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Re: [S-R] Domicella Maria Kesmanszky, virgin noble, Civ

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  • htcstech
    I m sure the consensus is right. Named after a town is very common. I posted that previous info about Magyar tribal names as a possible source. Have you any
    Message 1 of 31 , Apr 26, 2012
      I'm sure the consensus is right. Named after a town is very common. I
      posted that previous info about Magyar tribal names as a possible source.
      Have you any idea of the meaning or origin of the ~KO endings in some
      surnames?

      Peter M.

      On 26 April 2012 21:49, <david1law@...> wrote:

      > **
      >
      >
      > Dear Peter:
      >
      > I agree with the others who state that surname appears to be KESZMARSKY.
      > When I did a GOOGLE.COM search, there were only 6 results for KEZMANSKY,
      > 3
      > results for KEZMANSZKY, 0 results for KESZMANSKY, and 0 results for
      > KESZMANSZKY. In comparison, KEZMARSKY yields 78,000+ results, The -SKY in
      > Slovak
      > means "of" or "from the land of" similar to the Polish -SKI, and the -SZKY
      > is simply a variant in spelling of the Slovak - SKY. I love name
      > etymology and I definitely agree with Ladislav on his research that the
      > surname
      > derives from the town of Kežmarok/Késmárk.
      >
      > Best regards,
      >
      > David
      >
      >
      > In a message dated 4/26/2012 3:32:02 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
      > lacoros@... writes:
      >
      > Peter,
      >
      > Thanks for your information – but I dont believe you are right. I wrote
      > more about Kežmarok/Késmárk in my pervious mail.
      >
      > Names which are derived from names of old hungarian tribes are more in the
      > south of Slovakia – like Meder (Totmeder now Palarikovo or Velky Meder) or
      > Assakert (now Nové Dvory) from Kurth. The northern part of Slovakia became
      > a real part of Hungarian Kigndom only in 11th century – it took some time
      > while the border between Hungary and Poland was cleared. In that time the
      > Magyar tribes were only history.
      >
      > You cann read about Kežmarok in wikipedia _
      > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ke_
      > (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ke) žmarok weh have written sources only
      > from the time after the Mongol invasion. In that time the population was
      > very
      > low, so the king invated settler from Germany to Spiš (Szepes).
      >
      > Ladislav
      >
      > From: _SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com_ (mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com)
      >
      > [mailto:_SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com_
      > (mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com) ] On Behalf Of htcstech
      >
      > Sent: Thursday, April 26, 2012 7:50 AM
      > To: _SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com_ (mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com)
      > Subject: Re: [S-R] Domicella Maria Kesmanszky, virgin noble, Civ
      >
      > Thanks Vilo.... I think..!
      >
      > Kesz was the name of one of the original tribes of Hungary. It means HAND.
      > Marok means Palm of the hand.
      > Keszmarok means the palm of the hand. It can also mean the quantity - like
      > handful.
      >
      > Although officially the names of the Magyar tribes have been lost, I read
      > this somewhere and made a note:
      > (explanations are not mine)
      > The 7 Hungarian tribes were the *Hetmagyar*: *Jenő,* *Kér,* *Keszi,* *
      > Kürt-Gyarmat,* *Megyer* (Magyar), *Nyék,* and *Tarján* and their meanings
      > in English are:
      > Hetmagyar - Het=7=Hepta (Greek)
      > Jeno: Noble - Jeno is Eugene and the Western scholars think that it
      > originates from ancient Greek.
      > Ker: Circle - Building. Mansi tribe to this day build circular houses and
      > villages.
      > Keszi: The Hand - Fashioning items - Industry
      > Kurt-Gyarmat: The Garden Industry - Agricultural specialists
      > Megyer (Magyar): The Land - The most populous and the Seat of Arpad who was
      > the elected leader by the other 6 tribal chiefs.
      > Nyek: The Borderlands - They were expeditionary scouting forces - 5000 of
      > them were sent out and circumnavigated the European coast from Latvia
      > through France, Spain (Basque), Greece, Italy and Adriatic before returning
      > back to the Carpathians. The Basque language has similarity to Magyar.
      > Tarjan: The Whip - A battle whip - actually used by the Huns in battle
      > circa 500AD
      >
      > Additional tribes joined in the settlement and defense. They were the
      > Sarmatians, Scythians (Szekely), Huns and some Iranian and Turkic peoples.
      > By the time of King Stephen, all of these tribes had been conquered by the
      > Megyer (Magyar) tribe, who took ascendancy.
      > In fact, his father Geza, started the Christianization of the people. It
      > was Stephen who finished it and got crowned in the process.
      > Unfortunately, the original Magyar runic writings were destroyed in the
      > process of Christianization as well as the pagan belief world view.
      > I have read that these beliefs were tree based. A Shaman would climb a tree
      > under the effects of Scythian drugs and foretell the future :)
      > Sometimes I wonder what would have happened if the Magyars refused to
      > convert and keep the tribal governance instead.
      >
      > Peter M.
      >
      > On 26 April 2012 13:29, William C. Wormuth <_senzus@..._
      > (mailto:senzus@...) <mailto:senzus%40ymail.com> > wrote:
      >
      > > **
      > >
      > >
      > > Jane,
      > >
      > > I agree with your premise but not the way you listed names:
      > > Kesmanszky is [Kehshmahn-skee]. Hungarian s =sh and sz = s
      > >
      > > Kezsmanszky is [Kehzhmahn-skee]. Hungarian zs = zh
      > >
      > > In order for this spelling to be Kezmanszkyand pronounced
      > > [Kehzhmahn-skee], it would have been a mix of Slovak and Hungarian.
      > >
      > > Kezsmarszky [Kezhmahrr-sky] or Kez~marsky has a phome listing in Spis~sky
      > > Hrhov.
      > >
      > > This one is a mystery. We need Peter to be the translator for all. :o)
      > > :o) :o)
      > >
      > > Z Bohom,
      > >
      > > Vilko
      > >
      > > ________________________________
      > > From: Janet Kozlay <_kozlay@..._ (mailto:kozlay@...)
      > <mailto:kozlay%40verizon.net> >
      > > To: _SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com_ (mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com)
      >
      > <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
      > > Sent: Wednesday, April 25, 2012 9:45 PM
      > > Subject: RE: [S-R] Domicella Maria Kesmanszky, virgin noble, Civ
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > > Jane,
      > >
      > > Unless you have additional information to the contrary, I think you may
      > be
      > > misreading the Kesmanszky name, which I think is more likely Kesmarszky.
      > > According to Siebmacher's Wappenbuch, Georg Kesmarszky was ennobled in
      > 1649
      > > in Zips/Szepes/Spis county. It may also be spelled Kezmarszky or
      > > Kezsmarszky. No doubt the name derives from Kesmark (Kezmarok), which is
      > in
      > > the same general area that you are looking at.
      > >
      > > Janet
      > >
      > > From: _SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com_
      > (mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com) <mailto:
      > SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
      > [mailto:_SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com_ (mailto:
      > SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com)
      > <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> ]
      > > On
      > > Behalf Of Jane Murray
      > > Sent: Saturday, April 21, 2012 3:04 PM
      > > To: _SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com_ (mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com)
      >
      > <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
      > > Subject: [S-R] Domicella Maria Kesmanszky, virgin noble, Civ
      > >
      > > Please assist with a clarification on baptismal records for all the
      > > children
      > > born to my great,great, grandparents. The godparents are same for all
      > six
      > > children. D. Michael Hufzko & Domicella Maria Kesmanszky, virgin nob. I
      > > have included two image references.
      > > Reference: LDS Film 1739896 Roll 141, Item#2, Volume 763, 1803-1853
      > Spisske
      > > Podhradie, Image 325 & 351 (Sophia & Victoria birth records, child of
      > > Joannes & Maria Felenik Szabo)
      > > I did a google search for the name "Kesmanszky" to see if there was an
      > > important significance to the name, but could not find one. Would the "D"
      > > in front of Michael's name indicate a Doctor? What does the Domicella
      > > indicate besides "House of". Would this mean my great, great grandfather
      > > was employed by this house? I have found no relationship tie to those two
      > > individuals.
      > >
      > > I knew I would not be able to take the summer off from research, my
      > husband
      > > will just roll his eyes!
      > >
      > > Thanks again, Jane
      > >
      > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      > >
      > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      > >
      > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      > >
      > >
      > >
      >
      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      >
      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      >
      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      >
      >
      >


