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looking for Velky Rakovicz

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  • pdbennett_52
    I am trying to track down the ancestral village of my great-grandfather, Michael Cralley (originally Kraly), who emigrated from Hungary around 1880. We have no
    Message 1 of 15 , Apr 24, 2007
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      I am trying to track down the ancestral village of my
      great-grandfather, Michael Cralley (originally Kraly), who emigrated
      from Hungary around 1880. We have no family information about the
      Kraly family, except that Michael's sister, Barbara Kraly married John
      Yuhasz (originally Juhasz), who also left Hungary around the same time
      for England, and then the U.S. We are hoping that the Kraly family
      came from the same or a nearby village as the Yuhasz family. The
      Yuhasz family history shows them coming from Velky Rakovec or Velky
      Rakovicz, of Zemplen province in Upper Hungary. Is this town the
      present-day Rakovec nad Ondavou in the Kosice region of Slovakia?
    • Frank R. Plichta
      There is a village Vel ke Ras^kovce in Zemplin. In each of the following period it was known as: 1808 = Welke Rasskowce 1873-1882 = Nagyraska 1888-1913 =
      Message 2 of 15 , Apr 24, 2007
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        There is a village Vel'ke' Ras^kovce in Zemplin.



        In each of the following period it was known as:

        1808 = Welke' Rasskowce

        1873-1882 = Nagyraska

        1888-1913 = Nagyra'ska

        1920 = Vel'ke' Raz^kovce

        1927 = Vel'ke' Ras^kovce



        Try this one on for size.

        Frank

        _____

        From: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com] On
        Behalf Of pdbennett_52
        Sent: Tuesday, April 24, 2007 2:14 PM
        To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: [SPAM] [S-R] looking for Velky Rakovicz



        I am trying to track down the ancestral village of my
        great-grandfather, Michael Cralley (originally Kraly), who emigrated
        from Hungary around 1880. We have no family information about the
        Kraly family, except that Michael's sister, Barbara Kraly married John
        Yuhasz (originally Juhasz), who also left Hungary around the same time
        for England, and then the U.S. We are hoping that the Kraly family
        came from the same or a nearby village as the Yuhasz family. The
        Yuhasz family history shows them coming from Velky Rakovec or Velky
        Rakovicz, of Zemplen province in Upper Hungary. Is this town the
        present-day Rakovec nad Ondavou in the Kosice region of Slovakia?





        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • johnqadam
        ... Hungary.
        Message 3 of 15 , Apr 24, 2007
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          >>> Velky Rakovec or Velky Rakovicz, of Zemplen province in Upper
          Hungary. <<<

          On the map, you have the following possibilities in the former
          Zemplen Megye = county:

          Velké Raškovce, Slovakia; formerly Nagy ráska, Zemplén, Hungary near
          Malcice
          Velký Ruskov, Slovakia, formerly Nagy-Ruszka, Zemplén, Hungary,
          northwest of Trebisov
          Rakocz now Rakovec nad Ondavou west of Michalovce

          CURRENT MAP
          To locate places in Europe, especially if you are not sure of the
          proper spelling of the place name, the best reference is found at
          http://www.jewishgen.org/ShtetlSeeker/loctown.htm

          ShtetlSeeker will take you there via Mapquest, Multimap or Google.
          1910 HUNGARIAN MAP
          The old Hungarian map can be found at:
          http://lazarus.elte.hu/hun/maps/1910/zemplen.jpg

          To see who lived in each of those villages in 1869, the very
          informative 1869 Hungarian Census is available at your nearest LDS
          Family History center (FHC).
          Nagyráska (Velké Raškovce) – Nagyrozvágy Film #722755
          Nagyruszka (Velký Ruskov) -- Nagytárkány (Velký Tarkan) Film #722756
          Rád (Rad) -- Rafajócz (Rafajovce) -- Rákócz (Rakovec nad Ondavou)
          Film #722770

          LOCATE YOUR NEAREST FAMILY HISTORY CENTER AND ORDER CENSUS FILM
          You can go to the LDS web site to locate your nearest Family History
          Center (FHC) and determine their hours of operation. You will need to
          go there in person to order the film(s). In about a month, the film
          will arrive and you can book a film reader and begin your research.
          www.familysearch.org/Eng/Library/FHLC/frameset_fhlc.asp
        • johnqadam
          Based upon current phone listings, which by themselves prove nothing, I would bet on the more northern location. That implies Rakovec nad Ondavou. Good luck.
          Message 4 of 15 , Apr 24, 2007
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            Based upon current phone listings, which by themselves prove nothing, I
            would bet on the more northern location. That implies Rakovec nad
            Ondavou.

            Good luck.
          • helene cincebeaux
            HI Checked the Slovak Pride data base and found 11 Yuhas listings one is actually from Rakovec na Ond. Also found one Kraly listed - from Ruske Zemplin. get
            Message 5 of 15 , Apr 24, 2007
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              HI

              Checked the Slovak Pride data base and found 11 Yuhas listings

              one is actually from Rakovec na Ond.

