Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Readable images?

Expand Messages
  • MaryLou
    I uploaded 2 pages of the Magyar census that I am trying to decipher. I have written some notes on this page but cannot really see or translate what the
    Message 1 of 11 , Dec 4, 2009
    • 0 Attachment
      I uploaded 2 pages of the Magyar census that I am trying to decipher. I
      have written some notes on this page but cannot really see or translate what
      the occupations and professions are. And this is the page with what looks
      like AH as a religion. Can anyone tell me if that is correct?

      MaryLou

      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Bill Tarkulich
      AK = Augsburg Confession Bill ... From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of MaryLou Sent: Friday, December 04, 2009
      Message 2 of 11 , Dec 4, 2009
      • 0 Attachment
        AK = Augsburg Confession


        Bill


        -----Original Message-----
        From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com] On
        Behalf Of MaryLou
        Sent: Friday, December 04, 2009 7:50 PM
        To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: [S-R] Readable images?

        I uploaded 2 pages of the Magyar census that I am trying to decipher. I
        have written some notes on this page but cannot really see or translate what
        the occupations and professions are. And this is the page with what looks
        like AH as a religion. Can anyone tell me if that is correct?

        MaryLou

        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



        ------------------------------------

        To visit your group on the web, go to:
        http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SLOVAK-ROOTS/

        To unsubscribe from this group, go to
        http://www.yahoogroups.com/group/SLOVAK-ROOTS -or- send blank email to
        SLOVAK-ROOTS-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.comYahoo! Groups Links
      • Carl
        My family was Lutheran and I have hundreds of Lutheran church records of the Augsburg Confession and have never seen the designation of it as AK. It is
        Message 3 of 11 , Dec 4, 2009
        • 0 Attachment
          My family was Lutheran and I have hundreds of Lutheran church records of the Augsburg Confession and have never seen the designation of it as AK. It is typically "ag" and/or "ev". Sorry, but I don't know where Bill got his information or if it is correct.

          --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com, "Bill Tarkulich" <bill.tarkulich@...> wrote:
          >
          > AK = Augsburg Confession
          >
          >
          > Bill
          >
          >
          > -----Original Message-----
          > From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com] On
          > Behalf Of MaryLou
          > Sent: Friday, December 04, 2009 7:50 PM
          > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
          > Subject: [S-R] Readable images?
          >
          > I uploaded 2 pages of the Magyar census that I am trying to decipher. I
          > have written some notes on this page but cannot really see or translate what
          > the occupations and professions are. And this is the page with what looks
          > like AH as a religion. Can anyone tell me if that is correct?
          >
          > MaryLou
          >
          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          >
          >
          >
          > ------------------------------------
          >
          > To visit your group on the web, go to:
          > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SLOVAK-ROOTS/
          >
          > To unsubscribe from this group, go to
          > http://www.yahoogroups.com/group/SLOVAK-ROOTS -or- send blank email to
          > SLOVAK-ROOTS-unsubscribe@...! Groups Links
          >
        • MaryLou
          Thanks. Also--sorry the image was upside down--am sending new copy! MaryLou ... From: Bill Tarkulich Date: 12/4/2009 8:36:47 PM To:
          Message 4 of 11 , Dec 4, 2009
          • 0 Attachment
            Thanks.
            Also--sorry the image was upside down--am sending new copy!
            MaryLou

            -------Original Message-------

            From: Bill Tarkulich
            Date: 12/4/2009 8:36:47 PM
            To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: RE: [S-R] Readable images?

            AK = Augsburg Confession


            Bill


            -----Original Message-----
            From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com] On
            Behalf Of MaryLou
            Sent: Friday, December 04, 2009 7:50 PM
            To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: [S-R] Readable images?

            I uploaded 2 pages of the Magyar census that I am trying to decipher. I
            have written some notes on this page but cannot really see or translate what
            the occupations and professions are. And this is the page with what looks
            like AH as a religion. Can anyone tell me if that is correct?

