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Re: surname gender affix -ova

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  • Frank
    One of most common Slavic surname affixes is the one denoting gender of the bearer -ová (Slovak), -owa (Polish), and -oba (Russian). As a rule of Slovak
    Message 1 of 18 , Mar 26, 2003
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      One of most common Slavic surname affixes is the one denoting gender
      of the bearer -ová (Slovak), -owa (Polish), and -oba (Russian).

      As a rule of Slovak grammar, female surnames end in -á, -ská, or -ová.
      The feminine form of the surnames is considered merely a separate form
      of same surname, not a distinct surname in itself.

      If the surname is adjectival in origin , i.e., ends in -y', the ending
      changes to -á, so that wife of pán (Mr.) C^erny' would be pani (pi)
      (Mrs.) C^erná and their daughter would be slec^na (sl) (Miss) C^erná
      If surname is a noun in form or origin the suffix -ová is added to it,
      e.g., pán Kovác^, pani Kovác^ová, and slec^na Kovác^ová.

      I reply to surname queries from all central and eastern European
      Slavic web sites.
      None permit Roll Calls, recipes, nor political points of view
      no matter how patriotic.

      Roll Calls interfer with proper archived surname indexing.
      Nobody reads Roll Calls except subscribers at a particular genealogy
      message board.
      Rootsweb.com has sent a warning out to all its listowners and
      administrators.
      No!

      Roll Call
      (hypothetical example)

      Am (not) researching
      ZILAVY, IVANOVA, KOLAROVICOVA, ABELOVICOVA
      from Austria-Hungary
      (and where are the dates or places of origin ?)
    • Marty
      Frank, does the affix kovic denote anything as in my name Jurkovic I have always wondered about that. Marty Frank wrote:One of most common
      Message 2 of 18 , Mar 26, 2003
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        Frank, does the affix kovic denote anything as in my name Jurkovic I have always wondered about that. Marty
        Frank <frankur@...> wrote:One of most common Slavic surname affixes is the one denoting gender
        of the bearer -ov� (Slovak), -owa (Polish), and -oba (Russian).

        As a rule of Slovak grammar, female surnames end in -�, -sk�, or -ov�.
        The feminine form of the surnames is considered merely a separate form
        of same surname, not a distinct surname in itself.

        If the surname is adjectival in origin , i.e., ends in -y', the ending
        changes to -�, so that wife of p�n (Mr.) C^erny' would be pani (pi)
        (Mrs.) C^ern� and their daughter would be slec^na (sl) (Miss) C^ern�
        If surname is a noun in form or origin the suffix -ov� is added to it,
        e.g., p�n Kov�c^, pani Kov�c^ov�, and slec^na Kov�c^ov�.

        I reply to surname queries from all central and eastern European
        Slavic web sites.
        None permit Roll Calls, recipes, nor political points of view
        no matter how patriotic.

        Roll Calls interfer with proper archived surname indexing.
        Nobody reads Roll Calls except subscribers at a particular genealogy
        message board.
        Rootsweb.com has sent a warning out to all its listowners and
        administrators.
        No!

        Roll Call
        (hypothetical example)

        Am (not) researching
        ZILAVY, IVANOVA, KOLAROVICOVA, ABELOVICOVA
        from Austria-Hungary
        (and where are the dates or places of origin ?)



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      • Karen Salay
        I am researching Salaj and Szalaj or Pitlak in Turzovka near Zilina Thanks karen
        Message 3 of 18 , Mar 26, 2003
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          I am researching Salaj and Szalaj or Pitlak in
          Turzovka near Zilina

          Thanks
          karen
        • McKee June
          Hi Frank, could you tell me would Boldizar and Bolga be one in the same? ... __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum
          Message 4 of 18 , Mar 26, 2003
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            Hi Frank,

            could you tell me would Boldizar and Bolga be one in
            the same?
            --- Frank <frankur@...> wrote:
            > One of most common Slavic surname affixes is the one
            > denoting gender
            > of the bearer -ov� (Slovak), -owa (Polish), and -oba
            > (Russian).
            >
            > As a rule of Slovak grammar, female surnames end in
            > -�, -sk�, or -ov�.
            > The feminine form of the surnames is considered
            > merely a separate form
            > of same surname, not a distinct surname in itself.
            >
            > If the surname is adjectival in origin , i.e., ends
            > in -y', the ending
            > changes to -�, so that wife of p�n (Mr.) C^erny'
            > would be pani (pi)
            > (Mrs.) C^ern� and their daughter would be slec^na
            > (sl) (Miss) C^ern�
            > If surname is a noun in form or origin the suffix
            > -ov� is added to it,
            > e.g., p�n Kov�c^, pani Kov�c^ov�, and slec^na
            > Kov�c^ov�.
            >
            > I reply to surname queries from all central and
            > eastern European
            > Slavic web sites.
            > None permit Roll Calls, recipes, nor political
            > points of view
            > no matter how patriotic.
            >
            > Roll Calls interfer with proper archived surname
            > indexing.
            > Nobody reads Roll Calls except subscribers at a
            > particular genealogy
            > message board.
            > Rootsweb.com has sent a warning out to all its
            > listowners and
            > administrators.
            > No!
            >
            > Roll Call
            > (hypothetical example)
            >
            > Am (not) researching
            > ZILAVY, IVANOVA, KOLAROVICOVA, ABELOVICOVA
            > from Austria-Hungary
            > (and where are the dates or places of origin ?)
            >
            >
            >


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          • Frank
            ... have always wondered about that. Marty Marty Yes. George (E) Georgius (L) György, Gyurko (H) Juraj, Jurko (Sk) Gjuro,D uro (Cr) Jurkovic^ (Jurkovich)
            Message 5 of 18 , Mar 27, 2003
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              --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com, Marty <halfslovak@y...> wrote:
              >
              > Frank, does the affix kovic denote anything as in my name Jurkovic I
              have always wondered about that. Marty

              Marty

              Yes.

              George (E)
              Georgius (L)
              György, Gyurko (H)
              Juraj, Jurko (Sk)
              Gjuro,D'uro (Cr)

              Jurkovic^ (Jurkovich) would mean 'son of George'.

              Hungarians had a surname ending -ics which was not native to Hungarian
              but a phonetic adaptation i.e. written -ics pron. ick.

              This was akin to South Slavic surname affix -ic'/-vic', -ovic' pron.
              ovich, meaning 'son of'.
              Similar to Polish surname affix -owicz or -owycz which is pronounced
              the same as and means the same thing as 'son of' (clan name) in
              Croatian.
              In Czech and Slovak, the surname affix -ovic^ also pron. ovich,
              meaning 'son of'.
              This special surname ending also has the same meaning in Russian.
            • Marty
              ... have always wondered about that. Marty Marty Yes. George (E) Georgius (L) György, Gyurko (H) Juraj, Jurko (Sk) Gjuro,D uro (Cr) Jurkovic^ (Jurkovich)
              Message 6 of 18 , Mar 27, 2003
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                Frank, thankyou very much for that information, and it s true , n some older papers I have of my Grandfathers it is written ics. My late father had told me he thought it may have been Magyar. Frank <frankur@...> wrote:--- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com, Marty <halfslovak@y...> wrote:
                >
                > Frank, does the affix kovic denote anything as in my name Jurkovic I
                have always wondered about that. Marty

                Marty

                Yes.

                George (E)
                Georgius (L)
                Gy�rgy, Gyurko (H)
                Juraj, Jurko (Sk)
                Gjuro,D'uro (Cr)

                Jurkovic^ (Jurkovich) would mean 'son of George'.

