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baptismal

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  • christine mackara
    Hello, I need some help. I found in the RC records of Presov, two baptismal entries for the Makara Fam., were the name of our greatgrandmother was entered with
    Message 1 of 30 , Nov 30, 2007
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      Hello,
      I need some help.
      I found in the RC records of Presov, two baptismal entries for the Makara Fam., were the name of our greatgrandmother was entered with an addition, that I don't see in other entries.
      Under the heading for the parents of the baptized it looks like :
      Johann Makara
      Maria Kuczko recte
      Olsavszky
      asciarius sod. RC
      In the other 5 baptism, Maria is refered to as "Maria Olsavszky" (or varius spellings of that name!) only.
      In the marriage record she is refered to as "virgo" under heading of "conditio"
      What could the word "recte" mean in your opinion? The copy from the film is not too good, but that is what I make of it. Just wondering.

      Christine

      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • johnqadam
      ... Latin is not my first language and so I am guessing at the following. Maria Kuczko relicta = widow of Olsavszky asciarius = carpenter Check for the death
      Message 2 of 30 , Nov 30, 2007
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        >>> Maria Kuczko recte Olsavszky asciarius sod. RC <<<

        Latin is not my first language and so I am guessing at the following.

        Maria Kuczko relicta = widow of Olsavszky asciarius = carpenter

        Check for the death of Olsavszky with 1-3 months of Maria's remarriage.

        Other may have better ideas!
      • Janet Kozlay
        Dear Christine, The word recte means correctly. I am guessing that recte Olsavszky was added to correct the wrong name, Kuczko. But of course this leaves the
        Message 3 of 30 , Nov 30, 2007
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          Dear Christine,



          The word recte means correctly. I am guessing that "recte Olsavszky" was
          added to correct the wrong name, Kuczko. But of course this leaves the
          question of why Kuczko was used in the first place.



          It is possible that Olsavszky was an alias of Kuczko, but in those cases it
          usually just says "alias."



          Or it might have simply been an error of the priest in writing down the
          wrong name and then later correcting it, but you wouldn't think it would
          have happened twice.



          Do you see the use of the name Kuczko elsewhere in the records?



          I don't think John's "relicta" can be right since you indicate she was
          "virgo" in her marriage record.



          The word "asciarius," as John has already said, means carpenter, and must
          refer to Makara.



          The word "sod" is a puzzle to me.



          Janet



          _____

          From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com] On
          Behalf Of christine mackara
          Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 3:15 PM
          To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: [S-R] baptismal



          Hello,
          I need some help.
          I found in the RC records of Presov, two baptismal entries for the Makara
          Fam., were the name of our greatgrandmother was entered with an addition,
          that I don't see in other entries.
          Under the heading for the parents of the baptized it looks like :
          Johann Makara
          Maria Kuczko recte
          Olsavszky
          asciarius sod. RC
          In the other 5 baptism, Maria is refered to as "Maria Olsavszky" (or varius
          spellings of that name!) only.
          In the marriage record she is refered to as "virgo" under heading of
          "conditio"
          What could the word "recte" mean in your opinion? The copy from the film is
          not too good, but that is what I make of it. Just wondering.

          Christine

          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • konekta@nm.psg.sk
          We already explained in the past what the word Sodalis means. Vladimir _____ From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
          Message 4 of 30 , Nov 30, 2007
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            We already explained in the past what the word Sodalis means.
            Vladimir


            _____

            From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com] On
            Behalf Of Janet Kozlay
            Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 9:59 PM
            To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal



            Dear Christine,

            The word recte means correctly. I am guessing that "recte Olsavszky" was
            added to correct the wrong name, Kuczko. But of course this leaves the
            question of why Kuczko was used in the first place.

            It is possible that Olsavszky was an alias of Kuczko, but in those cases it
            usually just says "alias."

            Or it might have simply been an error of the priest in writing down the
            wrong name and then later correcting it, but you wouldn't think it would
            have happened twice.

            Do you see the use of the name Kuczko elsewhere in the records?

            I don't think John's "relicta" can be right since you indicate she was
            "virgo" in her marriage record.

            The word "asciarius," as John has already said, means carpenter, and must
            refer to Makara.

            The word "sod" is a puzzle to me.

            Janet

            _____

            From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
            [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
            yahoogroups.com] On
            Behalf Of christine mackara
            Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 3:15 PM
            To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
            Subject: [S-R] baptismal

            Hello,
            I need some help.
            I found in the RC records of Presov, two baptismal entries for the Makara
            Fam., were the name of our greatgrandmother was entered with an addition,
            that I don't see in other entries.
            Under the heading for the parents of the baptized it looks like :
            Johann Makara
            Maria Kuczko recte
            Olsavszky
            asciarius sod. RC
            In the other 5 baptism, Maria is refered to as "Maria Olsavszky" (or varius
            spellings of that name!) only.
            In the marriage record she is refered to as "virgo" under heading of
            "conditio"
            What could the word "recte" mean in your opinion? The copy from the film is
            not too good, but that is what I make of it. Just wondering.

            Christine

            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]






            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • Janet Kozlay
            Ah, Vladimir, you must be patient with us. Sometimes we need to see it more than once, if we even noted it the first time. I didn t even recognize it as an
            Message 5 of 30 , Nov 30, 2007
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              Ah, Vladimir, you must be patient with us. Sometimes we need to see it more
              than once, if we even noted it the first time. I didn't even recognize it as
              an abbreviation. So could you give us a little hint?



              Janet



              _____

              From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com] On
              Behalf Of konekta@...
              Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 4:01 PM
              To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal



              We already explained in the past what the word Sodalis means.
              Vladimir


              _____

              From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
              [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
              yahoogroups.com] On
              Behalf Of Janet Kozlay
              Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 9:59 PM
              To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
              Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal

              Dear Christine,

              The word recte means correctly. I am guessing that "recte Olsavszky" was
              added to correct the wrong name, Kuczko. But of course this leaves the
              question of why Kuczko was used in the first place.

              It is possible that Olsavszky was an alias of Kuczko, but in those cases it
              usually just says "alias."

              Or it might have simply been an error of the priest in writing down the
              wrong name and then later correcting it, but you wouldn't think it would
              have happened twice.

              Do you see the use of the name Kuczko elsewhere in the records?

              I don't think John's "relicta" can be right since you indicate she was
              "virgo" in her marriage record.

              The word "asciarius," as John has already said, means carpenter, and must
              refer to Makara.

              The word "sod" is a puzzle to me.

              Janet

              _____

              From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
              [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
              yahoogroups.com] On
              Behalf Of christine mackara
              Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 3:15 PM
              To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
              Subject: [S-R] baptismal

              Hello,
              I need some help.
              I found in the RC records of Presov, two baptismal entries for the Makara
              Fam., were the name of our greatgrandmother was entered with an addition,
              that I don't see in other entries.
              Under the heading for the parents of the baptized it looks like :
              Johann Makara
              Maria Kuczko recte
              Olsavszky
              asciarius sod. RC
              In the other 5 baptism, Maria is refered to as "Maria Olsavszky" (or varius
              spellings of that name!) only.
              In the marriage record she is refered to as "virgo" under heading of
              "conditio"
              What could the word "recte" mean in your opinion? The copy from the film is
              not too good, but that is what I make of it. Just wondering.

              Christine

              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • konekta@nm.psg.sk
              Dear Janet, It is Journeyman. Vladimir _____ From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Janet Kozlay Sent: Friday,
              Message 6 of 30 , Nov 30, 2007
              • 0 Attachment
                Dear Janet,
                It is Journeyman.
                Vladimir

                _____

                From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com] On
                Behalf Of Janet Kozlay
                Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 10:14 PM
                To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis



                Ah, Vladimir, you must be patient with us. Sometimes we need to see it more
                than once, if we even noted it the first time. I didn't even recognize it as
                an abbreviation. So could you give us a little hint?

                Janet

                _____

                From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                yahoogroups.com] On
                Behalf Of konekta@.... <mailto:konekta%40nm.psg.sk> sk
                Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 4:01 PM
                To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal

                We already explained in the past what the word Sodalis means.
                Vladimir

                _____

                From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                yahoogroups.com] On
                Behalf Of Janet Kozlay
                Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 9:59 PM
                To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal

                Dear Christine,

                The word recte means correctly. I am guessing that "recte Olsavszky" was
                added to correct the wrong name, Kuczko. But of course this leaves the
                question of why Kuczko was used in the first place.

                It is possible that Olsavszky was an alias of Kuczko, but in those cases it
                usually just says "alias."

                Or it might have simply been an error of the priest in writing down the
                wrong name and then later correcting it, but you wouldn't think it would
                have happened twice.

                Do you see the use of the name Kuczko elsewhere in the records?

                I don't think John's "relicta" can be right since you indicate she was
                "virgo" in her marriage record.

                The word "asciarius," as John has already said, means carpenter, and must
                refer to Makara.

                The word "sod" is a puzzle to me.

                Janet

                _____

                From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                yahoogroups.com] On
                Behalf Of christine mackara
                Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 3:15 PM
                To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                Subject: [S-R] baptismal

                Hello,
                I need some help.
                I found in the RC records of Presov, two baptismal entries for the Makara
                Fam., were the name of our greatgrandmother was entered with an addition,
                that I don't see in other entries.
                Under the heading for the parents of the baptized it looks like :
                Johann Makara
                Maria Kuczko recte
                Olsavszky
                asciarius sod. RC
                In the other 5 baptism, Maria is refered to as "Maria Olsavszky" (or varius
                spellings of that name!) only.
                In the marriage record she is refered to as "virgo" under heading of
                "conditio"
                What could the word "recte" mean in your opinion? The copy from the film is
                not too good, but that is what I make of it. Just wondering.

                Christine

                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]






                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • maxine
                Vladimir, since you are so knowledgeable, and without patience with us, could you start a file with the words we are asking about. Then we can refer back to
                Message 7 of 30 , Nov 30, 2007
                • 0 Attachment
                  Vladimir, since you are so knowledgeable, and without patience with us, could you start a "file" with the words we are asking about. Then we can refer back to them. New words are confusing to us. That would be helpful. maxine

                  ps Boy this group really shoots from the hip!


                  ----- Original Message -----
                  From: konekta@...
                  To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                  Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 4:25 PM
                  Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis


                  Dear Janet,
                  It is Journeyman.
                  Vladimir

                  _____

                  From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com] On
                  Behalf Of Janet Kozlay
                  Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 10:14 PM
                  To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                  Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis

                  Ah, Vladimir, you must be patient with us. Sometimes we need to see it more
                  than once, if we even noted it the first time. I didn't even recognize it as
                  an abbreviation. So could you give us a little hint?

                  Janet

                  _____

                  From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                  [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                  yahoogroups.com] On
                  Behalf Of konekta@.... <mailto:konekta%40nm.psg.sk> sk
                  Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 4:01 PM
                  To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                  Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal

                  We already explained in the past what the word Sodalis means.
                  Vladimir

                  _____

                  From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                  [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                  yahoogroups.com] On
                  Behalf Of Janet Kozlay
                  Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 9:59 PM
                  To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                  Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal

                  Dear Christine,

                  The word recte means correctly. I am guessing that "recte Olsavszky" was
                  added to correct the wrong name, Kuczko. But of course this leaves the
                  question of why Kuczko was used in the first place.

                  It is possible that Olsavszky was an alias of Kuczko, but in those cases it
                  usually just says "alias."

                  Or it might have simply been an error of the priest in writing down the
                  wrong name and then later correcting it, but you wouldn't think it would
                  have happened twice.

