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Re: City of Belova

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  • frankly1us
    ... Belova, Saris Megye Hungary. Trying to find the LDS film for this area. I have found my ggrf GAVEL in Lesnica, Hungary LDS films. ... Will have to guess.
    Message 1 of 20 , Sep 1, 2002
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      --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@y..., patricia gavel <pgsister@y...> wrote:
      >
      > On a 1911 church document, my ggrandmother Anna Sveda is from
      Belova, Saris Megye Hungary. Trying to find the LDS film for this
      area. I have found my ggrf GAVEL in Lesnica, Hungary LDS films.
      >
      > Thanks, Patricia
      >
      >
      >
      > ---------------------------------
      > Do You Yahoo!?
      > Yahoo! Finance - Get real-time stock quotes
      >
      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

      Will have to guess.
      For 1911, you would be looking for a Hungarian spelling of a place
      name located in now Slovakia.
      If an American document the place name was written as it sounded to
      the listener, not its actual spelling (which nobody checked in an
      atlas)

      A Bellova Ves is located in western Slovakia, 19 miles ESE of
      Bratislava so that can't be the place.

      According to the Hungarian Gazetteer, the only pre-WW I Hungarian
      place name (Bel?) located in Sáros megye (county) would be
      Belejóc
      (H), now Belejovce (Sk) and located 219 miles ENE of Bratislava.

      The Slovakia telephone directory lists 2 surnames S^veda under
      Svidník.
      Svidník is located 5 miles distant from Belejovce.

      The Slovakia telephone directory lists 4 surnames under Bardejov.
      Bardejov is located 14 miles from Bardejov.


      What was gGM's religion ?
    • patricia gavel
      The Gavel s in Lesnica were Roman Catholic. Sveda were supposedly Greek Catholic. Someone referred me to the LDS films of Hazlin Hungary #1792095 to find my
      Message 2 of 20 , Sep 2, 2002
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        The Gavel's in Lesnica were Roman Catholic. Sveda were supposedly Greek Catholic. Someone referred me to the LDS films of Hazlin Hungary #1792095 to find my Sveda. I haven't found anyone on the films so I thought I must have the wrong ones. Trying to double check my cities.
        After I find the city, can you advise what's the next step to connecting with some distant kin you are finding in the phone directory? I found email addresses to my Surname Slovakians but the server wouldn't deliver mail to them. Thanks. PGavel
        frankly1us wrote:--- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@y..., patricia gavel <pgsister@y...> wrote:
        >
        > On a 1911 church document, my ggrandmother Anna Sveda is from
        Belova, Saris Megye Hungary. Trying to find the LDS film for this
        area. I have found my ggrf GAVEL in Lesnica, Hungary LDS films.
        >
        > Thanks, Patricia
        >
        >
        >
        > ---------------------------------
        > Do You Yahoo!?
        > Yahoo! Finance - Get real-time stock quotes
        >
        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

        Will have to guess.
        For 1911, you would be looking for a Hungarian spelling of a place
        name located in now Slovakia.
        If an American document the place name was written as it sounded to
        the listener, not its actual spelling (which nobody checked in an
        atlas)

        A Bellova Ves is located in western Slovakia, 19 miles ESE of
        Bratislava so that can't be the place.

        According to the Hungarian Gazetteer, the only pre-WW I Hungarian
        place name (Bel?) located in S�ros megye (county) would be
        Belej�c
        (H), now Belejovce (Sk) and located 219 miles ENE of Bratislava.

        The Slovakia telephone directory lists 2 surnames S^veda under
        Svidn�k.
        Svidn�k is located 5 miles distant from Belejovce.

        The Slovakia telephone directory lists 4 surnames under Bardejov.
        Bardejov is located 14 miles from Bardejov.


        What was gGM's religion ?


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      • Dr. Joe Q
        You have mentioned the names of several towns, with similar sounding names (some maybe incomplete) and similar spellings: Belovez^a (Belovezsa, Sáros
        Message 3 of 20 , Sep 2, 2002
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          You have mentioned the names of several towns, with similar sounding names (some maybe incomplete) and similar spellings:

          Belovez^a (Belovezsa, Sáros "Hungary") is 8 km east of Bardejov (LDS films 1792049 and 1792004 - Greek Catholic).

          Haz^li'n is 3 km east of Belovez^a (LDS films 1792094 and 1792095 - Roman Catholic; 1792920 and 1792921 - Greek Catholic).

          Belejovce 12 km northeast of Haz^li'n, 7 km north of Svidni'k.

          As Frank pointed out below - Bellova Ves is about 25 km south east of Bratislava (about 350 km west southwest of Bardejov).

          Additionally Lesnica (LDS films 1739441 and 1739442 - Roman Catholic) is only 5 km northeast of Lechnica (LDS films 1739439 and 1739440 - Roman Catholic) both are about 40 km north of Levoc^a, 20 km north of Spis^ska' bela', and 66 km east northeast of Bardejov.