                Hungarians had a surname ending -ics which was not native to Hungarian
                but a phonetic adaptation i.e. written -ics pron. ick.

                This was akin to South Slavic surname affix -ic'/-vic', -ovic' pron.
                ovich, meaning 'son of'.
                Similar to Polish surname affix -owicz or -owycz which is pronounced
                the same as and means the same thing as 'son of' (clan name) in
                Croatian.
                In Czech and Slovak, the surname affix -ovic^ also pron. ovich,
                meaning 'son of'.
                This special surname ending also has the same meaning in Russian.



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              • Frank
                ... Boldizar and Bolga ? would be separate and distinct surnames found in Slovakia. You also had written Boldizar from Hungary emigrated via Ellis Island abt
                Message 7 of 18 , Mar 28, 2003
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                  --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com, McKee June <junemckee@y...>
                  wrote:
                  > Hi Frank,
                  >
                  > could you tell me would Boldizar and Bolga be one in
                  > the same?

                  Boldizar and Bolga ? would be separate and distinct surnames found in
                  Slovakia.
                  You also had written Boldizar from Hungary emigrated via Ellis Island
                  abt 1905 to 1907.

                  Some emigrants changed names after they had settled in the U.S.

                  The U.S. Social Security Death Index (SSDI) lists 63 surnames
                  Boldizar.
                  Were any related ?

                  The Ellis Island Records (EIR) list only 10 surnames Boldizar.

                  A Maria Boldizar, age 21, Magyar, emigrated to the U.S. via
                  Ellis Island (NYC) in 1907.
                  She went to her husband Josef Boldizar in NYC.
                  She was born in Tarcaszentpéter, Hungary which was Petrovany (Sk)
                  located in eastern Slovakia.

                  A Dezso" (H) (no English equivalent) Boldizar, age 23, married,
                  Magyar, emigrated in 1905 via Ellis Island.
                  He went to his brother-in-law a Peter Peidel.
                  He was accompanied by a another surname Peidel who was a cousin
                  of Peter.
                  Both surnames were from Ugod which was located in Veszprém megye
                  (county, Hungary.

                  Several female surnames Boldizarová emigrated from Kl'ac^no (Sk)
                  Nyitrafo" (H) in 1921.

                  Several surnames Bolgacs also emigrated from Hungary.
                  Bolgacs was a Hungarian spelling.

                  Would conclude the surname Bolgács was a Hungarian surname.
                  (Magyar letter 'cs' is pron. ch)
                  The surname is now found in Slovakia spelled as Bolgác^ (Bolgach)
                  and Bolgác^ová (feminine gender form)
                  This is consistent with a transliteration using Slovak diacritic
                  letters (which Hungarian doesn't use)
                  (Slovak letter 'c^' is pron. ch)

                  The Hungarian surname Bolkdizár is now found in both western and
                  eastern Slovakia spelled as Boldiz^ár/Boldiz^árová.
                  (Slovak letter 'z^' is pron. zh)
                • McKee June
                  Hi Frank, I am just wondering if there was a mistake made or either my grandmother had a stepfather. On all of the paperwork that we have ever seen which hasnt
                  Message 8 of 18 , Mar 28, 2003
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                    Hi Frank,

                    I am just wondering if there was a mistake made or
                    either my grandmother had a stepfather. On all of the
                    paperwork that we have ever seen which hasnt been too
                    much her maiden name was boldizar. I ordered her death
                    certificate and it told me that her fathers name was
                    Joseph bolga. I sent several months for her
                    immigration papers which I am waiting for and that
                    should give me much more information beings she would
                    have been the person giving the information. My
                    grandfather gave the information on the death
                    certificate when she died.

                    As far as the Maria Boldizar age 21 , I know that she
                    was only 16 and was not married till she got to new
                    york then met my grandfather which is a Joseph Kolina.
                    Strange her name is Mary.

                    I have looked over the ellis Island in the past but
                    not too recently for her name and none of them could
                    have been her because of the dates. I am going to take
                    another close look at it again and see if anything has
                    been added. I guess I have just been hoping that the
                    immigration papers I am waiting for will tell me what
                    I need to know.

                    thank you for your help as in the past. You are a
                    great wealth of good information. I enjoy reading what
                    you post because I always seem to learn something from
                    what you write.

                    thanks,
                    June
                    --- Frank <frankur@...> wrote:
                    > --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com, McKee June
                    > <junemckee@y...>
                    > wrote:
                    > > Hi Frank,
                    > >
                    > > could you tell me would Boldizar and Bolga be one
                    > in
                    > > the same?
                    >
                    > Boldizar and Bolga ? would be separate and distinct
                    > surnames found in
                    > Slovakia.
                    > You also had written Boldizar from Hungary emigrated
                    > via Ellis Island
                    > abt 1905 to 1907.
                    >
                    > Some emigrants changed names after they had settled
                    > in the U.S.
                    >
                    > The U.S. Social Security Death Index (SSDI) lists 63
                    > surnames
                    > Boldizar.
                    > Were any related ?
                    >
                    > The Ellis Island Records (EIR) list only 10 surnames
                    > Boldizar.
                    >
                    > A Maria Boldizar, age 21, Magyar, emigrated to the
                    > U.S. via
                    > Ellis Island (NYC) in 1907.
                    > She went to her husband Josef Boldizar in NYC.
                    > She was born in Tarcaszentp�ter, Hungary which was
                    > Petrovany (Sk)
                    > located in eastern Slovakia.
                    >
                    > A Dezso" (H) (no English equivalent) Boldizar, age
                    > 23, married,
                    > Magyar, emigrated in 1905 via Ellis Island.
                    > He went to his brother-in-law a Peter Peidel.
                    > He was accompanied by a another surname Peidel who
                    > was a cousin
                    > of Peter.
                    > Both surnames were from Ugod which was located in
                    > Veszpr�m megye
                    > (county, Hungary.
                    >
                    > Several female surnames Boldizarov� emigrated from
                    > Kl'ac^no (Sk)
                    > Nyitrafo" (H) in 1921.
                    >
                    > Several surnames Bolgacs also emigrated from
                    > Hungary.
                    > Bolgacs was a Hungarian spelling.
                    >
                    > Would conclude the surname Bolg�cs was a Hungarian
                    > surname.
                    > (Magyar letter 'cs' is pron. ch)
                    > The surname is now found in Slovakia spelled as
                    > Bolg�c^ (Bolgach)
                    > and Bolg�c^ov� (feminine gender form)
                    > This is consistent with a transliteration using
                    > Slovak diacritic
                    > letters (which Hungarian doesn't use)
                    > (Slovak letter 'c^' is pron. ch)
                    >
                    > The Hungarian surname Bolkdiz�r is now found in both
                    > western and
                    > eastern Slovakia spelled as Boldiz^�r/Boldiz^�rov�.
                    > (Slovak letter 'z^' is pron. zh)
                    >
                    >
                    >


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                  • William F Brna
                    June, May I suggest that you try every possible spelling combination of your grandmother s name in the EI records? I had tried to find my father s record ever
                    Message 9 of 18 , Mar 29, 2003
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                      June,

                      May I suggest that you try every possible spelling combination of your
                      grandmother's name in the EI records? I had tried to find my father's
                      record ever since Ellis Island went on line. I found my uncle's record
                      but could not find my father's. Last week,after reviewing the soundex
                      records for NY arrivals, I found my uncle's record twice, once spelled
                      "Brna" and once spelled "Brua". It was the same record but when the
                      soundex list was compiled, it was read properly once and once in error.
                      His first name was Tomas and it was recorded as "Jamas". In reviewing
                      the soundex record, I found 9 people whose surname was "Brna" (none of
                      them my father) and three in which the surname was spelled "Brno". These
                      were three children. I then went back to the Ellis Island records, using
                      the spelling "Brno" and found my father's record. You must remember that
                      many of the people who came through Ellis Island may have been
                      illiterate, to some degree, and the immigration authorities were not all
                      that great when it came to recording Central European names, nor were
                      they able to read properly what an immigrant may have written.