                  Do you see the use of the name Kuczko elsewhere in the records?

                  I don't think John's "relicta" can be right since you indicate she was
                  "virgo" in her marriage record.

                  The word "asciarius," as John has already said, means carpenter, and must
                  refer to Makara.

                  The word "sod" is a puzzle to me.

                  Janet

                  _____

                  From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                  [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                  yahoogroups.com] On
                  Behalf Of christine mackara
                  Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 3:15 PM
                  To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                  Subject: [S-R] baptismal

                  Hello,
                  I need some help.
                  I found in the RC records of Presov, two baptismal entries for the Makara
                  Fam., were the name of our greatgrandmother was entered with an addition,
                  that I don't see in other entries.
                  Under the heading for the parents of the baptized it looks like :
                  Johann Makara
                  Maria Kuczko recte
                  Olsavszky
                  asciarius sod. RC
                  In the other 5 baptism, Maria is refered to as "Maria Olsavszky" (or varius
                  spellings of that name!) only.
                  In the marriage record she is refered to as "virgo" under heading of
                  "conditio"
                  What could the word "recte" mean in your opinion? The copy from the film is
                  not too good, but that is what I make of it. Just wondering.

                  Christine

                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • Janet Kozlay
                  Thank you, Vladimir. So he was a journeyman carpenter. I ll not forget it this time. Janet [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  Message 8 of 30 , Nov 30, 2007
                  • 0 Attachment
                    Thank you, Vladimir. So he was a journeyman carpenter.



                    I'll not forget it this time.



                    Janet





                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • christine mackara
                    Dear Janet and John, Thank you for your help. So, since we can t get into the head of that priest, we will prob. never know for sure. I had run it by someone
                    Message 9 of 30 , Nov 30, 2007
                    • 0 Attachment
                      Dear Janet and John,
                      Thank you for your help. So, since we can't get into the head of that priest, we will prob. never know for sure.
                      I had run it by someone at the Family History Center here in Cherry Hill, NJ, and he thought possibly, she was adopted. I don't know ?! After I became aware of the name Kuczko, I only found a death entry : Andreas Kuczko died 22. March 1827, age 70, widower.
                      I haven't found her birth entry, but Maria Olsavszky was born about 1829

                      Thank you again.
                      Christine










                      ----- Original Message -----
                      From: Janet Kozlay
                      To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                      Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 4:14 PM
                      Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis


                      Ah, Vladimir, you must be patient with us. Sometimes we need to see it more
                      than once, if we even noted it the first time. I didn't even recognize it as
                      an abbreviation. So could you give us a little hint?

                      Janet

                      _____

                      From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com] On
                      Behalf Of konekta@...
                      Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 4:01 PM
                      To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                      Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal

                      We already explained in the past what the word Sodalis means.
                      Vladimir

                      _____

                      From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                      [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                      yahoogroups.com] On
                      Behalf Of Janet Kozlay
                      Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 9:59 PM
                      To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                      Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal

                      Dear Christine,

                      The word recte means correctly. I am guessing that "recte Olsavszky" was
                      added to correct the wrong name, Kuczko. But of course this leaves the
                      question of why Kuczko was used in the first place.

                      It is possible that Olsavszky was an alias of Kuczko, but in those cases it
                      usually just says "alias."

                      Or it might have simply been an error of the priest in writing down the
                      wrong name and then later correcting it, but you wouldn't think it would
                      have happened twice.

                      Do you see the use of the name Kuczko elsewhere in the records?

                      I don't think John's "relicta" can be right since you indicate she was
                      "virgo" in her marriage record.

                      The word "asciarius," as John has already said, means carpenter, and must
                      refer to Makara.

                      The word "sod" is a puzzle to me.

                      Janet

                      _____

                      From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                      [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                      yahoogroups.com] On
                      Behalf Of christine mackara
                      Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 3:15 PM
                      To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                      Subject: [S-R] baptismal

                      Hello,
                      I need some help.
                      I found in the RC records of Presov, two baptismal entries for the Makara
                      Fam., were the name of our greatgrandmother was entered with an addition,
                      that I don't see in other entries.
                      Under the heading for the parents of the baptized it looks like :
                      Johann Makara
                      Maria Kuczko recte
                      Olsavszky
                      asciarius sod. RC
                      In the other 5 baptism, Maria is refered to as "Maria Olsavszky" (or varius
                      spellings of that name!) only.
                      In the marriage record she is refered to as "virgo" under heading of
                      "conditio"
                      What could the word "recte" mean in your opinion? The copy from the film is
                      not too good, but that is what I make of it. Just wondering.

                      Christine

                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    • david1law@aol.com
                      Hi Christine: I just wanted to give you a note of encouragement. I believe you are on the right track. While certain entries in the church records, standing
                      Message 10 of 30 , Nov 30, 2007
                      • 0 Attachment
                        Hi Christine:

                        I just wanted to give you a note of encouragement. I believe you are on the
                        right track. While certain entries in the church records, standing alone,
                        can be confusing, they often become a little less confusing when they are
                        corroborated by other entries, which, it appears, is exactly what you are doing --
                        as you mentioned in your earlier e-mail that there were two baptismal
                        entries where you found that the name of your great grandmother was found with an
                        addition. In the parish records in SIROKE, which is located to the west of
                        PRESOV in the SARIS HIGHLANDS, I have seen some aliases used where the alias
                        surname -- in this case BALOGA-KOCIK -- ultimately traced back to a marriage in
                        the early 1800's between an ANDREAS BALOGA (also spelled BALOG among other
                        variants) and a SUSANNA KOTSIK. While the records may often be a puzzle, the
                        fact that you are gathering the additional information on the siblings, etc.
                        -- the CLUSTER GENEALOGY approach -- really does help. When I have run into
                        confusing puzzles in the church records, I have found that the best approach
                        is to collect all of the information on that surname (including its possible
                        variants) in that particular parish, as the more documents, the better and
                        there may be certain common details, such as the names of the godparents
                        (where the same persons were often used for each of the children in a particular
                        family) or a house number. In short, the little details often help piece
                        together the puzzle. JOHN ADAM was particularly helpful in helping me track down
                        my great, great, great grandparents MATHIAS BALOGA and his wife ANNA. There
                        were two MATHIAS BALOGA in the village, both born in 1804 according to the
                        1869 Urbarial Census, and both married to women named ANNA, and through
                        examining the little details, and double-checking these records against other
                        records in the parish relating to the respective families, the identity of my
                        great, great, great grandparents became more clear. So, JOHN ADAM, if you are
                        reading this (and I know you are), thank you again, my friend! While looking
                        for additional entries in the parish records for a family may sometimes take
                        a greater amount of time, it is well worth it as the additional information
                        which can be gleaned from these records, often fill in additional details and
                        additional pieces to the puzzle that we call genealogy. It appears that you
                        are on the right track, Christine.

                        Best regards,

                        David

                        P.S. If you come across the BALOGA (BALOG, BALOGH among other variants) in
                        the church records in PRESOV, please let me know.



                        **************************************Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest
                        products.
                        (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001)


                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      • christine mackara
                        Thank you, David for your kind words. I am so glad to have found this group to exchange ideas. And I will definitely keep an eye open for Baloga. Christine
                        Message 11 of 30 , Nov 30, 2007
                        • 0 Attachment
                          Thank you, David for your kind words.
                          I am so glad to have found this group to exchange ideas.
                          And I will definitely keep an eye open for "Baloga. "

                          Christine







                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        • lkocik@comcast.net
                          Christine Hi...My name is Kocik {Larry} I have 13 variants from legal documents and gravestones. Kotcik wasn t one. I certainly don t want to add to any
                          Message 12 of 30 , Nov 30, 2007
                          • 0 Attachment
                            Christine
                            Hi...My name is Kocik {Larry} I have 13 variants from legal documents and gravestones. Kotcik wasn't one. I certainly don't want to add to any confusion, but if I can help with the Kocik surname let me know...I have years worth of research.
                            As David says,... don't get discouraged. In the beginning it can seem hopeless with all the contradictions and misspellings. My greatgrandfather emmigrated under one spelling of his name. His death certificate had another, and his grave stone another, and still there was another on his naturalization papers.
                            One day when things finally click, you'll rub your chin, and with a smile of satisfaction, know where you are in the family of man, and that's when you'll know it was worth the struggle.
                            Larry Kocik
                            lkocik@...
                            -------------- Original message --------------
                            From: david1law@...
                            Hi Christine:

                            I just wanted to give you a note of encouragement. I believe you are on the
                            right track. While certain entries in the church records, standing alone,
                            can be confusing, they often become a little less confusing when they are
                            corroborated by other entries, which, it appears, is exactly what you are doing --
                            as you mentioned in your earlier e-mail that there were two baptismal
                            entries where you found that the name of your great grandmother was found with an
                            addition. In the parish records in SIROKE, which is located to the west of
                            PRESOV in the SARIS HIGHLANDS, I have seen some aliases used where the alias
                            surname -- in this case BALOGA-KOCIK -- ultimately traced back to a marriage in
                            the early 1800's between an ANDREAS BALOGA (also spelled BALOG among other
                            variants) and a SUSANNA KOTSIK. While the records may often be a puzzle, the
                            fact that you are gathering the additional information on the siblings, etc.
                            -- the CLUSTER GENEALOGY approach -- really does help. When I have run into
                            confusing puzzles in the church records, I have found that the best approach
                            is to collect all of the information on that surname (including its possible
                            variants) in that particular parish, as the more documents, the better and
                            there may be certain common details, such as the names of the godparents
                            (where the same persons were often used for each of the children in a particular
                            family) or a house number. In short, the little details often help piece
                            together the puzzle. JOHN ADAM was particularly helpful in helping me track down
                            my great, great, great grandparents MATHIAS BALOGA and his wife ANNA. There
                            were two MATHIAS BALOGA in the village, both born in 1804 according to the
                            1869 Urbarial Census, and both married to women named ANNA, and through
                            examining the little details, and double-checking these records against other
                            records in the parish relating to the respective families, the identity of my
                            great, great, great grandparents became more clear. So, JOHN ADAM, if you are
                            reading this (and I know you are), thank you again, my friend! While looking
                            for additional entries in the parish records for a family may sometimes take
                            a greater amount of time, it is well worth it as the additional information
                            which can be gleaned from these records, often fill in additional details and
                            additional pieces to the puzzle that we call genealogy. It appears that you
                            are on the right track, Christine.

                            Best regards,

                            David

                            P.S. If you come across the BALOGA (BALOG, BALOGH among other variants) in
                            the church records in PRESOV, please let me know.

                            **************************************Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest
                            products.
                            (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001)

                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          • lkocik@comcast.net
                            Christine Me again...If you drop the Magyar z from Kuczko it gives you the nick name of my great uncle John Kocik; kucko. I saw it spelled Kucki once also. I
                            Message 13 of 30 , Nov 30, 2007
                            • 0 Attachment
                              Christine
                              Me again...If you drop the Magyar "z" from Kuczko it gives you the nick name of my great uncle John Kocik; kucko. I saw it spelled Kucki once also. I have no idea of the origin of the nickname though.
                              Larry

                              -------------- Original message --------------
                              From: <konekta@...>
                              We already explained in the past what the word Sodalis means.
                              Vladimir


                              _____

                              From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com] On
                              Behalf Of Janet Kozlay
                              Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 9:59 PM
                              To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                              Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal

                              Dear Christine,

                              The word recte means correctly. I am guessing that "recte Olsavszky" was
                              added to correct the wrong name, Kuczko. But of course this leaves the
                              question of why Kuczko was used in the first place.