            MaryLou

            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



            ------------------------------------

            To visit your group on the web, go to:
            http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SLOVAK-ROOTS/

            To unsubscribe from this group, go to
            http://www.yahoogroups.com/group/SLOVAK-ROOTS -or- send blank email to
            SLOVAK-ROOTS-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.comYahoo! Groups Links







            ------------------------------------

            To visit your group on the web, go to:
            http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SLOVAK-ROOTS/

            To unsubscribe from this group, go to http://www.yahoogroups
            com/group/SLOVAK-ROOTS -or- send blank email to
            SLOVAK-ROOTS-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.comYahoo! Groups Links




            -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
            ---------------------
            Text inserted by Panda GP 2010:

            This message has NOT been classified as spam. If it is unsolicited mail
            (spam), click on the following link to reclassify it:
            http://localhost:6083/Panda?ID=pav_1&SPAM=true&path=C:\Users\MaryLou\AppData\
            ocal\Panda%20Security\Panda%20Global%20Protection%202010\AntiSpam
            -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
            ---------------------


            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • Ron
            I have also seen AK as Augsburg Kofession - Lutheran. It is common in the German at least. Ron PS. As a side note, if you encounter Konfirmation you are
            Message 5 of 11 , Dec 4, 2009
            • 0 Attachment
              I have also seen AK as Augsburg Kofession - Lutheran. It is common in the German at least.

              Ron
              PS. As a side note, if you encounter "Konfirmation" you are dealing with Evangelical (Protestant) records and with "Firmung" then Catholic records. German is one of the few languages that has these two different words for what we know in English as "confirmation".


              --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com, "Carl" <kotlarchik@...> wrote:
              >
              > My family was Lutheran and I have hundreds of Lutheran church records of the Augsburg Confession and have never seen the designation of it as AK. It is typically "ag" and/or "ev". Sorry, but I don't know where Bill got his information or if it is correct.
              >
              > --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com, "Bill Tarkulich" <bill.tarkulich@> wrote:
              > >
              > > AK = Augsburg Confession
              > >
              > >
              > > Bill
              > >
              > >
              > > -----Original Message-----
              > > From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com] On
              > > Behalf Of MaryLou
              > > Sent: Friday, December 04, 2009 7:50 PM
              > > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
              > > Subject: [S-R] Readable images?
              > >
              > > I uploaded 2 pages of the Magyar census that I am trying to decipher. I
              > > have written some notes on this page but cannot really see or translate what
              > > the occupations and professions are. And this is the page with what looks
              > > like AH as a religion. Can anyone tell me if that is correct?
              > >
              > > MaryLou
              > >
              > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > > ------------------------------------
              > >
              > > To visit your group on the web, go to:
              > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SLOVAK-ROOTS/
              > >
              > > To unsubscribe from this group, go to
              > > http://www.yahoogroups.com/group/SLOVAK-ROOTS -or- send blank email to
              > > SLOVAK-ROOTS-unsubscribe@! Groups Links
              > >
              >
            • treimer@nycap.rr.com
              A.B., C.A. and A.C. would be the correct abbreviations for Lutherans in old Hungary, for Augsburger Bekenntniss in German(Augsburg Confession), and in Latin
              Message 6 of 11 , Dec 5, 2009
              • 0 Attachment
                A.B., C.A. and A.C. would be the correct abbreviations for Lutherans in old Hungary, for Augsburger Bekenntniss in German(Augsburg Confession), and in Latin Confessio Augustana/Augustana Confessio. With C pronounced like a K, perhaps the writer spelled it that way? The reformed were H.B. (Helvetisches Bekenntnis) or C.H./H.C. (Confessio Helvetica/Helvetica Confessio) since the articles adopted in Hungary originated in Switzerland.

