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Mor & Mar and Moran & Maran

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  • Vatachal Thomas John
    .........What is the difference between sugar cane & cane sugar ? ........ And what is the difference between Orthodox Syrian & Syrian Orthodox ?.....
    Message 1 of 2 , Nov 29, 2008
      .........What is the difference between� sugar cane & cane sugar
      ? ........ And what is the difference between� Orthodox Syrian & Syrian Orthodox ?..... Again what is the difference between Mor & Mar? ...Let me take up the questions one by one..

      Sugar cane is something for enjoying which we have to use our
      teeth, while for enjoing cane sugar we need not use our teeth at all...... For, the former is a plant with sweet juice and the latter is a food material the diabetics are forebidden to take or simply the usual sugar which is produced from sugar cane. In other words cane sugar is produced from sugar cane and sugar cane is the source of cane sugar..

      Coming to the next question, Orthodox Syrian is something Indian while the Syrian (Syriac) Orthodox is something Universal... For making the Orthodox Syrian fully Indian, they have first done away
      with Syrian substituting it with the word Indian. ...Then it will look like Orthodox Indian. Thus Orthodox Syrian Church when made Indian will be Orthodox Indian Church. This name looks ugly; so they have it as Indian Orthodox Church. To put it in other words an evolution took place as follows:

      Stage 1 Syrian Orthodox Church0
      Stage 2 Orthodox Syrian Church
      Stage 3 Orthodox Indian Church
      Stage 4 Indian Orthodox Church

      I hope that you can now understand the difference between Syrian Orthodox and Orthodox Syrian.

      The names of some of the orthodox churches (Eastern and Oriental) are as follows

      Greek Orthodox Church,
      Russian Orthodox Church,
      Romanian Orthodox Church,
      Armenian Orthodox Church,
      Ethyopian Orthodox Church,
      Syrian Orthodox Church

      and last but not the least
      Orthodox Syrian Church

      Let me go to the Churches under H H the Pope of Rome. They are named as under:

      Latin Catholic
      Syrian Catholic etc.,

      Then why did they put the cart before the horse by calling themselves orthodox syrian?

      They wanted the entire properties of the Malankara Church and of the
      individual parish churches. When they go to a court of law they will never call themselves Indian Orthodox, but only Orthodox Syrian (cart before the horse); before any court of law, their spiritual head is Patriarch whom they do not recognise. Husband is the head of the wife and the head of the husband (and consequently of both) is the Lord ...... When the wife denies the husband, she denies the Lord as well. I do not say that this analogy is applicable to the Church. When they have all things in subjection under their feet or when they become rulers over all things, they will change everything. The church will be known as Universal Indian Orthodox Church and the Catholicos will be the Supreme Catholicos & Chief or Principal Patriarch with atleast four patriarchs under him one for the USA & Canada, one for the Europian Union, one for the Middle East and one for India thus trying to dilute the primacy of the Patriarch of Antioch.

      Now let me come to Mar and Mor. The Indian Orthodox Church always use
      the word "Mar" of East (Chaldian) Syriac and we use the word "Mor" of the West (Antiochian) Syriac. They say the Malankara Church used East Syriac as its litergical language until recently as is evident from the words mamodeesa, kurbana, thaksa, koodasa etc, every word ending with an "a". We in India, they say, seldom use words from West Syriac which end in "o". For them I have a question to ask. When you hear from the street a call " chaacko, paattayo, pathrakadalaaso, kuppiyo, plastico, pazhaya lohappathrangalo wilpanundooooo...will Mr. Chacko think that the call is intented for him and for him alone?. I have never found any words in Malayalam other than Chacko (derived from Jacob which ends with "o" . So my humble submission is that Syriac words ending with� "o" are baptised in to Malayalam substituting an "a" for "o".

      Coming back to Mor and Mar once again. When we say H G Geevargese Mar
      Coorilos we should mean the His Grace of the Indian Orthodox Church. When we say Geevargese Mor Coorilos, it is His Grace of our Church. Incidently I may state that the beloved mother of Mor Coorilos is a cousin of Mar Coorilos and the difference between their names is the same as the difference between "o" and "a"

      There is a prayer song in� East Syriac the opening words of which is " kampel maran" Malayalee would understand it as a direction to move to the branch. The West Syriac form of "kampel maran" is "kabel moran" The words mean "accept our Lord" or "njangalude karthave... kaikkollaname" It is evident that "maran" is the East Syriac form of the West Syriac "Moran". So we can say "mar" becomes "maran" and "mor" becomes "moran" In view of this His Holiness of
      the Indian Orthodox Church should be called: "His Holiness Maran Mar Basalius Mar Thoma Didimos I�" and if HB Mor Basalius Thomas I were to be referred by this title, it will be "Moran Mor Basalius Thomas I" His Beattitude will never allow anybody to club his name with the title Moran as it is used by us to refer to our Lord Jesus Christ and by the church as a whole to the exception of the Patriarch to refer to the Patriarch. the head of the Church. No patriarch has ever used the titles HH or Moran to refer to himself. No Catholicos of Indian Orthodox Church has failed to use the title to refer to himself except the Catholicos in India consecrated in 1964 by H H Moran Mor Ignatius Yaacoob III, for a short period until His Beattitude became conscious of his holiness and moranship. The Indian Orthodox Church is not unaware of the meanings of Moran & His Holiness. There is in the English Language His Holiness and Your Holiness and no My Holiness. There is Our Lord (Moran or Maran) My Lord is the same as Your Lordship ..But how can a person call himself Moran (Our Lord ) or His Holiness?

      I would end this with a home work for the readers; What is the name of the Malankara Church as specified by the St.Dianatius of Vattasseril of the Indian Orthodox Church in the Mathasamgathi? Clue refer to the Mathasangathi published by Mor Addai Study Centre

      V T John ID 3085
    • Shibu and Sherin
      Very nice and educative Write-up.   Regards,   Shibu and Sherin
      Message 2 of 2 , Dec 2 9:23 PM
        Very nice and educative Write-up.
        Shibu and Sherin
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