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Re: Re : Austria-Hungary or Slovakia /Language

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  • frankur@att.net
    ... stages ... another ... place (and ... language. That is what the U.S. Census enumerations would list under your Slovak surnames. What did the surname
    Message 1 of 16 , Aug 3, 2001
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      --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@y..., "Theresa Lindamood" <Kinseeker@w...> wrote:
      > Frankfur...your information was helpful for me as I am still in the
      stages
      > of trying to decide whether my Dipko family is from Slovakia or
      another
      > Eastern European country.

      > My immigrant ancestors who listed Austria-Hungary as their birth
      place (and
      > came to America before Ellis Island) listed "Slovak" as their
      language.

      That is what the U.S. Census enumerations would list under your Slovak
      surnames.
      What did the surname naturalization papers list ?

      Before WW I, Slovakia was part of Upper Hungary (Felvidék) and
      part of the Austro-Hungarian Empire (1867-1918) and earlier a
      part of Hungary under the Austrian Empire.

      Of course, the inhabitants of Slovakia spoke Slovak going back to
      whenever
      the language was first established.

      http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/14042a.htm

      > If read your posting correctly, are you saying that Slovak is not
      the
      > language of Slovakia? If it is not the language of Slovakia, whose
      language
      > is it?

      That is not what I wrote.
      The Magyars ruled Slovakia from 906 A.D. to 1918 A.D.

      The language of records was Latin and Hungarian and of administration
      it
      was Hungarian.

      In Upper-Hungary (Slovakia) the parish church registers were in Latin.
      Registers were written in Hungarian 1836-1849.
      After the failed Hungarian revolt (1848-1849) the Austrians banned the
      use of
      Hungarian in registers, and introduced Latin again.
      With establishment of dual Austro-Hungarian Monarchy (1867-1918)
      registers were
      written in Hungarian again.


      > A second question which was left unanswered is, what ports in Europe
      would
      > someone from Austria-Hungary immigrate from? I am not sure where to
      > continue my search. I did look at the Hamburg Passenger lists
      because my
      > Polish ancestors went through Hamburg.

      Probable port of exit in Europe (1871-1913) would depend upon the year
      of
      surname emigration from Hungary to the USA.

      Major European ports used :

      Fiume, Italy
      Trieste, Italy
      Hamburg, Germany
      Bremen, Germany
      Antwerp, Belgium
      Amsterdam, Holland
      Rotterdam, Holland
      Liverpool, England
      Southampton, England
      Le Havre, France
      Cherbourg, France
      Genova, Italy
      Napoli, Italy

      Hamburg and Bremen, Germany were the major ports used based on the
      number of
      emigrants who passed through them enroute to USA.

      Port city of Rijeka (C) Fiume (I) was part of Hungarian Modrus-Fiume
      Megye (county) under the dual Austro-Hungarian Monarchy and is located
      in
      Croatia.

      In 1903, Hungary established the most restrictive Emigration Law in
      the world and tried to funnel all emigrants leaving Hungary via
      Rijeka/Fiume.
      The law also enabled the Hungarian government to make a contract with
      the Cunard Steamship Company for a direct Fiume to New York route.

      Pre-WW I

      Migration from Hungary
      via Rijeka/Fiume

      1903 0 emigrants
      1904 22016
      1905 35961
      1906 49332
      1907 47620
      1908 15411
      1909 36824
      1910 36834
      1911 18532
      1912 21922
      1913 20847

      Migration from Hungary
      via Trieste

      1904 0 emigrants
      1905 867
      1906 3621
      1907 6028
      1908 1805
      1909 4729
      1910 4299
      1911 2379
      1912 3959
      1913 4345

      The Ellis Island Records (1892-1924) list only 2 surname Dipko.

      1 from Bialostock, Russia which I expect is Bialystok, Poland
      located 108 miles NE of Warszawa.
      This would have been located in Russian-Poland (1790s-1918)

      The other was from Guila, Russia which looks like one of several
      place names also located in Poland.

      So I read a Polish connection.
      What was the surname village/town of origin in Slovakia ?
    • frankur@att.net
      ... from ... Tiny Drahová (Sk) is located about 127 miles ENE of Bratislava and near Utekac^ . Now in okres (district) Luc^enec. Kévesliget means little
      Message 2 of 16 , Aug 3, 2001
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        --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@y..., "Monyak, Stephanie" <monyaksl@m...> wrote:
        > Risko and Bodzer were listed on their declarations of intention were
        from
        > Drahova, and kevesliget and also Chumalov.

