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Re: [S-R] terms for family members

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  • Maureen
    I can help with one of them. On my recent visit to Uzhhorod I was called Tutka Maureen - Aunt Maureen - by those whose language preference is clearly
    Message 1 of 20 , Dec 3, 2003
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      I can help with one of them. On my recent visit to Uzhhorod I was called "Tutka Maureen" - "Aunt Maureen" - by those whose language preference is clearly Ukrainian.

      Maureen
      www.deefalt.com

      ----- Original Message -----
      From: christopher gajda
      To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
      Sent: Wednesday, December 03, 2003 10:40 AM
      Subject: [S-R] terms for family members


      Does anyone know the precise relationship for "sovgor" (shovgor)? Based on some old photos and letters I had thoght "sovgor" meant brother-in-law, but recently some Russian exchange students told me "sovgor" was father-in-law.

      Recently someone had wrote about the terms used for various family members; in letters from Uzhgorod to my grandmother her neices who grew up in the Austro-Hungarian and Czechoslovak periods addressed her as "Tyutka" - but their children who grew up in USSR after WWII addressed my grandparents as "Strika i Strina". My grandmother sometimes used a word which sounded to me like "way-ka" for "uncle".



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    • pewterj
      I remember calling my Slovak Aunt Cetcie Annie . Does Cetcie mean Aunt? I m new to this group so please excuse my ignorance! Thanks. Mary
      Message 2 of 20 , Dec 4, 2003
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        I remember calling my Slovak Aunt "Cetcie Annie". Does "Cetcie" mean
        Aunt? I'm new to this group so please excuse my ignorance! Thanks.
        Mary
      • MAMallon
        I call all my Slovak Aunts by what I know as an endearing term for an aunt...... Tetka . Mary Ann ... From: pewterj [mailto:pewterj@aol.com] Sent: Thursday,
        Message 3 of 20 , Dec 4, 2003
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          I call all my Slovak Aunts by what I know as an endearing term for an
          aunt...... "Tetka".

          Mary Ann
          -----Original Message-----
          From: pewterj [mailto:pewterj@...]
          Sent: Thursday, December 04, 2003 3:29 PM
          To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: Re: [S-R] terms for family members


          I remember calling my Slovak Aunt "Cetcie Annie". Does "Cetcie" mean
          Aunt? I'm new to this group so please excuse my ignorance! Thanks.
          Mary


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        • yawho2001
          ... an ... We used the term tsetka for aunt. I uploaded a file to the Slovak Roots file section that contains many of the common terms used in research
          Message 4 of 20 , Dec 4, 2003
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            --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com, "MAMallon" <mamallon@a...> wrote:
            > I call all my Slovak Aunts by what I know as an endearing term for
            an
            > aunt...... "Tetka".

            We used the term "tsetka" for aunt. I uploaded a file to the Slovak
            Roots file section that contains many of the common terms used in
            research reports including family titles. Look for the file GLOS-
            SK.htm. Some of the other terms are: uncle = stry'ko(ujko in Rusyn),
            father-in-law = svokor, brother-in-law = s^vagor, etc. I believe
            Frank from this list may have originated the list.

            John M.
          • Janet Thompson
            If I recall aunt in Slovak is TETA and pronounced as TYE-TA Janet MAMallon wrote: I call all my Slovak Aunts by what I know as an
            Message 5 of 20 , Dec 5, 2003
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              If I recall aunt in Slovak is "TETA" and pronounced as "TYE-TA"

              Janet

              MAMallon <mamallon@...> wrote:
              I call all my Slovak Aunts by what I know as an endearing term for an
              aunt...... "Tetka".

              Mary Ann
              -----Original Message-----
              From: pewterj [mailto:pewterj@...]
              Sent: Thursday, December 04, 2003 3:29 PM
              To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: Re: [S-R] terms for family members


              I remember calling my Slovak Aunt "Cetcie Annie". Does "Cetcie" mean
              Aunt? I'm new to this group so please excuse my ignorance! Thanks.
              Mary


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            • squinch42
              When I was a mere lad, I refered to my great aunt as tsetka . She was from Trebisov. My grandmother, who instructed me on what to call my great aunt, was from
              Message 6 of 20 , Dec 5, 2003
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                When I was a mere lad, I refered to my great aunt as "tsetka". She
                was from Trebisov. My grandmother, who instructed me on what to call
                my great aunt, was from Malcov.


