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Re:Proposal for truce. (MSOC Vs JOC).

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  • Gleeson Baby
    Dear Mammen, ... Thomas . For IOC, HH Patriarch is the spiritual leader. The HH Catholicos and the HB Catholicos quandary can be solved through the
    Message 1 of 5 , Nov 5, 2008
      Dear Mammen,

      >>>>> Will a proposal in this forum make any positive move? But keen to know the opinions of others. The primary subject of the conflict is the "Throne". Let us adore the "Thrones", St. Peter's and St.
      Thomas'. For IOC, HH Patriarch is the spiritual leader. The "HH
      Catholicos" and the "HB Catholicos" quandary can be solved through
      the following steps.

      1. Let HH Patriarch be always our spiritual leader.
      2. Let both the HH and the HB retire and take rest.
      3. Let the new HH be the senior Metropolitan of the present
      Jacobite group.
      4. Let present Assistant Catholicos HB Milithios continue.
      5. Select another Metropolitan from Jacobite group to be in line
      for Assistant Catholicos.
      6. Dissolve both the associations and elect a new one.
      7. Shuffle the Diocese Bishops and Vicars.<<<<<<<<<<

      Let me give my opinion of your proposal.

      1. Its not the "Throne" the only issue or the most important issue. The fact is MOSC made apparant deviation from the centuries old faith, practises and customs of the mother church. As far as the Throne is concerned, historically its an accepted fact that the oldest or the first church is the See of Antioch established by St Peter. Its a fact even accepted by the catholic church, a church which never accepts anything which devalues Rome. Now if somebody wants to create a new throne just to compete with the See of Antioch, that too as late as 1974, its their problem. And if that Throne doesnt get accepted even by the christian community in malankara and needs the "honorific" title confered by the supreme court to survive, its for the creators to answer.

      2. HH the Patriarch is the supreme spiritual head of the jacobite syrian church. There is no argument on that. But as far as MOSC is concerned can you be authoritive about their stand. Of course the 95 SC judgement which is applicable to MOSC declares the Holy Patriarch as the Spiritual head. Even the 34 constitution also in a smocky way declares HH as the spiritual head. Ad Nariman when arguing in SC was asked by the judges what will be the status of malankara church without the Patriarch. He replied that it will be like the body without head...

      Now just go through the public atturances of the leaders of Mosc.. They talk as if HH is the head of some foreign church who have no business in malankara..This dual stand taken by MOSC inside and outside the court will never catalyse a serious discussion on peace talks..

      3.Your idea of giving retirement or rest to HH, HB etc etc arises out of your wrong perception that the church case is not issue based but the handiwork of some people.Any proposal which sidelines the actual issues to be discussed or sorted out will only fall through.It will only be a waste of time for the concerned. The issues which are under contention should be identified and should be discussed to find a solution, if at all its there..

      4. In my opinion there are two issues which have to be sorted out.
      a) The position of the Holy See in the Malankara Church.
      b) the temperol independence of the parish churches....

      I have written above on the dual stand by MOSC regarding the Holy See. Let them retreat from the stand taken by Ougen Catholicos in 74 and go back to the the letter and spirit of the Shalmoosa of the same Ougen Catholicos in 64..Let the MOSC publically accept that HH the Patriarch is the supreme spiritual head of the malankara church. They should not do it half heartedly. They shouldnt do it just because SC told them so.. they shouldnt do it just because its written in the 34 constitution or because they are reciting in the first thubdhen... They should do it because its a matter of faith to them which have been accepted by the community for centuries..

      Regarding the temperol independence of the parish churches, you may be knowing the stand of JSC. It dosnt accept any authority of the malankara metran or bishops or priests on the temperol affairs of the parish churches.The custodian of the temperol affais of the individual parish churches is vested on the parish pothuyogam and through it the parish managing commitee. Any talk of parish churches belonging to malankara metran or bishops( as in catholic churches) will never find acceptance in any JSC churches..

      I feel these two are the most important issues to be discussed.

      And i can guarantee you that MOSC will never take a clear stand on the above.. Its assured, and there you can find why the century old dispute can be settled only by a peacefull parting of ways...


      Gleeson Baby
      St George Jacobite Syrian Church
    • George Kurian
      Dear Saji, I and my New World Publication (www.newworldstories.com) wholeheartedly support the idea for peace. If Dr.Martin Luther King Jr. and the President
      Message 2 of 5 , Nov 6, 2008
        Dear Saji,

        I and my New World Publication (www.newworldstories.com) wholeheartedly support the idea for peace. If Dr.Martin Luther King Jr. and the President Elect Mr.Barack Obama could make a change of history, why not we the people from God's own Country connot make a small truce !!!

        Unless we move forward boldly and try for peace, it will never happen. Please read my posting "The Abandoned Treasure" published in by publication, we will know what we are losing !!

        Saji and dear friends let us all try and I am sure we will succeed.

        George Kurian
        Chief Editor
        New World
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