        Tiny Drahová (Sk) is located about 127 miles ENE of Bratislava and
        near Utekac^ .
        Now in okres (district) Luc^enec.
        Kévesliget means 'little grove' in Magyar.

        What was surname religion ?
        Doubt it was Roman Catholic ?
        Probably G.C.

        R.C. parish church records (1804-1895) for Drahová are listed under
        Kokava nad Rimavicou.
        Text in LATIN and HUNGARIAN.


        > Also on the ship manifest it said
        > the language for Risko was Ruthenian

        Carpatho-Rusyn, Rusnak, Ruthenian akin to Ukrainian.

        > the Monyak or Manyak name was from 'austria-hungary'and they were
        called
        > 'white russians' one city was Bukavena too.

        Byelorussia (now Belarus)
      • Monyak, Stephanie
        they were Ukrainain orthodox-I have tried contacting the us diocese-but they are not as good with their church records as roman Catholics are. Risko and Bodzer
        Message 3 of 16 , Aug 3, 2001
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          they were Ukrainain orthodox-I have tried contacting the us diocese-but they
          are not as good with their church records as roman Catholics are.
          Risko and Bodzer were married in 1909 in Brownseville,Pa-but there is no
          church that I can find that existed then-and I called the diocese out of new
          York and they refer me back to the local church-which I can't find. They
          also had to apply to be married-but in about 10 of the surrounding counties
          I can find no marriage applications from them.

          You are being so extremely helpful-thank you!

          Oh I do have a copy of a birth record from 1905 of a great aunt-would there
          be anyplace I could send it to see if someone might recognize the city or
          local? I do think it was also Bukovena-and there may be more birth records
          of other siblings there.

          -----Original Message-----
          From: frankur@... [mailto:frankur@...]
          Sent: Friday, August 03, 2001 10:32 AM
          To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: Re: [S-R] Re : Austria-Hungary or Slovakia /Language


          --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@y..., "Monyak, Stephanie" <monyaksl@m...> wrote:
          > Risko and Bodzer were listed on their declarations of intention were
          from
          > Drahova, and kevesliget and also Chumalov.

          Tiny Drahová (Sk) is located about 127 miles ENE of Bratislava and
          near Utekac^ .
          Now in okres (district) Luc^enec.
          Kévesliget means 'little grove' in Magyar.

          What was surname religion ?
          Doubt it was Roman Catholic ?
          Probably G.C.

          R.C. parish church records (1804-1895) for Drahová are listed under
          Kokava nad Rimavicou.
          Text in LATIN and HUNGARIAN.


          > Also on the ship manifest it said
          > the language for Risko was Ruthenian

          Carpatho-Rusyn, Rusnak, Ruthenian akin to Ukrainian.

          > the Monyak or Manyak name was from 'austria-hungary'and they were
          called
          > 'white russians' one city was Bukavena too.

          Byelorussia (now Belarus)







          Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/



          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • John
          ... Dargov, which was known as Drahov for the years 1948-1964 is about 12 miles east of Kos^ice and in an area that I believe would fall into the Ruthenian
          Message 4 of 16 , Aug 3, 2001
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            At 08:14 AM 8/3/01 -0400, you wrote:
            >Risko and Bodzer were listed on their declarations of intention were from
            >Drahova, and kevesliget and also Chumalov. Also on the ship manifest it said
            >the language for Risko was Ruthenian

            Dargov, which was known as Drahov for the years 1948-1964 is about 12 miles
            east of Kos^ice and in an area that I believe would fall into the Ruthenian
            category. There are a few Ris^ko (Rishko) in the Kos^ice phone directory.

            >the Monyak or Manyak name was from 'austria-hungary'and they were called
            >'white russians' one city was Bukavena too.