                --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com, "yawho2001" <jmatsko4@c...>
                wrote:
                > --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com, "MAMallon" <mamallon@a...>
                wrote:
                > > I call all my Slovak Aunts by what I know as an endearing term
                for
                > an
                > > aunt...... "Tetka".
                >
                > We used the term "tsetka" for aunt. I uploaded a file to the
                Slovak
                > Roots file section that contains many of the common terms used in
                > research reports including family titles. Look for the file GLOS-
                > SK.htm. Some of the other terms are: uncle = stry'ko(ujko in
                Rusyn),
                > father-in-law = svokor, brother-in-law = s^vagor, etc. I believe
                > Frank from this list may have originated the list.
                >
                > John M.
              • Armata, Joseph R. (JArmata)
                Kinship terms are really complicated! The old Slavs seemed to have a separate word for every sort of relationship; and the old terms along with imports from
                Message 7 of 20 , Dec 5, 2003
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                  Kinship terms are really complicated! The old Slavs seemed to
                  have a separate word for every sort of relationship; and the old
                  terms along with imports from German and Hungarian are often used
                  in different ways in different parts of the country.

                  Unfortunately, s~vagor can be either: father-in-law or
                  brother-in-law, depending on local usage. For father-in-law, it
                  traditionally refers to the wife's parents, though it wouldn't be
                  surprising if it were used for the husband's father too
                  somewhere.

                  Tyotka/tetka/tsetka and variations are general terms for aunt.

                  Traditionally, terms based on stri-/stry- refer to uncles and
                  aunts on your father's side, while those with vuj-/uj- refer to
                  uncles and aunts on your mother's side.

                  So striko and strina would be uncle and aunt respectively on the
                  father's side, while vuyko and vuyna would be the same on the
                  mother's side.

                  Joe


                  > Does anyone know the precise relationship for "sovgor" (shovgor)? Based
                  > on some old photos and letters I had thoght "sovgor" meant
                  > brother-in-law, but recently some Russian exchange students told me
                  > "sovgor" was father-in-law.
                  >
                  > Recently someone had wrote about the terms used for various family
                  > members; in letters from Uzhgorod to my grandmother her neices who grew
                  > up in the Austro-Hungarian and Czechoslovak periods addressed her as
                  > "Tyutka" - but their children who grew up in USSR after WWII addressed
                  > my grandparents as "Strika i Strina". My grandmother sometimes used a
                  > word which sounded to me like "way-ka" for "uncle".
                • Susan Friedhaber-Hard
                  Funny, I remember everyone calling my Slovak great aunt: Cetka. Susan Friedhaber-Hard pewterj wrote: I remember calling my Slovak Aunt
                  Message 8 of 20 , Dec 5, 2003
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                    Funny, I remember everyone calling my Slovak great aunt: Cetka.
                    Susan Friedhaber-Hard

                    pewterj <pewterj@...> wrote:
                    I remember calling my Slovak Aunt "Cetcie Annie". Does "Cetcie" mean
                    Aunt? I'm new to this group so please excuse my ignorance! Thanks.
                    Mary


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                  • yawho2001
                    ... Thanks Joe, I had no relatives on my father s side in America so althouh I heard the term stryko used occasionally,I didn t associate it with paternal
                    Message 9 of 20 , Dec 5, 2003
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                      --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com, "Armata, Joseph R. (JArmata)"
                      <JArmata@g...> wrote:
                      >>
                      > So striko and strina would be uncle and aunt respectively on the
                      > father's side, while vuyko and vuyna would be the same on the
                      > mother's side.
                      >
                      > Joe

                      Thanks Joe,

                      I had no relatives on my father's side in America so althouh I heard
                      the term stryko used occasionally,I didn't associate it with paternal
                      uncles. I did have maternal aunts and uncles so ujko and tsetka were
                      the only terms I used frequently. These were the terms used by rusyn
                      villages in the Bardejov area.

                      John
                    • Vladimir Bohinc
                      Dear Joe, Svagor is the brother of my wife. Svokor and svokra are her parents. We had a joke: Show a photo of your svokra in a drug store and you can get any
                      Message 10 of 20 , Dec 5, 2003
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                        Dear Joe,
                        Svagor is the brother of my wife.
                        Svokor and svokra are her parents.
                        We had a joke:
                        Show a photo of your svokra in a drug store and you can get any poison
                        without prescription.
                        They are very understandable people:-)
                        Vladimir

                        ----- Original Message -----
                        From: "Armata, Joseph R. (JArmata)" <JArmata@...>
                        To: <SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com>
                        Sent: Saturday, December 06, 2003 3:36 AM
                        Subject: Re: [S-R] terms for family members


