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ORIENTAL ORTHODOX CHURCHES

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  • BOBY GEORGE PAUL
    Which are the ORIENTAL ORTHODOX CHURCHES? I think all the Churches which agree with the decisions of the Holy General Council of CONSTANTINOPLE and disagree
    Message 1 of 9 , Sep 29 7:26 AM
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      Which are the ORIENTAL ORTHODOX CHURCHES? I think all the Churches which agree with the decisions of the Holy General Council of CONSTANTINOPLE and disagree with the COUNICL OF CHACEDINE are fenerally grouped as ORIENTAL ORTHODOX CHURCHES. Hoewever, to the best of my knowledge our CHURCH is having holy communion with only TWO Other Oriental Orthodx Churches viz. THE COPTIC CHURCH and the ARMEANIAN CHURCH. We are not having communion with other Churches which are also said to be Oriental churches including INIDAN ORTHODOX Church and THE INDEPENDED SYRIAN CHURCH (THOZHIYOOR) OF MALABAR.

      BG PAUL
      ========================
      From the desk of the Moderator:

      Please sign your messages with member ID. If not having a member ID, please send your details including contact number to moderators
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    • Mathew G M
      The Oriental Orthodox Churhes are: - Coptic Orthodox Church (under the Pope of Alexandria) - Syriac Orthodox Church (under the Patriarch of Antioch) - Armenian
      Message 2 of 9 , Sep 30 1:01 PM
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        The Oriental Orthodox Churhes are:

        - Coptic Orthodox Church (under the Pope of Alexandria)
        - Syriac Orthodox Church (under the Patriarch of Antioch)
        - Armenian Orthodox Church (under the Catholicose of All Armenians See of Etchmiadzin)
        - Armenian Orthodox Church (under the Catholicosate of the Great House of Cilicia)

        The See of Etchmiadzin having pre-eminent supremacy in all spiritual matters over the See of Cilicia.

        - Ethipian Orthodox Church (under the Patriarch of Ethiopia)
        - Eritrean Orthodox Church (under the Patriarch of Eritrea)

        All these churches are in full communion with each other.

        Now we have the Indian Orthodox Church under the Catholicose of the East which is in communion with all of the above except the Syriac Orthodox Church.

        The situation of the INDEPENDED SYRIAN CHURCH (THOZHIYOOR) OF MALABAR is different. They do have communion with the protestant Marthomites and also participate in the Anglican Conference. They claim that they are in communion but does not accept the reformation teachings of the protestants. They are currently not considered as part of the Oriental Orthodox Churches.

        In Christ,
        Mathew G M
        0929

        --- In SOCM-FORUM@yahoogroups.com, BOBY GEORGE PAUL wrote:
        >
        > Which are the ORIENTAL ORTHODOX CHURCHES? I think all the Churches which agree with the decisions of the Holy General Council of CONSTANTINOPLE and disagree with the COUNICL OF CHACEDINE are fenerally grouped as ORIENTAL ORTHODOX CHURCHES. Hoewever, to the best of my knowledge our CHURCH is having holy communion with only TWO Other Oriental Orthodx Churches viz. THE COPTIC CHURCH and the ARMEANIAN CHURCH. We are not having communion with other Churches which are also said to be Oriental churches including INIDAN ORTHODOX Church and THE INDEPENDED SYRIAN CHURCH (THOZHIYOOR) OF MALABAR.
        >
      • Davis Cherian
        Dear Mr. Paul Please see the attached for getting an idea regarding your question. link. http://www.syrianchurch.org/Articles/Sabha_Charithram.pdf Thanks.
        Message 3 of 9 , Sep 30 2:27 PM
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          Dear Mr. Paul

          Please see the attached for getting an idea regarding your question.
          link. http://www.syrianchurch.org/Articles/Sabha_Charithram.pdf

          Thanks.