                Thomas

                ---- Carl <kotlarchik@...> wrote:
                > My family was Lutheran and I have hundreds of Lutheran church records of the Augsburg Confession and have never seen the designation of it as AK. It is typically "ag" and/or "ev". Sorry, but I don't know where Bill got his information or if it is correct.
                >
                > --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com, "Bill Tarkulich" <bill.tarkulich@...> wrote:
                > >
                > > AK = Augsburg Confession
                > >
                > >
                > > Bill
                > >
                > >
                > > -----Original Message-----
                > > From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com] On
                > > Behalf Of MaryLou
                > > Sent: Friday, December 04, 2009 7:50 PM
                > > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                > > Subject: [S-R] Readable images?
                > >
                > > I uploaded 2 pages of the Magyar census that I am trying to decipher. I
                > > have written some notes on this page but cannot really see or translate what
                > > the occupations and professions are. And this is the page with what looks
                > > like AH as a religion. Can anyone tell me if that is correct?
                > >
                > > MaryLou
                > >
                > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                > >
                > >
                > >
              • MaryLou
                If you look at the image I posted in the folder Hanusovce, the abbreviation llisted looks more like AH than AK but I am not very familiar with this form of
                Message 7 of 11 , Dec 5, 2009
                • 0 Attachment
                  If you look at the image I posted in the folder Hanusovce, the abbreviation
                  llisted looks more like AH than AK but I am not very familiar with this form
                  of script.
                  MaryLou

                  -------Original Message-------

                  From: treimer@...
                  Date: 12/5/2009 1:14:38 PM
                  To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                  Cc: Carl
                  Subject: [S-R] AB Augsburger Bekenntnisses

                  A.B., C.A. and A.C. would be the correct abbreviations for Lutherans in old
                  Hungary, for Augsburger Bekenntniss in German(Augsburg Confession), and in
                  Latin Confessio Augustana/Augustana Confessio. With C pronounced like a K,
                  perhaps the writer spelled it that way? The reformed were H.B. (Helvetisches
                  Bekenntnis) or C.H./H.C. (Confessio Helvetica/Helvetica Confessio) since the
                  articles adopted in Hungary originated in Switzerland.

                  Thomas

                  ---- Carl <kotlarchik@...> wrote:
                  > My family was Lutheran and I have hundreds of Lutheran church records of
                  the Augsburg Confession and have never seen the designation of it as AK. It
                  is typically "ag" and/or "ev". Sorry, but I don't know where Bill got his
                  information or if it is correct.
                  >
                  > --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com, "Bill Tarkulich" <bill.tarkulich@...>
                  wrote:
                  > >
                  > > AK = Augsburg Confession
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > Bill
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > -----Original Message-----
                  > > From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com]
                  On
                  > > Behalf Of MaryLou
                  > > Sent: Friday, December 04, 2009 7:50 PM
                  > > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                  > > Subject: [S-R] Readable images?
                  > >
                  > > I uploaded 2 pages of the Magyar census that I am trying to decipher. I
                  > > have written some notes on this page but cannot really see or translate
                  what
                  > > the occupations and professions are. And this is the page with what
                  looks
                  > > like AH as a religion. Can anyone tell me if that is correct?
                  > >
                  > > MaryLou
                  > >
                  > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >



                  ------------------------------------

                  To visit your group on the web, go to:
                  http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SLOVAK-ROOTS/

                  To unsubscribe from this group, go to http://www.yahoogroups
                  com/group/SLOVAK-ROOTS -or- send blank email to
                  SLOVAK-ROOTS-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.comYahoo! Groups Links




                  -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
                  ---------------------
                  Text inserted by Panda GP 2010:

                  This message has NOT been classified as spam. If it is unsolicited mail
                  (spam), click on the following link to reclassify it:
                  http://localhost:6083/Panda?ID=pav_1&SPAM=true&path=C:\Users\MaryLou\AppData\
                  ocal\Panda%20Security\Panda%20Global%20Protection%202010\AntiSpam
                  -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
                  ---------------------


