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Surname:Nyemecz/Nemeth/Nimetz

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  • haluska
    Ahoj Group, Any insights into the surname Nimetz being of German lineage? This was the preferred spelling of a relation that came over from Shkurativtsi,
    Message 1 of 15 , Mar 26, 2011
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      Ahoj Group,

      Any insights into the surname "Nimetz" being of German lineage?

      This was the preferred spelling of a relation that came over from
      Shkurativtsi, Zakarpats'ka, Ukraine.

      I have also seen the name spelled "Nemeth" in the U.S.Census.

      I suspect the name to have been actually "Nyemec"

      This is very confusing since I am told that the family spoke Rusyn.

      Anything added to this would greatly help my research.

      Thanks,

      Dennis


      Bereghalmos > Munkacz > Kingdom of Hungary, Austro-Hungarian Empire and Kalnyk was formerly called Beregsarret

      Shurativtsi is a part of the Kalnyk village cluster, with which it shares its post ofc (zip 89633) and Village Administration


      Ellis Island


      Name: György Nyimecz
      Arrival Date: 30 Nov 1906
      Birth Year: abt 1889
      Birth Location Other: bereghalom
      Age: 17
      Gender: Male
      Ethnicity/Race­/Nationality: Slovakian
      Port of Departure: Fiume
      Port of Arrival: New York, New York
      Ship Name: Slavonia
    • Ron
      I lived in Germany for ten years and over time noticed that a lot of the names ending in tz and ke came from Eastern German, an area originally settled by
      Message 2 of 15 , Mar 26, 2011
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        I lived in Germany for ten years and over time noticed that a lot of the names ending in "tz" and "ke" came from Eastern German, an area originally settled by Sorbs and Wends and assimilated over time into the expanding Germans.

        I just did a Google search for "sorbian name nimetz" and came up with what I consider a partial confirmation. For the short of it, read
        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nimitz

        Then again the common Slavic word for German is Nemec ... with various spellingd depending upn language and orthography.

        Ron

        --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com, "haluska" <ddhalusker@...> wrote:
        >
        > Ahoj Group,
        >
        > Any insights into the surname "Nimetz" being of German lineage?
        >
        > This was the preferred spelling of a relation that came over from
        > Shkurativtsi, Zakarpats'ka, Ukraine.
        >
        > I have also seen the name spelled "Nemeth" in the U.S.Census.
        >
        > I suspect the name to have been actually "Nyemec"
        >
        > This is very confusing since I am told that the family spoke Rusyn.
        >
        > Anything added to this would greatly help my research.
        >
        > Thanks,
        >
        > Dennis
        >
        >
        > Bereghalmos > Munkacz > Kingdom of Hungary, Austro-Hungarian Empire and Kalnyk was formerly called Beregsarret
        >
        > Shurativtsi is a part of the Kalnyk village cluster, with which it shares its post ofc (zip 89633) and Village Administration
        >
        >
        > Ellis Island
        >
        >
        > Name: György Nyimecz
        > Arrival Date: 30 Nov 1906
        > Birth Year: abt 1889
        > Birth Location Other: bereghalom
        > Age: 17
        > Gender: Male
        > Ethnicity/Race­/Nationality: Slovakian
        > Port of Departure: Fiume
        > Port of Arrival: New York, New York
        > Ship Name: Slavonia
        >
      • haluska
        Truly Fascinating Ron! Thanks...
        Message 3 of 15 , Mar 26, 2011
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          Truly Fascinating Ron! Thanks...