          Davis Cherian
          Sharjah
          2356
        • Aji Thomas David
          ... Dear Mr. Mathew The ground reality is differing from this. Both IOC and SOC in Malankara having 99% full communion. Both accept the Baptism of both
          Message 4 of 9 , Oct 3, 2009
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            --- In SOCM-FORUM@yahoogroups.com, Mathew G M wrote:
            >
            > The Oriental Orthodox Churhes are:
            >
            >
            > Now we have the Indian Orthodox Church under the Catholicose of the East which is in communion with all of the above except the Syriac Orthodox Church.
            >
            > In Christ,
            > Mathew G M
            > 0929
            >

            Dear Mr. Mathew

            The ground reality is differing from this. Both IOC and SOC in Malankara having 99% full communion.

            Both accept the Baptism of both churches (In 70ees this was different and I am one of the victim of it. My sister was re-baptized by the IOC bishop during her marriage). Fortunately or unfortunately it is not happening nowadays.

            Most of the laity from both sides attend Holy Qurbana and even partake in it.

            Clergies attend marriages and funeral services and actively participating including reading the "Sedars" and offering incenses.

            Prelates who attending the funeral of the bishops of both sides offering the incenses.

            All this shows they are almost in full communion.

            Let me recall the posting of Mr. Simon in the our forum (15896)

            Quote

            It is my understanding that yes the Indian Orthodox Church has been excommunicated by the Holy Synod of the Syrian Orthodox Church. What this means is that a Syrian Orthodox Christian, in obedience to the Holy Synod, does not receive Holy Communion from Indian Orthodox altars.

            Unquote

            Now the question arises – are we, both clergy and laity, in obedience to the Holy Synod of the respective churches?

            I doubt, because, for majority the religion is a hobby or a part-time business and what ever its teachings are same as the doctrines of the political parties, nobody care about the afterlife or the impact of disobeying the spiritual guidelines.

            I noticed few instance in our Churches. There are clergies readout the Kalpana of HH, HB & HG in front of the Holy Mystery, but the same clergy practices against it or dilute the guidelines with his own explanation. Then how we can blame laity?

            Both churches must take strict actions. For the sake of loosing few fence sitting members if the authorities are diluting the seriousness of the spiritual guidelines, it will end up with another Sodom Gomora.

            May be I sound like a fanatic or even crazy, but this is the ground reality. Nobody can deny it.

            In Christ
            Aji Thomas David
            ID - 4088
          • Boby George Paul
            During meetings of the HEADS of ORIENTAL ORTHODOX CHURCHES hosted by our HOLY FATHER why all the ORIENTAL ORTHODOX HEADS are not being invited. To the best of
            Message 5 of 9 , Oct 5, 2009
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              During meetings of the HEADS of ORIENTAL ORTHODOX CHURCHES hosted by our HOLY FATHER why all the ORIENTAL ORTHODOX HEADS are not being invited. To the best of my knoledge only the following were invited 1. SYRIAC ORTHODOX CHURCH 2.COPTIC ORTHODOX CHURCH 3 ARMENIAN ORTHODOX CHURCH. I think this is because we have holy communion only with these churches. Ethiopian and Erithrean Churches are descenders or departed from the original Churches

              BG PAUL
              ID4199
            • Georgy Thomas
              I do agree with Mr. Aji. Few more clergy same as Eldo (UK) is still in our Church. The authority must list them as early as possible and remove them from our
              Message 6 of 9 , Oct 7, 2009
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                I do agree with Mr. Aji. Few more clergy same as Eldo (UK) is still in our Church. The authority must list them as early as possible and remove them from our Church. Most of them are outside Kerala . Let them go to their devalokam godfathers. Why our poor people should feed these fence sitters. Those who are not in obedience to the Holy Synod must be removed regardless of their glorious past.

                I thank the moderators of the forum and editors of MSV for publishing all disciplinary action documents in the site. Else we the laymen will be in the dark and may fell in the traps of these people.