                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • Ben Sorensen
                  Just looked at it, and Bill, unsurprisingly, is absolutely correct.   They are using a later form/ more latinized or latin influenced form of Gothic script,
                  Message 8 of 11 , Dec 5, 2009
                  • 0 Attachment
                    Just looked at it, and Bill, unsurprisingly, is absolutely correct.   They are using a later form/ more latinized or latin influenced form of Gothic script, so small "r's" are going to look like "v." Also, K and H are going to be similar (Gothic makes a K and an R look very similar- you have to look for the "serif" at the top of the letter to be sure...), and they were definately using the abbreviation that Bill mentioned.
                    If you reference that K with the H in Herman at the bottom, and you will see a difference in the "K" and "H" in this document.
                     Ben




                    ________________________________
                    From: MaryLou <mlvc@...>
                    To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                    Sent: Sat, December 5, 2009 1:25:44 PM
                    Subject: Re: [S-R] AB Augsburger Bekenntnisses

                     
                    If you look at the image I posted in the folder Hanusovce, the abbreviation
                    llisted looks more like AH than AK but I am not very familiar with this form
                    of script.
                    MaryLou

                    -------Original Message----- --

                    From: treimer@nycap. rr.com
                    Date: 12/5/2009 1:14:38 PM
                    To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
                    Cc: Carl
                    Subject: [S-R] AB Augsburger Bekenntnisses

                    A.B., C.A. and A.C. would be the correct abbreviations for Lutherans in old
                    Hungary, for Augsburger Bekenntniss in German(Augsburg Confession), and in
                    Latin Confessio Augustana/Augustana Confessio. With C pronounced like a K,
                    perhaps the writer spelled it that way? The reformed were H.B. (Helvetisches
                    Bekenntnis) or C.H./H.C. (Confessio Helvetica/Helvetica Confessio) since the
                    articles adopted in Hungary originated in Switzerland.

                    Thomas

                    ---- Carl <kotlarchik@zoominte rnet.net> wrote:
                    > My family was Lutheran and I have hundreds of Lutheran church records of
                    the Augsburg Confession and have never seen the designation of it as AK. It
                    is typically "ag" and/or "ev". Sorry, but I don't know where Bill got his
                    information or if it is correct.
                    >
                    > --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com, "Bill Tarkulich" <bill.tarkulich@ ...>
                    wrote:
                    > >
                    > > AK = Augsburg Confession
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > Bill
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > -----Original Message-----
                    > > From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com]
                    On
                    > > Behalf Of MaryLou
                    > > Sent: Friday, December 04, 2009 7:50 PM
                    > > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
                    > > Subject: [S-R] Readable images?
                    > >
                    > > I uploaded 2 pages of the Magyar census that I am trying to decipher. I
                    > > have written some notes on this page but cannot really see or translate
                    what
                    > > the occupations and professions are. And this is the page with what
                    looks
                    > > like AH as a religion. Can anyone tell me if that is correct?
                    > >
                    > > MaryLou
                    > >
                    > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >



                    ------------ --------- --------- ------

                    To visit your group on the web, go to:
                    http://groups. yahoo.com/ group/SLOVAK- ROOTS/

                    To unsubscribe from this group, go to http://www.yahoogroups
                    com/group/SLOVAK- ROOTS -or- send blank email to
                    SLOVAK-ROOTS- unsubscribe@ yahoogroups. comYahoo! Groups Links




                    ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- -
                    ------------ ---------
                    Text inserted by Panda GP 2010:

                    This message has NOT been classified as spam. If it is unsolicited mail
                    (spam), click on the following link to reclassify it:
                    http://localhost: 6083/Panda? ID=pav_1& SPAM=true& path=C:\Users\MaryLou\ AppData\
                    ocal\Panda%20Securi ty\Panda% 20Global% 20Protection% 202010\AntiSpam
                    ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- -
                    ------------ ---------


                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]







                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • Bill Tarkulich
                    Things are not always as they appear. Congratulations Ben, you are developing some of that insight that is essential to this line of work. Most certainly,
                    Message 9 of 11 , Dec 5, 2009
                    • 0 Attachment
                      "Things are not always as they appear." Congratulations Ben, you are developing some of that insight that is essential to this line of work. Most certainly, in this case, archaic/obsolete/regional forms of handwriting are a major factor. Plus, an understanding of the forms of religion in a specific region is critical. While the above is certainly true of church records, it can equally be true of census. The person asked to take the census was often an "important" person in the village, a priest, minister or mayor.