          A detailed map of Slovakia is very important when searching for "Americanized" town names, additionally Hungarian spellings are frequently interchanged with Slovak further confusing things. Some Hungarian town names bear very little resemblance to the Slovak name, e.g.
          Spis^ska' Nova' Ves = Iglo (Hungarian).

          Do you have any documents that could clarify this?

          Dr. "Q"

          patricia gavel wrote:

          > The Gavel's in Lesnica were Roman Catholic. Sveda were supposedly Greek Catholic. Someone referred me to the LDS films of Hazlin Hungary #1792095 to find my Sveda. I haven't found anyone on the films so I thought I must have the wrong ones. Trying to double check my cities.
          > After I find the city, can you advise what's the next step to connecting with some distant kin you are finding in the phone directory? I found email addresses to my Surname Slovakians but the server wouldn't deliver mail to them. Thanks. PGavel
          > frankly1us wrote:--- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@y..., patricia gavel <pgsister@y...> wrote:
          > >
          > > On a 1911 church document, my ggrandmother Anna Sveda is from
          > Belova, Saris Megye Hungary. Trying to find the LDS film for this
          > area. I have found my ggrf GAVEL in Lesnica, Hungary LDS films.
          > >
          > > Thanks, Patricia
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > > ---------------------------------
          > > Do You Yahoo!?
          > > Yahoo! Finance - Get real-time stock quotes
          > >
          > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          >
          > Will have to guess.
          > For 1911, you would be looking for a Hungarian spelling of a place
          > name located in now Slovakia.
          > If an American document the place name was written as it sounded to
          > the listener, not its actual spelling (which nobody checked in an
          > atlas)
          >
          > A Bellova Ves is located in western Slovakia, 19 miles ESE of
          > Bratislava so that can't be the place.
          >
          > According to the Hungarian Gazetteer, the only pre-WW I Hungarian
          > place name (Bel?) located in Sáros megye (county) would be
          > Belejóc
          > (H), now Belejovce (Sk) and located 219 miles ENE of Bratislava.
          >
          > The Slovakia telephone directory lists 2 surnames S^veda under
          > Svidník.
          > Svidník is located 5 miles distant from Belejovce.
          >
          > The Slovakia telephone directory lists 4 surnames under Bardejov.
          > Bardejov is located 14 miles from Bardejov.
          >
          > What was gGM's religion ?
        • Joan Hendershot
          I have a Maria Sveda married into one of my lines. She was from Olsavica, Spis, Hungary. Slovak Pride lists two Svedas. One from Bardejov and one from
          Message 4 of 20 , Nov 10, 2002
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            I have a Maria Sveda married into one of my lines. She was from Olsavica,
            Spis, Hungary.

            Slovak Pride lists two Svedas. One from Bardejov and one from Livovska
            Huta.

            Dont know if that helps.

            Joan
          • Konekta
            Hello Patricia, There is no place called Belova, but you can try Beloveza. I was researching this area recently and have surname Sveda, found in the Gc parish
            Message 5 of 20 , Nov 10, 2002
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              Hello Patricia,
              There is no place called Belova, but you can try Beloveza.
              I was researching this area recently and have surname Sveda, found in the Gc parish of Ortutova.
              But, try Beloveza first. I am sure, you will find them there.
              Regards,
              Vladimir
              ----- Original Message -----
              From: patricia gavel
              To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
              Sent: Sunday, November 10, 2002 2:37 PM
              Subject: [S-R] City of Belova



              Hello All,

              On a baptism cert. 1911 from Penn., Anna Sveda was listed from the city of Belova, Saris Megye Hungary. Have been searching LDS films 1792049 & 1792004 Cirkerna matrika in Belejovce. Didn't find any Sveda's or even close to the spelling. They were Greek Catholic and possible related to Karaffa surname. Does anyone have a suggestion where to look next?

              Thanks much, Patricia



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            • John M,
              ... My mother s village is located a few miles southwest of Bardejov. Sveda and Karaffa are familiar names to me. There are a few towns over the hill from her
              Message 6 of 20 , Nov 10, 2002
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                At 05:37 AM 11/10/2002 -0800, you wrote:

                >Hello All,
                >
                >On a baptism cert. 1911 from Penn., Anna Sveda was listed from the city of
                >Belova, Saris Megye Hungary. Have been searching LDS films 1792049 &
                >1792004 Cirkerna matrika in Belejovce. Didn't find any Sveda's or even
                >close to the spelling. They were Greek Catholic and possible related to
                >Karaffa surname. Does anyone have a suggestion where to look next?
                >
                >Thanks much, Patricia

                My mother's village is located a few miles southwest of Bardejov. Sveda
                and Karaffa are familiar names to me. There are a few towns over the hill
                from her village Livov, Livovska Hutta, Luko, and Valencia. If you look at
                the Ellis Island database you will find several Sveda and Karafa,Karaffa
                listing these towns (and variations of the town's spelling) as their home
                towns. It would take a bit of a stretch of imagination to come up with
                Belova but someone familiar with the language might see some
                possibilities. Was Belova in cursive on the certificate? If so could
                there be some possibility the town was misread? Was Sveda her maiden
                name? Where was she headed on arrival? Where in PA did she settle?