                        > Kinship terms are really complicated! The old Slavs seemed to
                        > have a separate word for every sort of relationship; and the old
                        > terms along with imports from German and Hungarian are often used
                        > in different ways in different parts of the country.
                        >
                        > Unfortunately, s~vagor can be either: father-in-law or
                        > brother-in-law, depending on local usage. For father-in-law, it
                        > traditionally refers to the wife's parents, though it wouldn't be
                        > surprising if it were used for the husband's father too
                        > somewhere.
                        >
                        > Tyotka/tetka/tsetka and variations are general terms for aunt.
                        >
                        > Traditionally, terms based on stri-/stry- refer to uncles and
                        > aunts on your father's side, while those with vuj-/uj- refer to
                        > uncles and aunts on your mother's side.
                        >
                        > So striko and strina would be uncle and aunt respectively on the
                        > father's side, while vuyko and vuyna would be the same on the
                        > mother's side.
                        >
                        > Joe
                        >
                        >
                        > > Does anyone know the precise relationship for "sovgor" (shovgor)? Based
                        > > on some old photos and letters I had thoght "sovgor" meant
                        > > brother-in-law, but recently some Russian exchange students told me
                        > > "sovgor" was father-in-law.
                        > >
                        > > Recently someone had wrote about the terms used for various family
                        > > members; in letters from Uzhgorod to my grandmother her neices who grew
                        > > up in the Austro-Hungarian and Czechoslovak periods addressed her as
                        > > "Tyutka" - but their children who grew up in USSR after WWII addressed
                        > > my grandparents as "Strika i Strina". My grandmother sometimes used a
                        > > word which sounded to me like "way-ka" for "uncle".
                        >
                        >
                        > To unsubscribe from this group, go to
                        http://www.yahoogroups.com/group/SLOVAK-ROOTS -or- send blank email to
                        SLOVAK-ROOTS-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                        >
                        > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                        >
                        >
                        >
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                        >
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                      • nhasior@aol.com
                        In a message dated 12/6/03 3:27:31 AM Eastern Standard Time, ... Vladimir, we will tell your mother in law what you said. hahahaha :O) Noreen [Non-text
                        Message 11 of 20 , Dec 6, 2003
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                          In a message dated 12/6/03 3:27:31 AM Eastern Standard Time,
                          konekta@... writes:

                          > Show a photo of your svokra in a drug store and you can get any poison
                          > without prescription.
                          >

                          Vladimir,
                          we will tell your mother in law what you said. hahahaha :O)
                          Noreen


                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        • Vladimir Bohinc
                          Noreen, She knows that all right. That s why she never wants to eat my delicious cooking:-) A discouraging My to ne jedavame = We don t eat that.; is always
                          Message 12 of 20 , Dec 6, 2003
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                            Noreen,
                            She knows that all right. That's why she never wants to eat my delicious
                            cooking:-)
                            A discouraging " My to ne jedavame" = We don't eat that.; is always the
                            answer.
                            But I'll keep trying.
                            Vladimir


                            ----- Original Message -----
                            From: <nhasior@...>
                            To: <SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com>
                            Sent: Saturday, December 06, 2003 5:30 PM
                            Subject: Re: [S-R] terms for family members


                            > In a message dated 12/6/03 3:27:31 AM Eastern Standard Time,
                            > konekta@... writes:
                            >
                            > > Show a photo of your svokra in a drug store and you can get any poison
                            > > without prescription.
                            > >
                            >
                            > Vladimir,
                            > we will tell your mother in law what you said. hahahaha :O)
                            > Noreen
                            >
                            >
                            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            > To unsubscribe from this group, go to
                            http://www.yahoogroups.com/group/SLOVAK-ROOTS -or- send blank email to
                            SLOVAK-ROOTS-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                            >
                            > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            > __________ Informacia od NOD32 1.573 (20031205) __________
                            >
                            > Tato sprava bola preverena antivirusovym systemom NOD32.
                            > http://www.eset.sk
                            >
                            >
                          • Armata, Joseph R. (JArmata)
                            Hi Vlad! The Ethnographic Atlas of Slovakia has a map for terms for parents-in-law. Looking at it closely, svokor/svokra is by far the most common, it blankets
                            Message 13 of 20 , Dec 6, 2003
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                              Hi Vlad! The Ethnographic Atlas of Slovakia has a map for terms
                              for parents-in-law.

                              Looking at it closely, svokor/svokra is by far the most common,
                              it blankets the country, with other terms marked as smaller areas
                              all over the place.

                              Other terms are test/testina, svat/svacha, svagor/svagrina,
                              apos/anos (Hungarian areas), ipamuram/napamason (Hungarian
                              areas), svigerfater/svigermuter (German areas); quite a few areas
                              are marked as having no special terms for parents-in-law - I
                              guess some things are just not discussed there :^)!

                              It looks like svagor/svagrina is used marked for
                              father-in-law/mother-in-law in an area to the east of Topolcany.
                              That usage is shown by blue stripes on the map, and it's really
                              hard to tell the blue stripes from the green stripes elsewhere,
                              but I think that's the only area with the blue stripes, so it
                              might be limited to there.