      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • david1law@aol.com
      Peter: The -ko can be a diminutive found among the Ruthenians, Rusyns, and other Slavic peoples, such as Jurasko. If the root of the name appears to be a
      Message 31 of 31 , Apr 26, 2012
        Peter:

        The "-ko" can be a diminutive found among the Ruthenians, Rusyns, and other
        Slavic peoples, such as Jurasko. If the root of the name appears to be a
        personal name, such as Juras (George), then it's most likely a Slavic
        family name with the -ko at the end. In Hungarian, "kő"
        means "stone" such as Boldogkő which means "Happy Stone" in Hungarian).
        With name etymology, one needs to be very careful, and if it is a village
        name, it is good to compare the equivalent names of the village in other
        languages (such as the Latin or the German), as they can sometimes offer some
        clues as to the origin of the name, as the equivalent names will often
        parallel the Slavic or Hungarian name.

        I hope that this helps a little.

        Best regards,

        David


        In a message dated 4/26/2012 9:57:25 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
        htcstech@... writes:




        I'm sure the consensus is right. Named after a town is very common. I
        posted that previous info about Magyar tribal names as a possible source.
        Have you any idea of the meaning or origin of the ~KO endings in some
        surnames?

        Peter M.

        On 26 April 2012 21:49, <_david1law@..._ (mailto:david1law@...) >
        wrote:

