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Is Judas is to be hatred??

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  • Eldo E V
    Dear Moderators, John 13: 27-As soon as Judas took the bread, Satan entered into him what you are about to do, do quickly . Luke 22:22-The son of man will go
    Message 1 of 8 , Nov 23, 2008
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      Dear Moderators,

      John 13: 27-As soon as Judas took the bread, Satan entered into
      him "what you are about to do, do quickly".
      Luke 22:22-The son of man will go as it has been decreed.

      Mark 14:20, Matthew 26:24-The Son of Man will go just as it is
      written about him.

      1. In our faith we hate Judas for betraying the Lord, as Jesus
      himself told in all Gospel that "But woe to the man who betrayed
      him". But is he to be hatred??The above verses clearly say the death
      of Jesus is determined. And the blood has washed the sins of human
      kind and gave salvation. So the Death of Jesus is inevitable and it
      is planned by the Father to save his peoples from the sins. If Jesus
      was not crucified and had a natural death, are there any Christians
      today?? Anyone remember Jesus?? So why can't we think the act of
      Judas has saved us and gave hope for salvation? Even though Jesus
      knows Judas going to betray him, He not prevented him but permitted
      him as written in the gospel of John. So the act of Judas is
      permitted by the Lord for completing his mission in the world.

      2. Again when the holy bread given by Jesus to Judas, Satan has
      entered to him. Here come some doubts. is Jesus allow Satan to enter
      his peoples? We believe that when we part with the holy mysteries,
      Holy Spirit will enlighten us. But here instead, Satan has entered.
      Is it not contradictory?? Is Satan is so powerful than Lord as he
      enter to Judas in presence of Lord??. In Old Testament also examples
      are there that Lord sent evil spirit to King Saul.

      Please someone can clear this doubts??

      Please forgive me if my words are against our faith.
      eldo e v
      #4120
    • V T John
      The correct word that should have been used by Habibo E V Eldo in his message is ``hated` and not `` hatred. For, the former is a verb while the latter is the
      Message 2 of 8 , Nov 25, 2008
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        The correct word that should have been used by Habibo E V Eldo in his
        message is ``hated` and not `` hatred. For, the former is a verb
        while the latter is the noun form of `` hate``.

        My humble submission is that one should not doubt the wisdom of God.
        It will be absurd to say that the magis (wise men from the east)
        should not have been shown the star to attract them to come and
        worship the Lord in consequence of which the young children of
        Bethlahem area aged two years and below were killed by Herod. Can
        anybody say that the selection of Soul as the first king of the
        Israel by God was a mistake commited by God ? If I were to say that
        God sided with Jacob to steal the blessing due to Esau from Isaac, no
        one will agree with me We should not judge anybody. God will judge
        every one on the Day of the Last Judgment including Cain,Judas and
        other such people Every one should tremble with fear so that he or
        she may not be in the list of Cain, Judas and others and for that
        accept the Lord Jesus Christ as his or her personal SAVIOR and abide
        in Him.

        There a sedro of the Sunday of the departed ones (Aaneedey
        Sunday) giving a description of the the events that take place before
        the Agnisimhasanam of our Lord Jesus Christ.

        With prayers and best wishes
        Yours in Him
        V T John
        ID 3085

        --- In SOCM-FORUM@yahoogroups.com, Eldo E V wrote:
        >
        > Dear Moderators,
        >
        > John 13: 27-As soon as Judas took the bread, Satan entered into
        > him "what you are about to do, do quickly".
        > Luke 22:22-The son of man will go as it has been decreed.
        >
        > Mark 14:20, Matthew 26:24-The Son of Man will go just as it is
        > written about him.
        >
      • Dr.K.P.Jacob
        Dear Friends, The question raised by Mr.Eldo is very pertinent, which most of us have in mind but dare not to raise it in an open form. I feel that Judas had
        Message 3 of 8 , Nov 25, 2008
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          Dear Friends,

          The question raised by Mr.Eldo is very pertinent, which most of us have in mind but dare not to raise it in an open form. I feel that Judas had full faith in Christ and in His powers. He had witnessed many miracles done by Christ and might have believed that no body could do any harm to him. Even if he had pointed on Christ, he might have thought that Christ would escape from the enemies and the 30 silver coins he had received in return would remain with him. If Christ didn't have faith in Judas' integrity, he would not have entrusted the money management with him. But when Judas found that his calculations were wrong and that Christ was sentensed to crucifixion, he could not stand it and tried to commit suicide by hanging himself.