                              It is possible that Olsavszky was an alias of Kuczko, but in those cases it
                              usually just says "alias."

                              Or it might have simply been an error of the priest in writing down the
                              wrong name and then later correcting it, but you wouldn't think it would
                              have happened twice.

                              Do you see the use of the name Kuczko elsewhere in the records?

                              I don't think John's "relicta" can be right since you indicate she was
                              "virgo" in her marriage record.

                              The word "asciarius," as John has already said, means carpenter, and must
                              refer to Makara.

                              The word "sod" is a puzzle to me.

                              Janet

                              _____

                              From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                              [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                              yahoogroups.com] On
                              Behalf Of christine mackara
                              Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 3:15 PM
                              To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                              Subject: [S-R] baptismal

                              Hello,
                              I need some help.
                              I found in the RC records of Presov, two baptismal entries for the Makara
                              Fam., were the name of our greatgrandmother was entered with an addition,
                              that I don't see in other entries.
                              Under the heading for the parents of the baptized it looks like :
                              Johann Makara
                              Maria Kuczko recte
                              Olsavszky
                              asciarius sod. RC
                              In the other 5 baptism, Maria is refered to as "Maria Olsavszky" (or varius
                              spellings of that name!) only.
                              In the marriage record she is refered to as "virgo" under heading of
                              "conditio"
                              What could the word "recte" mean in your opinion? The copy from the film is
                              not too good, but that is what I make of it. Just wondering.

                              Christine

                              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

                              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

                              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




                              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                            • konekta@nm.psg.sk
                              Maxine, you mean Quick Draw Mc Graw? :-) There is one obstacle: I do not have a direct access to my home page. I have to ask someone to do that and this is not
                              Message 14 of 30 , Dec 2, 2007
                              • 0 Attachment
                                Maxine, you mean Quick Draw Mc'Graw? :-)
                                There is one obstacle:
                                I do not have a direct access to my home page. I have to ask someone to do
                                that and this is not very practical, since the man is very busy. Maybe some
                                time in the future I will put all known occupations there.
                                In the mean time, everyone interested can make such a dictionary for
                                himself, no?
                                Regards,
                                Vladimir


                                _____

                                From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com] On
                                Behalf Of maxine
                                Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 10:37 PM
                                To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                                Subject: Re: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis



                                Vladimir, since you are so knowledgeable, and without patience with us,
                                could you start a "file" with the words we are asking about. Then we can
                                refer back to them. New words are confusing to us. That would be helpful.
                                maxine

                                ps Boy this group really shoots from the hip!

                                ----- Original Message -----
                                From: konekta@.... <mailto:konekta%40nm.psg.sk> sk
                                To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                                Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 4:25 PM
                                Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis

                                Dear Janet,
                                It is Journeyman.
                                Vladimir

                                _____

                                From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                                [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                yahoogroups.com] On
                                Behalf Of Janet Kozlay
                                Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 10:14 PM
                                To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                                Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis

                                Ah, Vladimir, you must be patient with us. Sometimes we need to see it more
                                than once, if we even noted it the first time. I didn't even recognize it as
                                an abbreviation. So could you give us a little hint?

                                Janet

                                _____

                                From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                                [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                yahoogroups.com] On
                                Behalf Of konekta@... <mailto:konekta%40nm.psg> .
                                <mailto:konekta%40nm.psg.sk> sk
                                Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 4:01 PM
                                To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                                Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal

                                We already explained in the past what the word Sodalis means.
                                Vladimir

                                _____

                                From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                                [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                yahoogroups.com] On
                                Behalf Of Janet Kozlay
                                Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 9:59 PM
                                To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                                Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal

                                Dear Christine,

                                The word recte means correctly. I am guessing that "recte Olsavszky" was
                                added to correct the wrong name, Kuczko. But of course this leaves the
                                question of why Kuczko was used in the first place.

                                It is possible that Olsavszky was an alias of Kuczko, but in those cases it
                                usually just says "alias."

                                Or it might have simply been an error of the priest in writing down the
                                wrong name and then later correcting it, but you wouldn't think it would
                                have happened twice.

                                Do you see the use of the name Kuczko elsewhere in the records?

                                I don't think John's "relicta" can be right since you indicate she was
                                "virgo" in her marriage record.

                                The word "asciarius," as John has already said, means carpenter, and must
                                refer to Makara.

                                The word "sod" is a puzzle to me.

                                Janet

                                _____

                                From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                                [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                yahoogroups.com] On
                                Behalf Of christine mackara
                                Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 3:15 PM
                                To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                                Subject: [S-R] baptismal

                                Hello,
                                I need some help.
                                I found in the RC records of Presov, two baptismal entries for the Makara
                                Fam., were the name of our greatgrandmother was entered with an addition,
                                that I don't see in other entries.
                                Under the heading for the parents of the baptized it looks like :
                                Johann Makara
                                Maria Kuczko recte
                                Olsavszky
                                asciarius sod. RC
                                In the other 5 baptism, Maria is refered to as "Maria Olsavszky" (or varius
                                spellings of that name!) only.
                                In the marriage record she is refered to as "virgo" under heading of
                                "conditio"
                                What could the word "recte" mean in your opinion? The copy from the film is
                                not too good, but that is what I make of it. Just wondering.

                                Christine

                                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

                                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

                                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

                                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

                                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

                                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]






                                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                              • Ron Matviyak
                                Maxine, If you are willing to collect and consolidate the individual lists that members have, you could make a major contribution to the forum. I have
                                Message 15 of 30 , Dec 2, 2007
                                • 0 Attachment
                                  Maxine,

                                  If you are willing to collect and consolidate the individual lists
                                  that members have, you could make a major contribution to the forum.
                                  I have collected some words and I am sure others have as well. If we
                                  all share, and you (or some other generous person) volunteers to
                                  consolidate the list and post it under the 'files' part of the S-R web
                                  page, we can add to it as time passes.

                                  Ron

                                  --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com, "maxine" <maxine96@...> wrote:
                                  >
                                  > Vladimir, since you are so knowledgeable, and without patience with
                                  us, could you start a "file" with the words we are asking about. Then
                                  we can refer back to them. New words are confusing to us. That would
                                  be helpful. maxine
                                  >
                                  > ps Boy this group really shoots from the hip!
                                  >
                                  >
                                  > ----- Original Message -----
                                  > From: konekta@...
                                  > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                                  > Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 4:25 PM
                                  > Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis
                                  >
                                  >
                                  > Dear Janet,
                                  > It is Journeyman.
                                  > Vladimir
                                  >
                                  > _____
                                  >
                                  > From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                                  [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com] On
                                  > Behalf Of Janet Kozlay
                                  > Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 10:14 PM
                                  > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                                  > Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis
                                  >
                                  > Ah, Vladimir, you must be patient with us. Sometimes we need to
                                  see it more
                                  > than once, if we even noted it the first time. I didn't even
                                  recognize it as
                                  > an abbreviation. So could you give us a little hint?
                                  >
                                  > Janet
                                  >
                                  > _____
                                  >
                                  > From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                  yahoogroups.com
                                  > [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                  > yahoogroups.com] On
                                  > Behalf Of konekta@... <mailto:konekta%40nm.psg.sk> sk
                                  > Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 4:01 PM
                                  > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                  yahoogroups.com
                                  > Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal
                                  >
                                  > We already explained in the past what the word Sodalis means.
                                  > Vladimir
                                  >
                                  > _____
                                  >
                                  > From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                  yahoogroups.com
                                  > [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                  > yahoogroups.com] On
                                  > Behalf Of Janet Kozlay
                                  > Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 9:59 PM
                                  > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                  yahoogroups.com
                                  > Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal
                                  >
                                  > Dear Christine,
                                  >
                                  > The word recte means correctly. I am guessing that "recte
                                  Olsavszky" was
                                  > added to correct the wrong name, Kuczko. But of course this leaves the
                                  > question of why Kuczko was used in the first place.
                                  >
                                  > It is possible that Olsavszky was an alias of Kuczko, but in those
                                  cases it
                                  > usually just says "alias."
                                  >
                                  > Or it might have simply been an error of the priest in writing
                                  down the
                                  > wrong name and then later correcting it, but you wouldn't think it
                                  would
                                  > have happened twice.
                                  >
                                  > Do you see the use of the name Kuczko elsewhere in the records?
                                  >
                                  > I don't think John's "relicta" can be right since you indicate she was
                                  > "virgo" in her marriage record.
                                  >
                                  > The word "asciarius," as John has already said, means carpenter,
                                  and must
                                  > refer to Makara.
                                  >
                                  > The word "sod" is a puzzle to me.
                                  >
                                  > Janet
                                  >
                                  > _____
                                  >
                                  > From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                  yahoogroups.com
                                  > [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                  > yahoogroups.com] On
                                  > Behalf Of christine mackara
                                  > Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 3:15 PM
                                  > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                  yahoogroups.com
                                  > Subject: [S-R] baptismal
                                  >
                                  > Hello,
                                  > I need some help.
                                  > I found in the RC records of Presov, two baptismal entries for the
                                  Makara
                                  > Fam., were the name of our greatgrandmother was entered with an
                                  addition,
                                  > that I don't see in other entries.
                                  > Under the heading for the parents of the baptized it looks like :
                                  > Johann Makara
                                  > Maria Kuczko recte
                                  > Olsavszky
                                  > asciarius sod. RC
                                  > In the other 5 baptism, Maria is refered to as "Maria Olsavszky"
                                  (or varius
                                  > spellings of that name!) only.
                                  > In the marriage record she is refered to as "virgo" under heading of
                                  > "conditio"
                                  > What could the word "recte" mean in your opinion? The copy from
                                  the film is
                                  > not too good, but that is what I make of it. Just wondering.
                                  >
                                  > Christine
                                  >
                                  > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                  >
                                  > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                  >
                                  > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                  >
                                  > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                  >
                                  > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                  >
                                • June McKee
                                  Ron, I think that is a great idea. I know that many of the new researchers do not have the dictionarys and I think that would be very helpful to them. June ...
                                  Message 16 of 30 , Dec 2, 2007
                                  • 0 Attachment
                                    Ron,
                                    I think that is a great idea. I know that many of the new researchers do not have the dictionarys and I think that would be very helpful to them.

                                    June

                                    ----- Original Message -----
                                    From: Ron Matviyak
                                    To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                                    Sent: Sunday, December 02, 2007 2:39 AM
                                    Subject: Re: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis


                                    Maxine,

                                    If you are willing to collect and consolidate the individual lists
                                    that members have, you could make a major contribution to the forum.
                                    I have collected some words and I am sure others have as well. If we
                                    all share, and you (or some other generous person) volunteers to
                                    consolidate the list and post it under the 'files' part of the S-R web
                                    page, we can add to it as time passes.