          --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com, "Ron" <amiak27@...> wrote:
          >
          > I lived in Germany for ten years and over time noticed that a lot of the names ending in "tz" and "ke" came from Eastern German, an area originally settled by Sorbs and Wends and assimilated over time into the expanding Germans.
          >
          > I just did a Google search for "sorbian name nimetz" and came up with what I consider a partial confirmation. For the short of it, read
          > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nimitz
          >
          > Then again the common Slavic word for German is Nemec ... with various spellingd depending upn language and orthography.
          >
          > Ron
          >
          > --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com, "haluska" <ddhalusker@> wrote:
          > >
          > > Ahoj Group,
          > >
          > > Any insights into the surname "Nimetz" being of German lineage?
          > >
          > > This was the preferred spelling of a relation that came over from
          > > Shkurativtsi, Zakarpats'ka, Ukraine.
          > >
          > > I have also seen the name spelled "Nemeth" in the U.S.Census.
          > >
          > > I suspect the name to have been actually "Nyemec"
          > >
          > > This is very confusing since I am told that the family spoke Rusyn.
          > >
          > > Anything added to this would greatly help my research.
          > >
          > > Thanks,
          > >
          > > Dennis
          > >
          > >
          > > Bereghalmos > Munkacz > Kingdom of Hungary, Austro-Hungarian Empire and Kalnyk was formerly called Beregsarret
          > >
          > > Shurativtsi is a part of the Kalnyk village cluster, with which it shares its post ofc (zip 89633) and Village Administration
          > >
          > >
          > > Ellis Island
          > >
          > >
          > > Name: György Nyimecz
          > > Arrival Date: 30 Nov 1906
          > > Birth Year: abt 1889
          > > Birth Location Other: bereghalom
          > > Age: 17
          > > Gender: Male
          > > Ethnicity/Race­/Nationality: Slovakian
          > > Port of Departure: Fiume
          > > Port of Arrival: New York, New York
          > > Ship Name: Slavonia
          > >
          >
        • John
          ... I am no expert but I believe that the word means German in Slovak and would be spelled Nemec.
          Message 4 of 15 , Mar 26, 2011
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            >>> Any insights into the surname "Nimetz" being of German lineage? <<<

            I am no expert but I believe that the word means German in Slovak and would be spelled Nemec.
          • n8de@thepoint.net
            I have seen the name with multiple spellings, including, but not limited to: Niemiec, Nemec, Nyemyetz ... and any other phonetic concoction you can think of.
            Message 5 of 15 , Mar 26, 2011
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              I have seen the name with multiple spellings, including, but not limited to:

              Niemiec, Nemec, Nyemyetz ... and any other phonetic concoction you can
              think of.

              Good luck
              Don Havlicek

              ..... Havlicsek, Havlitsek, Hlavecsek, etc ...etc ... etc...

              All spelling from hand-written records in 'Upper Hungary'.


              Quoting John <johnqadam@...>:

              >>>> Any insights into the surname "Nimetz" being of German lineage? <<<
              >
              > I am no expert but I believe that the word means German in Slovak
              > and would be spelled Nemec.
              >
              >
            • lkocik@comcast.net
              Hi`  Nemec originally meant mumbler and referred to people from elsewhere, that spoke a dialect or language that wasn t understood.  It eventually morphed
              Message 6 of 15 , Mar 26, 2011
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                Hi`

                 Nemec originally meant "mumbler" and referred to people from elsewhere, that spoke a dialect or language that wasn't understood.

                 It eventually morphed into specifically meaning a person from Germany.

                 I don't speak the language and can't cite my sources, so I would advise you to verify this if you are researching the origins on your name.

                 Good luck, I think researching roots and origins of surnames is not just interesting but helps understand the alternate spellings and helps you know what to look for in the older records.

                Larry----- Original Message -----
                From: n8de@...
                To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com, "John" <johnqadam@...>
                Sent: Saturday, March 26, 2011 1:50:00 PM
                Subject: Re: [S-R] Re: Surname:Nyemecz/Nemeth/Nimetz

                I have seen the name with multiple spellings, including, but not limited to:

                Niemiec, Nemec, Nyemyetz ... and any other phonetic concoction you can  
                think of.

                Good luck
                Don Havlicek

                ..... Havlicsek, Havlitsek, Hlavecsek, etc ...etc ... etc...