                      I often pause and do not provide every line of detail, because I want each of you to take some time to pursue independent research. Lucky for us, the tools and information are all within your reach.

                      The other reason I pause is that each village and each scribe has intoned his (really, his) own spin on things. I cannot possible decode each of the more than 2,500 village scribes inner thinking or education. Remember, oftentimes each priest or minister is from and trained in a far-off monastery or seminary, and himself may not embrace the culture and education of the villages in which he ministers.

                      Ben's response demonstrates important insight, blending the cultural, geographic, religious and educational aspects into a unique revelation.

                      Remember also that Juraj Cisarak has a lot of information on priests.

                      Keep up the good work.

                      Regards,



                      Bill


                      -----Original Message-----
                      From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ben Sorensen
                      Sent: Saturday, December 05, 2009 2:39 PM
                      To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                      Subject: Re: [S-R] AB Augsburger Bekenntnisses

                      Just looked at it, and Bill, unsurprisingly, is absolutely correct.�� They are using a later form/ more latinized or latin influenced form of Gothic script, so small "r's" are going to look like "v." Also, K and H are going to be similar (Gothic makes a K and an R look very similar- you have to look for the "serif" at the top of the letter to be sure...), and they were definately using the abbreviation that Bill mentioned.
                      If you reference that K with the H in Herman at the bottom, and you will see a difference in the "K" and "H" in this document.
                      �Ben




                      ________________________________
                      From: MaryLou <mlvc@...>
                      To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                      Sent: Sat, December 5, 2009 1:25:44 PM
                      Subject: Re: [S-R] AB Augsburger Bekenntnisses


                      If you look at the image I posted in the folder Hanusovce, the abbreviation
                      llisted looks more like AH than AK but I am not very familiar with this form
                      of script.
                      MaryLou

                      -------Original Message----- --

                      From: treimer@nycap. rr.com
                      Date: 12/5/2009 1:14:38 PM
                      To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
                      Cc: Carl
                      Subject: [S-R] AB Augsburger Bekenntnisses

                      A.B., C.A. and A.C. would be the correct abbreviations for Lutherans in old
                      Hungary, for Augsburger Bekenntniss in German(Augsburg Confession), and in
                      Latin Confessio Augustana/Augustana Confessio. With C pronounced like a K,
                      perhaps the writer spelled it that way? The reformed were H.B. (Helvetisches
                      Bekenntnis) or C.H./H.C. (Confessio Helvetica/Helvetica Confessio) since the
                      articles adopted in Hungary originated in Switzerland.

                      Thomas

                      ---- Carl <kotlarchik@zoominte rnet.net> wrote:
                      > My family was Lutheran and I have hundreds of Lutheran church records of
                      the Augsburg Confession and have never seen the designation of it as AK. It
                      is typically "ag" and/or "ev". Sorry, but I don't know where Bill got his
                      information or if it is correct.
                      >
                      > --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com, "Bill Tarkulich" <bill.tarkulich@ ...>
                      wrote:
                      > >
                      > > AK = Augsburg Confession
                      > >
                      > >
                      > > Bill
                      > >
                      > >
                      > > -----Original Message-----
                      > > From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com]
                      On
                      > > Behalf Of MaryLou
                      > > Sent: Friday, December 04, 2009 7:50 PM
                      > > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
                      > > Subject: [S-R] Readable images?
                      > >
                      > > I uploaded 2 pages of the Magyar census that I am trying to decipher. I
                      > > have written some notes on this page but cannot really see or translate
                      what
                      > > the occupations and professions are. And this is the page with what
                      looks
                      > > like AH as a religion. Can anyone tell me if that is correct?
                      > >
                      > > MaryLou
                      > >
                      > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >



                      ------------ --------- --------- ------

                      To visit your group on the web, go to:
                      http://groups. yahoo.com/ group/SLOVAK- ROOTS/