                John M.
              • Konekta
                Dear John M., Of course, this Belova is a misspelling. As I already noted, there is and was no such place here. Most probably, there was no place to write the
                Message 7 of 20 , Nov 10, 2002
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                  Dear John M.,
                  Of course, this Belova is a misspelling. As I already noted, there is and was no such place here.
                  Most probably, there was no place to write the name in whole length, which would have been Beloveza.
                  Vladimir
                  ----- Original Message -----
                  From: John M,
                  To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                  Sent: Monday, November 11, 2002 6:11 AM
                  Subject: Re: [S-R] City of Belova


                  At 05:37 AM 11/10/2002 -0800, you wrote:

                  >Hello All,
                  >
                  >On a baptism cert. 1911 from Penn., Anna Sveda was listed from the city of
                  >Belova, Saris Megye Hungary. Have been searching LDS films 1792049 &
                  >1792004 Cirkerna matrika in Belejovce. Didn't find any Sveda's or even
                  >close to the spelling. They were Greek Catholic and possible related to
                  >Karaffa surname. Does anyone have a suggestion where to look next?
                  >
                  >Thanks much, Patricia

                  My mother's village is located a few miles southwest of Bardejov. Sveda
                  and Karaffa are familiar names to me. There are a few towns over the hill
                  from her village Livov, Livovska Hutta, Luko, and Valencia. If you look at
                  the Ellis Island database you will find several Sveda and Karafa,Karaffa
                  listing these towns (and variations of the town's spelling) as their home
                  towns. It would take a bit of a stretch of imagination to come up with
                  Belova but someone familiar with the language might see some
                  possibilities. Was Belova in cursive on the certificate? If so could
                  there be some possibility the town was misread? Was Sveda her maiden
                  name? Where was she headed on arrival? Where in PA did she settle?

                  John M.




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                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • John M,
                  ... Dear Vlad, I indicated it was misspelled from the beginning. On September 1st, I wrote: There is a town called Bellova Ves but it is in the Bratislava
                  Message 8 of 20 , Nov 11, 2002
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                    At 07:59 AM 11/11/2002 +0100, you wrote:
                    >Dear John M.,
                    >Of course, this Belova is a misspelling. As I already noted, there is and
                    >was no such place here.
                    >Most probably, there was no place to write the name in whole length, which
                    >would have been Beloveza.
                    >Vladimir

                    Dear Vlad,
                    I indicated it was misspelled from the beginning. On September 1st, I wrote:

                    "There is a town called Bellova Ves but it is in the Bratislava area. You
                    may be looking for Beloveza or Belejovce. Both are in what was S^aris
                    Megye. Beloveza is a short distance to the east of Bardejov."

                    Good theory Vlad but she said:

                    "Have been searching LDS films 1792049 & 1792004 Cirkerna matrika in
                    Belejovce." (error in naming the village)

                    FHL INTL Film 1792049 , FHL INTL Film 1792004 are BELOVEZA films and she
                    then said:

                    "Didn't find any Sveda's or even close to the spelling. They were Greek
                    Catholic and possible related to Karaffa surname. Does anyone have a
                    suggestion where to look next?"

                    One of the EIDB entries I found was for a family of 6 by the name of
                    Karaffa. Their home village was spelled Libowa in 5 cases and a typo
                    Lobowa for the 6th. There is no such town in Slovakia. I think they were
                    referring to Livo, now known as Livov and, which had several Karaffa
                    emigrees. Since you are fluent in Slovak, perhaps you can explain the
                    ending given to the town name. There are a few towns that begin with Libo
                    but none that end in "wa".

                    John M.
                  • Konekta
                    Dear John, It was something, that begins with Belo.So, if she checked the Beloveza already, then she should check Belejovce next. This is all the same general
                    Message 9 of 20 , Nov 11, 2002
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                      Dear John,
                      It was something, that begins with Belo.So, if she checked the Beloveza already, then she should check Belejovce next. This is all the same general area and I know, the surnames were there.
                      The ending wa merely indicates female gender of the place name.
                      Philadelphia would be female and Boston would be male.
                      So are the places here too. And many other forms too.
                      Quite complicated to learn and understand for non Slovaks.
                      Some Examples;
                      Bardejov je (is)
                      Breznicka je (is)
                      Giraltovce su (is)
                      Hankovce su (is)
                      Zilina je (is)
                      Piestany su (is)
                      Kozany su (is)
                      Kosariska su (is)
                      Smolinske je (is)
                      Krajne je (is)
                      Krompachy su (is)
                      Cicmany su (is)
                      Gbely je (is)
                      and so on
                      Regards,
                      Vladimir
                      ----- Original Message -----
                      From: John M,
                      To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                      Sent: Monday, November 11, 2002 5:41 PM
                      Subject: Re: [S-R] City of Belova