                              Joe


                              >
                              > Dear Joe,
                              > Svagor is the brother of my wife.
                              > Svokor and svokra are her parents.
                              > We had a joke:
                              > Show a photo of your svokra in a drug store and you can get any poison
                              > without prescription.
                              > They are very understandable people:-)
                              > Vladimir
                              >
                            • Vladimir Bohinc
                              Dear Joe, This matter is very complicated. I read about it now in the book Traditions of the slovak family and came to the conclusion, that for an individual,
                              Message 14 of 20 , Dec 7, 2003
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                                Dear Joe,
                                This matter is very complicated. I read about it now in the book Traditions
                                of the slovak family and came to the conclusion, that for an individual, it
                                is the best just to ask his relatives for the terms they are using.
                                These terms depend upon the geographical location, the time taken into
                                consideration and even the ethnicity of the family. Although, they are let
                                us say slovak families, in fact, many were of different ethnicities, which
                                have their own specifics.
                                And, of course, if you are using one term for a particular person, your
                                child can not use the same term, your wife can not use the same term etc.
                                This is when it gets complicated. What to remember and for who'se use?
                                The book says, that parents often were practicing using terms, that their
                                children were suppose to use, just to teach their own children of correct
                                terms.
                                So, when the mother said: " Ujo prisiel", it was an Ujo to the child, not to
                                her.
                                I read, that there about 35 to 40 such terms to be found on the territory of
                                Slovakia in different times.
                                In general, any strange man is an Ujo to the child.At least here, in Western
                                Slovakia.
                                Vladimir

                                ----- Original Message -----
                                From: "Armata, Joseph R. (JArmata)" <JArmata@...>
                                To: <SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com>
                                Sent: Sunday, December 07, 2003 3:02 AM
                                Subject: Re: [S-R] terms for family members


                                > Hi Vlad! The Ethnographic Atlas of Slovakia has a map for terms
                                > for parents-in-law.
                                >
                                > Looking at it closely, svokor/svokra is by far the most common,
                                > it blankets the country, with other terms marked as smaller areas
                                > all over the place.
                                >
                                > Other terms are test/testina, svat/svacha, svagor/svagrina,
                                > apos/anos (Hungarian areas), ipamuram/napamason (Hungarian
                                > areas), svigerfater/svigermuter (German areas); quite a few areas
                                > are marked as having no special terms for parents-in-law - I
                                > guess some things are just not discussed there :^)!
                                >
                                > It looks like svagor/svagrina is used marked for
                                > father-in-law/mother-in-law in an area to the east of Topolcany.
                                > That usage is shown by blue stripes on the map, and it's really
                                > hard to tell the blue stripes from the green stripes elsewhere,
                                > but I think that's the only area with the blue stripes, so it
                                > might be limited to there.
                                >
                                > Joe
                                >
                                >
                                > >
                                > > Dear Joe,
                                > > Svagor is the brother of my wife.
                                > > Svokor and svokra are her parents.
                                > > We had a joke:
                                > > Show a photo of your svokra in a drug store and you can get any poison
                                > > without prescription.
                                > > They are very understandable people:-)
                                > > Vladimir
                                > >
                                >
                                >
                                > To unsubscribe from this group, go to
                                http://www.yahoogroups.com/group/SLOVAK-ROOTS -or- send blank email to
                                SLOVAK-ROOTS-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                                >
                                > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                > __________ Informacia od NOD32 1.573 (20031205) __________
                                >
                                > Tato sprava bola preverena antivirusovym systemom NOD32.
                                > http://www.eset.sk
                                >
                                >
                              • nhasior@aol.com
                                Maybe all of these terms were for a very good purpose. Slovak children certainly knew what relationship each adult was to them. That they would be so
                                Message 15 of 20 , Dec 7, 2003
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                                  Maybe all of these terms were for a very good purpose. Slovak children
                                  certainly knew what relationship each adult was to them. That they would be so
                                  specific must have, at one time, been decided out of some sort of necessity.
                                  Noreen


                                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                • christopher gajda
                                  on photo s from my relatives in Uzhgorod they wrote the word sovgor to identify one man; I thought it might have been a misspelling of svogor but in his
                                  Message 16 of 20 , Dec 8, 2003
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                                    on photo's from my relatives in Uzhgorod they wrote the word "sovgor" to identify one man; I thought it might have been a misspelling of "svogor" but in his funeral pictures there is a wreath that has "shovgor" written in Cyrillic. Is this some kind of regional variation or is this an entirely different word?

                                    Vladimir Bohinc <konekta@...> wrote:Dear Joe,
                                    Svagor is the brother of my wife.
                                    Svokor and svokra are her parents.
                                    We had a joke:
                                    Show a photo of your svokra in a drug store and you can get any poison
                                    without prescription.
                                    They are very understandable people:-)
                                    Vladimir

                                    ----- Original Message -----
                                    From: "Armata, Joseph R. (JArmata)" <JArmata@...>
                                    To: <SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com>
                                    Sent: Saturday, December 06, 2003 3:36 AM
                                    Subject: Re: [S-R] terms for family members