            Bukavena - There are 3 Bukovina in Slovakia, several in the Czech
            Republic, Poland, etc.. I've heard the term "White Russians" (Bela Rus a
            country west of Russia and north of Ukraine) used by some families to
            distinguish themselves from "Red Russians" (the bad guys) when they were
            actually Rusyns, Ruthenians, Pod Karpatski Rus, etc.. Normally first
            generation immigrants married in Europe and if not, they emigrated to areas
            where their families, neighbors and neighboring villagers emigrated
            to. They would then most likely marry into the same culture (religion,
            language, etc.). What I'm saying is there is a good likelihood that all
            were from the area now located in NE Slovakia, SE Poland, W Ukraine. If
            they were from SE Poland it probably would have been written as
            Bukowina. There is a Bukowina located just north of the Slovak border
            about 20 miles east of Stara Lubovna in an area that would have been
            considered to be Rusyn.

            Do you know what religion they were. That would be helpful. My s-i-l's
            family believed their grandfather was Bohemian but as I found out, he was
            Greek Catholic, Rusyn, and from NE Slovakia. Frank K may have a better
            handle on this. I couldn't locate some of the towns you mentioned.
            *****
            Just read your post about their religion. Ukrainian Orthodox is
            essentially the same as Greek Catholic but they were not reunited with the
            Roman Catholic church. This would indicate they were Ruthenian. Were the
            Monyak, Manyak also U.O.? Did you ever see their name spelled Monjak or
            Manjak?

            John
          • Monyak, Stephanie
            I have seen the monyak spelled MAnyak and on my great grandfather s petition for naturalization as well as his brothers it was misspelled as monyah and
            Message 5 of 16 , Aug 3, 2001
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              I have seen the monyak spelled MAnyak and on my great grandfather's
              petition for naturalization as well as his brothers' it was misspelled as
              monyah and monjak-but that was in this country-that birth certificate REALLY
              looks as if the name were Manyak and the maiden name of the mother was
              Popelicova.
              They came thru Baltimore so I can't even check ellisisland.org.
              I think they were Greek Orthodox.
              OH ON RISKO"S SISTER"S NATURALIZATION PAPERS SHE WAS BORN IN Chumalov' and
              husband was born in Nizny Seliste'Czechoslovakia.
              Bodzer's form says Csumalyava, Austria Hungary

              On the Monyak birth record:
              Bukovina is spelled Bukovinka

              The form says this:

              Vytah z matriky narozeni
              Szuletesi anyakonyvi kivonat

              There are other words too but they use non english-type letters so I can't
              even write it for you.

              There is a seal at the bottom but it is a bad copy and I can't make out what
              it says-that's why I was hoping to fax a copy or mail acopy to someone who
              might recognize the city it was from.
              Another draw back is that may family has been divorced so i never knew any
              of my monyak side except for my dad-and a few internet cousins who sent me
              the birth record.

              -----Original Message-----
              From: John [ mailto:jmatsko4@... <mailto:jmatsko4@...> ]
              Sent: Friday, August 03, 2001 11:33 AM
              To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: RE: [S-R] Re : Austria-Hungary or Slovakia /Language


              At 08:14 AM 8/3/01 -0400, you wrote:
              >Risko and Bodzer were listed on their declarations of intention were from
              >Drahova, and kevesliget and also Chumalov. Also on the ship manifest it
              said
              >the language for Risko was Ruthenian

              Dargov, which was known as Drahov for the years 1948-1964 is about 12 miles
              east of Kos^ice and in an area that I believe would fall into the Ruthenian
              category. There are a few Ris^ko (Rishko) in the Kos^ice phone directory.

              >the Monyak or Manyak name was from 'austria-hungary'and they were called
              >'white russians' one city was Bukavena too.

              Bukavena - There are 3 Bukovina in Slovakia, several in the Czech
              Republic, Poland, etc.. I've heard the term "White Russians" (Bela Rus a
              country west of Russia and north of Ukraine) used by some families to
              distinguish themselves from "Red Russians" (the bad guys) when they were
              actually Rusyns, Ruthenians, Pod Karpatski Rus, etc.. Normally first
              generation immigrants married in Europe and if not, they emigrated to areas
              where their families, neighbors and neighboring villagers emigrated
              to. They would then most likely marry into the same culture (religion,
              language, etc.). What I'm saying is there is a good likelihood that all
              were from the area now located in NE Slovakia, SE Poland, W Ukraine. If
              they were from SE Poland it probably would have been written as
              Bukowina. There is a Bukowina located just north of the Slovak border
              about 20 miles east of Stara Lubovna in an area that would have been
              considered to be Rusyn.