                                    Ron

                                    --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com, "maxine" <maxine96@...> wrote:
                                    >
                                    > Vladimir, since you are so knowledgeable, and without patience with
                                    us, could you start a "file" with the words we are asking about. Then
                                    we can refer back to them. New words are confusing to us. That would
                                    be helpful. maxine
                                    >
                                    > ps Boy this group really shoots from the hip!
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > ----- Original Message -----
                                    > From: konekta@...
                                    > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                                    > Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 4:25 PM
                                    > Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > Dear Janet,
                                    > It is Journeyman.
                                    > Vladimir
                                    >
                                    > _____
                                    >
                                    > From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                                    [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com] On
                                    > Behalf Of Janet Kozlay
                                    > Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 10:14 PM
                                    > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                                    > Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis
                                    >
                                    > Ah, Vladimir, you must be patient with us. Sometimes we need to
                                    see it more
                                    > than once, if we even noted it the first time. I didn't even
                                    recognize it as
                                    > an abbreviation. So could you give us a little hint?
                                    >
                                    > Janet
                                    >
                                    > _____
                                    >
                                    > From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                    yahoogroups.com
                                    > [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                    > yahoogroups.com] On
                                    > Behalf Of konekta@... <mailto:konekta%40nm.psg.sk> sk
                                    > Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 4:01 PM
                                    > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                    yahoogroups.com
                                    > Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal
                                    >
                                    > We already explained in the past what the word Sodalis means.
                                    > Vladimir
                                    >
                                    > _____
                                    >
                                    > From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                    yahoogroups.com
                                    > [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                    > yahoogroups.com] On
                                    > Behalf Of Janet Kozlay
                                    > Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 9:59 PM
                                    > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                    yahoogroups.com
                                    > Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal
                                    >
                                    > Dear Christine,
                                    >
                                    > The word recte means correctly. I am guessing that "recte
                                    Olsavszky" was
                                    > added to correct the wrong name, Kuczko. But of course this leaves the
                                    > question of why Kuczko was used in the first place.
                                    >
                                    > It is possible that Olsavszky was an alias of Kuczko, but in those
                                    cases it
                                    > usually just says "alias."
                                    >
                                    > Or it might have simply been an error of the priest in writing
                                    down the
                                    > wrong name and then later correcting it, but you wouldn't think it
                                    would
                                    > have happened twice.
                                    >
                                    > Do you see the use of the name Kuczko elsewhere in the records?
                                    >
                                    > I don't think John's "relicta" can be right since you indicate she was
                                    > "virgo" in her marriage record.
                                    >
                                    > The word "asciarius," as John has already said, means carpenter,
                                    and must
                                    > refer to Makara.
                                    >
                                    > The word "sod" is a puzzle to me.
                                    >
                                    > Janet
                                    >
                                    > _____
                                    >
                                    > From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                    yahoogroups.com
                                    > [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                    > yahoogroups.com] On
                                    > Behalf Of christine mackara
                                    > Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 3:15 PM
                                    > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                    yahoogroups.com
                                    > Subject: [S-R] baptismal
                                    >
                                    > Hello,
                                    > I need some help.
                                    > I found in the RC records of Presov, two baptismal entries for the
                                    Makara
                                    > Fam., were the name of our greatgrandmother was entered with an
                                    addition,
                                    > that I don't see in other entries.
                                    > Under the heading for the parents of the baptized it looks like :
                                    > Johann Makara
                                    > Maria Kuczko recte
                                    > Olsavszky
                                    > asciarius sod. RC
                                    > In the other 5 baptism, Maria is refered to as "Maria Olsavszky"
                                    (or varius
                                    > spellings of that name!) only.
                                    > In the marriage record she is refered to as "virgo" under heading of
                                    > "conditio"
                                    > What could the word "recte" mean in your opinion? The copy from
                                    the film is
                                    > not too good, but that is what I make of it. Just wondering.
                                    >
                                    > Christine
                                    >
                                    > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                    >
                                    > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                    >
                                    > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                    >
                                    > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                    >
                                    > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                    >





                                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                  • maxine
                                    Hi, having a list of words would be great! It must be stated if they are Rusyn or Slovak or ? I would be more than happy to do this, however, I have no
                                    Message 17 of 30 , Dec 2, 2007
                                    • 0 Attachment
                                      Hi, having a list of "words" would be great! It must be stated if they are Rusyn or Slovak or ? I would be more than happy to do this, however,
                                      I have no knowledge of any language. Only know a few words. It is my hope someday to contribute to this group, and others, however, I am just learning myself. Attempting to learn the computer for 3 years now and the history, customs, etc of my people. Presently the only thing I can contribute are photo's. But there again I do not know how to send them. One day I hope to be able to contribute a lot more as I have learned much from the people on this site. Ron, I believe you know this! thanks guys maxine sasala




                                      ----- Original Message -----
                                      From: Ron Matviyak
                                      To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                                      Sent: Sunday, December 02, 2007 5:39 AM
                                      Subject: Re: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis


                                      Maxine,

                                      If you are willing to collect and consolidate the individual lists
                                      that members have, you could make a major contribution to the forum.
                                      I have collected some words and I am sure others have as well. If we
                                      all share, and you (or some other generous person) volunteers to
                                      consolidate the list and post it under the 'files' part of the S-R web
                                      page, we can add to it as time passes.

                                      Ron

                                      --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com, "maxine" <maxine96@...> wrote:
                                      >
                                      > Vladimir, since you are so knowledgeable, and without patience with
                                      us, could you start a "file" with the words we are asking about. Then
                                      we can refer back to them. New words are confusing to us. That would
                                      be helpful. maxine
                                      >
                                      > ps Boy this group really shoots from the hip!
                                      >
                                      >
                                      > ----- Original Message -----
                                      > From: konekta@...
                                      > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                                      > Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 4:25 PM
                                      > Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis
                                      >
                                      >
                                      > Dear Janet,
                                      > It is Journeyman.
                                      > Vladimir
                                      >
                                      > _____
                                      >
                                      > From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                                      [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com] On
                                      > Behalf Of Janet Kozlay
                                      > Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 10:14 PM
                                      > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                                      > Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis
                                      >
                                      > Ah, Vladimir, you must be patient with us. Sometimes we need to
                                      see it more
                                      > than once, if we even noted it the first time. I didn't even
                                      recognize it as
                                      > an abbreviation. So could you give us a little hint?
                                      >
                                      > Janet
                                      >
                                      > _____
                                      >
                                      > From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                      yahoogroups.com
                                      > [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                      > yahoogroups.com] On
                                      > Behalf Of konekta@... <mailto:konekta%40nm.psg.sk> sk
                                      > Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 4:01 PM
                                      > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                      yahoogroups.com
                                      > Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal
                                      >
                                      > We already explained in the past what the word Sodalis means.
                                      > Vladimir
                                      >
                                      > _____
                                      >
                                      > From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                      yahoogroups.com
                                      > [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                      > yahoogroups.com] On
                                      > Behalf Of Janet Kozlay
                                      > Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 9:59 PM
                                      > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                      yahoogroups.com
                                      > Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal
                                      >
                                      > Dear Christine,
                                      >
                                      > The word recte means correctly. I am guessing that "recte
                                      Olsavszky" was
                                      > added to correct the wrong name, Kuczko. But of course this leaves the
                                      > question of why Kuczko was used in the first place.
                                      >
                                      > It is possible that Olsavszky was an alias of Kuczko, but in those
                                      cases it
                                      > usually just says "alias."
                                      >
                                      > Or it might have simply been an error of the priest in writing
                                      down the
                                      > wrong name and then later correcting it, but you wouldn't think it
                                      would
                                      > have happened twice.
                                      >
                                      > Do you see the use of the name Kuczko elsewhere in the records?
                                      >
                                      > I don't think John's "relicta" can be right since you indicate she was
                                      > "virgo" in her marriage record.
                                      >
                                      > The word "asciarius," as John has already said, means carpenter,
                                      and must
                                      > refer to Makara.
                                      >
                                      > The word "sod" is a puzzle to me.
                                      >
                                      > Janet
                                      >
                                      > _____
                                      >
                                      > From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                      yahoogroups.com
                                      > [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                      > yahoogroups.com] On
                                      > Behalf Of christine mackara
                                      > Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 3:15 PM
                                      > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                      yahoogroups.com
                                      > Subject: [S-R] baptismal
                                      >
                                      > Hello,
                                      > I need some help.
                                      > I found in the RC records of Presov, two baptismal entries for the
                                      Makara
                                      > Fam., were the name of our greatgrandmother was entered with an
                                      addition,
                                      > that I don't see in other entries.
                                      > Under the heading for the parents of the baptized it looks like :
                                      > Johann Makara
                                      > Maria Kuczko recte
                                      > Olsavszky
                                      > asciarius sod. RC
                                      > In the other 5 baptism, Maria is refered to as "Maria Olsavszky"
                                      (or varius
                                      > spellings of that name!) only.
                                      > In the marriage record she is refered to as "virgo" under heading of
                                      > "conditio"
                                      > What could the word "recte" mean in your opinion? The copy from
                                      the film is
                                      > not too good, but that is what I make of it. Just wondering.
                                      >
                                      > Christine
                                      >
                                      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                      >
                                      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                      >
                                      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                      >
                                      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                      >
                                      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                      >





                                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                    • johnqadam
                                      Google Handy Guide to Hungarian Genealogical Records by Jared H. Suess and see if your library has it or can get it. Long out of print. Very informative 100
                                      Message 18 of 30 , Dec 2, 2007
                                      • 0 Attachment
                                        Google "Handy Guide to Hungarian Genealogical Records" by Jared H.
                                        Suess and see if your library has it or can get it. Long out of print.
                                        Very informative 100 page manual.
                                      • Helen France
                                        or you can try this site: http://www.familysearch.org.uk/Eng/Search/rg/guide/WLHungarian.ASP?Aid=&Gid=
                                        Message 19 of 30 , Dec 2, 2007
                                        • 0 Attachment
                                          or you can try this site:

                                          http://www.familysearch.org.uk/Eng/Search/rg/guide/WLHungarian.ASP?Aid=&Gid=
                                          &Lid=&Sid=&Sisgid=undefined&Did=&Juris1=&Event=&Year=&Gloss=&Sub=&Tab=&Entry
                                          =&Loc=undefined



                                          -----Original Message-----
                                          From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com]On
                                          Behalf Of johnqadam
                                          Sent: Sunday, December 02, 2007 1:56 PM
                                          To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                                          Subject: [S-R] Hungarian Word List & much more


                                          Google "Handy Guide to Hungarian Genealogical Records" by Jared H.
                                          Suess and see if your library has it or can get it. Long out of print.
                                          Very informative 100 page manual.




                                          No virus found in this outgoing message.
                                          Checked by AVG.
                                          Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.16.13/1164 - Release Date: 12/2/2007
                                          11:30 AM


                                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                        • PHILBAER@aol.com
                                          You can still download the .pdf document - I just did. In a message dated 12/2/2007 10:47:55 P.M. W. Europe Standard Time, ...
                                          Message 20 of 30 , Dec 2, 2007
                                          • 0 Attachment
                                            You can still download the .pdf document - I just did.


                                            In a message dated 12/2/2007 10:47:55 P.M. W. Europe Standard Time,
                                            johnqadam@... writes:




                                            >>> or you can try this site:
                                            >
                                            > _http://www.familysehttp://wwhttp://www.famhttp://wwhttp://www.fhttp_
                                            (http://www.familysearch.org.uk/Eng/Search/rg/guide/WLHungarian.ASP?)
                                            Aid=&Gid=&Lid=&Sid=&Sisgid=Sisgid=<W&<WBR&Juris1=&Event=&Year=&Gloss=&Su
                                            b=&Tab=&Entry=&Loc=undefined

                                            NOT. They removed the pdf file.







                                            **************************************Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest
                                            products.
                                            (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001)


                                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                          • Helen France
                                            Yes, you re correct. Just click at upper right hand and there you have it! Don t know what the problem was with John. ... From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                                            Message 21 of 30 , Dec 2, 2007
                                            • 0 Attachment
                                              Yes, you're correct. Just click at upper right hand and there you have it!
                                              Don't know what the problem was with John.