                      At 07:59 AM 11/11/2002 +0100, you wrote:
                      >Dear John M.,
                      >Of course, this Belova is a misspelling. As I already noted, there is and
                      >was no such place here.
                      >Most probably, there was no place to write the name in whole length, which
                      >would have been Beloveza.
                      >Vladimir

                      Dear Vlad,
                      I indicated it was misspelled from the beginning. On September 1st, I wrote:

                      "There is a town called Bellova Ves but it is in the Bratislava area. You
                      may be looking for Beloveza or Belejovce. Both are in what was S^aris
                      Megye. Beloveza is a short distance to the east of Bardejov."

                      Good theory Vlad but she said:

                      "Have been searching LDS films 1792049 & 1792004 Cirkerna matrika in
                      Belejovce." (error in naming the village)

                      FHL INTL Film 1792049 , FHL INTL Film 1792004 are BELOVEZA films and she
                      then said:

                      "Didn't find any Sveda's or even close to the spelling. They were Greek
                      Catholic and possible related to Karaffa surname. Does anyone have a
                      suggestion where to look next?"

                      One of the EIDB entries I found was for a family of 6 by the name of
                      Karaffa. Their home village was spelled Libowa in 5 cases and a typo
                      Lobowa for the 6th. There is no such town in Slovakia. I think they were
                      referring to Livo, now known as Livov and, which had several Karaffa
                      emigrees. Since you are fluent in Slovak, perhaps you can explain the
                      ending given to the town name. There are a few towns that begin with Libo
                      but none that end in "wa".

                      John M.







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                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    • patricia gavel
                      Hello Gentlemen, You re expertise is appreciated because I m not slovak and I m trying desperately to learn all I can. Are you both in agreement that I should
                      Message 10 of 20 , Nov 11, 2002
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                        Hello Gentlemen,
                        You're expertise is appreciated because I'm not slovak and I'm trying desperately to learn all I can. Are you both in agreement that I should order FHL INTL Film 1794356 and 1794357 Belejoc in GC Vapenik records?
                        Patricia
                        Konekta <konekta@...> wrote:Dear John,
                        It was something, that begins with Belo.So, if she checked the Beloveza already, then she should check Belejovce next. This is all the same general area and I know, the surnames were there.
                        The ending wa merely indicates female gender of the place name.
                        Philadelphia would be female and Boston would be male.
                        So are the places here too. And many other forms too.
                        Quite complicated to learn and understand for non Slovaks.
                        Some Examples;
                        Bardejov je (is)
                        Breznicka je (is)
                        Giraltovce su (is)
                        Hankovce su (is)
                        Zilina je (is)
                        Piestany su (is)
                        Kozany su (is)
                        Kosariska su (is)
                        Smolinske je (is)
                        Krajne je (is)
                        Krompachy su (is)
                        Cicmany su (is)
                        Gbely je (is)
                        and so on
                        Regards,
                        Vladimir
                        ----- Original Message -----
                        From: John M,
                        To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                        Sent: Monday, November 11, 2002 5:41 PM
                        Subject: Re: [S-R] City of Belova


                        At 07:59 AM 11/11/2002 +0100, you wrote:
                        >Dear John M.,
                        >Of course, this Belova is a misspelling. As I already noted, there is and
                        >was no such place here.
                        >Most probably, there was no place to write the name in whole length, which
                        >would have been Beloveza.
                        >Vladimir

                        Dear Vlad,
                        I indicated it was misspelled from the beginning. On September 1st, I wrote:

                        "There is a town called Bellova Ves but it is in the Bratislava area. You
                        may be looking for Beloveza or Belejovce. Both are in what was S^aris
                        Megye. Beloveza is a short distance to the east of Bardejov."

                        Good theory Vlad but she said:

                        "Have been searching LDS films 1792049 & 1792004 Cirkerna matrika in
                        Belejovce." (error in naming the village)

                        FHL INTL Film 1792049 , FHL INTL Film 1792004 are BELOVEZA films and she
                        then said:

                        "Didn't find any Sveda's or even close to the spelling. They were Greek
                        Catholic and possible related to Karaffa surname. Does anyone have a
                        suggestion where to look next?"

                        One of the EIDB entries I found was for a family of 6 by the name of
                        Karaffa. Their home village was spelled Libowa in 5 cases and a typo
                        Lobowa for the 6th. There is no such town in Slovakia. I think they were
                        referring to Livo, now known as Livov and, which had several Karaffa
                        emigrees. Since you are fluent in Slovak, perhaps you can explain the
                        ending given to the town name. There are a few towns that begin with Libo
                        but none that end in "wa".

                        John M.







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                        Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.