                      To unsubscribe from this group, go to http://www.yahoogroups
                      com/group/SLOVAK- ROOTS -or- send blank email to
                      SLOVAK-ROOTS- unsubscribe@ yahoogroups. comYahoo! Groups Links




                      ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- -
                      ------------ ---------
                      Text inserted by Panda GP 2010:

                      This message has NOT been classified as spam. If it is unsolicited mail
                      (spam), click on the following link to reclassify it:
                      http://localhost: 6083/Panda? ID=pav_1& SPAM=true& path=C:\Users\MaryLou\ AppData\
                      ocal\Panda%20Securi ty\Panda% 20Global% 20Protection% 202010\AntiSpam
                      ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- -
                      ------------ ---------


                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]







                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



                      ------------------------------------

                      To visit your group on the web, go to:
                      http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SLOVAK-ROOTS/

                      To unsubscribe from this group, go to http://www.yahoogroups.com/group/SLOVAK-ROOTS -or- send blank email to SLOVAK-ROOTS-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.comYahoo! Groups Links
                    • Ron
                      I just want to reiterate that AK remains a legitimate alternative to those Thomas has proposed. After reading his post I went to Google.de and checked it out.
                      Message 10 of 11 , Dec 5, 2009
                      • 0 Attachment
                        I just want to reiterate that AK remains a legitimate alternative to those Thomas has proposed. After reading his post I went to Google.de and checked it out. Between all of these postings on this topic, it is pretty well covered!

                        Ron

                        --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com, Ben Sorensen <cerrunos1@...> wrote:
                        >
                        > Just looked at it, and Bill, unsurprisingly, is absolutely correct.   They are using a later form/ more latinized or latin influenced form of Gothic script, so small "r's" are going to look like "v." Also, K and H are going to be similar (Gothic makes a K and an R look very similar- you have to look for the "serif" at the top of the letter to be sure...), and they were definately using the abbreviation that Bill mentioned.
                        > If you reference that K with the H in Herman at the bottom, and you will see a difference in the "K" and "H" in this document.
                        >  Ben
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > ________________________________
                        > From: MaryLou <mlvc@...>
                        > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                        > Sent: Sat, December 5, 2009 1:25:44 PM
                        > Subject: Re: [S-R] AB Augsburger Bekenntnisses
                        >
                        >  
                        > If you look at the image I posted in the folder Hanusovce, the abbreviation
                        > llisted looks more like AH than AK but I am not very familiar with this form
                        > of script.
                        > MaryLou
                        >
                        > -------Original Message----- --
                        >
                        > From: treimer@nycap. rr.com
                        > Date: 12/5/2009 1:14:38 PM
                        > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
                        > Cc: Carl
                        > Subject: [S-R] AB Augsburger Bekenntnisses
                        >
                        > A.B., C.A. and A.C. would be the correct abbreviations for Lutherans in old
                        > Hungary, for Augsburger Bekenntniss in German(Augsburg Confession), and in
                        > Latin Confessio Augustana/Augustana Confessio. With C pronounced like a K,
                        > perhaps the writer spelled it that way? The reformed were H.B. (Helvetisches
                        > Bekenntnis) or C.H./H.C. (Confessio Helvetica/Helvetica Confessio) since the
                        > articles adopted in Hungary originated in Switzerland.
                        >
                        > Thomas
                        >
                        > ---- Carl <kotlarchik@zoominte rnet.net> wrote:
                        > > My family was Lutheran and I have hundreds of Lutheran church records of
                        > the Augsburg Confession and have never seen the designation of it as AK. It
                        > is typically "ag" and/or "ev". Sorry, but I don't know where Bill got his
                        > information or if it is correct.
                        > >
                        > > --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com, "Bill Tarkulich" <bill.tarkulich@ ...>
                        > wrote:
                        > > >
                        > > > AK = Augsburg Confession
                        > > >
                        > > >
                        > > > Bill
                        > > >
                        > > >
                        > > > -----Original Message-----
                        > > > From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com]
                        > On
                        > > > Behalf Of MaryLou
                        > > > Sent: Friday, December 04, 2009 7:50 PM
                        > > > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
                        > > > Subject: [S-R] Readable images?
                        > > >
                        > > > I uploaded 2 pages of the Magyar census that I am trying to decipher. I
                        > > > have written some notes on this page but cannot really see or translate
                        > what
                        > > > the occupations and professions are. And this is the page with what
                        > looks
                        > > > like AH as a religion. Can anyone tell me if that is correct?
                        > > >
                        > > > MaryLou
                        > > >
                        > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        > > >
                        > > >
                        > > >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > ------------ --------- --------- ------
                        >
                        > To visit your group on the web, go to:
                        > http://groups. yahoo.com/ group/SLOVAK- ROOTS/
                        >
                        > To unsubscribe from this group, go to http://www.yahoogroups
                        > com/group/SLOVAK- ROOTS -or- send blank email to
                        > SLOVAK-ROOTS- unsubscribe@ yahoogroups. comYahoo! Groups Links
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- -
                        > ------------ ---------
                        > Text inserted by Panda GP 2010:
                        >
                        > This message has NOT been classified as spam. If it is unsolicited mail
                        > (spam), click on the following link to reclassify it:
                        > http://localhost: 6083/Panda? ID=pav_1& SPAM=true& path=C:\Users\MaryLou\ AppData\
                        > ocal\Panda%20Securi ty\Panda% 20Global% 20Protection% 202010\AntiSpam
                        > ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- -
                        > ------------ ---------
                        >
                        >
                        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        >
                      • Ben Sorensen
                         _Plus, an understanding of the forms of religion in a specific region is critical. While the above is certainly true of church records, it can equally be
                        Message 11 of 11 , Dec 5, 2009
                        • 0 Attachment
                           _Plus, an understanding of the forms of religion in a specific region is critical. While the above is certainly true of church records, it can equally be true of census._