          Christ had told many times about his crcifixion and that one of his deciples would betray him and Judas knew that he was the person Jesus meant. Christ had warned about the fate of that person. Fully knowing this fact, Judas dared to point at Christ to fulfill His words. When we analyse things in a proper perspective, I think it is not right to curse Judas. If Judas had not betryed Christ and if Christ didn't have His death on cross, His mission would not have been fulfilled.

          Dr.K.P.Jacob
        • Chev. Thomas Daniel
          ... enter ... examples ... Dear Eldho Shlomo From my tiny knowledge in the Holy Scriptures, the answer is written in the Holy Bible itself. Please read the
          Message 4 of 8 , Nov 25, 2008
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            --- In SOCM-FORUM@yahoogroups.com, Eldo E V wrote:
            >
            > John 13: 27-As soon as Judas took the bread, Satan entered into
            > him "what you are about to do, do quickly".

            > 2. Again when the holy bread given by Jesus to Judas, Satan has
            > entered to him. Here come some doubts. is Jesus allow Satan to
            enter
            > his peoples? We believe that when we part with the holy mysteries,
            > Holy Spirit will enlighten us. But here instead, Satan has entered.
            > Is it not contradictory?? Is Satan is so powerful than Lord as he
            > enter to Judas in presence of Lord??. In Old Testament also
            examples
            > are there that Lord sent evil spirit to King Saul.

            Dear Eldho
            Shlomo

            From my tiny knowledge in the Holy Scriptures, the answer is written
            in the Holy Bible itself. Please read the following verses, it is
            self explanatory and clearly mention why and how Satan entered into
            him (Judas). It's still happening even today.

            +++
            (Holy Bible - King James Version)
            11:26 For as often as ye eat this bread, and drink this cup, ye do
            shew the Lord's death till he come.

            11:27 Wherefore whosoever shall eat this bread, and drink this cup of
            the Lord, unworthily, shall be guilty of the body and blood of the
            Lord.

            11:28 But let a man examine himself, and so let him eat of that
            bread, and drink of that cup.

            11:29 For he that eateth and drinketh unworthily, eateth and drinketh
            damnation to himself, not discerning the Lord's body.
            ++++

            I request the learned members of this forum to correct me if I am
            wrong and seek HIS Mercy for trying to interpret HIS Words.

            In HIS Love
            Chevalier Thomas Daniel (Reji)
            # 0001
          • Varghese Abraham
            Dear all, 1) Judas is not to be hated. His act should be hated.Our Lord told us to love our enemies. But that does not mean approving their actions if it is
            Message 5 of 8 , Nov 26, 2008
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              Dear all,

              1) Judas is not to be hated. His act should be hated.Our Lord told us
              to love our enemies. But that does not mean approving their actions if
              it is wrong. Do not asssume that without Judas, Christ's mission would not have been completed. The high priests and Pharisees would have captured Jesus through some other means or through someone else. God works in several ways,we may be blinded to many.

              2)The holy bread will act in a person only if the concerned person
              believes in it. Otherwise it is like any other food item. But for the
              believer it is the body of the Lord which will cleanse him. As far as
              Judas is concerned, he did not believe, so he is not enlightened. Again,Satan entered Judas in the presence of our Lord. There is nothing contradictory here. Remember Satan had come near the Lord to test him. Evil spirit entered Saul only after he himself disobeyed God. God does not test anyone beyond that person's capacity. These are my thoughts,could be wrong. One of our Thirumenis or scholars could clarify further.

              Regards,
              Varghese Abraham

              --- In SOCM-FORUM@yahoogroups.com, Eldo E V wrote:
              >
              > Dear Moderators,
              >
              > John 13: 27-As soon as Judas took the bread, Satan entered into
              > him "what you are about to do, do quickly".
              > Luke 22:22-The son of man will go as it has been decreed.
              >
            • Apu Jose
              Dear Varghese Abraham sir, In the last posting Varghese sir wrote: 2)The holy bread will act in a person only if the concerned person believes in it. Otherwise
              Message 6 of 8 , Nov 27, 2008
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                Dear Varghese Abraham sir,

                In the last posting Varghese sir wrote:

                2)The holy bread will act in a person only if the concerned person
                believes in it. Otherwise it is like any other food item. But for the
                believer it is the body of the Lord which will cleanse him.