                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


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                      • John M,
                        ... I believe she is doing that. ... Thanks. It has been 40 years since I spoke Rusyn on an infrequent and imperfect basis with my parents but I have a hazy
                        Message 11 of 20 , Nov 11, 2002
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                          At 08:44 PM 11/11/2002 +0100, you wrote:
                          >Dear John,
                          >It was something, that begins with Belo.So, if she checked the Beloveza
                          >already, then she should check Belejovce next. This is all the same
                          >general area and I know, the surnames were there.

                          I believe she is doing that.

                          > The ending wa merely indicates female gender of the place name.
                          > Philadelphia would be female and Boston would be male. So are the places
                          > here too. And many other forms too. Quite complicated to learn and
                          > understand for non Slovaks.

                          Thanks. It has been 40 years since I spoke Rusyn on an infrequent and
                          imperfect basis with my parents but I have a hazy recollection of their
                          using the term Livova. I think it would be used in a case where they would
                          say "Ona je od Livova" which I hope is the correct way of saying "She is
                          from Livov".

                          The reason I mentioned the Karaffas from Libowa is that I believe they were
                          from Livo(v). They were going to Toronto, Ohio which is an Ohio River town
                          near Pittsburgh. Many of the villagers from Livov and surrounding villages
                          emigrated to Toronto, Empire, and Stratton Ohio. These towns are clustered
                          together on the Ohio River. Others went to the Braddock, Homestead,
                          Pittsburgh Pennsylvania area. There is an Anna Sveda from Luko (ancestral
                          village of actor Robert Urich (1946-2002)) going to the Pittsburgh area and
                          several other Svedas from Livov, and Livovska Hutta going to the same area
                          in Pennsylvania. Unfortunately, I have been unable to change Livova to
                          Belova but the EIDB does show a lot of Karaffa and Sveda emigrating from
                          that area.

                          John M.
                        • Konekta
                          Yes, Patricia. Vapeni Gc. But, you will not have much fun. The records are only 1862-1895. If you then check the census for 1869 , you can find persons there,
                          Message 12 of 20 , Nov 12, 2002
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                            Yes, Patricia. Vapeni Gc. But, you will not have much fun. The records are only 1862-1895.
                            If you then check the census for 1869 , you can find persons there, that were born before 1862.
                            =====
                            Interestingly, nobody reacted on place names I gave.
                            Example;
                            Bardejov je daleko. Bardejov is far. Here the "is" is correct.
                            A foreigner would always use "is" in english, whic is, of course not always correct.
                            Here are now the correct english spellings for the examples;
                            Breznicka is far.
                            Giraltovce are far.
                            Hankovce are far.
                            Zilina is far.
                            Piestany are far.
                            Kozany are far.
                            Kosariska are far.
                            Smolinske is / are far. Not sure myself.
                            Krajne is far.
                            Krompachy are far.
                            Cicmany are far.
                            Gbely is far.

                            Vladimir
                            ----- Original Message -----
                            From: patricia gavel
                            To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                            Sent: Monday, November 11, 2002 10:24 PM
                            Subject: Re: [S-R] City of Belova FHL Film



                            Hello Gentlemen,
                            You're expertise is appreciated because I'm not slovak and I'm trying desperately to learn all I can. Are you both in agreement that I should order FHL INTL Film 1794356 and 1794357 Belejoc in GC Vapenik records?
                            Patricia
                            Konekta <konekta@...> wrote:Dear John,
                            It was something, that begins with Belo.So, if she checked the Beloveza already, then she should check Belejovce next. This is all the same general area and I know, the surnames were there.
                            The ending wa merely indicates female gender of the place name.
                            Philadelphia would be female and Boston would be male.
                            So are the places here too. And many other forms too.
                            Quite complicated to learn and understand for non Slovaks.
                            Some Examples;
                            Bardejov je (is)
                            Breznicka je (is)
                            Giraltovce su (is)
                            Hankovce su (is)
                            Zilina je (is)
                            Piestany su (is)
                            Kozany su (is)
                            Kosariska su (is)
                            Smolinske je (is)
                            Krajne je (is)
                            Krompachy su (is)
                            Cicmany su (is)
                            Gbely je (is)
                            and so on
                            Regards,
                            Vladimir
                            ----- Original Message -----
                            From: John M,
                            To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                            Sent: Monday, November 11, 2002 5:41 PM
                            Subject: Re: [S-R] City of Belova


                            At 07:59 AM 11/11/2002 +0100, you wrote:
                            >Dear John M.,
                            >Of course, this Belova is a misspelling. As I already noted, there is and
                            >was no such place here.
                            >Most probably, there was no place to write the name in whole length, which
                            >would have been Beloveza.
                            >Vladimir

                            Dear Vlad,
                            I indicated it was misspelled from the beginning. On September 1st, I wrote:

                            "There is a town called Bellova Ves but it is in the Bratislava area. You
                            may be looking for Beloveza or Belejovce. Both are in what was S^aris
                            Megye. Beloveza is a short distance to the east of Bardejov."