              Also found one Kraly listed - from Ruske Zemplin.

              get back to me if you want more info on how to contact the listers

              helene
              helenezx@...

              pdbennett_52 <pbennett@...> wrote:
              I am trying to track down the ancestral village of my
              great-grandfather, Michael Cralley (originally Kraly), who emigrated
              from Hungary around 1880. We have no family information about the
              Kraly family, except that Michael's sister, Barbara Kraly married John
              Yuhasz (originally Juhasz), who also left Hungary around the same time
              for England, and then the U.S. We are hoping that the Kraly family
              came from the same or a nearby village as the Yuhasz family. The
              Yuhasz family history shows them coming from Velky Rakovec or Velky
              Rakovicz, of Zemplen province in Upper Hungary. Is this town the
              present-day Rakovec nad Ondavou in the Kosice region of Slovakia?






              ---------------------------------
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              Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.

              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • pdbennett_52
              Thanks to all who replied to my post! At least the field of possible villages seems to be narrowed down to 2 or perhaps 3 candidates. I have already ordered
              Message 6 of 15 , Apr 25, 2007
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                Thanks to all who replied to my post! At least the field of possible
                villages seems to be narrowed down to 2 or perhaps 3 candidates. I have
                already ordered the FHL census film for Rakovec nad Ondavou. In the
                meantime, I am trying to check family history to see if I can find the
                Hungarian name of this village. I'll post what I find when I have
                something more definitive to report.

                Phil
              • genealogyslovakia
                Velky Rakovec is in Ukraine! Rakovec nad ondavou is a wrong way of searching. Juraj see my website - www.cisarik.com ... possible ... have ... the
                Message 7 of 15 , Apr 25, 2007
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                  Velky Rakovec is in Ukraine!
                  Rakovec nad ondavou is a wrong way of searching.
                  Juraj
                  see my website -
                  www.cisarik.com


                  --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com, "pdbennett_52" <pbennett@...>
                  wrote:
                  >
                  > Thanks to all who replied to my post! At least the field of
                  possible
                  > villages seems to be narrowed down to 2 or perhaps 3 candidates. I
                  have
                  > already ordered the FHL census film for Rakovec nad Ondavou. In the
                  > meantime, I am trying to check family history to see if I can find
                  the
                  > Hungarian name of this village. I'll post what I find when I have
                  > something more definitive to report.
                  >
                  > Phil
                  >
                • johnqadam
                  ... How do you reconcile that with Zemplen Megye? Where in Ukraine? Can you point it out on the 1910 map at http://lazarus.elte.hu/hun/maps/1910/zemplen.jpg
                  Message 8 of 15 , Apr 25, 2007
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                    >>> Velky Rakovec is in Ukraine!<<<

                    How do you reconcile that with Zemplen Megye? Where in Ukraine? Can you
                    point it out on the 1910 map at
                    http://lazarus.elte.hu/hun/maps/1910/zemplen.jpg
                  • Juraj Cisarik
                    This village is on: http://lazarus.elte.hu/hun/maps/1910/ugocsa.jpg see the right top corner of the map, there is N.Rakocz Juraj names of villages are on my
                    Message 9 of 15 , Apr 25, 2007
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                      This village is on:
                      http://lazarus.elte.hu/hun/maps/1910/ugocsa.jpg
                      see the right top corner of the map, there is N.Rakocz

                      Juraj
                      names of villages are on my exact address of the site:
                      http://www.cisarik.com/Hungary-Slovak-names-of-villages-CENSUS-1869.html


                      >From: "johnqadam" <johnqadam@...>
                      >Reply-To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                      >To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                      >Subject: [S-R] Re: looking for Velky Rakovicz
                      >Date: Wed, 25 Apr 2007 22:02:43 -0000
                      >
                      > >>> Velky Rakovec is in Ukraine!<<<
                      >
                      >How do you reconcile that with Zemplen Megye? Where in Ukraine? Can you
                      >point it out on the 1910 map at
                      >http://lazarus.elte.hu/hun/maps/1910/zemplen.jpg
                      >
                      >
                      >

                      _________________________________________________________________
                      Potrebujete vediet, ake pocasie bude na Slovensku aj vo svete.
                      http://www.msn.sk/weather
                    • johnqadam
                      ... see the right top corner of the map, there is N.Rakocz
                      Message 10 of 15 , Apr 26, 2007
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                        >>> This village is on: http://lazarus.elte.hu/hun/maps/1910/ugocsa.jpg
                        see the right top corner of the map, there is N.Rakocz <<<

                        I agree that Nagy Rakocz shows up in Ugocsa Megye. That raises the
                        question of where the original poster got the Zemplen Megye information.
                      • pdbennett_52
                        ... Yes, I had also found Nagy Ra ko cz in the far northeast corner of the 1910 map of Ugocsa Megye after Juraj s original post about the Ukraine location. I
                        Message 11 of 15 , Apr 26, 2007
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                          >
                          > I agree that Nagy Rakocz shows up in Ugocsa Megye. That raises the
                          > question of where the original poster got the Zemplen Megye information.
                          >

                          Yes, I had also found Nagy Ra'ko'cz in the far northeast corner of
                          the 1910 map of Ugocsa Megye after Juraj's original post about the
                          Ukraine location. I agree that this is a good potential candidate. The
                          problem now is that none of the possible sites fully agree with the
                          information I have, which come from various documents passed down in
                          the family. I'm working third-hand here since I don't have these in my
                          possession, but I have requested copies so that I can examine these
                          directly. Again, the information I have been told (by my cousin,
                          quoting directly) is:

                          "I also looked at a partial copy of something Irene sent me. It shows
                          the Yuhasz family coming from Rakocz, which I think is Rakovec in
                          Hungarian."