                All spelling from hand-written records in 'Upper Hungary'.


                Quoting John <johnqadam@...>:

                >>>> Any insights into the surname "Nimetz" being of German lineage? <<<
                >
                > I am no expert but I believe that the word means German in Slovak  
                > and would be spelled Nemec.
                >
                >





                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • Frank R Plichta
                Nemec is the Slovak word for German nemc^ina is also German Nemecko is Germany Nemecky is German It is not that these words morphed in
                Message 7 of 15 , Mar 26, 2011
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                  "Nemec" is the Slovak word for "German"

                  "nemc^ina" is also "German"

                  "Nemecko" is "Germany"

                  "Nemecky' " is "German"



                  It is not that these words "morphed" in meaning a person from Germany. They
                  are the Slovak words for Germany.



                  _____

                  From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com] On
                  Behalf Of lkocik@...
                  Sent: Saturday, March 26, 2011 4:06 PM
                  To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                  Subject: Re: [S-R] Re: Surname:Nyemecz/Nemeth/Nimetz

                  Nemec originally meant "mumbler" and referred to people from elsewhere,
                  that spoke a dialect or language that wasn't understood.

                  It eventually morphed into specifically meaning a person from Germany.

                  I don't speak the language and can't cite my sources, so I would advise you
                  to verify this if you are researching the origins on your name.






                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • nilo3rak
                  I have been researching in the Gaboltov, Stropkov, and Sobrance area and have seen a lot of Nemecz - old Hungarian for Nemec. Both are pronounced Nemets,
                  Message 8 of 15 , Mar 26, 2011
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                    I have been researching in the Gaboltov, Stropkov, and Sobrance area and have seen a lot of "Nemecz" - old Hungarian for Nemec. Both are pronounced Nemets, which means German.
                    Carolyn


                    --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com, "haluska" <ddhalusker@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > Ahoj Group,
                    >
                    > Any insights into the surname "Nimetz" being of German lineage?
                    >
                    > This was the preferred spelling of a relation that came over from
                    > Shkurativtsi, Zakarpats'ka, Ukraine.
                    >
                    > I have also seen the name spelled "Nemeth" in the U.S.Census.
                    >
                    > I suspect the name to have been actually "Nyemec"
                    >
                    > This is very confusing since I am told that the family spoke Rusyn.
                    >
                    > Anything added to this would greatly help my research.
                    >
                    > Thanks,
                    >
                    > Dennis
                    >
                    >
                    > Bereghalmos > Munkacz > Kingdom of Hungary, Austro-Hungarian Empire and Kalnyk was formerly called Beregsarret
                    >
                    > Shurativtsi is a part of the Kalnyk village cluster, with which it shares its post ofc (zip 89633) and Village Administration
                    >
                    >
                    > Ellis Island
                    >
                    >
                    > Name: György Nyimecz
                    > Arrival Date: 30 Nov 1906
                    > Birth Year: abt 1889
                    > Birth Location Other: bereghalom
                    > Age: 17
                    > Gender: Male
                    > Ethnicity/Race­/Nationality: Slovakian
                    > Port of Departure: Fiume
                    > Port of Arrival: New York, New York
                    > Ship Name: Slavonia
                    >
                  • lkocik@comcast.net
                    Frank  N emec is indeed the Slovak word for a German [today], but as the name of this forum implies [Slovak-roots] I was offering insight into the possible
                    Message 9 of 15 , Mar 27, 2011
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                      Frank

                       N emec is indeed the Slovak word for a German [today], but as the name of this forum implies [Slovak-roots] I was offering insight into the possible origins of the word. It is derived from nemy, which is the Czech word for mute, and referred to an inability to speak Czech. You can do a search on google by entering "meaning of nemec" and it will verify this with numerous sites.