                      Bill Brna

                      On Fri, 28 Mar 2003 22:07:33 -0800 (PST) McKee June <junemckee@...>
                      writes:
                      > Hi Frank,
                      >
                      > I am just wondering if there was a mistake made or
                      > either my grandmother had a stepfather. On all of the
                      > paperwork that we have ever seen which hasnt been too
                      > much her maiden name was boldizar. I ordered her death
                      > certificate and it told me that her fathers name was
                      > Joseph bolga. I sent several months for her
                      > immigration papers which I am waiting for and that
                      > should give me much more information beings she would
                      > have been the person giving the information. My
                      > grandfather gave the information on the death
                      > certificate when she died.
                      >
                      > As far as the Maria Boldizar age 21 , I know that she
                      > was only 16 and was not married till she got to new
                      > york then met my grandfather which is a Joseph Kolina.
                      > Strange her name is Mary.
                      >
                      > I have looked over the ellis Island in the past but
                      > not too recently for her name and none of them could
                      > have been her because of the dates. I am going to take
                      > another close look at it again and see if anything has
                      > been added. I guess I have just been hoping that the
                      > immigration papers I am waiting for will tell me what
                      > I need to know.
                      >
                      > thank you for your help as in the past. You are a
                      > great wealth of good information. I enjoy reading what
                      > you post because I always seem to learn something from
                      > what you write.
                      >
                      > thanks,
                      > June
                      > --- Frank <frankur@...> wrote:
                      > > --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com, McKee June
                      > > <junemckee@y...>
                      > > wrote:
                      > > > Hi Frank,
                      > > >
                      > > > could you tell me would Boldizar and Bolga be one
                      > > in
                      > > > the same?
                      > >
                      > > Boldizar and Bolga ? would be separate and distinct
                      > > surnames found in
                      > > Slovakia.
                      > > You also had written Boldizar from Hungary emigrated
                      > > via Ellis Island
                      > > abt 1905 to 1907.
                      > >
                      > > Some emigrants changed names after they had settled
                      > > in the U.S.
                      > >
                      > > The U.S. Social Security Death Index (SSDI) lists 63
                      > > surnames
                      > > Boldizar.
                      > > Were any related ?
                      > >
                      > > The Ellis Island Records (EIR) list only 10 surnames
                      > > Boldizar.
                      > >
                      > > A Maria Boldizar, age 21, Magyar, emigrated to the
                      > > U.S. via
                      > > Ellis Island (NYC) in 1907.
                      > > She went to her husband Josef Boldizar in NYC.
                      > > She was born in Tarcaszentpiter, Hungary which was
                      > > Petrovany (Sk)
                      > > located in eastern Slovakia.
                      > >
                      > > A Dezso" (H) (no English equivalent) Boldizar, age
                      > > 23, married,
                      > > Magyar, emigrated in 1905 via Ellis Island.
                      > > He went to his brother-in-law a Peter Peidel.
                      > > He was accompanied by a another surname Peidel who
                      > > was a cousin
                      > > of Peter.
                      > > Both surnames were from Ugod which was located in
                      > > Veszprim megye
                      > > (county, Hungary.
                      > >
                      > > Several female surnames Boldizarova emigrated from
                      > > Kl'ac^no (Sk)
                      > > Nyitrafo" (H) in 1921.
                      > >
                      > > Several surnames Bolgacs also emigrated from
                      > > Hungary.
                      > > Bolgacs was a Hungarian spelling.
                      > >
                      > > Would conclude the surname Bolgacs was a Hungarian
                      > > surname.
                      > > (Magyar letter 'cs' is pron. ch)
                      > > The surname is now found in Slovakia spelled as
                      > > Bolgac^ (Bolgach)
                      > > and Bolgac^ova (feminine gender form)
                      > > This is consistent with a transliteration using
                      > > Slovak diacritic
                      > > letters (which Hungarian doesn't use)
                      > > (Slovak letter 'c^' is pron. ch)
                      > >
                      > > The Hungarian surname Bolkdizar is now found in both
                      > > western and
                      > > eastern Slovakia spelled as Boldiz^ar/Boldiz^arova.
                      > > (Slovak letter 'z^' is pron. zh)
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      >
                      >
                      > __________________________________________________
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                    • McKee June
                      William, thanks for the information I will look at it again. I believe that is what has happened with my grandfathers name Kolina as I think we may have found
                      Message 10 of 18 , Mar 29, 2003
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                        William,
                        thanks for the information I will look at it again. I
                        believe that is what has happened with my grandfathers
                        name Kolina as I think we may have found him but it is
                        spelled Kulina. Paul had found this for me in december
                        and I didnt think it was him till a month or so ago
                        when I really took a good look at it and I do beleive
                        it could be my grandfather. That is the ship manifest
                        that I had sent for and did not get anymore
                        information from them than what ellis island gives
                        you. I need to get more to know if it is him or not
                        such as his parents names which I was hoping to get
                        but didnt. I have them from his death certificate but
                        really want to know if the ship mainfest with the name
                        kulina is him.