                                    > Kinship terms are really complicated! The old Slavs seemed to
                                    > have a separate word for every sort of relationship; and the old
                                    > terms along with imports from German and Hungarian are often used
                                    > in different ways in different parts of the country.
                                    >
                                    > Unfortunately, s~vagor can be either: father-in-law or
                                    > brother-in-law, depending on local usage. For father-in-law, it
                                    > traditionally refers to the wife's parents, though it wouldn't be
                                    > surprising if it were used for the husband's father too
                                    > somewhere.
                                    >
                                    > Tyotka/tetka/tsetka and variations are general terms for aunt.
                                    >
                                    > Traditionally, terms based on stri-/stry- refer to uncles and
                                    > aunts on your father's side, while those with vuj-/uj- refer to
                                    > uncles and aunts on your mother's side.
                                    >
                                    > So striko and strina would be uncle and aunt respectively on the
                                    > father's side, while vuyko and vuyna would be the same on the
                                    > mother's side.
                                    >
                                    > Joe
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > > Does anyone know the precise relationship for "sovgor" (shovgor)? Based
                                    > > on some old photos and letters I had thoght "sovgor" meant
                                    > > brother-in-law, but recently some Russian exchange students told me
                                    > > "sovgor" was father-in-law.
                                    > >
                                    > > Recently someone had wrote about the terms used for various family
                                    > > members; in letters from Uzhgorod to my grandmother her neices who grew
                                    > > up in the Austro-Hungarian and Czechoslovak periods addressed her as
                                    > > "Tyutka" - but their children who grew up in USSR after WWII addressed
                                    > > my grandparents as "Strika i Strina". My grandmother sometimes used a
                                    > > word which sounded to me like "way-ka" for "uncle".
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > To unsubscribe from this group, go to
                                    http://www.yahoogroups.com/group/SLOVAK-ROOTS -or- send blank email to
                                    SLOVAK-ROOTS-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                                    >
                                    > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > __________ Informacia od NOD32 1.557 (20031114) __________
                                    >
                                    > Tato sprava bola preverena antivirusovym systemom NOD32.
                                    > http://www.eset.sk
                                    >
                                    >


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                                  • Vladimir Bohinc
                                    Dear Christopher, It is one of the two possibilities, where I would think, it rather means brother in law. But, to be sure, one would have to ask somebody,
                                    Message 17 of 20 , Dec 12, 2003
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                                      Dear Christopher,
                                      It is one of the two possibilities, where I would think, it rather means
                                      brother in law.
                                      But, to be sure, one would have to ask somebody, that is more acquainted
                                      with Rusyn terms of this sort.
                                      Vladimir

                                      ----- Original Message -----
                                      From: "christopher gajda" <christophergajda@...>
                                      To: <SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com>
                                      Sent: Monday, December 08, 2003 7:19 PM
                                      Subject: Re: [S-R] terms for family members


                                      > on photo's from my relatives in Uzhgorod they wrote the word "sovgor" to
                                      identify one man; I thought it might have been a misspelling of "svogor" but
                                      in his funeral pictures there is a wreath that has "shovgor" written in
                                      Cyrillic. Is this some kind of regional variation or is this an entirely
                                      different word?
                                      >
                                      > Vladimir Bohinc <konekta@...> wrote:Dear Joe,
                                      > Svagor is the brother of my wife.
                                      > Svokor and svokra are her parents.
                                      > We had a joke:
                                      > Show a photo of your svokra in a drug store and you can get any poison
                                      > without prescription.
                                      > They are very understandable people:-)
                                      > Vladimir
                                      >
                                      > ----- Original Message -----
                                      > From: "Armata, Joseph R. (JArmata)" <JArmata@...>
                                      > To: <SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com>
                                      > Sent: Saturday, December 06, 2003 3:36 AM
                                      > Subject: Re: [S-R] terms for family members
                                      >
                                      >
                                      > > Kinship terms are really complicated! The old Slavs seemed to
                                      > > have a separate word for every sort of relationship; and the old
                                      > > terms along with imports from German and Hungarian are often used
                                      > > in different ways in different parts of the country.
                                      > >
                                      > > Unfortunately, s~vagor can be either: father-in-law or
                                      > > brother-in-law, depending on local usage. For father-in-law, it
                                      > > traditionally refers to the wife's parents, though it wouldn't be
                                      > > surprising if it were used for the husband's father too
                                      > > somewhere.
                                      > >
                                      > > Tyotka/tetka/tsetka and variations are general terms for aunt.
                                      > >
                                      > > Traditionally, terms based on stri-/stry- refer to uncles and
                                      > > aunts on your father's side, while those with vuj-/uj- refer to
                                      > > uncles and aunts on your mother's side.
                                      > >
                                      > > So striko and strina would be uncle and aunt respectively on the
                                      > > father's side, while vuyko and vuyna would be the same on the
                                      > > mother's side.
                                      > >
                                      > > Joe
                                      > >
                                      > >
                                      > > > Does anyone know the precise relationship for "sovgor" (shovgor)?
                                      Based
                                      > > > on some old photos and letters I had thoght "sovgor" meant
                                      > > > brother-in-law, but recently some Russian exchange students told me
                                      > > > "sovgor" was father-in-law.
                                      > > >
                                      > > > Recently someone had wrote about the terms used for various family
                                      > > > members; in letters from Uzhgorod to my grandmother her neices who
                                      grew
                                      > > > up in the Austro-Hungarian and Czechoslovak periods addressed her as
                                      > > > "Tyutka" - but their children who grew up in USSR after WWII addressed
                                      > > > my grandparents as "Strika i Strina". My grandmother sometimes used
                                      a
                                      > > > word which sounded to me like "way-ka" for "uncle".
                                      > >
                                      > >
                                      > > To unsubscribe from this group, go to
                                      > http://www.yahoogroups.com/group/SLOVAK-ROOTS -or- send blank email to
                                      > SLOVAK-ROOTS-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
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                                    • marianne50614
                                      Thanks for this string of messages re: terms for grandparents, aunts and uncles. My cousins and I have been curious about the identity of a woman whose
                                      Message 18 of 20 , Dec 21, 2003
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                                        Thanks for this string of messages re: terms for grandparents, aunts
                                        and uncles. My cousins and I have been curious about the identity of
                                        a woman whose identity is listed on the back of her old photo
                                        as "Strina". The rest of the description we were unable to read
                                        (sadly, my generation didn't learn to read Slovak or Rusyn).