                            Good theory Vlad but she said:

                            "Have been searching LDS films 1792049 & 1792004 Cirkerna matrika in
                            Belejovce." (error in naming the village)

                            FHL INTL Film 1792049 , FHL INTL Film 1792004 are BELOVEZA films and she
                            then said:

                            "Didn't find any Sveda's or even close to the spelling. They were Greek
                            Catholic and possible related to Karaffa surname. Does anyone have a
                            suggestion where to look next?"

                            One of the EIDB entries I found was for a family of 6 by the name of
                            Karaffa. Their home village was spelled Libowa in 5 cases and a typo
                            Lobowa for the 6th. There is no such town in Slovakia. I think they were
                            referring to Livo, now known as Livov and, which had several Karaffa
                            emigrees. Since you are fluent in Slovak, perhaps you can explain the
                            ending given to the town name. There are a few towns that begin with Libo
                            but none that end in "wa".

                            John M.







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                          • patricia gavel
                            Vladimir, Is the census located on the same films? Not familiar. Christina Anna Sveda was born 5-3-1887. Her death cert. said her father was John Sveda. I m
                            Message 13 of 20 , Nov 12, 2002
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                              Vladimir,
                              Is the census located on the same films? Not familiar. Christina Anna Sveda was born 5-3-1887. Her death cert. said her father was John Sveda. I'm going this afternoon to order these film. thanks,
                              Patricia
                              Konekta <konekta@...> wrote:Yes, Patricia. Vapeni Gc. But, you will not have much fun. The records are only 1862-1895.
                              If you then check the census for 1869 , you can find persons there, that were born before 1862.
                              =====
                              Interestingly, nobody reacted on place names I gave.
                              Example;
                              Bardejov je daleko. Bardejov is far. Here the "is" is correct.
                              A foreigner would always use "is" in english, whic is, of course not always correct.
                              Here are now the correct english spellings for the examples;
                              Breznicka is far.
                              Giraltovce are far.
                              Hankovce are far.
                              Zilina is far.
                              Piestany are far.
                              Kozany are far.
                              Kosariska are far.
                              Smolinske is / are far. Not sure myself.
                              Krajne is far.
                              Krompachy are far.
                              Cicmany are far.
                              Gbely is far.

                              Vladimir







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                            • John M,
                              ... No. The census is on - Belejócz (Belejovce) - FHL INTL Film [ 2150628 Item 9 ] John M.
                              Message 14 of 20 , Nov 12, 2002
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                                At 01:38 PM 11/12/2002 -0800, you wrote:

                                >Vladimir,
                                >Is the census located on the same films? Not familiar. Christina Anna
                                >Sveda was born 5-3-1887. Her death cert. said her father was John
                                >Sveda. I'm going this afternoon to order these film. thanks,
                                >Patricia

                                No. The census is on - Belejócz (Belejovce) - FHL INTL Film [ 2150628
                                Item 9 ]

                                John M.
                              • Dr. Joe Q
                                The name Karaffa was in Livov at least until 1980. It is the name of my great great grandfather (Andrej [about 1832 - 1935] who was married Anna Molc^an [12
                                Message 15 of 20 , Nov 12, 2002
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                                  The name Karaffa was in Livov at least until 1980. It is the name of my great great grandfather (Andrej [about 1832 - 1935] who was married Anna Molc^an
                                  [12 Aug 1824 - ?), their daughter Anna Karaffa married Michael Pi'llar (also from Livov).

                                  Dr. "Q"


                                  "John M," wrote:

                                  > At 08:44 PM 11/11/2002 +0100, you wrote:
                                  > >Dear John,
                                  > >It was something, that begins with Belo.So, if she checked the Beloveza
                                  > >already, then she should check Belejovce next. This is all the same
                                  > >general area and I know, the surnames were there.
                                  >
                                  > I believe she is doing that.
                                  >
                                  > > The ending wa merely indicates female gender of the place name.
                                  > > Philadelphia would be female and Boston would be male. So are the places
                                  > > here too. And many other forms too. Quite complicated to learn and
                                  > > understand for non Slovaks.
                                  >
                                  > Thanks. It has been 40 years since I spoke Rusyn on an infrequent and
                                  > imperfect basis with my parents but I have a hazy recollection of their
                                  > using the term Livova. I think it would be used in a case where they would
                                  > say "Ona je od Livova" which I hope is the correct way of saying "She is
                                  > from Livov".
                                  >
                                  > The reason I mentioned the Karaffas from Libowa is that I believe they were
                                  > from Livo(v). They were going to Toronto, Ohio which is an Ohio River town
                                  > near Pittsburgh. Many of the villagers from Livov and surrounding villages
                                  > emigrated to Toronto, Empire, and Stratton Ohio. These towns are clustered
                                  > together on the Ohio River. Others went to the Braddock, Homestead,
                                  > Pittsburgh Pennsylvania area. There is an Anna Sveda from Luko (ancestral
                                  > village of actor Robert Urich (1946-2002)) going to the Pittsburgh area and
                                  > several other Svedas from Livov, and Livovska Hutta going to the same area
                                  > in Pennsylvania. Unfortunately, I have been unable to change Livova to
                                  > Belova but the EIDB does show a lot of Karaffa and Sveda emigrating from
                                  > that area.
                                  >
                                  > John M.
                                • patricia gavel
                                  Dr. Joe Q wrote: On the marriage license for my ggrandmother Anna Sveda 20yr married 1907 Jakob Gavel 23yr. Above her name ^ Karaffa as
                                  Message 16 of 20 , Nov 12, 2002
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                                    "Dr. Joe Q" <drq@...> wrote:
                                    On the marriage license for my ggrandmother Anna Sveda 20yr married 1907 Jakob Gavel 23yr. Above her name ^ Karaffa as an inserted name. Noone has heard of this name but it must have been in the family somewhere. Oh, they married in Penn.