                        thanks for the information
                        June
                        --- William F Brna <wfbrna@...> wrote:
                        > June,
                        >
                        > May I suggest that you try every possible spelling
                        > combination of your
                        > grandmother's name in the EI records? I had tried
                        > to find my father's
                        > record ever since Ellis Island went on line. I
                        > found my uncle's record
                        > but could not find my father's. Last week,after
                        > reviewing the soundex
                        > records for NY arrivals, I found my uncle's record
                        > twice, once spelled
                        > "Brna" and once spelled "Brua". It was the same
                        > record but when the
                        > soundex list was compiled, it was read properly once
                        > and once in error.
                        > His first name was Tomas and it was recorded as
                        > "Jamas". In reviewing
                        > the soundex record, I found 9 people whose surname
                        > was "Brna" (none of
                        > them my father) and three in which the surname was
                        > spelled "Brno". These
                        > were three children. I then went back to the Ellis
                        > Island records, using
                        > the spelling "Brno" and found my father's record.
                        > You must remember that
                        > many of the people who came through Ellis Island may
                        > have been
                        > illiterate, to some degree, and the immigration
                        > authorities were not all
                        > that great when it came to recording Central
                        > European names, nor were
                        > they able to read properly what an immigrant may
                        > have written.
                        >
                        > Bill Brna
                        >
                        > On Fri, 28 Mar 2003 22:07:33 -0800 (PST) McKee June
                        > <junemckee@...>
                        > writes:
                        > > Hi Frank,
                        > >
                        > > I am just wondering if there was a mistake made or
                        > > either my grandmother had a stepfather. On all of
                        > the
                        > > paperwork that we have ever seen which hasnt been
                        > too
                        > > much her maiden name was boldizar. I ordered her
                        > death
                        > > certificate and it told me that her fathers name
                        > was
                        > > Joseph bolga. I sent several months for her
                        > > immigration papers which I am waiting for and that
                        > > should give me much more information beings she
                        > would
                        > > have been the person giving the information. My
                        > > grandfather gave the information on the death
                        > > certificate when she died.
                        > >
                        > > As far as the Maria Boldizar age 21 , I know that
                        > she
                        > > was only 16 and was not married till she got to
                        > new
                        > > york then met my grandfather which is a Joseph
                        > Kolina.
                        > > Strange her name is Mary.
                        > >
                        > > I have looked over the ellis Island in the past
                        > but
                        > > not too recently for her name and none of them
                        > could
                        > > have been her because of the dates. I am going to
                        > take
                        > > another close look at it again and see if anything
                        > has
                        > > been added. I guess I have just been hoping that
                        > the
                        > > immigration papers I am waiting for will tell me
                        > what
                        > > I need to know.
                        > >
                        > > thank you for your help as in the past. You are a
                        > > great wealth of good information. I enjoy reading
                        > what
                        > > you post because I always seem to learn something
                        > from
                        > > what you write.
                        > >
                        > > thanks,
                        > > June
                        > > --- Frank <frankur@...> wrote:
                        > > > --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com, McKee June
                        > > > <junemckee@y...>
                        > > > wrote:
                        > > > > Hi Frank,
                        > > > >
                        > > > > could you tell me would Boldizar and Bolga be
                        > one
                        > > > in
                        > > > > the same?
                        > > >
                        > > > Boldizar and Bolga ? would be separate and
                        > distinct
                        > > > surnames found in
                        > > > Slovakia.
                        > > > You also had written Boldizar from Hungary
                        > emigrated
                        > > > via Ellis Island
                        > > > abt 1905 to 1907.
                        > > >
                        > > > Some emigrants changed names after they had
                        > settled
                        > > > in the U.S.
                        > > >
                        > > > The U.S. Social Security Death Index (SSDI)
                        > lists 63
                        > > > surnames
                        > > > Boldizar.
                        > > > Were any related ?
                        > > >
                        > > > The Ellis Island Records (EIR) list only 10
                        > surnames
                        > > > Boldizar.
                        > > >
                        > > > A Maria Boldizar, age 21, Magyar, emigrated to
                        > the
                        > > > U.S. via
                        > > > Ellis Island (NYC) in 1907.
                        > > > She went to her husband Josef Boldizar in NYC.
                        > > > She was born in Tarcaszentpiter, Hungary which
                        > was
                        > > > Petrovany (Sk)
                        > > > located in eastern Slovakia.
                        > > >
                        > > > A Dezso" (H) (no English equivalent) Boldizar,
                        > age
                        > > > 23, married,
                        > > > Magyar, emigrated in 1905 via Ellis Island.
                        > > > He went to his brother-in-law a Peter Peidel.
                        > > > He was accompanied by a another surname Peidel
                        > who
                        > > > was a cousin
                        > > > of Peter.
                        > > > Both surnames were from Ugod which was located
                        > in
                        > > > Veszprim megye
                        > > > (county, Hungary.
                        > > >
                        > > > Several female surnames Boldizarova emigrated
                        > from
                        > > > Kl'ac^no (Sk)
                        > > > Nyitrafo" (H) in 1921.
                        > > >
                        > > > Several surnames Bolgacs also emigrated from
                        > > > Hungary.
                        > > > Bolgacs was a Hungarian spelling.
                        > > >
                        > > > Would conclude the surname Bolgacs was a
                        > Hungarian
                        > > > surname.
                        > > > (Magyar letter 'cs' is pron. ch)
                        > > > The surname is now found in Slovakia spelled as
                        > > > Bolgac^ (Bolgach)
                        > > > and Bolgac^ova (feminine gender form)
                        > > > This is consistent with a transliteration using
                        > > > Slovak diacritic
                        > > > letters (which Hungarian doesn't use)
                        > > > (Slovak letter 'c^' is pron. ch)
                        > > >
                        > > > The Hungarian surname Bolkdizar is now found in
                        > both
                        > > > western and
                        > > > eastern Slovakia spelled as
                        > Boldiz^ar/Boldiz^arova.
                        > > > (Slovak letter 'z^' is pron. zh)
                        > > >
                        > > >
                        > > >
                        > >
                        > >
                        > > __________________________________________________
                        > > Do you Yahoo!?
                        > > Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness,
                        > live on your
                        > > desktop!
                        > > http://platinum.yahoo.com
                        > >
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                        > >
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                        > > http://www.yahoogroups.com/group/SLOVAK-ROOTS
                        > -or- send blank
                        > > email to SLOVAK-ROOTS-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                        > >
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                        > > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
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                        > >
                        > >
                        >
                        >
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                      • Bruce Morrison
                        I would appreciate any help on 2 issues: 1. In the research I have done on Slovenia, it talked about the original inhabitants were Slavic people who spoke
                        Message 11 of 18 , Mar 29, 2003
                        • 0 Attachment
                          I would appreciate any help on 2 issues:

                          1. In the research I have done on Slovenia, it talked about the original
                          inhabitants were Slavic people who spoke Slovenian around 500A.D. Where
                          were these Slovenes from and were Slovaks and Slovenians from these same
                          first Slavic people?

                          2. How do you pronounce the Slovenian given name "Janez"?

                          Thanks much!

                          Bruce



                          -----Original Message-----
                          From: Frank [mailto:frankur@...]
                          Sent: Thursday, March 27, 2003 9:16 AM
                          To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                          Subject: [S-R] Re: surname gender affix -ova


                          --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com, Marty <halfslovak@y...> wrote:
                          >
                          > Frank, does the affix kovic denote anything as in my name Jurkovic I
                          have always wondered about that. Marty

                          Marty

                          Yes.

                          George (E)
                          Georgius (L)
                          György, Gyurko (H)
                          Juraj, Jurko (Sk)
                          Gjuro,D'uro (Cr)

                          Jurkovic^ (Jurkovich) would mean 'son of George'.

                          Hungarians had a surname ending -ics which was not native to Hungarian
                          but a phonetic adaptation i.e. written -ics pron. ick.

                          This was akin to South Slavic surname affix -ic'/-vic', -ovic' pron.
                          ovich, meaning 'son of'.
                          Similar to Polish surname affix -owicz or -owycz which is pronounced
                          the same as and means the same thing as 'son of' (clan name) in
                          Croatian.
                          In Czech and Slovak, the surname affix -ovic^ also pron. ovich,
                          meaning 'son of'.
                          This special surname ending also has the same meaning in Russian.



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                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        • John M,
                          ... If it is the Kulina that arrived in 1902, he was, I believe, from Presov. The manifest shows him coming from Efserics but it looks more like Eperies which
                          Message 12 of 18 , Mar 29, 2003
                          • 0 Attachment
                            At 08:04 AM 3/29/2003 -0800, you wrote:
                            >William,
                            >thanks for the information I will look at it again. I
                            >believe that is what has happened with my grandfathers
                            >name Kolina as I think we may have found him but it is
                            >spelled Kulina.

                            If it is the Kulina that arrived in 1902, he was, I believe, from
                            Presov. The manifest shows him coming from Efserics but it looks more like
                            Eperies which was one of the names for Presov. The name listed for Presov
                            for the period 1863-1913 was Eperjes. The two sound quite a bit alike so
                            it could have been an error on the part of the clerk that entered it.

                            you. I need to get more to know if it is him or not
                            >such as his parents names which I was hoping to get
                            >but didnt. I have them from his death certificate but
                            >really want to know if the ship mainfest with the name
                            >kulina is him.