                         What words and surnames have come to mean over time, compared to their original meaning is sometimes the results of Slovak and some other Slavic languages being more a spoken language of the peasant classes, rather than an exact written one.That's why I used the phrase "morphed" as in metamorphosis.

                       I would add that when researching a surname it is, in some ways,  comparable to researching an ancestral villiage where present day spelling means very little.

                          W ith surnames, present day meanings can also be deceiving.

                         I've learned a lot from your contributions to this forum over the years Frank, and I'll concede that your knowledge of all things Slovak, is admirable,and far superior to mine,

                        but I took your reply as a bit condescending and trite in that you seemed to be saying your thoughts were the last word on the subject.

                      respectfully

                      Larry                                                                           ----- Original Message -----
                      From: "Frank R Plichta" <frank.r.plichta@...>
                      To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                      Sent: Saturday, March 26, 2011 3:24:37 PM
                      Subject: Nemec = German RE: [S-R] Re: Surname:Nyemecz/Nemeth/Nimetz

                      "Nemec" is the Slovak word for "German"

                      "nemc^ina" is also "German"

                      "Nemecko" is "Germany"

                      "Nemecky' " is "German"

                       



                      It is not that these words "morphed" in meaning a person from Germany.  They
                      are the Slovak words for Germany.

                       

                        _____  

                      From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com] On
                      Behalf Of lkocik@...
                      Sent: Saturday, March 26, 2011 4:06 PM
                      To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                      Subject: Re: [S-R] Re: Surname:Nyemecz/Nemeth/Nimetz

                       Nemec originally meant "mumbler" and referred to people from elsewhere,
                      that spoke a dialect or language that wasn't understood.

                       It eventually morphed into specifically meaning a person from Germany.

                       I don't speak the language and can't cite my sources, so I would advise you
                      to verify this if you are researching the origins on your name.






                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    • david1law@aol.com
                      Dear Larry: I really enjoyed your earlier posts regarding the origin of the name Nemec. As many of you may know, I love name etymology and have been
                      Message 10 of 15 , Mar 27, 2011
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                        Dear Larry:

                        I really enjoyed your earlier posts regarding the origin of the name
                        "Nemec." As many of you may know, I love name etymology and have been studying
                        it for a very long time. Larry, you are indeed correct with regard to the
                        word origin of the name "Nemec" which means "German" in modern Slovak. The
                        root "nem" means "mute" and thus the name "Nemec" at its root meant the
                        "mute ones" and there is a definite parallel between the ancient and modern
                        meanings. There are also several other parallels that occur like this. For
                        example, the word "Slavic" is derived from the "slovo" meaning "word" and
                        essentially denotes "one who speaks our word[s]" And interesting, the word
                        "jazyk" which means "language" or "tongue" in Slovak also has a parallel
                        with the Sarmatian "Iazyges" people (the Jassic or Ossetic people, who are
                        known in Hungarian as the "Jasz"), who appeared in ancient times around the
                        Sea of Azov, which forms part of the borders between the Ukraine and
                        Russia), and which is located northeast of and connected to the Black Sea.

                        In essence, the word "Slavic" meant those who spoke the same language, the
                        word "jazyk" meant those who spoke another language, and in comparison,
                        the German language was so very different from the Slavic languages that to
                        the ancient Slavs, the German language was so unintelligible, the Germans
                        appeared to be "mute." It all makes sense when one studies the ancient
                        history of the Slavic people, as the Slavs originally lived in closer proximity
                        to the Sarmatians than to the Germans. Larry, I really enjoy your posts.
                        Please continue to contribute your knowledge and insights in our forum

                        I hope that you have a great day. May God bless and smile upon you.

                        Best regards,

                        David





                        In a message dated 3/27/2011 3:18:11 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
                        lkocik@... writes:






                        Frank

                        N emec is indeed the Slovak word for a German [today], but as the name of
                        this forum implies [Slovak-roots] I was offering insight into the possible
                        origins of the word. It is derived from nemy, which is the Czech word for
                        mute, and referred to an inability to speak Czech. You can do a search on
                        google by entering "meaning of nemec" and it will verify this with numerous
                        sites.