                                    Patricia

                                    The name Karaffa was in Livov at least until 1980. It is the name of my great great grandfather (Andrej [about 1832 - 1935] who was married Anna Molc^an
                                    [12 Aug 1824 - ?), their daughter Anna Karaffa married Michael Pi'llar (also from Livov).

                                    Dr. "Q"
                                    .


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                                  • Frank
                                    ... is and ... length, which ... area. You ... S^aris ... and she ... Greek ... typo ... they were ... the ... with Libo ... Libowa isn t Lipowa, but you can
                                    Message 17 of 20 , Nov 12, 2002
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                                      --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@y..., "John M," <jmatsko4@c...> wrote:
                                      > At 07:59 AM 11/11/2002 +0100, you wrote:
                                      > >Dear John M.,
                                      > >Of course, this Belova is a misspelling. As I already noted, there
                                      is and
                                      > >was no such place here.
                                      > >Most probably, there was no place to write the name in whole
                                      length, which
                                      > >would have been Beloveza.
                                      > >Vladimir
                                      >
                                      > Dear Vlad,
                                      > I indicated it was misspelled from the beginning. On September 1st,
                                      I wrote:
                                      >
                                      > "There is a town called Bellova Ves but it is in the Bratislava
                                      area. You
                                      > may be looking for Beloveza or Belejovce. Both are in what was
                                      S^aris
                                      > Megye. Beloveza is a short distance to the east of Bardejov."
                                      >
                                      > Good theory Vlad but she said:
                                      >
                                      > "Have been searching LDS films 1792049 & 1792004 Cirkerna matrika in
                                      > Belejovce." (error in naming the village)
                                      >
                                      > FHL INTL Film 1792049 , FHL INTL Film 1792004 are BELOVEZA films
                                      and she
                                      > then said:
                                      >
                                      > "Didn't find any Sveda's or even close to the spelling. They were
                                      Greek
                                      > Catholic and possible related to Karaffa surname. Does anyone have a
                                      > suggestion where to look next?"
                                      >
                                      > One of the EIDB entries I found was for a family of 6 by the name of
                                      > Karaffa. Their home village was spelled Libowa in 5 cases and a
                                      typo
                                      > Lobowa for the 6th. There is no such town in Slovakia. I think
                                      they were
                                      > referring to Livo, now known as Livov and, which had several Karaffa
                                      > emigrees. Since you are fluent in Slovak, perhaps you can explain
                                      the
                                      > ending given to the town name. There are a few towns that begin
                                      with Libo
                                      > but none that end in "wa".
                                      >
                                      > John M.

                                      Libowa isn't Lipowa, but you can use it by way of analogy.

                                      In Slovak, letter v is pron. v and letter v (ending) is pron. w
                                      In Polish, letter w is pron. v.
                                      In German, letter v is pron. f,v and letter w is pron. v.

                                      (There are 8 place names Lipowa located in Poland)

                                      Livo' (H)
                                      Livov (Sk)
                                      Livivi (Rusyn)

                                      Belejovce (Sk) is Belejivci in Rusyn.
                                      Belovez^a (Sk) is Biloveza in Rusyn.

                                      Some names for towns or villages are plural in Slovak.
                                      Often they end in -ice (feminine gender) or -any (masculine gender)

                                      Pies^t'any (m)
                                      Topol'c^any (m)

                                      Kos^ice (f)
                                      Madunice (f)


                                      When Cyrillic alphabet is transliterated into Roman (Latin)
                                      alphabet, 5-6 different spellings are possible - all correct because
                                      there is no standard.
                                      Depends upon which European language the names were transliterated to
                                      last.