                            Does the age come close to what you know of him? The LDS have the
                            microfilms for Presov:

                            http://www.familysearch.org/Eng/Library/fhlcatalog/supermainframeset.asp?display=localitydetails&subject=64226&subject_disp=Slovakia,_Presov&columns=*,180,0

                            You might be able to find him in the church birth records based on his name
                            and age. Do you know what religion he practiced? The manifest indicates
                            he was born about 1876. I had a hard time finding my father in the EIDB
                            because they transcribed a "c" to an "e" in his surname and my wife's
                            grandfather because an "f" was transcribed as an "s". Good luck.

                            John M
                          • McKee June
                            the age would work out to be exactly right beings he was born march 1886. It also looks to me like the ocpuation says butcher, which he was. He also had a twin
                            Message 13 of 18 , Mar 29, 2003
                            • 0 Attachment
                              the age would work out to be exactly right beings he
                              was born march 1886. It also looks to me like the
                              ocpuation says butcher, which he was. He also had a
                              twin brother which I dont know what his name was but
                              looks as he was going to meet up with a brother.

                              June
                              --- "John M," <jmatsko4@...> wrote:
                              > At 08:04 AM 3/29/2003 -0800, you wrote:
                              > >William,
                              > >thanks for the information I will look at it again.
                              > I
                              > >believe that is what has happened with my
                              > grandfathers
                              > >name Kolina as I think we may have found him but it
                              > is
                              > >spelled Kulina.
                              >
                              > If it is the Kulina that arrived in 1902, he was, I
                              > believe, from
                              > Presov. The manifest shows him coming from Efserics
                              > but it looks more like
                              > Eperies which was one of the names for Presov. The
                              > name listed for Presov
                              > for the period 1863-1913 was Eperjes. The two sound
                              > quite a bit alike so
                              > it could have been an error on the part of the clerk
                              > that entered it.
                              >
                              > you. I need to get more to know if it is him or not
                              > >such as his parents names which I was hoping to get
                              > >but didnt. I have them from his death certificate
                              > but
                              > >really want to know if the ship mainfest with the
                              > name
                              > >kulina is him.
                              >
                              > Does the age come close to what you know of him?
                              > The LDS have the
                              > microfilms for Presov:
                              >
                              >
                              http://www.familysearch.org/Eng/Library/fhlcatalog/supermainframeset.asp?display=localitydetails&subject=64226&subject_disp=Slovakia,_Presov&columns=*,180,0
                              >
                              > You might be able to find him in the church birth
                              > records based on his name
                              > and age. Do you know what religion he practiced?
                              > The manifest indicates
                              > he was born about 1876. I had a hard time finding
                              > my father in the EIDB
                              > because they transcribed a "c" to an "e" in his
                              > surname and my wife's
                              > grandfather because an "f" was transcribed as an
                              > "s". Good luck.
                              >
                              > John M
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >


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                            • Stephanie M
                              Just a note about a little luck I had on ellis island. Try a sibling. I could not for the life of me find my g g grandmother-but when I looked up one of her
                              Message 14 of 18 , Mar 29, 2003
                              • 0 Attachment
                                Just a note about a little luck I had on ellis island.
                                Try a sibling.
                                I could not for the life of me find my g g grandmother-but when I looked up
                                one of her children's names-it came up-
                                she came over here with 3 of her children to join her husband

                                1st of all she was listed under her maiden name-and on the ei they spelled
                                it incorrectly-but her children came under their father's name-and I found
                                them without any difficulty which of course meant that I found her as well.






                                >From: William F Brna <wfbrna@...>
                                >Reply-To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                                >To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                                >Subject: Re: [S-R] Re: surname gender affix -ova
                                >Date: Sat, 29 Mar 2003 07:58:09 -0500
                                >
                                >June,
                                >
                                >May I suggest that you try every possible spelling combination of your
                                >grandmother's name in the EI records? I had tried to find my father's
                                >record ever since Ellis Island went on line. I found my uncle's record
                                >but could not find my father's. Last week,after reviewing the soundex
                                >records for NY arrivals, I found my uncle's record twice, once spelled
                                >"Brna" and once spelled "Brua". It was the same record but when the
                                >soundex list was compiled, it was read properly once and once in error.
                                >His first name was Tomas and it was recorded as "Jamas". In reviewing
                                >the soundex record, I found 9 people whose surname was "Brna" (none of
                                >them my father) and three in which the surname was spelled "Brno". These
                                >were three children. I then went back to the Ellis Island records, using
                                >the spelling "Brno" and found my father's record. You must remember that
                                >many of the people who came through Ellis Island may have been
                                >illiterate, to some degree, and the immigration authorities were not all
                                >that great when it came to recording Central European names, nor were
                                >they able to read properly what an immigrant may have written.
                                >
                                >Bill Brna
                                >
                                >On Fri, 28 Mar 2003 22:07:33 -0800 (PST) McKee June <junemckee@...>
                                >writes:
                                > > Hi Frank,
                                > >
                                > > I am just wondering if there was a mistake made or
                                > > either my grandmother had a stepfather. On all of the
                                > > paperwork that we have ever seen which hasnt been too
                                > > much her maiden name was boldizar. I ordered her death
                                > > certificate and it told me that her fathers name was
                                > > Joseph bolga. I sent several months for her
                                > > immigration papers which I am waiting for and that
                                > > should give me much more information beings she would
                                > > have been the person giving the information. My
                                > > grandfather gave the information on the death
                                > > certificate when she died.
                                > >
                                > > As far as the Maria Boldizar age 21 , I know that she
                                > > was only 16 and was not married till she got to new
                                > > york then met my grandfather which is a Joseph Kolina.
                                > > Strange her name is Mary.
                                > >
                                > > I have looked over the ellis Island in the past but
                                > > not too recently for her name and none of them could
                                > > have been her because of the dates. I am going to take
                                > > another close look at it again and see if anything has
                                > > been added. I guess I have just been hoping that the
                                > > immigration papers I am waiting for will tell me what
                                > > I need to know.
                                > >
                                > > thank you for your help as in the past. You are a
                                > > great wealth of good information. I enjoy reading what
                                > > you post because I always seem to learn something from
                                > > what you write.
                                > >
                                > > thanks,
                                > > June
                                > > --- Frank <frankur@...> wrote:
                                > > > --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com, McKee June
                                > > > <junemckee@y...>
                                > > > wrote:
                                > > > > Hi Frank,
                                > > > >
                                > > > > could you tell me would Boldizar and Bolga be one
                                > > > in
                                > > > > the same?
                                > > >
                                > > > Boldizar and Bolga ? would be separate and distinct
                                > > > surnames found in
                                > > > Slovakia.
                                > > > You also had written Boldizar from Hungary emigrated
                                > > > via Ellis Island
                                > > > abt 1905 to 1907.
                                > > >
                                > > > Some emigrants changed names after they had settled
                                > > > in the U.S.
                                > > >
                                > > > The U.S. Social Security Death Index (SSDI) lists 63
                                > > > surnames
                                > > > Boldizar.
                                > > > Were any related ?
                                > > >
                                > > > The Ellis Island Records (EIR) list only 10 surnames
                                > > > Boldizar.
                                > > >
                                > > > A Maria Boldizar, age 21, Magyar, emigrated to the
                                > > > U.S. via
                                > > > Ellis Island (NYC) in 1907.
                                > > > She went to her husband Josef Boldizar in NYC.
                                > > > She was born in Tarcaszentpiter, Hungary which was
                                > > > Petrovany (Sk)
                                > > > located in eastern Slovakia.
                                > > >
                                > > > A Dezso" (H) (no English equivalent) Boldizar, age
                                > > > 23, married,
                                > > > Magyar, emigrated in 1905 via Ellis Island.
                                > > > He went to his brother-in-law a Peter Peidel.
                                > > > He was accompanied by a another surname Peidel who
                                > > > was a cousin
                                > > > of Peter.
                                > > > Both surnames were from Ugod which was located in
                                > > > Veszprim megye
                                > > > (county, Hungary.
                                > > >
                                > > > Several female surnames Boldizarova emigrated from
                                > > > Kl'ac^no (Sk)
                                > > > Nyitrafo" (H) in 1921.
                                > > >
                                > > > Several surnames Bolgacs also emigrated from
                                > > > Hungary.
                                > > > Bolgacs was a Hungarian spelling.
                                > > >
                                > > > Would conclude the surname Bolgacs was a Hungarian
                                > > > surname.
                                > > > (Magyar letter 'cs' is pron. ch)
                                > > > The surname is now found in Slovakia spelled as
                                > > > Bolgac^ (Bolgach)
                                > > > and Bolgac^ova (feminine gender form)
                                > > > This is consistent with a transliteration using
                                > > > Slovak diacritic
                                > > > letters (which Hungarian doesn't use)
                                > > > (Slovak letter 'c^' is pron. ch)
                                > > >
                                > > > The Hungarian surname Bolkdizar is now found in both
                                > > > western and
                                > > > eastern Slovakia spelled as Boldiz^ar/Boldiz^arova.
                                > > > (Slovak letter 'z^' is pron. zh)
                                > > >
                                > > >
                                > > >
                                > >
                                > >
                                > > __________________________________________________
                                > > Do you Yahoo!?
                                > > Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your
                                > > desktop!
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                                > >
                                > > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
                                > >
                                > > To unsubscribe from this group, go to
                                > > http://www.yahoogroups.com/group/SLOVAK-ROOTS -or- send blank
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                                > >
                                > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
                                > > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
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                                > >
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                              • Marianne50614@netscape.net
                                I always look at the Ellis Island info for children. I know some of my ancestors/relatives came to the U.S. as children, and knowing that, I look at those
                                Message 15 of 18 , Mar 30, 2003
                                • 0 Attachment
                                  I always look at the Ellis Island info for children. I know some of my ancestors/relatives came to the U.S. as children, and knowing that, I look at those too. Like Stephanie's case, the children's mother was listed under her maiden name, but the info on to whom these children and their mother were going gave me info on other relatives who were already here.

