Eucharist.

      Our Church is going through a phase where we are being bombarded with court cases against us and every day our basic existence is being challenged. Let us pray that the defectors will wake up from their pride and arrogance and realize that they are just money banks to the Devalokam lawyers and truly repent and return back to the mother church. It is noteworthy that His Beatitude, the Catholicos through his recent bull has opened the doors for this return with a clear message to those attending other denomination churches outside Kerala on the consequences of putting their feet on two boats.

      Slomo,

      Bobby Kuriakose
      ID # 2333
    • Aji Thomas David
      ... Dear brother Boby I think you are wrong, please read the SALMUSA Parumala Thirumeni, section 9 of SALMUSA
      Message 2 of 8 , Nov 6, 2009
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        --- In SOCM-FORUM@yahoogroups.com, BOBY GEORGE PAUL wrote:
        >
        > ATTITTUDE TOWARDS THE EXCOMMUNICATED
        >
        > We should not humiliate those excommunicated from the Holy Church. >They were lost sheep and we must pray for their return. What I >understood is that the excommunicated priests were forbidden to use >their Ecleciastical powers and not eligible to enjoy the >priestly/spiritual powers henceforth enjoyed by them. Once ordained, >the Holy priesthood is not taken back from them, but what happens is >just they are prohibited to use the same in the Holy Church.

        Dear brother Boby

        I think you are wrong, please read the SALMUSA Parumala Thirumeni, section 9 of SALMUSA

        http://sor.cua.edu/Personage/MGregoriusGChathuruthil/18761216shalmootho.html

        9.Again, for the judgment according to the righteous judgements of the Holy Spirit, and as the Evangelion commands "all that you bind on earth shall be bound also in heaven", and according to the authority bestowed on Your Holiness by God, I will not only become eligible to be expelled from your presence, judged and removed from my position; if I modify or alter this document that I have written myself of my own volition or any of the pledges stated above, it is just that Your Holiness proclaim that I am fraudulent, so that no one trusts my word.

        In Malayalam
        http://syrianchurch.org/StGG/salmusa_StGregorios.pdf

        It is very clearly stated, His Holiness has the authority to take away priesthood from the excommunicated priest or a bishop.

        In Christ
        Aji Thomas David
        ID - 4088
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