                        What words and surnames have come to mean over time, compared to their
                        original meaning is sometimes the results of Slovak and some other Slavic
                        languages being more a spoken language of the peasant classes, rather than an
                        exact written one.That's why I used the phrase "morphed" as in
                        metamorphosis.

                        I would add that when researching a surname it is, in some ways,
                        comparable to researching an ancestral villiage where present day spelling means
                        very little.

                        W ith surnames, present day meanings can also be deceiving.

                        I've learned a lot from your contributions to this forum over the years
                        Frank, and I'll concede that your knowledge of all things Slovak, is
                        admirable,and far superior to mine,

                        but I took your reply as a bit condescending and trite in that you seemed
                        to be saying your thoughts were the last word on the subject.

                        respectfully

                        Larry
                        ----- Original Message -----
                        From: "Frank R Plichta" <_frank.r.plichta@..._
                        (mailto:frank.r.plichta@...) >
                        To: _SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com_ (mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com)
                        Sent: Saturday, March 26, 2011 3:24:37 PM
                        Subject: Nemec = German RE: [S-R] Re: Surname:Nyemecz/Nemeth/Nimetz

                        "Nemec" is the Slovak word for "German"

                        "nemc^ina" is also "German"

                        "Nemecko" is "Germany"

                        "Nemecky' " is "German"



                        It is not that these words "morphed" in meaning a person from Germany.
                        They
                        are the Slovak words for Germany.



                        _____

                        From: _SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com_ (mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com)
                        [mailto:_SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com_
                        (mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com) ] On
                        Behalf Of _lkocik@..._ (mailto:lkocik@...)
                        Sent: Saturday, March 26, 2011 4:06 PM
                        To: _SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com_ (mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com)
                        Subject: Re: [S-R] Re: Surname:Nyemecz/Nemeth/Nimetz

                        Nemec originally meant "mumbler" and referred to people from elsewhere,
                        that spoke a dialect or language that wasn't understood.

                        It eventually morphed into specifically meaning a person from Germany.

                        I don't speak the language and can't cite my sources, so I would advise
                        you
                        to verify this if you are researching the origins on your name.

                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      • haluska
                        I have been told that it also means People who don t speak like us. Much the same meaning as Mumbler You think? Dennis
                        Message 11 of 15 , Mar 27, 2011
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                          I have been told that it also means "People who don't speak like us."

                          Much the same meaning as "Mumbler" You think?

                          Dennis


                          --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com, lkocik@... wrote:
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > Hi`
                          >
                          >  Nemec originally meant "mumbler" and referred to people from elsewhere, that spoke a dialect or language that wasn't understood.
                          >
                          >  It eventually morphed into specifically meaning a person from Germany.
                          >
                          >  I don't speak the language and can't cite my sources, so I would advise you to verify this if you are researching the origins on your name.
                          >
                          >  Good luck, I think researching roots and origins of surnames is not just interesting but helps understand the alternate spellings and helps you know what to look for in the older records.
                          >
                          > Larry----- Original Message -----
                          > From: n8de@...
                          > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com, "John" <johnqadam@...>
                          > Sent: Saturday, March 26, 2011 1:50:00 PM
                          > Subject: Re: [S-R] Re: Surname:Nyemecz/Nemeth/Nimetz
                          >
                          > I have seen the name with multiple spellings, including, but not limited to:
                          >
                          > Niemiec, Nemec, Nyemyetz ... and any other phonetic concoction you can  
                          > think of.
                          >
                          > Good luck
                          > Don Havlicek
                          >
                          > ..... Havlicsek, Havlitsek, Hlavecsek, etc ...etc ... etc...
                          >
                          > All spelling from hand-written records in 'Upper Hungary'.
                          >
                          >
                          > Quoting John <johnqadam@...>:
                          >
                          > >>>> Any insights into the surname "Nimetz" being of German lineage? <<<
                          > >
                          > > I am no expert but I believe that the word means German in Slovak  
                          > > and would be spelled Nemec.
                          > >
                          > >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          >
                        • Frank R Plichta
                          Larry, I don t know what to say in response. All I did was list four Slovak words from the dictionary with their English meanings. I didn t add any editorial
                          Message 12 of 15 , Mar 27, 2011
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                            Larry,