                Regards
                Georgy Thomas
                3958

                --- In SOCM-FORUM@yahoogroups.com, Aji Thomas David wrote:
                >
                > Dear Mr. Mathew
                >
                > The ground reality is differing from this. Both IOC and SOC in Malankara having 99% full communion.
                >
                > Both accept the Baptism of both churches (In 70ees this was different and I am one of the victim of it. My sister was re-baptized by the IOC bishop during her marriage). Fortunately or unfortunately it is not happening nowadays.
                >
              • Michael Poe
                Dear brother in Christ, All of the Oriental Orthodox churches are in complete union with one-another.They constitute the Syrian Orthodox, Coptic Orthodox,
                Message 7 of 9 , Oct 8, 2009
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                  Dear brother in Christ,

                  All of the Oriental Orthodox churches are in complete union with one-another.They constitute the Syrian Orthodox, Coptic Orthodox, Ethiopian Orthodox, Eretrian Orthodox, Armenian Orthodox, and the Malankara Orthodox Syrian church. They all are equel and are one in there pure Orthodox faith and truth.

                  Your brother in Christ,
                  Michael.
                  4172
                  -------------------------------------------
                  From the desk of moderators

                  Holy Syrian (Syriac) Orthodox Church is not in communion with Malankara Orthodox Syrian church at this time
                • Mathew G M
                  Dear BG Paul, The meeting that you are referring to is the Middle Eastern Council of Churches to which only the Coptic Orthodox and Armenian Orthodox attended.
                  Message 8 of 9 , Oct 9, 2009
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                    Dear BG Paul,
                    The meeting that you are referring to is the Middle Eastern Council of Churches to which only the Coptic Orthodox and Armenian Orthodox attended. The Ethiopian and Eritrean churches are African churches and not Middle Eastern churches and naturally they were not there.

                    Ethipian or Eritrean churches has not introduced any heretical teachings and the Syriac Orthodox Church is in FULL communion with these churches. Our clergy including Bishops co-celeberate the divine liturgy with these churches. So please dont make such claim about sister churches.

                    In Christ,
                    Mathew G M
                    # 0929

                    --- In SOCM-FORUM@yahoogroups.com, Boby George Paul wrote:
                    >
                    > During meetings of the HEADS of ORIENTAL ORTHODOX CHURCHES hosted by our HOLY FATHER why all the ORIENTAL ORTHODOX HEADS are not being invited. To the best of my knoledge only the following were invited 1. SYRIAC ORTHODOX CHURCH 2.COPTIC ORTHODOX CHURCH 3 ARMENIAN ORTHODOX CHURCH. I think this is because we have holy communion only with these churches. Ethiopian and Erithrean Churches are descenders or departed from the original Churches
                  • Aji Thomas David
                    Dear Mr. Paul The meeting you referring may be a meeting of Middle East OO church, more details of such meetings please refer the following link The tenth
                    Message 9 of 9 , Oct 9, 2009
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                      Dear Mr. Paul

                      The meeting you referring may be a meeting of Middle East OO church, more details of such meetings please refer the following link

                      The tenth meeting of the heads of the oriental orthodox churches in the middle east
                      http://www.socmnet.org/Resource_OO_Common_Decleration_Syria_2007.htm
                      Common declaration of these meetings are available in SOCMNET
                      http://www.socmnet.org/Resource.htm

                      Our Church is fully communion with Ethiopian and Eritrean churches and our prelates do concelebrate Sacraments. Please refer the following old messages in this forum
                      http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SOCM-FORUM/message/7764
                      http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SOCM-FORUM/message/5472

                      In Christ
                      Aji Thomas David
                      ID - 4088

                      --- In SOCM-FORUM@yahoogroups.com, Boby George Paul wrote:
                      >
                      > During meetings of the HEADS of ORIENTAL ORTHODOX CHURCHES hosted by our HOLY FATHER why all the ORIENTAL ORTHODOX HEADS are not being invited. To the best of my knoledge only the following were invited 1. SYRIAC ORTHODOX CHURCH 2.COPTIC ORTHODOX CHURCH 3 ARMENIAN ORTHODOX CHURCH. I think this is because we have holy communion only with these churches. Ethiopian and Erithrean Churches are descenders or departed from the original Churches
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