              Do you know what religion they were. That would be helpful. My s-i-l's
              family believed their grandfather was Bohemian but as I found out, he was
              Greek Catholic, Rusyn, and from NE Slovakia. Frank K may have a better
              handle on this. I couldn't locate some of the towns you mentioned.
              *****
              Just read your post about their religion. Ukrainian Orthodox is
              essentially the same as Greek Catholic but they were not reunited with the
              Roman Catholic church. This would indicate they were Ruthenian. Were the
              Monyak, Manyak also U.O.? Did you ever see their name spelled Monjak or
              Manjak?

              John







              Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
              <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>





              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • John
              ... The letter j is usually used for y in slavic and other languages (Jan [Yan] = John, jak [yak] = how). That s why I asked. Also, Mon~ak is pronounced
              Message 6 of 16 , Aug 3, 2001
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                At 12:01 PM 8/3/01 -0400, you wrote:
                >I have seen the monyak spelled MAnyak and on my great grandfather's
                >petition for naturalization as well as his brothers' it was misspelled as
                >monyah and monjak-but that was in this country-that birth certificate REALLY
                >looks as if the name were Manyak and the maiden name of the mother was
                >Popelicova.

                The letter "j" is usually used for "y" in slavic and other languages (Jan
                [Yan] = John, jak [yak] = how). That's why I asked. Also, Mon~ak is
                pronounced Monyak the "n~" being pronounced like in Spanish (la nin~a = la
                ni-nya). There are Mon~ak in Eastern Slovakia.

                >They came thru Baltimore so I can't even check ellisisland.org.

                You can check the Baltimore arrivals through NARA and the LDS FHC but it is
                not as convenient. This site provides some good information on how to:

                http://home.att.net/~arnielang/shipgide.html

                >I think they were Greek Orthodox.

                It was probably Greek Catholic or Ukrainian Orthodox. Greek Orthodox is
                actually the Greek church and I think they use Greek in their liturgy. The
                reason for the Greek in Greek Catholic (use(d) old Slavonic language in
                Divine Liturgy) is to distinguish it (Eastern) from the Roman (Western)
                church (use(d) Latin in their Mass). The Ukrainian Orthodox also uses(sd)
                old Slavonic in their liturgy.The Greek Catholic church is now called
                Byzantine (Eastern) Rite Catholic to decrease the confusion.

                http://www.byzcath.org/

                >OH ON RISKO"S SISTER"S NATURALIZATION PAPERS SHE WAS BORN IN Chumalov' and
                >husband was born in Nizny Seliste'Czechoslovakia.

                Nizny Selice was probably spelled phonetically. Nearest I could come to
                that was a a Niz^ny S^ebes^ or Niz^ny Silac^. You might use Mapquest to
                check them out.

                >Bodzer's form says Csumalyava, Austria Hungary

                That's still a mystery to
                me. Try http://www.jewishgen.org/ShtetlSeeker/loctown.htm to locate.

                >On the Monyak birth record:
                >Bukovina is spelled Bukovinka

                There is a reference that a town called Bukovinka is S^iatorska' Bukovinka
                but it is located just north of the Hungarian border in Central Slovakia
                south of Radzovce and not in Eastern SK.


                >The form says this:
                >
                >Vytah z matriky narozeni

                Extracted from the birth register (Slovak)

                >Szuletesi anyakonyvi kivonat

                Hungarian I believe. Probably the same as the Slovak translation.

                >There are other words too but they use non english-type letters so I can't
                >even write it for you.

                Might say the same as above. Do you mean the alphabet is different? The
                Rusyns, Ruthenians, Ukrianians used the Cyrillic alphabet which is also
                used by the Russians. If you could scan the document or part of it and
                upload to the file section of S-R, it would allow us to look at it.

                >There is a seal at the bottom but it is a bad copy and I can't make out
                >what it says-that's why I was hoping to fax a copy or mail acopy to
                >someone who might recognize the city it was from.

                Scanning and uploading would be the easiest and allow everyone to take a
                crack at it.

                John
              • Monyak, Stephanie
                ... computer only at work and we don t have scanners. I will e-mail the relative who sent me the copy-perhaps he can scan it and send it to me and then I will
                Message 7 of 16 , Aug 3, 2001
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                  :(:(:( I don't have a scanner...that's why I am so bummed out-I have a
                  computer only at work and we don't have scanners.