        > **
        >
        >
        > Dear Peter:
        >
        > I agree with the others who state that surname appears to be KESZMARSKY.
        > When I did a GOOGLE.COM search, there were only 6 results for KEZMANSKY,
        > 3
        > results for KEZMANSZKY, 0 results for KESZMANSKY, and 0 results for
        > KESZMANSZKY. In comparison, KEZMARSKY yields 78,000+ results, The -SKY
        in
        > Slovak
        > means "of" or "from the land of" similar to the Polish -SKI, and the
        -SZKY
        > is simply a variant in spelling of the Slovak - SKY. I love name
        > etymology and I definitely agree with Ladislav on his research that the
        > surname
        > derives from the town of Kežmarok/Késmárk.
        >
        > Best regards,
        >
        > David
        >
        >
        > In a message dated 4/26/2012 3:32:02 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
        > _lacoros@..._ (mailto:lacoros@...) writes:
        >
        > Peter,
        >
        > Thanks for your information – but I dont believe you are right. I wrote
        > more about Kežmarok/Késmárk in my pervious mail.
        >
        > Names which are derived from names of old hungarian tribes are more in
        the
        > south of Slovakia – like Meder (Totmeder now Palarikovo or Velky Meder)
        or
        > Assakert (now Nové Dvory) from Kurth. The northern part of Slovakia
        became
        > a real part of Hungarian Kigndom only in 11th century – it took some time
        > while the border between Hungary and Poland was cleared. In that time the
        > Magyar tribes were only history.
        >
        > You cann read about Kežmarok in wikipedia _
        > _http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ke__ (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ke_)
        > (_http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ke_ (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ke) ) ž
        marok weh have written sources only
        > from the time after the Mongol invasion. In that time the population was
        > very
        > low, so the king invated settler from Germany to Spiš (Szepes).
        >
        > Ladislav
        >
        > From: __SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com_
        (mailto:_SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com) _ (mailto:_SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com_
        (mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com) )
        >
        > [mailto:__SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com_
        (mailto:_SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com) _
        > (mailto:_SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com_
        (mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com) ) ] On Behalf Of htcstech
        >
        > Sent: Thursday, April 26, 2012 7:50 AM
        > To: __SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com_
        (mailto:_SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com) _ (mailto:_SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com_
        (mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com) )
        > Subject: Re: [S-R] Domicella Maria Kesmanszky, virgin noble, Civ
        >
        > Thanks Vilo.... I think..!
        >
        > Kesz was the name of one of the original tribes of Hungary. It means
        HAND.
        > Marok means Palm of the hand.
        > Keszmarok means the palm of the hand. It can also mean the quantity -
        like
        > handful.
        >
        > Although officially the names of the Magyar tribes have been lost, I read
        > this somewhere and made a note:
        > (explanations are not mine)
        > The 7 Hungarian tribes were the *Hetmagyar*: *Jenő,* *Kér,* *Keszi,* *
        > Kürt-Gyarmat,* *Megyer* (Magyar), *Nyék,* and *Tarján* and their
        meanings
        > in English are:
        > Hetmagyar - Het=7=Hepta (Greek)
        > Jeno: Noble - Jeno is Eugene and the Western scholars think that it
        > originates from ancient Greek.
        > Ker: Circle - Building. Mansi tribe to this day build circular houses and
        > villages.
        > Keszi: The Hand - Fashioning items - Industry
        > Kurt-Gyarmat: The Garden Industry - Agricultural specialists
        > Megyer (Magyar): The Land - The most populous and the Seat of Arpad who
        was
        > the elected leader by the other 6 tribal chiefs.
        > Nyek: The Borderlands - They were expeditionary scouting forces - 5000 of
        > them were sent out and circumnavigated the European coast from Latvia
        > through France, Spain (Basque), Greece, Italy and Adriatic before
        returning
        > back to the Carpathians. The Basque language has similarity to Magyar.
        > Tarjan: The Whip - A battle whip - actually used by the Huns in battle
        > circa 500AD
        >
        > Additional tribes joined in the settlement and defense. They were the
        > Sarmatians, Scythians (Szekely), Huns and some Iranian and Turkic
        peoples.
        > By the time of King Stephen, all of these tribes had been conquered by
        the
        > Megyer (Magyar) tribe, who took ascendancy.
        > In fact, his father Geza, started the Christianization of the people. It
        > was Stephen who finished it and got crowned in the process.
        > Unfortunately, the original Magyar runic writings were destroyed in the
        > process of Christianization as well as the pagan belief world view.
        > I have read that these beliefs were tree based. A Shaman would climb a
        tree