                                      Lvov (E) is located 468 km west of Kiev, Ukraine.
                                      Lwów (P)
                                      Lvóv, Lvyv
                                      J| b B i B (Uk)
                                      J| b B O B (Ru)
                                      Leopolis (L)
                                      Lemberg (G)


                                      Or, Kiev (E)
                                      K | | B (Cyrillic)
                                      K i i v
                                      Kief
                                      Kiew
                                      Kijew
                                      Kijow
                                      Kiyev
                                      Kyyi

                                      As for typos in EIR, I found my related surnames under 11 different
                                      place name spellings, which were actually 3 different place names
                                      under Upper Hungary (Slovakia) misspelled.
                                      Sometimes you need to know both the Slovak and Magyar place names so
                                      you can identify the actual village.
                                    • Konekta
                                      Dear Frank, Excellent. Thank you. Always, when I have a problem, identifying the place of one spouse, I try so called genealogical triangulation . I use the
                                      Message 18 of 20 , Nov 13, 2002
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                                        Dear Frank,
                                        Excellent. Thank you.
                                        Always, when I have a problem, identifying the place of one spouse, I try so called " genealogical triangulation".
                                        I use the place of the wife , which should not be far away, if not the same.Have solved couple ud hopeless cases in this way.
                                        Of course, this is not always possible.
                                        Regards,
                                        Vladimir
                                        ----- Original Message -----
                                        From: Frank
                                        To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                                        Sent: Wednesday, November 13, 2002 7:28 AM
                                        Subject: Re: [S-R] City of Belova et al


                                        --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@y..., "John M," <jmatsko4@c...> wrote:
                                        > At 07:59 AM 11/11/2002 +0100, you wrote:
                                        > >Dear John M.,
                                        > >Of course, this Belova is a misspelling. As I already noted, there
                                        is and
                                        > >was no such place here.
                                        > >Most probably, there was no place to write the name in whole
                                        length, which
                                        > >would have been Beloveza.
                                        > >Vladimir
                                        >
                                        > Dear Vlad,
                                        > I indicated it was misspelled from the beginning. On September 1st,
                                        I wrote:
                                        >
                                        > "There is a town called Bellova Ves but it is in the Bratislava
                                        area. You
                                        > may be looking for Beloveza or Belejovce. Both are in what was
                                        S^aris
                                        > Megye. Beloveza is a short distance to the east of Bardejov."
                                        >
                                        > Good theory Vlad but she said:
                                        >
                                        > "Have been searching LDS films 1792049 & 1792004 Cirkerna matrika in
                                        > Belejovce." (error in naming the village)
                                        >
                                        > FHL INTL Film 1792049 , FHL INTL Film 1792004 are BELOVEZA films
                                        and she
                                        > then said:
                                        >
                                        > "Didn't find any Sveda's or even close to the spelling. They were
                                        Greek
                                        > Catholic and possible related to Karaffa surname. Does anyone have a
                                        > suggestion where to look next?"
                                        >
                                        > One of the EIDB entries I found was for a family of 6 by the name of
                                        > Karaffa. Their home village was spelled Libowa in 5 cases and a
                                        typo
                                        > Lobowa for the 6th. There is no such town in Slovakia. I think
                                        they were
                                        > referring to Livo, now known as Livov and, which had several Karaffa
                                        > emigrees. Since you are fluent in Slovak, perhaps you can explain
                                        the
                                        > ending given to the town name. There are a few towns that begin
                                        with Libo
                                        > but none that end in "wa".
                                        >
                                        > John M.

                                        Libowa isn't Lipowa, but you can use it by way of analogy.

                                        In Slovak, letter v is pron. v and letter v (ending) is pron. w
                                        In Polish, letter w is pron. v.
                                        In German, letter v is pron. f,v and letter w is pron. v.

                                        (There are 8 place names Lipowa located in Poland)

                                        Livo' (H)
                                        Livov (Sk)
                                        Livivi (Rusyn)

                                        Belejovce (Sk) is Belejivci in Rusyn.
                                        Belovez^a (Sk) is Biloveza in Rusyn.

                                        Some names for towns or villages are plural in Slovak.
                                        Often they end in -ice (feminine gender) or -any (masculine gender)

                                        Pies^t'any (m)
                                        Topol'c^any (m)

                                        Kos^ice (f)
                                        Madunice (f)


                                        When Cyrillic alphabet is transliterated into Roman (Latin)
                                        alphabet, 5-6 different spellings are possible - all correct because
                                        there is no standard.
                                        Depends upon which European language the names were transliterated to
                                        last.

                                        Lvov (E) is located 468 km west of Kiev, Ukraine.
                                        Lwów (P)
                                        Lvóv, Lvyv
                                        J| b B i B (Uk)
                                        J| b B O B (Ru)
                                        Leopolis (L)
                                        Lemberg (G)


                                        Or, Kiev (E)
                                        K | | B (Cyrillic)
                                        K i i v
                                        Kief
                                        Kiew
                                        Kijew
                                        Kijow
                                        Kiyev
                                        Kyyi

                                        As for typos in EIR, I found my related surnames under 11 different
                                        place name spellings, which were actually 3 different place names
                                        under Upper Hungary (Slovakia) misspelled.
                                        Sometimes you need to know both the Slovak and Magyar place names so
                                        you can identify the actual village.




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