                  I will e-mail the relative who sent me the copy-perhaps he can scan it and
                  send it to me and then I will forward it to the group.

                  -----Original Message-----
                  From: John [mailto:jmatsko4@...]
                  Sent: Friday, August 03, 2001 2:27 PM
                  To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                  Subject: RE: [S-R] Re : Austria-Hungary or Slovakia /Language


                  At 12:01 PM 8/3/01 -0400, you wrote:
                  >I have seen the monyak spelled MAnyak and on my great grandfather's
                  >petition for naturalization as well as his brothers' it was misspelled as
                  >monyah and monjak-but that was in this country-that birth certificate
                  REALLY
                  >looks as if the name were Manyak and the maiden name of the mother was
                  >Popelicova.

                  The letter "j" is usually used for "y" in slavic and other languages (Jan
                  [Yan] = John, jak [yak] = how). That's why I asked. Also, Mon~ak is
                  pronounced Monyak the "n~" being pronounced like in Spanish (la nin~a = la
                  ni-nya). There are Mon~ak in Eastern Slovakia.

                  >They came thru Baltimore so I can't even check ellisisland.org.

                  You can check the Baltimore arrivals through NARA and the LDS FHC but it is
                  not as convenient. This site provides some good information on how to:

                  http://home.att.net/~arnielang/shipgide.html

                  >I think they were Greek Orthodox.

                  It was probably Greek Catholic or Ukrainian Orthodox. Greek Orthodox is
                  actually the Greek church and I think they use Greek in their liturgy. The
                  reason for the Greek in Greek Catholic (use(d) old Slavonic language in
                  Divine Liturgy) is to distinguish it (Eastern) from the Roman (Western)
                  church (use(d) Latin in their Mass). The Ukrainian Orthodox also uses(sd)
                  old Slavonic in their liturgy.The Greek Catholic church is now called
                  Byzantine (Eastern) Rite Catholic to decrease the confusion.

                  http://www.byzcath.org/

                  >OH ON RISKO"S SISTER"S NATURALIZATION PAPERS SHE WAS BORN IN Chumalov' and
                  >husband was born in Nizny Seliste'Czechoslovakia.

                  Nizny Selice was probably spelled phonetically. Nearest I could come to
                  that was a a Niz^ny S^ebes^ or Niz^ny Silac^. You might use Mapquest to
                  check them out.

                  >Bodzer's form says Csumalyava, Austria Hungary

                  That's still a mystery to
                  me. Try http://www.jewishgen.org/ShtetlSeeker/loctown.htm to locate.

                  >On the Monyak birth record:
                  >Bukovina is spelled Bukovinka

                  There is a reference that a town called Bukovinka is S^iatorska' Bukovinka
                  but it is located just north of the Hungarian border in Central Slovakia
                  south of Radzovce and not in Eastern SK.


                  >The form says this:
                  >
                  >Vytah z matriky narozeni

                  Extracted from the birth register (Slovak)

                  >Szuletesi anyakonyvi kivonat

                  Hungarian I believe. Probably the same as the Slovak translation.

                  >There are other words too but they use non english-type letters so I can't
                  >even write it for you.

                  Might say the same as above. Do you mean the alphabet is different? The
                  Rusyns, Ruthenians, Ukrianians used the Cyrillic alphabet which is also
                  used by the Russians. If you could scan the document or part of it and
                  upload to the file section of S-R, it would allow us to look at it.

                  >There is a seal at the bottom but it is a bad copy and I can't make out
                  >what it says-that's why I was hoping to fax a copy or mail acopy to
                  >someone who might recognize the city it was from.

                  Scanning and uploading would be the easiest and allow everyone to take a
                  crack at it.