                            I don't know what to say in response.

                            All I did was list four Slovak words from the dictionary with their English
                            meanings. I didn't add any editorial remarks. I just don't understand how
                            you can say that I "was a bit condescending and trite."

                            Some folk's skin must be very thin.

                            When I want to be condescending and trite I know how to do that.

                            Frank

                            _____

                            From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com] On
                            Behalf Of lkocik@...
                            Sent: Sunday, March 27, 2011 3:01 AM
                            To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                            Subject: Re: Nemec = German RE: [S-R] Re: Surname:Nyemecz/Nemeth/Nimetz







                            Frank

                            N emec is indeed the Slovak word for a German [today], but as the name of
                            this forum implies [Slovak-roots] I was offering insight into the possible
                            origins of the word. It is derived from nemy, which is the Czech word for
                            mute, and referred to an inability to speak Czech. You can do a search on
                            google by entering "meaning of nemec" and it will verify this with numerous
                            sites.

                            What words and surnames have come to mean over time, compared to their
                            original meaning is sometimes the results of Slovak and some other Slavic
                            languages being more a spoken language of the peasant classes, rather than
                            an exact written one.That's why I used the phrase "morphed" as in
                            metamorphosis.

                            I would add that when researching a surname it is, in some ways,
                            comparable to researching an ancestral villiage where present day spelling
                            means very little.

                            W ith surnames, present day meanings can also be deceiving.

                            I've learned a lot from your contributions to this forum over the years
                            Frank, and I'll concede that your knowledge of all things Slovak, is
                            admirable,and far superior to mine,

                            but I took your reply as a bit condescending and trite in that you seemed
                            to be saying your thoughts were the last word on the subject.

                            respectfully

                            Larry
                            ----- Original Message -----
                            From: "Frank R Plichta" <frank.r.plichta@...
                            <mailto:frank.r.plichta%40earthlink.net> >
                            To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                            Sent: Saturday, March 26, 2011 3:24:37 PM
                            Subject: Nemec = German RE: [S-R] Re: Surname:Nyemecz/Nemeth/Nimetz

                            "Nemec" is the Slovak word for "German"

                            "nemc^ina" is also "German"

                            "Nemecko" is "Germany"

                            "Nemecky' " is "German"



                            It is not that these words "morphed" in meaning a person from Germany. They

                            are the Slovak words for Germany.



                            _____

                            From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                            [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                            ] On
                            Behalf Of lkocik@... <mailto:lkocik%40comcast.net>
                            Sent: Saturday, March 26, 2011 4:06 PM
                            To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                            Subject: Re: [S-R] Re: Surname:Nyemecz/Nemeth/Nimetz

                            Nemec originally meant "mumbler" and referred to people from elsewhere,
                            that spoke a dialect or language that wasn't understood.

                            It eventually morphed into specifically meaning a person from Germany.

                            I don't speak the language and can't cite my sources, so I would advise you

                            to verify this if you are researching the origins on your name.

                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          • Ron
                            I think you are looking for precision in meaning where there is none. As an experiment take a common English word and ask 10 people to define that word. How
                            Message 13 of 15 , Mar 27, 2011
                            • 0 Attachment
                              I think you are looking for precision in meaning where there is none.

                              As an experiment take a common English word and ask 10 people to define that word. How many of the 10 definitions do you expect to match one another?