                                              -----Original Message-----
                                              From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com]On
                                              Behalf Of PHILBAER@...
                                              Sent: Sunday, December 02, 2007 4:05 PM
                                              To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                                              Subject: Re: [S-R] Hungarian Word List & much more


                                              You can still download the .pdf document - I just did.


                                              In a message dated 12/2/2007 10:47:55 P.M. W. Europe Standard Time,
                                              johnqadam@... writes:

                                              >>> or you can try this site:
                                              >
                                              > _http://www.familysehttp://wwhttp://www.famhttp://wwhttp://www.fhttp_
                                              (http://www.familysearch.org.uk/Eng/Search/rg/guide/WLHungarian.ASP?)
                                              Aid=&Gid=&Lid=&Sid=&Sisgid=Sisgid=<W&<WBR&Juris1=&Event=&Year=&Gloss=&Su
                                              b=&Tab=&Entry=&Loc=undefined

                                              NOT. They removed the pdf file.

                                              **************************************Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest
                                              products.
                                              (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001)

                                              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




                                              No virus found in this outgoing message.
                                              Checked by AVG.
                                              Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.16.13/1164 - Release Date: 12/2/2007
                                              11:30 AM


                                              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                            • Cheryl Gentsy-Penkrot
                                              The PDF file is located on the upper right hand side of the page...Click on the area that says PDF download the printable...you will have 15 pages of wonder of
                                              Message 22 of 30 , Dec 2, 2007
                                              • 0 Attachment
                                                The PDF file is located on the upper right hand side of the page...Click on the area that says PDF download the printable...you will have 15 pages of wonder of the hungarian language. Hope this helps... :)

                                                Cheri




                                                johnqadam <johnqadam@...> wrote:
                                                >>> or you can try this site:
                                                >
                                                > http://www.familysearch.org.uk/Eng/Search/rg/guide/WLHungarian.ASP?
                                                Aid=&Gid=&Lid=&Sid=&Sisgid=undefined&Did=&Juris1=&Event=&Year=&Gloss=&Su
                                                b=&Tab=&Entry=&Loc=undefined

                                                NOT. They removed the pdf file.






                                                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                              • maxine
                                                Hi everyone, when I say word list , I do NOT mean every word. I mean the ones that come up or are useful for searching families, or words your grandparents
                                                Message 23 of 30 , Dec 2, 2007
                                                • 0 Attachment
                                                  Hi everyone, when I say "word list", I do NOT mean every word. I mean the ones that "come up" or are useful for searching families, or words your grandparents used, on documents, that kind of stuff. Agree or disagree maxine sasala




                                                  ----- Original Message -----
                                                  From: johnqadam
                                                  To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                                                  Sent: Sunday, December 02, 2007 2:44 PM
                                                  Subject: Re: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis


                                                  >>> Hi, having a list of "words" would be great! It must be stated if
                                                  they are Rusyn or Slovak or ? <<<

                                                  LDS has already dome this. That's the good news. The bad news is that
                                                  the pdf file has been removed from their web site and now they sell the
                                                  word list for US$1.25.

                                                  Here is Hungarian word list link
                                                  www.ldscatalog.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?
                                                  catalogId=10151&storeId=10151&productId=42285&langId=-
                                                  1&sortId=3&sortOr=1&sTerm=36335&sNVPs=%26beginIndex%3D0%26pageSize%
                                                  3D200%26searchTerm%3D36335%26searchType%3DANY%26sType%3DSimple%26pageId%
                                                  3D1%26pageCt%3D15&retURLtext=Back%20to%20'36335'%20search&retURL=http%
                                                  3A%2F%2Fwww.ldscatalog.com%2Fwebapp%2Fwcs%2Fstores%2Fservlet%
                                                  2FCatalogSearchResultView%3FcatalogId%3D10151%26amp%3BstoreId%3D10151%
                                                  26amp%3BlangId%3D-1%26beginIndex%3D0%26pageSize%3D200%26searchTerm%
                                                  3D36335%26searchType%3DANY%26sType%3DSimple%26pageId%3D1%26pageCt%3D15%
                                                  26sortId%3D3%26sortOr%3D1





                                                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                • johnqadam
                                                  ... CORRECT. Click on pdf and the file is found!!!!
                                                  Message 24 of 30 , Dec 2, 2007
                                                  • 0 Attachment
                                                    >>> You can still download the .pdf document - I just did. <<<

                                                    CORRECT. Click on pdf and the file is found!!!!
                                                  • konekta@nm.psg.sk
                                                    No, Maxine It would be latin-english Vladimir _____ From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of maxine Sent: Sunday,
                                                    Message 25 of 30 , Dec 2, 2007
                                                    • 0 Attachment
                                                      No, Maxine
                                                      It would be latin-english
                                                      Vladimir

                                                      _____

                                                      From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com] On
                                                      Behalf Of maxine
                                                      Sent: Sunday, December 02, 2007 7:40 PM
                                                      To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                                                      Subject: Re: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis



                                                      Hi, having a list of "words" would be great! It must be stated if they are
                                                      Rusyn or Slovak or ? I would be more than happy to do this, however,
                                                      I have no knowledge of any language. Only know a few words. It is my hope
                                                      someday to contribute to this group, and others, however, I am just learning
                                                      myself. Attempting to learn the computer for 3 years now and the history,
                                                      customs, etc of my people. Presently the only thing I can contribute are
                                                      photo's. But there again I do not know how to send them. One day I hope to
                                                      be able to contribute a lot more as I have learned much from the people on
                                                      this site. Ron, I believe you know this! thanks guys maxine sasala

                                                      ----- Original Message -----
                                                      From: Ron Matviyak
                                                      To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                                                      Sent: Sunday, December 02, 2007 5:39 AM
                                                      Subject: Re: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis

                                                      Maxine,

                                                      If you are willing to collect and consolidate the individual lists
                                                      that members have, you could make a major contribution to the forum.
                                                      I have collected some words and I am sure others have as well. If we
                                                      all share, and you (or some other generous person) volunteers to
                                                      consolidate the list and post it under the 'files' part of the S-R web
                                                      page, we can add to it as time passes.

                                                      Ron

                                                      --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                      yahoogroups.com, "maxine" <maxine96@...> wrote:
                                                      >
                                                      > Vladimir, since you are so knowledgeable, and without patience with
                                                      us, could you start a "file" with the words we are asking about. Then
                                                      we can refer back to them. New words are confusing to us. That would
                                                      be helpful. maxine
                                                      >
                                                      > ps Boy this group really shoots from the hip!
                                                      >
                                                      >
                                                      > ----- Original Message -----
                                                      > From: konekta@...
                                                      > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                                                      > Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 4:25 PM
                                                      > Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis
                                                      >
                                                      >
                                                      > Dear Janet,
                                                      > It is Journeyman.
                                                      > Vladimir
                                                      >
                                                      > _____
                                                      >
                                                      > From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                      yahoogroups.com
                                                      [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                      yahoogroups.com] On
                                                      > Behalf Of Janet Kozlay
                                                      > Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 10:14 PM
                                                      > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                                                      > Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis
                                                      >
                                                      > Ah, Vladimir, you must be patient with us. Sometimes we need to
                                                      see it more
                                                      > than once, if we even noted it the first time. I didn't even
                                                      recognize it as
                                                      > an abbreviation. So could you give us a little hint?
                                                      >
                                                      > Janet
                                                      >
                                                      > _____
                                                      >
                                                      > From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                      yahoogroups.com
                                                      > [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                      > yahoogroups.com] On
                                                      > Behalf Of konekta@... <mailto:konekta%40nm.psg.sk> sk
                                                      > Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 4:01 PM
                                                      > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                      yahoogroups.com
                                                      > Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal
                                                      >
                                                      > We already explained in the past what the word Sodalis means.
                                                      > Vladimir
                                                      >
                                                      > _____
                                                      >
                                                      > From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                      yahoogroups.com
                                                      > [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                      > yahoogroups.com] On
                                                      > Behalf Of Janet Kozlay
                                                      > Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 9:59 PM
                                                      > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                      yahoogroups.com
                                                      > Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal
                                                      >
                                                      > Dear Christine,
                                                      >
                                                      > The word recte means correctly. I am guessing that "recte
                                                      Olsavszky" was
                                                      > added to correct the wrong name, Kuczko. But of course this leaves the
                                                      > question of why Kuczko was used in the first place.
                                                      >
                                                      > It is possible that Olsavszky was an alias of Kuczko, but in those
                                                      cases it
                                                      > usually just says "alias."
                                                      >
                                                      > Or it might have simply been an error of the priest in writing
                                                      down the
                                                      > wrong name and then later correcting it, but you wouldn't think it
                                                      would
                                                      > have happened twice.
                                                      >
                                                      > Do you see the use of the name Kuczko elsewhere in the records?
                                                      >
                                                      > I don't think John's "relicta" can be right since you indicate she was
                                                      > "virgo" in her marriage record.
                                                      >
                                                      > The word "asciarius," as John has already said, means carpenter,
                                                      and must
                                                      > refer to Makara.
                                                      >
                                                      > The word "sod" is a puzzle to me.
                                                      >
                                                      > Janet
                                                      >
                                                      > _____
                                                      >
                                                      > From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                      yahoogroups.com
                                                      > [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                      > yahoogroups.com] On
                                                      > Behalf Of christine mackara
                                                      > Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 3:15 PM
                                                      > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                      yahoogroups.com
                                                      > Subject: [S-R] baptismal
                                                      >
                                                      > Hello,
                                                      > I need some help.
                                                      > I found in the RC records of Presov, two baptismal entries for the
                                                      Makara
                                                      > Fam., were the name of our greatgrandmother was entered with an
                                                      addition,
                                                      > that I don't see in other entries.
                                                      > Under the heading for the parents of the baptized it looks like :
                                                      > Johann Makara
                                                      > Maria Kuczko recte
                                                      > Olsavszky
                                                      > asciarius sod. RC
                                                      > In the other 5 baptism, Maria is refered to as "Maria Olsavszky"
                                                      (or varius
                                                      > spellings of that name!) only.
                                                      > In the marriage record she is refered to as "virgo" under heading of
                                                      > "conditio"
                                                      > What could the word "recte" mean in your opinion? The copy from
                                                      the film is
                                                      > not too good, but that is what I make of it. Just wondering.
                                                      >
                                                      > Christine
                                                      >
                                                      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                      >
                                                      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                      >
                                                      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                      >
                                                      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                      >
                                                      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                      >
                                                      >
                                                      >
                                                      >
                                                      >
                                                      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                      >

                                                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]






                                                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                    • maxine
                                                      Hi Vladimir, thanks for the info. I think that is why so many of us are confused. Me at least. I do not know the difference between the latin, Rusyn, Slovak,
                                                      Message 26 of 30 , Dec 3, 2007
                                                      • 0 Attachment
                                                        Hi Vladimir, thanks for the info. I think that is why so many of us are confused. Me at least. I do not know the difference between the latin, Rusyn, Slovak, etc. Thanks for your help. maxine




                                                        ----- Original Message -----
                                                        From: konekta@...
                                                        To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                                                        Sent: Monday, December 03, 2007 1:47 AM
                                                        Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis


                                                        No, Maxine
                                                        It would be latin-english
                                                        Vladimir

                                                        _____

                                                        From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com] On
                                                        Behalf Of maxine
                                                        Sent: Sunday, December 02, 2007 7:40 PM
                                                        To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                                                        Subject: Re: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis

                                                        Hi, having a list of "words" would be great! It must be stated if they are
                                                        Rusyn or Slovak or ? I would be more than happy to do this, however,
                                                        I have no knowledge of any language. Only know a few words. It is my hope
                                                        someday to contribute to this group, and others, however, I am just learning
                                                        myself. Attempting to learn the computer for 3 years now and the history,
                                                        customs, etc of my people. Presently the only thing I can contribute are
                                                        photo's. But there again I do not know how to send them. One day I hope to
                                                        be able to contribute a lot more as I have learned much from the people on
                                                        this site. Ron, I believe you know this! thanks guys maxine sasala

                                                        ----- Original Message -----
                                                        From: Ron Matviyak
                                                        To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                                                        Sent: Sunday, December 02, 2007 5:39 AM
                                                        Subject: Re: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis

                                                        Maxine,

                                                        If you are willing to collect and consolidate the individual lists
                                                        that members have, you could make a major contribution to the forum.
                                                        I have collected some words and I am sure others have as well. If we
                                                        all share, and you (or some other generous person) volunteers to
                                                        consolidate the list and post it under the 'files' part of the S-R web
                                                        page, we can add to it as time passes.