                  John







                  Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/



                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • frankur@att.net
                  ... a ... it and ... grandfather s ... misspelled as ... certificate ... was ... Chumalov and ... come to ... Mapquest to ... out ... Naturalization papers
                  Message 8 of 16 , Aug 4, 2001
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                    --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@y..., "Monyak, Stephanie" <monyaksl@m...> wrote:
                    > :(:(:( I don't have a scanner...that's why I am so bummed out-I have
                    a
                    > computer only at work and we don't have scanners.
                    >
                    > I will e-mail the relative who sent me the copy-perhaps he can scan
                    it and
                    > send it to me and then I will forward it to the group.
                    >
                    > -----Original Message-----
                    > From: John [mailto:jmatsko4@h...]
                    > Sent: Friday, August 03, 2001 2:27 PM
                    > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@y...
                    > Subject: RE: [S-R] Re : Austria-Hungary or Slovakia /Language
                    >
                    >
                    > At 12:01 PM 8/3/01 -0400, you wrote:
                    > >I have seen the monyak spelled MAnyak and on my great
                    grandfather's
                    > >petition for naturalization as well as his brothers' it was
                    misspelled as
                    > >monyah and monjak-but that was in this country-that birth
                    certificate
                    > REALLY
                    > >looks as if the name were Manyak and the maiden name of the mother
                    was
                    > >Popelicova.

                    > >OH ON RISKO"S SISTER"S NATURALIZATION PAPERS SHE WAS BORN IN
                    Chumalov' and
                    > >husband was born in Nizny Seliste'Czechoslovakia.
                    >
                    > Nizny Selice was probably spelled phonetically. Nearest I could
                    come to
                    > that was a a Niz^ny S^ebes^ or Niz^ny Silac^. You might use
                    Mapquest to
                    > check them out.
                    >
                    > >Bodzer's form says Csumalyava, Austria Hungary
                    >

                    > >The form says this:
                    > >
                    > >Vytah z matriky narozeni
                    >
                    > Extracted from the birth register (Slovak)
                    >
                    > >Szuletesi anyakonyvi kivonat
                    >

                    > >There is a seal at the bottom but it is a bad copy and I can't make
                    out
                    > >what it says-that's why I was hoping to fax a copy or mail acopy to
                    > >someone who might recognize the city it was from.
                    >

                    Naturalization papers often contain the same type of spelling errors
                    as do the Ellis Island Records.
                    Or they revert to 'sounds-like' spellings.

                    In Hungarian születési anyakönyvi kivonat = birth certificate

                    In Slovak rodny' list = birth certificate

                    vytah z matriky narozeni

                    Slovak

                    vy't'ah = to extract
                    z = from

                    matriky = parish church records
                    Krstení = baptisms (Christenings)
                    Sobás^ení = marriages
                    Zomrelí = deaths

                    narodenie = birth

                    As a rule of Slovak grammar, female surnames end in -á, -ská, or -ová.
                    The feminine form of the surnames is considered merely a separate form
                    of same surname, not a distinct surname in itself.
                    If family surname is a noun in form or origin the suffix -ová is added
                    to it, i.e., Popelic + ová.


                    Hungarian letter cs = Slovak diacritic letter c ^ = ch.
                    Expect that Csumalyava actually was Carpatho-Rusyn village C^umal'ovo
                    now located in the Ukraine.
                    It was formerly located in Subcarpathian Rus' which was part of
                    Czechoslovakia only 1920-1938 but part of Hungary from 10th c to 1918.
                    Csomanfalva (H) Cumaleve (Ukr) Comal'ovo (Rusyn)
                    -falva means village in Hungarian and was often misspelled or
                    misread in records.
                  • Theresa Lindamood
                    Thanks everyone for their help. I have some more stuff to look up now and will probably come back with more questions! Theresa ... Outgoing mail is certified
                    Message 9 of 16 , Aug 5, 2001
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                      Thanks everyone for their help. I have some more stuff to look up now and
                      will probably come back with more questions! Theresa



                      ---
                      Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
                      Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
                      Version: 6.0.265 / Virus Database: 137 - Release Date: 7/18/01
                    • Monyak, Stephanie
                      Theresa, I just noticed your last name-my friend works at lindamood in California-you aren t related to them are you? ... From: Theresa Lindamood
                      Message 10 of 16 , Aug 6, 2001
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                        Theresa,
                        I just noticed your last name-my friend works at lindamood in California-you
                        aren't related to them are you?