                                        Though my cousins and I share at least one great-great-grandfather
                                        (GGF), we had all heard different terms for "aunt" or "uncle", and
                                        the replies I've seen here have cleared up why they were different.
                                        (Our paternal ancestors are related to one another.)

                                        Question: How would one refer to their godparents? My mother
                                        referred to her godmother as "Nina" and her godfather as "Bacsi" (I'm
                                        not sure of the spelling; pronounced "bahch-ee", accent more on first
                                        syllable). She wasn't sure if these were actually the terms for
                                        godparents or more "terms of endearment" she was taught to use for
                                        them.

                                        MARIANNE


                                        --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com, "Vladimir Bohinc" <konekta@n...>
                                        wrote:
                                        > Dear Christopher,
                                        > It is one of the two possibilities, where I would think, it rather
                                        means
                                        > brother in law.
                                        > But, to be sure, one would have to ask somebody, that is more
                                        acquainted
                                        > with Rusyn terms of this sort.
                                        > Vladimir
                                        >
                                        > ----- Original Message -----
                                        > From: "christopher gajda" <christophergajda@y...>
                                        > To: <SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com>
                                        > Sent: Monday, December 08, 2003 7:19 PM
                                        > Subject: Re: [S-R] terms for family members
                                        >
                                        >
                                        > > on photo's from my relatives in Uzhgorod they wrote the
                                        word "sovgor" to
                                        > identify one man; I thought it might have been a misspelling
                                        of "svogor" but
                                        > in his funeral pictures there is a wreath that has "shovgor"
                                        written in
                                        > Cyrillic. Is this some kind of regional variation or is this an
                                        entirely
                                        > different word?
                                        > >
                                        > > Vladimir Bohinc <konekta@n...> wrote:Dear Joe,
                                        > > Svagor is the brother of my wife.
                                        > > Svokor and svokra are her parents.
                                        > > We had a joke:
                                        > > Show a photo of your svokra in a drug store and you can get any
                                        poison
                                        > > without prescription.
                                        > > They are very understandable people:-)
                                        > > Vladimir
                                        > >
                                        > > ----- Original Message -----
                                        > > From: "Armata, Joseph R. (JArmata)" <JArmata@g...>
                                        > > To: <SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com>
                                        > > Sent: Saturday, December 06, 2003 3:36 AM
                                        > > Subject: Re: [S-R] terms for family members
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > > > Kinship terms are really complicated! The old Slavs seemed to
                                        > > > have a separate word for every sort of relationship; and the old
                                        > > > terms along with imports from German and Hungarian are often
                                        used
                                        > > > in different ways in different parts of the country.
                                        > > >
                                        > > > Unfortunately, s~vagor can be either: father-in-law or
                                        > > > brother-in-law, depending on local usage. For father-in-law, it
                                        > > > traditionally refers to the wife's parents, though it wouldn't
                                        be
                                        > > > surprising if it were used for the husband's father too
                                        > > > somewhere.
                                        > > >
                                        > > > Tyotka/tetka/tsetka and variations are general terms for aunt.
                                        > > >
                                        > > > Traditionally, terms based on stri-/stry- refer to uncles and
                                        > > > aunts on your father's side, while those with vuj-/uj- refer to
                                        > > > uncles and aunts on your mother's side.
                                        > > >
                                        > > > So striko and strina would be uncle and aunt respectively on the
                                        > > > father's side, while vuyko and vuyna would be the same on the
                                        > > > mother's side.
                                        > > >
                                        > > > Joe
                                        > > >
                                        > > >
                                        > > > > Does anyone know the precise relationship for "sovgor"
                                        (shovgor)?
                                        > Based
                                        > > > > on some old photos and letters I had thoght "sovgor" meant
                                        > > > > brother-in-law, but recently some Russian exchange students
                                        told me
                                        > > > > "sovgor" was father-in-law.
                                        > > > >
                                        > > > > Recently someone had wrote about the terms used for various
                                        family
                                        > > > > members; in letters from Uzhgorod to my grandmother her
                                        neices who
                                        > grew
                                        > > > > up in the Austro-Hungarian and Czechoslovak periods addressed
                                        her as
                                        > > > > "Tyutka" - but their children who grew up in USSR after WWII
                                        addressed
                                        > > > > my grandparents as "Strika i Strina". My grandmother
                                        sometimes used
                                        > a
                                        > > > > word which sounded to me like "way-ka" for "uncle".
                                        > > >
                                        > > >
                                        > > > To unsubscribe from this group, go to
                                        > > http://www.yahoogroups.com/group/SLOVAK-ROOTS -or- send blank
                                        email to
                                        > > SLOVAK-ROOTS-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                                        > > >
                                        > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
                                        > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                                        > > >
                                        > > >
                                        > > >
                                        > > > __________ Informacia od NOD32 1.557 (20031114) __________
                                        > > >
                                        > > > Tato sprava bola preverena antivirusovym systemom NOD32.
                                        > > > http://www.eset.sk
                                        > > >
                                        > > >
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > > Yahoo! Groups SponsorADVERTISEMENT
                                        > >
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                                        > > http://www.eset.sk
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                      • William F Brna
                                        Stryna is the wife of Stryc who is a paternal uncle. She would be an aunt on the father s side. Godfather is Krstnyotec and godmother is Krstnamat .
                                        Message 19 of 20 , Dec 21, 2003
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                                          "Stryna" is the wife of "Stryc" who is a paternal uncle. She would be an
                                          aunt on the father's side. Godfather is "Krstnyotec" and godmother is
                                          "Krstnamat". My parents also used "Kmotor" for godfather, but I do not
                                          know the distinction, unless it referred to my mother's godfather as
                                          opposed to mine.