                          Thank you Bill, I am seeing that my Historiology class (German and Slavic Genealogy) is not going to waste. :-) I should also point out that the understanding of the area has a "dead giveaway:" The most common forms of religion found there are LISTED IN THE HEADING. :-) It isn't always so easy, but one should also "be aware of his surroundings."

                          This almost Gothic script shows two things- the person was familiar with Latin and had some Germanic-influenced schooling. I am glad that we are not deciphering English Secretary script.... that is far worse than Latin, fraktur, gothic....

                          Ben


                          ________________________________
                          From: Bill Tarkulich <bill.tarkulich@...>
                          To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                          Sent: Sat, December 5, 2009 5:20:23 PM
                          Subject: RE: [S-R] AB Augsburger Bekenntnisses

                           
                          "Things are not always as they appear." Congratulations Ben, you are developing some of that insight that is essential to this line of work. Most certainly, in this case, archaic/obsolete/ regional forms of handwriting are a major factor. Plus, an understanding of the forms of religion in a specific region is critical. While the above is certainly true of church records, it can equally be true of census. The person asked to take the census was often an "important" person in the village, a priest, minister or mayor.

                          I often pause and do not provide every line of detail, because I want each of you to take some time to pursue independent research. Lucky for us, the tools and information are all within your reach.

                          The other reason I pause is that each village and each scribe has intoned his (really, his) own spin on things. I cannot possible decode each of the more than 2,500 village scribes inner thinking or education. Remember, oftentimes each priest or minister is from and trained in a far-off monastery or seminary, and himself may not embrace the culture and education of the villages in which he ministers.

                          Ben's response demonstrates important insight, blending the cultural, geographic, religious and educational aspects into a unique revelation.

                          Remember also that Juraj Cisarak has a lot of information on priests.

                          Keep up the good work.