                                                        Ron

                                                        --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                        yahoogroups.com, "maxine" <maxine96@...> wrote:
                                                        >
                                                        > Vladimir, since you are so knowledgeable, and without patience with
                                                        us, could you start a "file" with the words we are asking about. Then
                                                        we can refer back to them. New words are confusing to us. That would
                                                        be helpful. maxine
                                                        >
                                                        > ps Boy this group really shoots from the hip!
                                                        >
                                                        >
                                                        > ----- Original Message -----
                                                        > From: konekta@...
                                                        > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                                                        > Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 4:25 PM
                                                        > Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis
                                                        >
                                                        >
                                                        > Dear Janet,
                                                        > It is Journeyman.
                                                        > Vladimir
                                                        >
                                                        > _____
                                                        >
                                                        > From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                        yahoogroups.com
                                                        [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                        yahoogroups.com] On
                                                        > Behalf Of Janet Kozlay
                                                        > Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 10:14 PM
                                                        > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                                                        > Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis
                                                        >
                                                        > Ah, Vladimir, you must be patient with us. Sometimes we need to
                                                        see it more
                                                        > than once, if we even noted it the first time. I didn't even
                                                        recognize it as
                                                        > an abbreviation. So could you give us a little hint?
                                                        >
                                                        > Janet
                                                        >
                                                        > _____
                                                        >
                                                        > From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                        yahoogroups.com
                                                        > [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                        > yahoogroups.com] On
                                                        > Behalf Of konekta@... <mailto:konekta%40nm.psg.sk> sk
                                                        > Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 4:01 PM
                                                        > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                        yahoogroups.com
                                                        > Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal
                                                        >
                                                        > We already explained in the past what the word Sodalis means.
                                                        > Vladimir
                                                        >
                                                        > _____
                                                        >
                                                        > From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                        yahoogroups.com
                                                        > [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                        > yahoogroups.com] On
                                                        > Behalf Of Janet Kozlay
                                                        > Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 9:59 PM
                                                        > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                        yahoogroups.com
                                                        > Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal
                                                        >
                                                        > Dear Christine,
                                                        >
                                                        > The word recte means correctly. I am guessing that "recte
                                                        Olsavszky" was
                                                        > added to correct the wrong name, Kuczko. But of course this leaves the
                                                        > question of why Kuczko was used in the first place.
                                                        >
                                                        > It is possible that Olsavszky was an alias of Kuczko, but in those
                                                        cases it
                                                        > usually just says "alias."
                                                        >
                                                        > Or it might have simply been an error of the priest in writing
                                                        down the
                                                        > wrong name and then later correcting it, but you wouldn't think it
                                                        would
                                                        > have happened twice.
                                                        >
                                                        > Do you see the use of the name Kuczko elsewhere in the records?
                                                        >
                                                        > I don't think John's "relicta" can be right since you indicate she was
                                                        > "virgo" in her marriage record.
                                                        >
                                                        > The word "asciarius," as John has already said, means carpenter,
                                                        and must
                                                        > refer to Makara.
                                                        >
                                                        > The word "sod" is a puzzle to me.
                                                        >
                                                        > Janet
                                                        >
                                                        > _____
                                                        >
                                                        > From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                        yahoogroups.com
                                                        > [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                        > yahoogroups.com] On
                                                        > Behalf Of christine mackara
                                                        > Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 3:15 PM
                                                        > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                        yahoogroups.com
                                                        > Subject: [S-R] baptismal
                                                        >
                                                        > Hello,
                                                        > I need some help.
                                                        > I found in the RC records of Presov, two baptismal entries for the
                                                        Makara
                                                        > Fam., were the name of our greatgrandmother was entered with an
                                                        addition,
                                                        > that I don't see in other entries.
                                                        > Under the heading for the parents of the baptized it looks like :
                                                        > Johann Makara
                                                        > Maria Kuczko recte
                                                        > Olsavszky
                                                        > asciarius sod. RC
                                                        > In the other 5 baptism, Maria is refered to as "Maria Olsavszky"
                                                        (or varius
                                                        > spellings of that name!) only.
                                                        > In the marriage record she is refered to as "virgo" under heading of
                                                        > "conditio"
                                                        > What could the word "recte" mean in your opinion? The copy from
                                                        the film is
                                                        > not too good, but that is what I make of it. Just wondering.
                                                        >
                                                        > Christine
                                                        >
                                                        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                        >
                                                        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                        >
                                                        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                        >
                                                        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                        >
                                                        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                        >
                                                        >
                                                        >
                                                        >
                                                        >
                                                        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                        >

                                                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

                                                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





                                                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                      • konekta@nm.psg.sk
                                                        Dear Maxine, Studying church records is not that simple as one might think. If you can not read what is there then the whole effort is in vain. You will miss
                                                        Message 27 of 30 , Dec 3, 2007
                                                        • 0 Attachment
                                                          Dear Maxine,
                                                          Studying church records is not that simple as one might think. If you can
                                                          not read what is there then the whole effort is in vain. You will miss
                                                          information.
                                                          Some people do their "own research" by coordinating the work of other people
                                                          who know.
                                                          If you really want to do it by yourself, then you have to learn and learn.
                                                          Vladimir


                                                          _____

                                                          From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com] On
                                                          Behalf Of maxine
                                                          Sent: Monday, December 03, 2007 2:42 PM
                                                          To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                                                          Subject: Re: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis



                                                          Hi Vladimir, thanks for the info. I think that is why so many of us are
                                                          confused. Me at least. I do not know the difference between the latin,
                                                          Rusyn, Slovak, etc. Thanks for your help. maxine

                                                          ----- Original Message -----
                                                          From: konekta@.... <mailto:konekta%40nm.psg.sk> sk
                                                          To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                                                          Sent: Monday, December 03, 2007 1:47 AM
                                                          Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis

                                                          No, Maxine
                                                          It would be latin-english
                                                          Vladimir

                                                          _____

                                                          From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                                                          [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                          yahoogroups.com] On
                                                          Behalf Of maxine
                                                          Sent: Sunday, December 02, 2007 7:40 PM
                                                          To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                                                          Subject: Re: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis

                                                          Hi, having a list of "words" would be great! It must be stated if they are
                                                          Rusyn or Slovak or ? I would be more than happy to do this, however,
                                                          I have no knowledge of any language. Only know a few words. It is my hope
                                                          someday to contribute to this group, and others, however, I am just learning
                                                          myself. Attempting to learn the computer for 3 years now and the history,
                                                          customs, etc of my people. Presently the only thing I can contribute are
                                                          photo's. But there again I do not know how to send them. One day I hope to
                                                          be able to contribute a lot more as I have learned much from the people on
                                                          this site. Ron, I believe you know this! thanks guys maxine sasala

                                                          ----- Original Message -----
                                                          From: Ron Matviyak
                                                          To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                                                          Sent: Sunday, December 02, 2007 5:39 AM
                                                          Subject: Re: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis

                                                          Maxine,

                                                          If you are willing to collect and consolidate the individual lists
                                                          that members have, you could make a major contribution to the forum.
                                                          I have collected some words and I am sure others have as well. If we
                                                          all share, and you (or some other generous person) volunteers to
                                                          consolidate the list and post it under the 'files' part of the S-R web
                                                          page, we can add to it as time passes.

                                                          Ron

                                                          --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                          yahoogroups.com, "maxine" <maxine96@...> wrote:
                                                          >
                                                          > Vladimir, since you are so knowledgeable, and without patience with
                                                          us, could you start a "file" with the words we are asking about. Then
                                                          we can refer back to them. New words are confusing to us. That would
                                                          be helpful. maxine
                                                          >
                                                          > ps Boy this group really shoots from the hip!
                                                          >
                                                          >
                                                          > ----- Original Message -----
                                                          > From: konekta@...
                                                          > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                                                          > Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 4:25 PM
                                                          > Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis
                                                          >
                                                          >
                                                          > Dear Janet,
                                                          > It is Journeyman.
                                                          > Vladimir
                                                          >
                                                          > _____
                                                          >
                                                          > From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                          yahoogroups.com
                                                          [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                          yahoogroups.com] On
                                                          > Behalf Of Janet Kozlay
                                                          > Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 10:14 PM
                                                          > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                                                          > Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis
                                                          >
                                                          > Ah, Vladimir, you must be patient with us. Sometimes we need to
                                                          see it more
                                                          > than once, if we even noted it the first time. I didn't even
                                                          recognize it as
                                                          > an abbreviation. So could you give us a little hint?
                                                          >
                                                          > Janet
                                                          >
                                                          > _____
                                                          >
                                                          > From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                          yahoogroups.com
                                                          > [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                          > yahoogroups.com] On
                                                          > Behalf Of konekta@... <mailto:konekta%40nm.psg.sk> sk
                                                          > Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 4:01 PM
                                                          > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                          yahoogroups.com
                                                          > Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal
                                                          >
                                                          > We already explained in the past what the word Sodalis means.
                                                          > Vladimir
                                                          >
                                                          > _____
                                                          >
                                                          > From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                          yahoogroups.com
                                                          > [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                          > yahoogroups.com] On
                                                          > Behalf Of Janet Kozlay
                                                          > Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 9:59 PM
                                                          > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                          yahoogroups.com
                                                          > Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal
                                                          >
                                                          > Dear Christine,
                                                          >
                                                          > The word recte means correctly. I am guessing that "recte
                                                          Olsavszky" was
                                                          > added to correct the wrong name, Kuczko. But of course this leaves the
                                                          > question of why Kuczko was used in the first place.
                                                          >
                                                          > It is possible that Olsavszky was an alias of Kuczko, but in those
                                                          cases it
                                                          > usually just says "alias."
                                                          >
                                                          > Or it might have simply been an error of the priest in writing
                                                          down the
                                                          > wrong name and then later correcting it, but you wouldn't think it
                                                          would
                                                          > have happened twice.
                                                          >
                                                          > Do you see the use of the name Kuczko elsewhere in the records?
                                                          >
                                                          > I don't think John's "relicta" can be right since you indicate she was
                                                          > "virgo" in her marriage record.
                                                          >
                                                          > The word "asciarius," as John has already said, means carpenter,
                                                          and must
                                                          > refer to Makara.
                                                          >
                                                          > The word "sod" is a puzzle to me.
                                                          >
                                                          > Janet
                                                          >
                                                          > _____
                                                          >
                                                          > From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                          yahoogroups.com
                                                          > [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                          > yahoogroups.com] On
                                                          > Behalf Of christine mackara
                                                          > Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 3:15 PM
                                                          > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                          yahoogroups.com
                                                          > Subject: [S-R] baptismal
                                                          >
                                                          > Hello,
                                                          > I need some help.
                                                          > I found in the RC records of Presov, two baptismal entries for the
                                                          Makara
                                                          > Fam., were the name of our greatgrandmother was entered with an
                                                          addition,
                                                          > that I don't see in other entries.
                                                          > Under the heading for the parents of the baptized it looks like :
                                                          > Johann Makara
                                                          > Maria Kuczko recte
                                                          > Olsavszky
                                                          > asciarius sod. RC
                                                          > In the other 5 baptism, Maria is refered to as "Maria Olsavszky"
                                                          (or varius
                                                          > spellings of that name!) only.
                                                          > In the marriage record she is refered to as "virgo" under heading of
                                                          > "conditio"
                                                          > What could the word "recte" mean in your opinion? The copy from
                                                          the film is
                                                          > not too good, but that is what I make of it. Just wondering.
                                                          >
                                                          > Christine
                                                          >
                                                          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                          >
                                                          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                          >
                                                          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                          >
                                                          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                          >
                                                          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                          >
                                                          >
                                                          >
                                                          >
                                                          >
                                                          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                          >