                                          William F. Brna

                                          On Sun, 21 Dec 2003 17:00:26 -0000 "marianne50614" <mmpetruska@...>
                                          writes:
                                          > Thanks for this string of messages re: terms for grandparents, aunts
                                          >
                                          > and uncles. My cousins and I have been curious about the identity
                                          > of
                                          > a woman whose identity is listed on the back of her old photo
                                          > as "Strina". The rest of the description we were unable to read
                                          > (sadly, my generation didn't learn to read Slovak or Rusyn).
                                          >
                                          > Though my cousins and I share at least one great-great-grandfather
                                          > (GGF), we had all heard different terms for "aunt" or "uncle", and
                                          > the replies I've seen here have cleared up why they were different.
                                          >
                                          > (Our paternal ancestors are related to one another.)
                                          >
                                          > Question: How would one refer to their godparents? My mother
                                          > referred to her godmother as "Nina" and her godfather as "Bacsi"
                                          > (I'm
                                          > not sure of the spelling; pronounced "bahch-ee", accent more on
                                          > first
                                          > syllable). She wasn't sure if these were actually the terms for
                                          > godparents or more "terms of endearment" she was taught to use for
                                          > them.
                                          >
                                          > MARIANNE
                                          >
                                          >
                                          > --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com, "Vladimir Bohinc"
                                          > <konekta@n...>
                                          > wrote:
                                          > > Dear Christopher,
                                          > > It is one of the two possibilities, where I would think, it rather
                                          >
                                          > means
                                          > > brother in law.
                                          > > But, to be sure, one would have to ask somebody, that is more
                                          > acquainted
                                          > > with Rusyn terms of this sort.
                                          > > Vladimir
                                          > >
                                          > > ----- Original Message -----
                                          > > From: "christopher gajda" <christophergajda@y...>
                                          > > To: <SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com>
                                          > > Sent: Monday, December 08, 2003 7:19 PM
                                          > > Subject: Re: [S-R] terms for family members
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > > > on photo's from my relatives in Uzhgorod they wrote the
                                          > word "sovgor" to
                                          > > identify one man; I thought it might have been a misspelling
                                          > of "svogor" but
                                          > > in his funeral pictures there is a wreath that has "shovgor"
                                          > written in
                                          > > Cyrillic. Is this some kind of regional variation or is this an
                                          > entirely
                                          > > different word?
                                          > > >
                                          > > > Vladimir Bohinc <konekta@n...> wrote:Dear Joe,
                                          > > > Svagor is the brother of my wife.
                                          > > > Svokor and svokra are her parents.
                                          > > > We had a joke:
                                          > > > Show a photo of your svokra in a drug store and you can get any
                                          >
                                          > poison
                                          > > > without prescription.
                                          > > > They are very understandable people:-)
                                          > > > Vladimir
                                          > > >
                                          > > > ----- Original Message -----
                                          > > > From: "Armata, Joseph R. (JArmata)" <JArmata@g...>
                                          > > > To: <SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com>
                                          > > > Sent: Saturday, December 06, 2003 3:36 AM
                                          > > > Subject: Re: [S-R] terms for family members
                                          > > >
                                          > > >
                                          > > > > Kinship terms are really complicated! The old Slavs seemed
                                          > to
                                          > > > > have a separate word for every sort of relationship; and the
                                          > old
                                          > > > > terms along with imports from German and Hungarian are often
                                          > used
                                          > > > > in different ways in different parts of the country.
                                          > > > >
                                          > > > > Unfortunately, s~vagor can be either: father-in-law or
                                          > > > > brother-in-law, depending on local usage. For father-in-law,
                                          > it
                                          > > > > traditionally refers to the wife's parents, though it wouldn't
                                          >
                                          > be