        > under the effects of Scythian drugs and foretell the future :)
        > Sometimes I wonder what would have happened if the Magyars refused to
        > convert and keep the tribal governance instead.
        >
        > Peter M.
        >
        > On 26 April 2012 13:29, William C. Wormuth <__senzus@..._
        (mailto:_senzus@...) _
        > (mailto:_senzus@..._ (mailto:senzus@...) )
        <mailto:senzus%40ymail.com> > wrote:
        >
        > > **
        > >
        > >
        > > Jane,
        > >
        > > I agree with your premise but not the way you listed names:
        > > Kesmanszky is [Kehshmahn-skee]. Hungarian s =sh and sz = s
        > >
        > > Kezsmanszky is [Kehzhmahn-skee]. Hungarian zs = zh
        > >
        > > In order for this spelling to be Kezmanszkyand pronounced
        > > [Kehzhmahn-skee], it would have been a mix of Slovak and Hungarian.
        > >
        > > Kezsmarszky [Kezhmahrr-sky] or Kez~marsky has a phome listing in
        Spis~sky
        > > Hrhov.
        > >
        > > This one is a mystery. We need Peter to be the translator for all. :o)
        > > :o) :o)
        > >
        > > Z Bohom,
        > >
        > > Vilko
        > >
        > > ________________________________
        > > From: Janet Kozlay <__kozlay@..._ (mailto:_kozlay@...)
        _ (mailto:_kozlay@..._ (mailto:kozlay@...) )
        > <mailto:kozlay%40verizon.net> >
        > > To: __SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com_
        (mailto:_SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com) _ (mailto:_SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com_
        (mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com) )
        >
        > <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
        > > Sent: Wednesday, April 25, 2012 9:45 PM
        > > Subject: RE: [S-R] Domicella Maria Kesmanszky, virgin noble, Civ
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > > Jane,
        > >
        > > Unless you have additional information to the contrary, I think you may
        > be
        > > misreading the Kesmanszky name, which I think is more likely
        Kesmarszky.
        > > According to Siebmacher's Wappenbuch, Georg Kesmarszky was ennobled in
        > 1649
        > > in Zips/Szepes/Spis county. It may also be spelled Kezmarszky or
        > > Kezsmarszky. No doubt the name derives from Kesmark (Kezmarok), which
        is
        > in
        > > the same general area that you are looking at.
        > >
        > > Janet
        > >
        > > From: __SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com_
        (mailto:_SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com) _
        > (mailto:_SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com_
        (mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com) ) <mailto:
        > SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
        > [mailto:__SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com_
        (mailto:_SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com) _ (mailto:
        > _SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com_ (mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com) )
        > <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> ]
        > > On
        > > Behalf Of Jane Murray
        > > Sent: Saturday, April 21, 2012 3:04 PM
        > > To: __SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com_
        (mailto:_SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com) _ (mailto:_SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com_
        (mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com) )
        >
        > <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
        > > Subject: [S-R] Domicella Maria Kesmanszky, virgin noble, Civ
        > >
        > > Please assist with a clarification on baptismal records for all the
        > > children
        > > born to my great,great, grandparents. The godparents are same for all
        > six
        > > children. D. Michael Hufzko & Domicella Maria Kesmanszky, virgin nob. I
        > > have included two image references.
        > > Reference: LDS Film 1739896 Roll 141, Item#2, Volume 763, 1803-1853
        > Spisske
        > > Podhradie, Image 325 & 351 (Sophia & Victoria birth records, child of
        > > Joannes & Maria Felenik Szabo)
        > > I did a google search for the name "Kesmanszky" to see if there was an
        > > important significance to the name, but could not find one. Would the
        "D"
        > > in front of Michael's name indicate a Doctor? What does the Domicella
        > > indicate besides "House of". Would this mean my great, great
        grandfather
        > > was employed by this house? I have found no relationship tie to those
        two
        > > individuals.
        > >
        > > I knew I would not be able to take the summer off from research, my
        > husband
        > > will just roll his eyes!
        > >
        > > Thanks again, Jane
        > >
        > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        > >
        > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        > >
        > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        > >
        > >
        > >
        >
        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        >
        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        >
        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        >
        >
        >

        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]






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