                              Whether the meaning is
                              "dummy" in the old sense of "deaf and dumb" or
                              "People who don't speak like us." or
                              "Mumbler"

                              how would you expect the definitions to vary from valley dialect to valley dialect, from border people to people isolated from direct contact, to asking the question in the year 1400, year 1600 and year 1800?

                              How many of the words Shakespear used around 1600 carry the same or different meanings today? One example a quick search finds is "use: When it's being employed as a noun, rather than a verb, the older meaning of "use" is close to the modern words "habit" and "custom". In fact we still maintain this sense in the phrase "to be used to something"."
                              http://www.suite101.com/content/tricky-words-in-shakespeare-a31748

                              To summarize, be happy you have such good answers and don't try to overanalyze unless you get deeply into etymology of Slovak and Slavic languages.

                              Ron

                              --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com, "haluska" <ddhalusker@...> wrote:
                              >
                              >
                              > I have been told that it also means "People who don't speak like us."
                              >
                              > Much the same meaning as "Mumbler" You think?
                              >
                              > Dennis
                              >
                            • Lubos Brieda
                              I think these days the word maďar (Hungarian) replaced the word nemec (German) as a term for someone who doesn t understand what you are saying. It s quite
                              Message 14 of 15 , Mar 27, 2011
                              • 0 Attachment
                                I think these days the word maďar (Hungarian) replaced the word nemec (German)
                                as a term for someone who doesn't understand what you are saying. It's quite
                                common to say something along the lines of "čo si dáky maďar?" (what are you
                                some kind of a hungarian?) to someone who is clueless about what you are trying
                                to explain.
                                -- Lubos Brieda --

                                Slovak recipes: www.slovakcooking.com






                                ________________________________
                                From: Ron <amiak27@...>
                                To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                                Sent: Sun, March 27, 2011 5:36:47 PM
                                Subject: [S-R] Re: Surname:Nyemecz/Nemeth/Nimetz

                                I think you are looking for precision in meaning where there is none.

                                As an experiment take a common English word and ask 10 people to define that
                                word. How many of the 10 definitions do you expect to match one another?

                                Whether the meaning is
                                "dummy" in the old sense of "deaf and dumb" or
                                "People who don't speak like us." or
                                "Mumbler"

                                how would you expect the definitions to vary from valley dialect to valley
                                dialect, from border people to people isolated from direct contact, to asking
                                the question in the year 1400, year 1600 and year 1800?

                                How many of the words Shakespear used around 1600 carry the same or different
                                meanings today? One example a quick search finds is "use: When it's being
                                employed as a noun, rather than a verb, the older meaning of "use" is close to
                                the modern words "habit" and "custom". In fact we still maintain this sense in
                                the phrase "to be used to something"."
                                http://www.suite101.com/content/tricky-words-in-shakespeare-a31748

                                To summarize, be happy you have such good answers and don't try to overanalyze
                                unless you get deeply into etymology of Slovak and Slavic languages.

                                Ron

                                --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com, "haluska" <ddhalusker@...> wrote:
                                >
                                >
                                > I have been told that it also means "People who don't speak like us."
                                >
                                > Much the same meaning as "Mumbler" You think?
                                >
                                > Dennis
                                >



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                              • lkocik@comcast.net
                                Frank  Yes I was thin skinned in the way I responded. My comment didn t add to our conversation, and for that I apologize to you and the forum in general.  I
                                Message 15 of 15 , Mar 27, 2011
                                • 0 Attachment
                                  Frank

                                   Yes I was thin skinned in the way I responded. My comment didn't add to our conversation, and for that I apologize to you and the forum in general.

                                   I read your post as defining the word nemec as referring to a German in the present day Slovak language, which indeed is true. What I took as condescending is the paragraph at the end. I read that as saying it doesn't matter what the origin is just accept it for what it is today.I know this whole discussion started with me misinterrpeting what you said and my response i s what was actually trite.  I've already responded as to why I feel it is critical to understand roots and origins, and I know you would agree with that, so  I won't go any farther off the topic of

                                    the original thread.