                                  "Stephanie M" <czeching@...> wrote:

                                  >Just a note about a little luck I had on ellis island.
                                  >Try a sibling.
                                  >I could not for the life of me find my g g grandmother-but when I looked up
                                  >one of her children's names-it came up-
                                  >she came over here with 3 of her children to join her husband
                                  >
                                  >1st of all she was listed under her maiden name-and on the ei they spelled
                                  >it incorrectly-but her children came under their father's name-and I found
                                  >them without any difficulty which of course meant that I found her as well.
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >>From: William F Brna <wfbrna@...>
                                  >>Reply-To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                                  >>To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                                  >>Subject: Re: [S-R] Re: surname gender affix -ova
                                  >>Date: Sat, 29 Mar 2003 07:58:09 -0500
                                  >>
                                  >>June,
                                  >>
                                  >>May I suggest that you try every possible spelling combination of your
                                  >>grandmother's name in the EI records?  I had tried to find my father's
                                  >>record ever since Ellis Island went on line.  I found my uncle's record
                                  >>but could not find my father's.  Last week,after reviewing the soundex
                                  >>records for NY arrivals, I found my uncle's record twice,  once spelled
                                  >>"Brna"  and once spelled "Brua".  It was the same record but when the
                                  >>soundex list was compiled, it was read properly once and once in error.
                                  >>His first name was Tomas and it was recorded as "Jamas".  In reviewing
                                  >>the soundex record, I found 9 people whose surname was "Brna" (none of
                                  >>them my father) and three in which the surname was spelled "Brno".  These
                                  >>were three children.  I then went back to the Ellis Island records, using
                                  >>the spelling "Brno" and found my father's record.  You must remember that
                                  >>many of the people who came through Ellis Island may have been
                                  >>illiterate, to some degree, and the immigration authorities were not all
                                  >>that great when it came to recording Central European names, nor were
                                  >>they able to read properly what an immigrant may have written.
                                  >>
                                  >>Bill Brna
                                  >>
                                  >>On Fri, 28 Mar 2003 22:07:33 -0800 (PST) McKee June <junemckee@...>
                                  >>writes:
                                  >> > Hi Frank,
                                  >> >
                                  >> > I am just wondering if there was a mistake made or
                                  >> > either my grandmother had a stepfather. On all of the
                                  >> > paperwork that we have ever seen which hasnt been too
                                  >> > much her maiden name was boldizar. I ordered her death
                                  >> > certificate and it told me that her fathers name was
                                  >> > Joseph bolga. I sent several months for her
                                  >> > immigration papers which I am waiting for and that
                                  >> > should give me much more information beings she would
                                  >> > have been the person giving the information. My
                                  >> > grandfather gave the information on the death
                                  >> > certificate when she died.
                                  >> >
                                  >> > As far as the Maria Boldizar age 21 , I know that she
                                  >> > was only 16 and was not married till she got to new
                                  >> > york then met my grandfather which is a Joseph Kolina.
                                  >> > Strange her name is Mary.
                                  >> >
                                  >> > I have looked over the ellis Island in the past but
                                  >> > not too recently for her name and none of them could
                                  >> > have been her because of the dates. I am going to take
                                  >> > another close look at it again and see if anything has
                                  >> > been added. I guess I have just been hoping that the
                                  >> > immigration papers I am waiting for will tell me what
                                  >> > I need to know.
                                  >> >
                                  >> > thank you for your help as in the past. You are a
                                  >> > great wealth of good information. I enjoy reading what
                                  >> > you post because I always seem to learn something from
                                  >> > what you write.
                                  >> >
                                  >> > thanks,
                                  >> > June
                                  >> > --- Frank <frankur@...> wrote:
                                  >> > > --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com, McKee June
                                  >> > > <junemckee@y...>
                                  >> > > wrote:
                                  >> > > > Hi Frank,
                                  >> > > >
                                  >> > > > could you tell me would Boldizar and Bolga be one
                                  >> > > in
                                  >> > > > the same?
                                  >> > >
                                  >> > > Boldizar and Bolga ? would be separate and distinct
                                  >> > > surnames found in
                                  >> > > Slovakia.
                                  >> > > You also had written Boldizar from Hungary emigrated
                                  >> > > via Ellis Island
                                  >> > > abt 1905 to 1907.
                                  >> > >
                                  >> > > Some emigrants changed names after they had settled
                                  >> > > in the U.S.
                                  >> > >
                                  >> > > The U.S. Social Security Death Index (SSDI) lists 63
                                  >> > > surnames
                                  >> > > Boldizar.
                                  >> > > Were any related ?
                                  >> > >
                                  >> > > The Ellis Island Records (EIR) list only 10 surnames
                                  >> > > Boldizar.
                                  >> > >
                                  >> > > A Maria Boldizar, age 21, Magyar, emigrated to the
                                  >> > > U.S. via
                                  >> > > Ellis Island (NYC) in 1907.
                                  >> > > She went to her husband Josef Boldizar in NYC.
                                  >> > > She was born in Tarcaszentpiter, Hungary which was
                                  >> > > Petrovany (Sk)
                                  >> > > located in eastern Slovakia.
                                  >> > >
                                  >> > > A Dezso" (H) (no English equivalent) Boldizar, age
                                  >> > > 23, married,
                                  >> > > Magyar, emigrated in 1905 via Ellis Island.
                                  >> > > He went to his brother-in-law a Peter Peidel.
                                  >> > > He was accompanied by a another surname Peidel who
                                  >> > > was a cousin
                                  >> > > of Peter.
                                  >> > > Both surnames were from Ugod which was located in
                                  >> > > Veszprim megye
                                  >> > > (county, Hungary.
                                  >> > >
                                  >> > > Several female surnames Boldizarova emigrated from
                                  >> > > Kl'ac^no (Sk)
                                  >> > > Nyitrafo" (H) in 1921.
                                  >> > >
                                  >> > > Several surnames Bolgacs also emigrated from
                                  >> > > Hungary.
                                  >> > > Bolgacs was a Hungarian spelling.
                                  >> > >
                                  >> > > Would  conclude the surname Bolgacs was a Hungarian
                                  >> > > surname.
                                  >> > > (Magyar letter 'cs' is pron. ch)
                                  >> > > The surname is now found in Slovakia spelled as
                                  >> > > Bolgac^ (Bolgach)
                                  >> > > and Bolgac^ova (feminine gender form)
                                  >> > > This is consistent with a transliteration using
                                  >> > > Slovak diacritic
                                  >> > > letters (which Hungarian doesn't use)
                                  >> > > (Slovak letter 'c^' is pron. ch)
                                  >> > >
                                  >> > > The Hungarian surname Bolkdizar is now found in both
                                  >> > > western and
                                  >> > > eastern Slovakia spelled as Boldiz^ar/Boldiz^arova.
                                  >> > > (Slovak letter 'z^' is pron. zh)
                                  >> > >
                                  >> > >
                                  >> > >
                                  >> >
                                  >> >
                                  >> > __________________________________________________
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                                • RMH
                                  I had come across the fact that if an Italian woman travelled here without her husband, she was listed under her maiden name - I found my daughter-in-law s
                                  Message 16 of 18 , Mar 30, 2003
                                  • 0 Attachment
                                    I had come across the fact that if an Italian woman travelled here without
                                    her husband, she was listed under her maiden name - I found my
                                    daughter-in-law's grandmother listed this way, and was told that that was
                                    routine. Maybe the same custom applied for those coming from
                                    Austria-Hungary?