                                                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

                                                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

                                                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]






                                                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                        • maxine
                                                          Thanks Valadimir for the info and you are right. However, I do not do it by myself, I do not have the knowledge you and the others have. I am still learning
                                                          Message 28 of 30 , Dec 4, 2007
                                                          • 0 Attachment
                                                            Thanks Valadimir for the info and you are right. However, I do not do it by myself, I do not have the knowledge you and the others have. I am still learning and I have a lot to learn. That is why these sites, like SR, are so helpful, usually everyone on the site tries to help each other. I am grateful for that. maxine


                                                            ----- Original Message -----
                                                            From: konekta@...
                                                            To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                                                            Sent: Tuesday, December 04, 2007 2:34 AM
                                                            Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis


                                                            Dear Maxine,
                                                            Studying church records is not that simple as one might think. If you can
                                                            not read what is there then the whole effort is in vain. You will miss
                                                            information.
                                                            Some people do their "own research" by coordinating the work of other people
                                                            who know.
                                                            If you really want to do it by yourself, then you have to learn and learn.
                                                            Vladimir


                                                            _____

                                                            From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com] On
                                                            Behalf Of maxine
                                                            Sent: Monday, December 03, 2007 2:42 PM
                                                            To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                                                            Subject: Re: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis

                                                            Hi Vladimir, thanks for the info. I think that is why so many of us are
                                                            confused. Me at least. I do not know the difference between the latin,
                                                            Rusyn, Slovak, etc. Thanks for your help. maxine

                                                            ----- Original Message -----
                                                            From: konekta@.... <mailto:konekta%40nm.psg.sk> sk
                                                            To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                                                            Sent: Monday, December 03, 2007 1:47 AM
                                                            Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis

                                                            No, Maxine
                                                            It would be latin-english
                                                            Vladimir

                                                            _____

                                                            From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                                                            [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                            yahoogroups.com] On
                                                            Behalf Of maxine
                                                            Sent: Sunday, December 02, 2007 7:40 PM
                                                            To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                                                            Subject: Re: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis

                                                            Hi, having a list of "words" would be great! It must be stated if they are
                                                            Rusyn or Slovak or ? I would be more than happy to do this, however,
                                                            I have no knowledge of any language. Only know a few words. It is my hope
                                                            someday to contribute to this group, and others, however, I am just learning
                                                            myself. Attempting to learn the computer for 3 years now and the history,
                                                            customs, etc of my people. Presently the only thing I can contribute are
                                                            photo's. But there again I do not know how to send them. One day I hope to
                                                            be able to contribute a lot more as I have learned much from the people on
                                                            this site. Ron, I believe you know this! thanks guys maxine sasala

                                                            ----- Original Message -----
                                                            From: Ron Matviyak
                                                            To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                                                            Sent: Sunday, December 02, 2007 5:39 AM
                                                            Subject: Re: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis

                                                            Maxine,

                                                            If you are willing to collect and consolidate the individual lists
                                                            that members have, you could make a major contribution to the forum.
                                                            I have collected some words and I am sure others have as well. If we
                                                            all share, and you (or some other generous person) volunteers to
                                                            consolidate the list and post it under the 'files' part of the S-R web
                                                            page, we can add to it as time passes.

                                                            Ron

                                                            --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                            yahoogroups.com, "maxine" <maxine96@...> wrote:
                                                            >
                                                            > Vladimir, since you are so knowledgeable, and without patience with
                                                            us, could you start a "file" with the words we are asking about. Then
                                                            we can refer back to them. New words are confusing to us. That would
                                                            be helpful. maxine
                                                            >
                                                            > ps Boy this group really shoots from the hip!
                                                            >
                                                            >
                                                            > ----- Original Message -----
                                                            > From: konekta@...
                                                            > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                                                            > Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 4:25 PM
                                                            > Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis
                                                            >
                                                            >
                                                            > Dear Janet,
                                                            > It is Journeyman.
                                                            > Vladimir
                                                            >
                                                            > _____
                                                            >
                                                            > From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                            yahoogroups.com
                                                            [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                            yahoogroups.com] On
                                                            > Behalf Of Janet Kozlay
                                                            > Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 10:14 PM
                                                            > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                                                            > Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis
                                                            >
                                                            > Ah, Vladimir, you must be patient with us. Sometimes we need to
                                                            see it more
                                                            > than once, if we even noted it the first time. I didn't even
                                                            recognize it as
                                                            > an abbreviation. So could you give us a little hint?
                                                            >
                                                            > Janet
                                                            >
                                                            > _____
                                                            >
                                                            > From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                            yahoogroups.com
                                                            > [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                            > yahoogroups.com] On
                                                            > Behalf Of konekta@... <mailto:konekta%40nm.psg.sk> sk
                                                            > Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 4:01 PM
                                                            > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                            yahoogroups.com
                                                            > Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal
                                                            >
                                                            > We already explained in the past what the word Sodalis means.
                                                            > Vladimir
                                                            >
                                                            > _____
                                                            >
                                                            > From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                            yahoogroups.com
                                                            > [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                            > yahoogroups.com] On
                                                            > Behalf Of Janet Kozlay
                                                            > Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 9:59 PM
                                                            > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                            yahoogroups.com
                                                            > Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal
                                                            >
                                                            > Dear Christine,
                                                            >
                                                            > The word recte means correctly. I am guessing that "recte
                                                            Olsavszky" was
                                                            > added to correct the wrong name, Kuczko. But of course this leaves the
                                                            > question of why Kuczko was used in the first place.
                                                            >
                                                            > It is possible that Olsavszky was an alias of Kuczko, but in those
                                                            cases it
                                                            > usually just says "alias."
                                                            >
                                                            > Or it might have simply been an error of the priest in writing
                                                            down the
                                                            > wrong name and then later correcting it, but you wouldn't think it
                                                            would
                                                            > have happened twice.
                                                            >
                                                            > Do you see the use of the name Kuczko elsewhere in the records?
                                                            >
                                                            > I don't think John's "relicta" can be right since you indicate she was
                                                            > "virgo" in her marriage record.
                                                            >
                                                            > The word "asciarius," as John has already said, means carpenter,
                                                            and must
                                                            > refer to Makara.
                                                            >
                                                            > The word "sod" is a puzzle to me.
                                                            >
                                                            > Janet
                                                            >
                                                            > _____
                                                            >
                                                            > From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                            yahoogroups.com
                                                            > [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                            > yahoogroups.com] On
                                                            > Behalf Of christine mackara
                                                            > Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 3:15 PM
                                                            > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                            yahoogroups.com
                                                            > Subject: [S-R] baptismal
                                                            >
                                                            > Hello,
                                                            > I need some help.
                                                            > I found in the RC records of Presov, two baptismal entries for the
                                                            Makara
                                                            > Fam., were the name of our greatgrandmother was entered with an
                                                            addition,
                                                            > that I don't see in other entries.
                                                            > Under the heading for the parents of the baptized it looks like :
                                                            > Johann Makara
                                                            > Maria Kuczko recte
                                                            > Olsavszky
                                                            > asciarius sod. RC
                                                            > In the other 5 baptism, Maria is refered to as "Maria Olsavszky"
                                                            (or varius
                                                            > spellings of that name!) only.
                                                            > In the marriage record she is refered to as "virgo" under heading of
                                                            > "conditio"
                                                            > What could the word "recte" mean in your opinion? The copy from
                                                            the film is
                                                            > not too good, but that is what I make of it. Just wondering.
                                                            >
                                                            > Christine
                                                            >
                                                            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                            >
                                                            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                            >
                                                            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                            >
                                                            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                            >
                                                            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                            >
                                                            >
                                                            >
                                                            >
                                                            >
                                                            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                            >

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                                                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                          • Bill Tarkulich
                                                            Hello Maxine, Vladimir is most certainly correct. Simply knowing the words will not be sufficient. Understanding the context in which they are written is
                                                            Message 29 of 30 , Dec 4, 2007
                                                            • 0 Attachment
                                                              Hello Maxine,

                                                              Vladimir is most certainly correct. Simply knowing the words will not be
                                                              sufficient. Understanding the context in which they are written is
                                                              essential. That's why when someone asks for a translation of a word or
                                                              sentence, I ask to see the whole page or more. It puts it into context of
                                                              the writer, the handwriting, the general form of the document. From there
                                                              we can deduce the style and method of that particular writer - everyone
                                                              writes differently.

                                                              Taken to the next level, understanding the history of the time in which
                                                              you are examining is extremely helpful and productive. National, regional
                                                              and village histories are all essential reading. Again, this is putting
                                                              the event in context. It helps to explain the "why" which we are always
                                                              left with.

                                                              Care must often be taken when we make generalizations. Often we find
                                                              ourselves grasping for generalizations, perhaps about lifestyle of our
                                                              ancestors. We may take a wide-ranging book on Slovak customs and assume
                                                              they were the same in our village. Maybe not. Even from nearby villages,
                                                              customs could vary significantly. There are more than 2,500 villages in
                                                              Slovakia alone.

                                                              We must also take care not to assume or "read into" material too deeply or
                                                              take a single data point as fact. I always insist on at least one
                                                              additional, independent source by which to corroborate my facts. It is
                                                              only then that I have enough confidence to declare it a fact.

                                                              Back to words. First, you must at least identify which language the
                                                              document is written in before you even have a chance to begin. Read more,
                                                              look at all the samples you can, not just of your research work, but the
                                                              work of others.

                                                              With regard to word lists, there are hundreds of word lists available
                                                              today. Perhaps the best lists are those compiled and available for free
                                                              from the Family History Center.
                                                              http://www.familysearch.org/Eng/Search/RG/frameset_rhelps.asp

                                                              For Example:
                                                              Latin: http://www.familysearch.org/Eng/Search/RG/guide/WLLatin.asp
                                                              "Hungarian"/Magyar: http://tinyurl.com/b9qqx
                                                              There are several others.

                                                              I have also compiled a list of my favorites,
                                                              http://www.iabsi.com/gen/public/language.htm which is a good starting
                                                              point.