                          Regards,

                          Bill

                          -----Original Message-----
                          From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of Ben Sorensen
                          Sent: Saturday, December 05, 2009 2:39 PM
                          To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
                          Subject: Re: [S-R] AB Augsburger Bekenntnisses

                          Just looked at it, and Bill, unsurprisingly, is absolutely correct.�� They are using a later form/ more latinized or latin influenced form of Gothic script, so small "r's" are going to look like "v." Also, K and H are going to be similar (Gothic makes a K and an R look very similar- you have to look for the "serif" at the top of the letter to be sure...), and they were definately using the abbreviation that Bill mentioned.
                          If you reference that K with the H in Herman at the bottom, and you will see a difference in the "K" and "H" in this document.
                          �Ben

                          ____________ _________ _________ __
                          From: MaryLou <mlvc@earthlink. net>
                          To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
                          Sent: Sat, December 5, 2009 1:25:44 PM
                          Subject: Re: [S-R] AB Augsburger Bekenntnisses


                          If you look at the image I posted in the folder Hanusovce, the abbreviation
                          llisted looks more like AH than AK but I am not very familiar with this form
                          of script.
                          MaryLou

                          -------Original Message----- --

                          From: treimer@nycap. rr.com
                          Date: 12/5/2009 1:14:38 PM
                          To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
                          Cc: Carl
                          Subject: [S-R] AB Augsburger Bekenntnisses

                          A.B., C.A. and A.C. would be the correct abbreviations for Lutherans in old
                          Hungary, for Augsburger Bekenntniss in German(Augsburg Confession), and in
                          Latin Confessio Augustana/Augustana Confessio. With C pronounced like a K,
                          perhaps the writer spelled it that way? The reformed were H.B. (Helvetisches
                          Bekenntnis) or C.H./H.C. (Confessio Helvetica/Helvetica Confessio) since the
                          articles adopted in Hungary originated in Switzerland.

                          Thomas

                          ---- Carl <kotlarchik@ zoominte rnet.net> wrote:
                          > My family was Lutheran and I have hundreds of Lutheran church records of
                          the Augsburg Confession and have never seen the designation of it as AK. It
                          is typically "ag" and/or "ev". Sorry, but I don't know where Bill got his
                          information or if it is correct.
                          >
                          > --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com, "Bill Tarkulich" <bill.tarkulich@ ...>
                          wrote:
                          > >
                          > > AK = Augsburg Confession
                          > >
                          > >
                          > > Bill
                          > >
                          > >
                          > > -----Original Message-----
                          > > From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:SLOVAK- ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com]
                          On
                          > > Behalf Of MaryLou
                          > > Sent: Friday, December 04, 2009 7:50 PM
                          > > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ yahoogroups. com
                          > > Subject: [S-R] Readable images?
                          > >
                          > > I uploaded 2 pages of the Magyar census that I am trying to decipher. I
                          > > have written some notes on this page but cannot really see or translate
                          what
                          > > the occupations and professions are. And this is the page with what
                          looks
                          > > like AH as a religion. Can anyone tell me if that is correct?
                          > >
                          > > MaryLou
                          > >
                          > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          > >
                          > >
                          > >

                          ------------ --------- --------- ------

                          To visit your group on the web, go to:
                          http://groups. yahoo.com/ group/SLOVAK- ROOTS/

                          To unsubscribe from this group, go to http://www.yahoogroups
                          com/group/SLOVAK- ROOTS -or- send blank email to
                          SLOVAK-ROOTS- unsubscribe@ yahoogroups. comYahoo! Groups Links

                          ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- -
                          ------------ ---------
                          Text inserted by Panda GP 2010:

                          This message has NOT been classified as spam. If it is unsolicited mail
                          (spam), click on the following link to reclassify it:
                          http://localhost: 6083/Panda? ID=pav_1& SPAM=true& path=C:\Users\ MaryLou\ AppData\
                          ocal\Panda%20Securi ty\Panda% 20Global% 20Protection% 202010\AntiSpam
                          ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- -
                          ------------ ---------

                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

                          ------------ --------- --------- ------

                          To visit your group on the web, go to:
                          http://groups. yahoo.com/ group/SLOVAK- ROOTS/

                          To unsubscribe from this group, go to http://www.yahoogroups.com/group/SLOVAK-ROOTS -or- send blank email to SLOVAK-ROOTS- unsubscribe@ yahoogroups. comYahoo! Groups Links







                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.