                        -----Original Message-----
                        From: Theresa Lindamood [mailto:Kinseeker@...]
                        Sent: Sunday, August 05, 2001 9:16 PM
                        To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                        Subject: Re: [S-R] Re : Austria-Hungary or Slovakia /Language


                        Thanks everyone for their help. I have some more stuff to look up now and
                        will probably come back with more questions! Theresa



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                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      • Richard D. Custer
                        ... said ... Oy vey! Ruthenian, Slovaks, Bukovina, Czechoslovakia, White Russians, Ukrainian Orthodox... So much (mis)information, but nobody got it right...
                        Message 11 of 16 , Aug 6, 2001
                        • 0 Attachment
                          >Risko and Bodzer were listed on their declarations of intention were from
                          >Drahova, and kevesliget and also Chumalov. Also on the ship manifest it
                          said
                          >the language for Risko was Ruthenian
                          >
                          >the Monyak or Manyak name was from 'austria-hungary'and they were called
                          >'white russians' one city was Bukavena too.


                          Oy vey! Ruthenian, Slovaks, Bukovina, Czechoslovakia, White Russians,
                          Ukrainian Orthodox...

                          So much (mis)information, but nobody got it right... but like Mighty Mouse,
                          "here I come to save the day":

                          These places are not in any gazetteers of Slovakia 'cuz they ain't in
                          Slovakia. They're in Ukraine. However, they are in that part of Ukraine
                          which *used to be* in Czechoslovakia, namely Zakarpattia / Subcarpathian
                          Rus'.

                          First village mentioned, "Drahova" is Drahovo, Maramaros County, Hungary,
                          now Khustskyj Rajon [Khust District], Zakarpatska Oblast [Transcarpathian
                          Region], Ukraine.

                          Kevesliget should be Kovesliget, which is now Drahovo as above.

                          Chumalov was Csomanfalva, Chumaleve or Chumal'ovo, Maramaros County,
                          Hungary, now Khustskyj Rajon [Khust District], Zakarpatska Oblast
                          [Transcarpathian Region], Ukraine.

                          >OH ON RISKO"S SISTER"S NATURALIZATION PAPERS SHE WAS BORN IN Chumalov' and
                          >husband was born in Nizny Seliste'Czechoslovakia.
                          >Bodzer's form says Csumalyava, Austria Hungary

                          Nizny Seliste should be Nyzhnje Selyshche, Maramaros County, Hungary, now
                          Khustskyj Rajon [Khust District], Zakarpatska Oblast [Transcarpathian
                          Region], Ukraine.

                          Csumalyava as above is Chumal'ovo / Chumaleve.

                          All these villages are adjacent, within a few miles of each other. They
                          appear on this map segment:
                          http://www.lemko.org/atlas/Pages/Pg59.html
                          In the lower third of the map, look just east of the red blotch, the city of
                          Khust (XYCT). They're all along the same road: Nyzhnje Selyshche, then the
                          road goes east & north to Drahovo, or east and south to Chumal'ovo and
                          Krychovo.

                          Zakarpatska Oblast was part of Czechoslovakia (the eastern province, known
                          as Podkarpatska Rus' or Subcarpathian Rus'/Ruthenia) from ~1920 until 1945
                          when it was given to the Soviet Union.

                          There were dozens of families who settled in the Brownsville, PA area from
                          these villages. Also in Vintondale, PA (Indiana County). They were
                          Byzantine/Greek Catholics when they came to the USA but most became
                          [Russian] Orthodox here.

                          I have data on all marriages of Rusyns who lived in Brownsville, PA vicinity
                          through ~1915 whether Greek Catholic or Orthodox. First Rusyn church in
                          Brownsville was St. Nicholas Greek Catholic (1911). Before that they
                          attended Holy Ghost Greek Catholic in Charleroi (1899). Some who converted
                          to Orthodoxy attended Holy Trinity Russian Orthodox in Charleroi (1901) and
                          later Holy Resurrection Russian Orthodox in West Brownsville (1915). There
                          were no Ukrainian Catholic or Ukrainian Orthodox churches in this part of
                          the Monongahela River valley -- but these people were not Ukrainians in the
                          first place, so you need not be concerned with finding a Ukrainian Orthodox
                          church for your research.

                          I have the same info for Vintondale.

                          Nothing of all this has anything to do with Slovaks, Slovakia, etc. Try
                          these sites:
                          www.carpatho-rusyn.org
                          www.carpathorusynsociety.org
                          or the "Rusyns" list at topica.com .

                          If you have questions about the data I have, please email me privately, as
                          this is a Slovak list.

                          RDC
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