                                                              Best of Luck,

                                                              Bill Tarkulich


                                                              On Tue, December 4, 2007 2:34 am, konekta@... wrote:
                                                              > Dear Maxine,
                                                              > Studying church records is not that simple as one might think. If you can
                                                              > not read what is there then the whole effort is in vain. You will miss
                                                              > information.
                                                              > Some people do their "own research" by coordinating the work of other
                                                              > people
                                                              > who know.
                                                              > If you really want to do it by yourself, then you have to learn and learn.
                                                              > Vladimir
                                                              >
                                                              >
                                                              > _____
                                                              >
                                                              > From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com]
                                                              > On
                                                              > Behalf Of maxine
                                                              > Sent: Monday, December 03, 2007 2:42 PM
                                                              > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                                                              > Subject: Re: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis
                                                              >
                                                              >
                                                              >
                                                              > Hi Vladimir, thanks for the info. I think that is why so many of us are
                                                              > confused. Me at least. I do not know the difference between the latin,
                                                              > Rusyn, Slovak, etc. Thanks for your help. maxine
                                                              >
                                                              > ----- Original Message -----
                                                              > From: konekta@.... <mailto:konekta%40nm.psg.sk> sk
                                                              > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                                                              > Sent: Monday, December 03, 2007 1:47 AM
                                                              > Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis
                                                              >
                                                              > No, Maxine
                                                              > It would be latin-english
                                                              > Vladimir
                                                              >
                                                              > _____
                                                              >
                                                              > From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                              > yahoogroups.com
                                                              > [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                              > yahoogroups.com] On
                                                              > Behalf Of maxine
                                                              > Sent: Sunday, December 02, 2007 7:40 PM
                                                              > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                                                              > Subject: Re: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis
                                                              >
                                                              > Hi, having a list of "words" would be great! It must be stated if they are
                                                              > Rusyn or Slovak or ? I would be more than happy to do this, however,
                                                              > I have no knowledge of any language. Only know a few words. It is my hope
                                                              > someday to contribute to this group, and others, however, I am just
                                                              > learning
                                                              > myself. Attempting to learn the computer for 3 years now and the history,
                                                              > customs, etc of my people. Presently the only thing I can contribute are
                                                              > photo's. But there again I do not know how to send them. One day I hope to
                                                              > be able to contribute a lot more as I have learned much from the people on
                                                              > this site. Ron, I believe you know this! thanks guys maxine sasala
                                                              >
                                                              > ----- Original Message -----
                                                              > From: Ron Matviyak
                                                              > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                                                              > Sent: Sunday, December 02, 2007 5:39 AM
                                                              > Subject: Re: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis
                                                              >
                                                              > Maxine,
                                                              >
                                                              > If you are willing to collect and consolidate the individual lists
                                                              > that members have, you could make a major contribution to the forum.
                                                              > I have collected some words and I am sure others have as well. If we
                                                              > all share, and you (or some other generous person) volunteers to
                                                              > consolidate the list and post it under the 'files' part of the S-R web
                                                              > page, we can add to it as time passes.
                                                              >
                                                              > Ron
                                                              >

                                                              --
                                                              Bill Tarkulich
                                                              http://www.iabsi.com
                                                            • konekta@nm.psg.sk
                                                              Dear Maxine, What I mean is, when you are sitting with the viewer, you are alone. You can not consult the this site. In case you get stuck, you must stop , go
                                                              Message 30 of 30 , Dec 4, 2007
                                                              • 0 Attachment
                                                                Dear Maxine,
                                                                What I mean is, when you are sitting with the viewer, you are alone. You can
                                                                not consult the this site. In case you get stuck, you must stop , go home
                                                                and talk to us. But, you must also be able to realize that there is
                                                                something you should be able to read before going on.This is not very
                                                                practical, if you stop every now and then. If you can not read, you don't
                                                                even know what and when you missed something.
                                                                Best,
                                                                Vladimir


                                                                _____

                                                                From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com] On
                                                                Behalf Of maxine
                                                                Sent: Tuesday, December 04, 2007 1:16 PM
                                                                To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                                                                Subject: Re: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis



                                                                Thanks Valadimir for the info and you are right. However, I do not do it by
                                                                myself, I do not have the knowledge you and the others have. I am still
                                                                learning and I have a lot to learn. That is why these sites, like SR, are so
                                                                helpful, usually everyone on the site tries to help each other. I am
                                                                grateful for that. maxine

                                                                ----- Original Message -----
                                                                From: konekta@.... <mailto:konekta%40nm.psg.sk> sk
                                                                To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                                                                Sent: Tuesday, December 04, 2007 2:34 AM
                                                                Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis

                                                                Dear Maxine,
                                                                Studying church records is not that simple as one might think. If you can
                                                                not read what is there then the whole effort is in vain. You will miss
                                                                information.
                                                                Some people do their "own research" by coordinating the work of other people
                                                                who know.
                                                                If you really want to do it by yourself, then you have to learn and learn.
                                                                Vladimir

                                                                _____

                                                                From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                                                                [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                                yahoogroups.com] On
                                                                Behalf Of maxine
                                                                Sent: Monday, December 03, 2007 2:42 PM
                                                                To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                                                                Subject: Re: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis

                                                                Hi Vladimir, thanks for the info. I think that is why so many of us are
                                                                confused. Me at least. I do not know the difference between the latin,
                                                                Rusyn, Slovak, etc. Thanks for your help. maxine

                                                                ----- Original Message -----
                                                                From: konekta@... <mailto:konekta%40nm.psg> .
                                                                <mailto:konekta%40nm.psg.sk> sk
                                                                To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                                                                Sent: Monday, December 03, 2007 1:47 AM
                                                                Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis

                                                                No, Maxine
                                                                It would be latin-english
                                                                Vladimir

                                                                _____

                                                                From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                                                                [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                                yahoogroups.com] On
                                                                Behalf Of maxine
                                                                Sent: Sunday, December 02, 2007 7:40 PM
                                                                To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                                                                Subject: Re: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis

                                                                Hi, having a list of "words" would be great! It must be stated if they are
                                                                Rusyn or Slovak or ? I would be more than happy to do this, however,
                                                                I have no knowledge of any language. Only know a few words. It is my hope
                                                                someday to contribute to this group, and others, however, I am just learning
                                                                myself. Attempting to learn the computer for 3 years now and the history,
                                                                customs, etc of my people. Presently the only thing I can contribute are
                                                                photo's. But there again I do not know how to send them. One day I hope to
                                                                be able to contribute a lot more as I have learned much from the people on
                                                                this site. Ron, I believe you know this! thanks guys maxine sasala

                                                                ----- Original Message -----
                                                                From: Ron Matviyak
                                                                To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                                                                Sent: Sunday, December 02, 2007 5:39 AM
                                                                Subject: Re: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis

                                                                Maxine,

                                                                If you are willing to collect and consolidate the individual lists
                                                                that members have, you could make a major contribution to the forum.
                                                                I have collected some words and I am sure others have as well. If we
                                                                all share, and you (or some other generous person) volunteers to
                                                                consolidate the list and post it under the 'files' part of the S-R web
                                                                page, we can add to it as time passes.

                                                                Ron

                                                                --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                                yahoogroups.com, "maxine" <maxine96@...> wrote:
                                                                >
                                                                > Vladimir, since you are so knowledgeable, and without patience with
                                                                us, could you start a "file" with the words we are asking about. Then
                                                                we can refer back to them. New words are confusing to us. That would
                                                                be helpful. maxine
                                                                >
                                                                > ps Boy this group really shoots from the hip!
                                                                >
                                                                >
                                                                > ----- Original Message -----
                                                                > From: konekta@...
                                                                > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                                                                > Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 4:25 PM
                                                                > Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis
                                                                >
                                                                >
                                                                > Dear Janet,
                                                                > It is Journeyman.
                                                                > Vladimir
                                                                >
                                                                > _____
                                                                >
                                                                > From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                                yahoogroups.com
                                                                [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                                yahoogroups.com] On
                                                                > Behalf Of Janet Kozlay
                                                                > Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 10:14 PM
                                                                > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
                                                                > Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal - sodalis
                                                                >
                                                                > Ah, Vladimir, you must be patient with us. Sometimes we need to
                                                                see it more
                                                                > than once, if we even noted it the first time. I didn't even
                                                                recognize it as
                                                                > an abbreviation. So could you give us a little hint?
                                                                >
                                                                > Janet
                                                                >
                                                                > _____
                                                                >
                                                                > From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                                yahoogroups.com
                                                                > [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                                > yahoogroups.com] On
                                                                > Behalf Of konekta@... <mailto:konekta%40nm.psg.sk> sk
                                                                > Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 4:01 PM
                                                                > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                                yahoogroups.com
                                                                > Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal
                                                                >
                                                                > We already explained in the past what the word Sodalis means.
                                                                > Vladimir
                                                                >
                                                                > _____
                                                                >
                                                                > From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                                yahoogroups.com
                                                                > [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                                > yahoogroups.com] On
                                                                > Behalf Of Janet Kozlay
                                                                > Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 9:59 PM
                                                                > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                                yahoogroups.com
                                                                > Subject: RE: [S-R] baptismal
                                                                >
                                                                > Dear Christine,
                                                                >
                                                                > The word recte means correctly. I am guessing that "recte
                                                                Olsavszky" was
                                                                > added to correct the wrong name, Kuczko. But of course this leaves the
                                                                > question of why Kuczko was used in the first place.
                                                                >
                                                                > It is possible that Olsavszky was an alias of Kuczko, but in those
                                                                cases it
                                                                > usually just says "alias."
                                                                >
                                                                > Or it might have simply been an error of the priest in writing
                                                                down the
                                                                > wrong name and then later correcting it, but you wouldn't think it
                                                                would
                                                                > have happened twice.
                                                                >
                                                                > Do you see the use of the name Kuczko elsewhere in the records?
                                                                >
                                                                > I don't think John's "relicta" can be right since you indicate she was
                                                                > "virgo" in her marriage record.
                                                                >
                                                                > The word "asciarius," as John has already said, means carpenter,
                                                                and must
                                                                > refer to Makara.
                                                                >
                                                                > The word "sod" is a puzzle to me.
                                                                >
                                                                > Janet
                                                                >
                                                                > _____
                                                                >
                                                                > From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                                yahoogroups.com
                                                                > [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                                > yahoogroups.com] On
                                                                > Behalf Of christine mackara
                                                                > Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 3:15 PM
                                                                > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@ <mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS%40yahoogroups.com>
                                                                yahoogroups.com
                                                                > Subject: [S-R] baptismal
                                                                >
                                                                > Hello,
                                                                > I need some help.
                                                                > I found in the RC records of Presov, two baptismal entries for the
                                                                Makara
                                                                > Fam., were the name of our greatgrandmother was entered with an
                                                                addition,
                                                                > that I don't see in other entries.
                                                                > Under the heading for the parents of the baptized it looks like :
                                                                > Johann Makara
                                                                > Maria Kuczko recte
                                                                > Olsavszky
                                                                > asciarius sod. RC
                                                                > In the other 5 baptism, Maria is refered to as "Maria Olsavszky"
                                                                (or varius
                                                                > spellings of that name!) only.
                                                                > In the marriage record she is refered to as "virgo" under heading of
                                                                > "conditio"
                                                                > What could the word "recte" mean in your opinion? The copy from
                                                                the film is
                                                                > not too good, but that is what I make of it. Just wondering.
                                                                >
                                                                > Christine
                                                                >
                                                                > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                                >
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                                                                >
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                                                                >

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