                I guess , this is not the correct faith. The Holy Mysteries(ie both the Holy elements Body and Blood of Jesus Christ ) is truely the Body and Blood of Jesus Christ. The belief of the person is not important to decide whether it is body and blood of Jesus christ. Whatever be his belief, it remains body and blood of Jesus Christ. It is not and it cannot be any normal food item (if the mass is celebrated by properly ordained Oriental Orthodox clergy) even if the recipent believes otherwise.

                It should be taken only after proper examination of your life and Holy Confession (in front of a properly ordained priest).

                A person who takes it without proper Holy Confession and who takes it thinking it like any other food invites the wrath of God.

                With prayers
                Apu Jose
                Bhubaneswar
                4096
              • Varghese Abraham
                Dear Apu, Thank you for your clarification. You are absolutely right,the holy sacraments is the flesh and blood of Christ. What I mentioned is also clear-for
                Message 7 of 8 , Nov 29, 2008
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                  Dear Apu,

                  Thank you for your clarification. You are absolutely right,the holy
                  sacraments is the flesh and blood of Christ. What I mentioned is also
                  clear-for the nonbeliever, who if he happens to have it,it does not
                  seem so.But he is wrong. Unless he believes, the mere physical act of
                  having the sacrament is not going to transform him.

                  Regards,
                  Aby

                  --- In SOCM-FORUM@yahoogroups.com, Apu Jose wrote:
                  >
                  > Dear Varghese Abraham sir,
                  >
                  > In the last posting Varghese sir wrote:
                  >
                  > 2)The holy bread will act in a person only if the concerned person
                  > believes in it. Otherwise it is like any other food item. But for
                  the
                  > believer it is the body of the Lord which will cleanse him.
                • Rev. Dn. Bennet Kuriakose
                  Dear Eldho, You have asked a nice question. Many are having this doubt, that is whether Judas is to be venerated or not. From my experience, some Muslims and
                  Message 8 of 8 , Dec 1, 2008
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                    Dear Eldho,
                    You have asked a nice question. Many are having this doubt, that is whether Judas is to be venerated or not. From my experience, some Muslims and Bible critics also ask these question.

                    Jesus' crucifiction and death is ofcourse planned from the beginning.
                    Prophets were proclaiming it. Judas did a wrong thing to betray his Teacher.

                    We have no doubt. But, the doubt is that, because of this betrayal only, we could attain salvation. So why should not Judas be praised? It is just because of the fact that he had done the sin to betray his teacher. But the God can tranform a bad doing to a good. Just like, Moses did a sin to kill an Egyptian, but he fled afraid of Pharaoh and then God used the oportunity to select him as a prophet. There are hell a lot of examples from the Bible itself. When we closely observe our lives, this is still happening!! One must have done a wrong thing to you, but God make this an opportunity to bring a good prosperity out of that.

                    So the sin of Judas was tranformed to a good by the Lord. And that is the truth. So a sinner and sin cannot be venerated. And there is a term called 'free will'. If we want to do sin, God will never interfere in that. That is we have the prevelage to select good or bad in our lives. This is what is meant in Lord's words to Caen "The sin is at the door.....". Adam and Eve was given the prevelage to eat the fruit or not. We are still having that prevelage. But God will warn us through many mediums. Judas was also warned many times. We can see Jesus warning Judas even just before the Last Supper. Still he was not turning his heart, so Jesus was just leaving him like "Do
                    what you have decieded". That is not a permission.

                    About the second doubt, that is Satan entered Judas' heart when he recieved the Holy Eucharist. That is a clear explanation of what will happen when Eucharist is consumed by one who is unholy or with his sins. Judas was with his heart unholy, consumed the Euchartist and Satan entered. But the other Apostles also consumed it, but recieves the blessing and Holy Spirit.

                    Dn. Bennet Kuriakose
                    3281
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