                                          > > > > surprising if it were used for the husband's father too
                                          > > > > somewhere.
                                          > > > >
                                          > > > > Tyotka/tetka/tsetka and variations are general terms for
                                          > aunt.
                                          > > > >
                                          > > > > Traditionally, terms based on stri-/stry- refer to uncles and
                                          > > > > aunts on your father's side, while those with vuj-/uj- refer
                                          > to
                                          > > > > uncles and aunts on your mother's side.
                                          > > > >
                                          > > > > So striko and strina would be uncle and aunt respectively on
                                          > the
                                          > > > > father's side, while vuyko and vuyna would be the same on the
                                          > > > > mother's side.
                                          > > > >
                                          > > > > Joe
                                          > > > >
                                          > > > >
                                          > > > > > Does anyone know the precise relationship for "sovgor"
                                          > (shovgor)?
                                          > > Based
                                          > > > > > on some old photos and letters I had thoght "sovgor" meant
                                          > > > > > brother-in-law, but recently some Russian exchange students
                                          >
                                          > told me
                                          > > > > > "sovgor" was father-in-law.
                                          > > > > >
                                          > > > > > Recently someone had wrote about the terms used for various
                                          >
                                          > family
                                          > > > > > members; in letters from Uzhgorod to my grandmother her
                                          > neices who
                                          > > grew
                                          > > > > > up in the Austro-Hungarian and Czechoslovak periods
                                          > addressed
                                          > her as
                                          > > > > > "Tyutka" - but their children who grew up in USSR after WWII
                                          >
                                          > addressed
                                          > > > > > my grandparents as "Strika i Strina". My grandmother
                                          > sometimes used
                                          > > a
                                          > > > > > word which sounded to me like "way-ka" for "uncle".
                                          > > > >
                                          > > > >
                                          > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, go to
                                          > > > http://www.yahoogroups.com/group/SLOVAK-ROOTS -or- send blank
                                          >
                                          > email to
                                          > > > SLOVAK-ROOTS-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
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                                          > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
                                          > > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                                          > > > >
                                          > > > >
                                          > > > >
                                          > > > > __________ Informacia od NOD32 1.557 (20031114) __________
                                          > > > >
                                          > > > > Tato sprava bola preverena antivirusovym systemom NOD32.
                                          > > > > http://www.eset.sk
                                          > > > >
                                          > > > >
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                                          > > >
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                                        • Milan Huba
                                          Since nobody answered your specific query, let my give you my impression. Cetka appears to be a variation of Tetka which means aunt. The pronunciation of
                                          Message 20 of 20 , Dec 22, 2003
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                                            Since nobody answered your specific query, let my give you my impression.
                                            "Cetka" appears to be a variation of "Tetka" which means aunt. The
                                            pronunciation of words vary from area to area. My father and his family came
                                            from central Slovakia (Liptov county) and my mother and her family from
                                            western Slovakia around Bratislava. They spoke a different brand of Slovak,
                                            sometimes pronouncing the very same work differently and other times using a
                                            totally different word to mean the same thing.

                                            -----Original Message-----
                                            From: Susan Friedhaber-Hard [mailto:barclaypenn@...]
                                            Sent: Friday, December 05, 2003 11:02 PM
                                            To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                                            Subject: Re: [S-R] terms for family members


                                            Funny, I remember everyone calling my Slovak great aunt: Cetka.
                                            Susan Friedhaber-Hard

                                            pewterj <pewterj@...> wrote:
                                            I remember calling my Slovak Aunt "Cetcie Annie". Does "Cetcie" mean
                                            Aunt? I'm new to this group so please excuse my ignorance! Thanks.
                                            Mary


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