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Re: [S-R] Passenger Lists general question

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  • CurtB
    Sandra, A saint s day is the liturgical calender (Saints Cycle) of the Roman Catholic Church. Every canonized or customary saint is given a festal day of
    Message 1 of 16 , Feb 8, 2011
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      Sandra,
      A saint's day is the liturgical calender (Saints Cycle) of the Roman Catholic Church. Every canonized or customary saint is given a festal day of celebration, usually the day of their death, but sometimes another day. The official list is the Roman Martyrology. You can find it online. It varied from place to place over history, or country to country until quite recently. Thus Hungary and Slovakia and Czech Republic and Germany have somewhat different name days, though major ones are the same. Throughout Europe what we call New Year's Eve is usually called Sylvester, because 31 Dec is the liturgical feast day of St. Sylvester.

      Since this was such an important church event, no one would have confused a saint day with birthday. Birthday just wasn't important. My grandparents wrote down something different each time they were asked when their birthday was. They just didn't know or care at all. This is just a cultural difference that seems difficult for Americans to grasp. Not a single other document matches their Slovak church birth registers. But my grandfather knew that June 24 was the feast of St. John the Baptist. (His name was John).

      Curt B.

      --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com, Sandra & John Panzitta <pman40@...> wrote:
      >
      > Is there a listing of Saint's Name Days? I would be curious to see how many of the Saint's Name Days are close to the dates our ancestors thought were their births.
      >
      > Sandra
      > On Feb 8, 2011, at 9:13 PM, Bill Tarkulich wrote:
      >
      > > As everyone noted, birth days were not important. However your Saint's Name Day was a very big deal. Remember how elders always wished you well on your name day? That's what people remembered.
      > >
      > > Bill
      > >
      > > -----Original Message-----
      > > From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of lkocik@...
      > > Sent: Tuesday, February 08, 2011 5:34 PM
      > > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
      > > Subject: Re: [S-R] Passenger Lists general question
      > >
      > > Helene
      > >
      > > Thank you...
      > >
      > > It always helps when someone else has an fresh opinion.
      > >
      > > It's actually so simple I don't know why I never seen that.
      > >
      > > I would think for the Catholic church baptism is of more significance that birth.
      > >
      > > I've always loved that I was named for my grandfather and took a strange sense of pride that I was born on his birthday.
      > >
      > > It was hurtfull in another strange way when I found I wasn't born on his birthday.
      > >
      > > Now I can grab back onto that feeling of connection with my grandfather.
      > >
      > > Your response, though simple, was a eureka moment for me.
      > >
      > > It's not the first time you've done this for me.
      > >
      > > Thanks Helene
      > >
      > > Larry----- Original Message -----
      > > From: "helene cincebeaux" <helenezx@...>
      > > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
      > > Sent: Tuesday, February 8, 2011 2:49:58 PM
      > > Subject: Re: [S-R] Passenger Lists general question
      > >
      > > Hi Larry - do you supposed he was baptized on Valentine's Day?
      > >
      > > helene
      > >
      > > ________________________________
      > > From: "lkocik@..." <lkocik@...>
      > > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
      > > Sent: Tue, February 8, 2011 4:38:39 PM
      > > Subject: Re: [S-R] Passenger Lists general question
      > >
      > > I agree with Frank.
      > >
      > > My grandfather [Valent] claimed Feb 14 as his birth day on all official
      > > documents. I was born on Feb 14 and my middle name is Valent , after him.
      > >
      > > I found the original church birth record and his birth was Feb 11.
      > >
      > > As for the fact that age in the old country didn't matter; that's probably true.
      > >
      > > In our country age matters for voting, drinking, driving, and even "the age of
      > > consent" and military conscription". so it's hard for us to understand why it
      > > meant nothing to our ancestors.
      > >
      > > It is the same for how the surname was spelled...in this country it matters, but
      > > in the old country if your ancestors were peasant class, it meant nothing.
      > >
      > > To para quote one of my favorite members..."all opinions are my own."
      > >
      > > Larry ----- Original Message -----
      > > From: "Frank R Plichta" <frank.r.plichta@...>
      > > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
      > > Sent: Tuesday, February 8, 2011 10:11:00 AM
      > > Subject: RE: [S-R] Passenger Lists general question
      > >
      > > Birthdays and the number of years that a person was living were not
      > > important to the folks 100 years ago. Sometimes they really didn't know and
      > > just guessed. When they set sail for America, and the passenger list was
      > > compiled at the port of departure in Europe, it may have been the first time
      > > that they were ever asked the question as to age. My opinion is that they
      > > didn't really know because up to that time they didn't have a reason to keep
      > > track of that information.
      > >
      > > Frank
      > >
      > > _____
      > >
      > > From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com] On
      > > Behalf Of Nancy Gibbs
      > > Sent: Tuesday, February 08, 2011 11:08 AM
      > > To: Slovak Roots Group
      > > Subject: [S-R] Passenger Lists general question
      > >
      > > My question is this: Was there any reason for the parent to lie about the
      > > age
      > > of their children? Or did the person writing down the information just guess
      > >
      > > sometimes? My grandmother is recorded as being 4 when she really would have
      > > been 6; her brother 9 when he was 11. Then my grandfather was recorded as 4
      > > when he was 9 and his sister 5 when she was 6. Thanks.
      > > Nancy
      > >
      > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      > >
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      > >
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      > >
      > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      > >
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      > >
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      > >
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