                                    Regina Rabatin Haring
                                    Nanuet, NY
                                    http://www.dutchdoorgenealogy.com

                                    ----- Original Message -----
                                    From: <Marianne50614@...>
                                    To: <SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com>
                                    Sent: Sunday, March 30, 2003 8:04 AM
                                    Subject: Re: [S-R] Re: surname gender affix -ova


                                    > I always look at the Ellis Island info for children. I know some of my
                                    ancestors/relatives came to the U.S. as children, and knowing that, I look
                                    at those too. Like Stephanie's case, the children's mother was listed under
                                    her maiden name, but the info on to whom these children and their mother
                                    were going gave me info on other relatives who were already here.
                                    >
                                    > "Stephanie M" <czeching@...> wrote:
                                    >
                                    > >Just a note about a little luck I had on ellis island.
                                    > >Try a sibling.
                                    > >I could not for the life of me find my g g grandmother-but when I looked
                                    up
                                    > >one of her children's names-it came up-
                                    > >she came over here with 3 of her children to join her husband
                                    > >
                                    > >1st of all she was listed under her maiden name-and on the ei they
                                    spelled
                                    > >it incorrectly-but her children came under their father's name-and I
                                    found
                                    > >them without any difficulty which of course meant that I found her as
                                    well.
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >>From: William F Brna <wfbrna@...>
                                    > >>Reply-To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                                    > >>To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                                    > >>Subject: Re: [S-R] Re: surname gender affix -ova
                                    > >>Date: Sat, 29 Mar 2003 07:58:09 -0500
                                    > >>
                                    > >>June,
                                    > >>
                                    > >>May I suggest that you try every possible spelling combination of your
                                    > >>grandmother's name in the EI records? I had tried to find my father's
                                    > >>record ever since Ellis Island went on line. I found my uncle's record
                                    > >>but could not find my father's. Last week,after reviewing the soundex
                                    > >>records for NY arrivals, I found my uncle's record twice, once spelled
                                    > >>"Brna" and once spelled "Brua". It was the same record but when the
                                    > >>soundex list was compiled, it was read properly once and once in error.
                                    > >>His first name was Tomas and it was recorded as "Jamas". In reviewing
                                    > >>the soundex record, I found 9 people whose surname was "Brna" (none of
                                    > >>them my father) and three in which the surname was spelled "Brno". These
                                    > >>were three children. I then went back to the Ellis Island records, using
                                    > >>the spelling "Brno" and found my father's record. You must remember that
                                    > >>many of the people who came through Ellis Island may have been
                                    > >>illiterate, to some degree, and the immigration authorities were not all
                                    > >>that great when it came to recording Central European names, nor were
                                    > >>they able to read properly what an immigrant may have written.
                                    > >>
                                    > >>Bill Brna
                                    > >>
                                    > >>On Fri, 28 Mar 2003 22:07:33 -0800 (PST) McKee June
                                    <junemckee@...>
                                    > >>writes:
                                    > >> > Hi Frank,
                                    > >> >
                                    > >> > I am just wondering if there was a mistake made or
                                    > >> > either my grandmother had a stepfather. On all of the
                                    > >> > paperwork that we have ever seen which hasnt been too
                                    > >> > much her maiden name was boldizar. I ordered her death
                                    > >> > certificate and it told me that her fathers name was
                                    > >> > Joseph bolga. I sent several months for her
                                    > >> > immigration papers which I am waiting for and that
                                    > >> > should give me much more information beings she would
                                    > >> > have been the person giving the information. My
                                    > >> > grandfather gave the information on the death
                                    > >> > certificate when she died.
                                    > >> >
                                    > >> > As far as the Maria Boldizar age 21 , I know that she
                                    > >> > was only 16 and was not married till she got to new
                                    > >> > york then met my grandfather which is a Joseph Kolina.
                                    > >> > Strange her name is Mary.
                                    > >> >
                                    > >> > I have looked over the ellis Island in the past but
                                    > >> > not too recently for her name and none of them could
                                    > >> > have been her because of the dates. I am going to take
                                    > >> > another close look at it again and see if anything has
                                    > >> > been added. I guess I have just been hoping that the
                                    > >> > immigration papers I am waiting for will tell me what
                                    > >> > I need to know.
                                    > >> >
                                    > >> > thank you for your help as in the past. You are a
                                    > >> > great wealth of good information. I enjoy reading what
                                    > >> > you post because I always seem to learn something from
                                    > >> > what you write.
                                    > >> >
                                    > >> > thanks,
                                    > >> > June
                                    > >> > --- Frank <frankur@...> wrote:
                                    > >> > > --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com, McKee June
                                    > >> > > <junemckee@y...>
                                    > >> > > wrote:
                                    > >> > > > Hi Frank,
                                    > >> > > >
                                    > >> > > > could you tell me would Boldizar and Bolga be one
                                    > >> > > in
                                    > >> > > > the same?
                                    > >> > >
                                    > >> > > Boldizar and Bolga ? would be separate and distinct
                                    > >> > > surnames found in
                                    > >> > > Slovakia.
                                    > >> > > You also had written Boldizar from Hungary emigrated
                                    > >> > > via Ellis Island
                                    > >> > > abt 1905 to 1907.
                                    > >> > >
                                    > >> > > Some emigrants changed names after they had settled
                                    > >> > > in the U.S.
                                    > >> > >
                                    > >> > > The U.S. Social Security Death Index (SSDI) lists 63
                                    > >> > > surnames
                                    > >> > > Boldizar.
                                    > >> > > Were any related ?
                                    > >> > >
                                    > >> > > The Ellis Island Records (EIR) list only 10 surnames
                                    > >> > > Boldizar.
                                    > >> > >
                                    > >> > > A Maria Boldizar, age 21, Magyar, emigrated to the
                                    > >> > > U.S. via
                                    > >> > > Ellis Island (NYC) in 1907.
                                    > >> > > She went to her husband Josef Boldizar in NYC.
                                    > >> > > She was born in Tarcaszentpiter, Hungary which was
                                    > >> > > Petrovany (Sk)
                                    > >> > > located in eastern Slovakia.
                                    > >> > >
                                    > >> > > A Dezso" (H) (no English equivalent) Boldizar, age
                                    > >> > > 23, married,
                                    > >> > > Magyar, emigrated in 1905 via Ellis Island.
                                    > >> > > He went to his brother-in-law a Peter Peidel.
                                    > >> > > He was accompanied by a another surname Peidel who
                                    > >> > > was a cousin
                                    > >> > > of Peter.
                                    > >> > > Both surnames were from Ugod which was located in
                                    > >> > > Veszprim megye
                                    > >> > > (county, Hungary.
                                    > >> > >
                                    > >> > > Several female surnames Boldizarova emigrated from
                                    > >> > > Kl'ac^no (Sk)
                                    > >> > > Nyitrafo" (H) in 1921.
                                    > >> > >
                                    > >> > > Several surnames Bolgacs also emigrated from
                                    > >> > > Hungary.
                                    > >> > > Bolgacs was a Hungarian spelling.
                                    > >> > >
                                    > >> > > Would conclude the surname Bolgacs was a Hungarian
                                    > >> > > surname.
                                    > >> > > (Magyar letter 'cs' is pron. ch)
                                    > >> > > The surname is now found in Slovakia spelled as
                                    > >> > > Bolgac^ (Bolgach)
                                    > >> > > and Bolgac^ova (feminine gender form)
                                    > >> > > This is consistent with a transliteration using
                                    > >> > > Slovak diacritic
                                    > >> > > letters (which Hungarian doesn't use)
                                    > >> > > (Slovak letter 'c^' is pron. ch)
                                    > >> > >
                                    > >> > > The Hungarian surname Bolkdizar is now found in both
                                    > >> > > western and
                                    > >> > > eastern Slovakia spelled as Boldiz^ar/Boldiz^arova.
                                    > >> > > (Slovak letter 'z^' is pron. zh)
                                    > >> > >
                                    > >> > >
                                    > >> > >
                                    > >> >
                                    > >> >
                                    > >> > __________________________________________________
                                    > >> > Do you Yahoo!?
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                                    > >> > desktop!
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                                    > >> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
                                    > >> > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
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                                    SLOVAK-ROOTS-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
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                                  • Frank
                                    ... Today many people move to large cities to work. In the past most stayed in their native villages. For example, the Slovakia telephone directory lists under
                                    Message 17 of 18 , Mar 30, 2003
                                    • 0 Attachment
                                      --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com, McKee June <junemckee@y...>
                                      wrote:
                                      > Hi Frank,
                                      >
                                      > I am just wondering if there was a mistake made or
                                      > either my grandmother had a stepfather. On all of the
                                      > paperwork that we have ever seen which hasnt been too
                                      > much her maiden name was boldizar. I ordered her death
                                      > certificate and it told me that her fathers name was
                                      > Joseph bolga. I sent several months for her
                                      > immigration papers which I am waiting for and that
                                      > should give me much more information beings she would
                                      > have been the person giving the information. My
                                      > grandfather gave the information on the death
                                      > certificate when she died.
                                      >
                                      > As far as the Maria Boldizar age 21 , I know that she
                                      > was only 16 and was not married till she got to new
                                      > york then met my grandfather which is a Joseph Kolina.
                                      > Strange her name is Mary.