                                  Lastly I just want to say I think it's good to be able for both of us to state our views in a civil manner, although my comments were uncalled for.

                                   respectfully

                                  Larry

                                   
                                  ----- Original Message -----
                                  From: "Frank R Plichta" <frank.r.plichta@...>
                                  To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                                  Sent: Sunday, March 27, 2011 12:26:34 PM
                                  Subject: Trite and Condescending?? RE: Nemec = German RE: [S-R] Re: Surname:Nyemecz/Nemeth/Nimetz

                                  Larry,

                                   

                                  I don't know what to say in response.  

                                  All I did was list four Slovak words from the dictionary with their English
                                  meanings.  I didn't add any editorial remarks.  I just don't understand how
                                  you can say that I "was a bit condescending and trite."

                                  Some folk's skin must be very thin.

                                  When I want to be condescending and trite I know how to do that.

                                  Frank

                                    _____  

                                  From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com] On
                                  Behalf Of lkocik@...
                                  Sent: Sunday, March 27, 2011 3:01 AM
                                  To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                                  Subject: Re: Nemec = German RE: [S-R] Re: Surname:Nyemecz/Nemeth/Nimetz

                                   

                                    



                                  Frank

                                   N emec is indeed the Slovak word for a German [today], but as the name of
                                  this forum implies [Slovak-roots] I was offering insight into the possible
                                  origins of the word. It is derived from nemy, which is the Czech word for
                                  mute, and referred to an inability to speak Czech. You can do a search on
                                  google by entering "meaning of nemec" and it will verify this with numerous
                                  sites.

                                     What words and surnames have come to mean over time, compared to their
                                  original meaning is sometimes the results of Slovak and some other Slavic
                                  languages being more a spoken language of the peasant classes, rather than
                                  an exact written one.That's why I used the phrase "morphed" as in
                                  metamorphosis.

                                   I would add that when researching a surname it is, in some ways,
                                  comparable to researching an ancestral villiage where present day spelling
                                  means very little.

                                      W ith surnames, present day meanings can also be deceiving.

                                     I've learned a lot from your contributions to this forum over the years
                                  Frank, and I'll concede that your knowledge of all things Slovak, is
                                  admirable,and far superior to mine,

                                    but I took your reply as a bit condescending and trite in that you seemed
                                  to be saying your thoughts were the last word on the subject.

                                  respectfully

                                  Larry
                                  ----- Original Message -----
                                  From: "Frank R Plichta" <frank.r.plichta@...
                                  <mailto:frank.r.plichta%40earthlink.net> >
                                  To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>  
                                  Sent: Saturday, March 26, 2011 3:24:37 PM
                                  Subject: Nemec = German RE: [S-R] Re: Surname:Nyemecz/Nemeth/Nimetz

                                  "Nemec" is the Slovak word for "German"

                                  "nemc^ina" is also "German"

                                  "Nemecko" is "Germany"

                                  "Nemecky' " is "German"

                                    

                                  It is not that these words "morphed" in meaning a person from Germany.  They

                                  are the Slovak words for Germany.

                                    

                                    _____  

                                  From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                  [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                  ] On
                                  Behalf Of lkocik@... <mailto:lkocik%40comcast.net>  
                                  Sent: Saturday, March 26, 2011 4:06 PM
                                  To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>  
                                  Subject: Re: [S-R] Re: Surname:Nyemecz/Nemeth/Nimetz

                                   Nemec originally meant "mumbler" and referred to people from elsewhere,
                                  that spoke a dialect or language that wasn't understood.

                                   It eventually morphed into specifically meaning a person from Germany.

                                   I don't speak the language and can't cite my sources, so I would advise you

                                  to verify this if you are researching the origins on your name.

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