                                      Today many people move to large cities to work.
                                      In the past most stayed in their native villages.
                                      For example, the Slovakia telephone directory lists
                                      under Bratislava :

                                      8 surnames Bolgác^, male, including 1 doctor and 2 engineers.
                                      5 surnames Bolgác^ová , female.

                                      2 surnames Boldiz^árová, female.

                                      The EIR listed only 10 surnames Boldizár.
                                      3 surnames had emigrated from Jugoslavija.
                                      The son listed bore either a Serbian or Slovak first name, which
                                      was not a Croatian or Slovene or Hungarian given name.

                                      Social Security Death Index (SSDI) began in 1937.
                                      Lists 22 surnames Kolina.

                                      SSDI lists only 6 surnames Bolga.
                                      A Joseph Bolga (1909-1974) was listed under Pittsburgh PA.
                                    • McKee June
                                      I do know that my g-grandfather was a joseph bolga as from what my grandmothers death certificate said, but I know from what my father told me that joseph
                                      Message 18 of 18 , Mar 30, 2003
                                      • 0 Attachment
                                        I do know that my g-grandfather was a joseph bolga as
                                        from what my grandmothers death certificate said, but
                                        I know from what my father told me that joseph bolga
                                        was a engineer and died by falling off a building in
                                        hungary. Julia my g-grandmother also died in hungary.
                                        My grandmother mary boldizar I know wouldnt be in the
                                        SSI beings she did die in 1935. I have seen my uncles
                                        listed but not my grandfather Joseph Kolina which is
                                        spelled Kuling in the ellis island.
                                        June

                                        Frank <frankur@...> wrote:
                                        > --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com, McKee June
                                        > <junemckee@y...>
                                        > wrote:
                                        > > Hi Frank,
                                        > >
                                        > > I am just wondering if there was a mistake made or
                                        > > either my grandmother had a stepfather. On all of
                                        > the
                                        > > paperwork that we have ever seen which hasnt been
                                        > too
                                        > > much her maiden name was boldizar. I ordered her
                                        > death
                                        > > certificate and it told me that her fathers name
                                        > was
                                        > > Joseph bolga. I sent several months for her
                                        > > immigration papers which I am waiting for and that
                                        > > should give me much more information beings she
                                        > would
                                        > > have been the person giving the information. My
                                        > > grandfather gave the information on the death
                                        > > certificate when she died.
                                        > >
                                        > > As far as the Maria Boldizar age 21 , I know that
                                        > she
                                        > > was only 16 and was not married till she got to
                                        > new
                                        > > york then met my grandfather which is a Joseph
                                        > Kolina.
                                        > > Strange her name is Mary.
                                        >
                                        > Today many people move to large cities to work.
                                        > In the past most stayed in their native villages.
                                        > For example, the Slovakia telephone directory lists
                                        > under Bratislava :
                                        >
                                        > 8 surnames Bolg�c^, male, including 1 doctor and 2
                                        > engineers.
                                        > 5 surnames Bolg�c^ov� , female.
                                        >
                                        > 2 surnames Boldiz^�rov�, female.
                                        >
                                        > The EIR listed only 10 surnames Boldiz�r.
                                        > 3 surnames had emigrated from Jugoslavija.
                                        > The son listed bore either a Serbian or Slovak first
                                        > name, which
                                        > was not a Croatian or Slovene or Hungarian given
                                        > name.
                                        >
                                        > Social Security Death Index (SSDI) began in 1937.
                                        > Lists 22 surnames Kolina.
                                        >
                                        > SSDI lists only 6 surnames Bolga.
                                        > A Joseph Bolga (1909-1974) was listed under
                                        > Pittsburgh PA.
                                        >
                                        >
                                        >


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