                          and a quote from another e-mail:

                          "I looked at the book I have from Irene called Opportunity Realized:
                          The Greek Catholic Union's First One Hundred Years 1892-1992... I have
                          Michel Yuhasz's village as Velky Rakovec, Zemplin County,
                          Subcarpathian Rus' [I understand this to mean the information came
                          from the GCU book]. I found this town on a 1906 map I received, and
                          don't know if it is the same today."

                          and a later response, after I'd suggested Rakovec nad Ondavou as the
                          possible village in modern-day Slovakia:

                          "Anyway, I checked the book, Opportunity Realized, and that is where I
                          saw Velky Rakovicz, not Rakovec nad Ondavou. I had written in notes
                          that this is the correct name from the man in Pittsburgh I called for
                          the 1906 map..."

                          So the information I have so far from family records implies the
                          village was really Velky Rakovicz (or Rakovec) in Zemplen megye of
                          pre-WWI Hungary.

                          This is all I know from the family directly. I have not been able to
                          find other documentation confirming this information. The best I have
                          been able to do is glean a sense of the region from which the Yuhasz's
                          emigrated from data appearing on census forms over several decades, as
                          political boundaries changed. The Yuhasz family left Hungary in 1884,
                          and came to England. The English 1891 and 1901 censuses give the
                          Yuhasz family members' birthplace as Hungary and Austria respectively.
                          The family immigrated to the U.S. from England in 1905. The US 1910
                          census gives their place of birth as Hungary-Ruthenia. In 1920, this
                          appears as Rusinia, and in 1930 as Czechoslovakia. A son's WWII US
                          registration card only gives Czechoslovakia as the place of birth (the
                          form asks for the town, but unfortunately, that is all that was
                          given). A biographical excerpt published in 1922 states that one of
                          the Yuhasz brothers was born in Upper Hungary, Carpathian Mountains,
                          Czechoslovakia, again, unfortunately, with no village mentioned. All
                          of these general locations are consistent with the three most
                          promising candidate villages mentioned on this thread:

                          1. Rakovec nad Ondavou, Slovakia = Ra'ko'cz, Zemplen FHL # 722770
                          2. Velke' Raskovce, Slovakia = Nagyra'ska, Zemplen: FHL # 722755
                          3. Velykyi Rakovets, Ukraine = Nagy Ra'Ko'cz, Ugocsa: not filmed?

                          I'm hoping the village is not in Ukraine, because I don't believe any
                          of the Ugocsa 1869 census records and church records have been filmed
                          by the LDS. In this case, trying to find the Yuhasz family in the
                          ancestral village will come to a sudden dead end. However, family
                          records indicate the village was in Zemplen county. I believe it more
                          likely that the village name has been garbled than the county name has
                          been passed down incorrectly. So I still favor Rakovec nad Ond.

                          Phil
                        • Rich Custer
                          Well, now this becomes somewhat clearer. Michael Juhasz of the Greek Catholic Union was absolutely born in Rakovec nad Ondavou in Zemplen County, not Velykyj
                          Message 12 of 15 , Apr 26, 2007
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                            Well, now this becomes somewhat clearer.

                            Michael Juhasz of the Greek Catholic Union was
                            absolutely born in Rakovec nad Ondavou in Zemplen
                            County, not Velykyj Rakovec in Ugocsa county. Many
                            of the early leaders of the Greek Catholic Union
                            were also from villages around Vranov and Trebisov,
                            yet despite this being Slovak ethnographic territory
                            today, they called themselves Rusins /
                            Carpatho-Russians.

                            If the GCU used as their reference for _Opportunity
                            Realized_ the "Ethnographic Map of Uhro-Rus', 1906"
                            by Andrew Perejda and distributed by the Byzantine
                            Catholic Eparchy of Passaic, that explains the
                            discrepancy in the village name as stated in
                            _Opportunity Realized_. That map is riddled with
                            errors as far as the village names are concerned.

                            ---- Original message ----

                            Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2007 18:40:51 -0000
                            From: "pdbennett_52" <pbennett@...>
                            Subject: [S-R] Re: looking for Velky Rakovicz
                            To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com

                            >

                            > I agree that Nagy Rakocz shows up in Ugocsa
                            Megye. That raises the

                            > question of where the original poster got the
                            Zemplen Megye information.

                            >

                            Yes, I had also found Nagy Ra'ko'cz in the far
                            northeast corner of

                            the 1910 map of Ugocsa Megye after Juraj's
                            original post about the

                            Ukraine location. I agree that this is a good
                            potential candidate. The

                            problem now is that none of the possible sites
                            fully agree with the

                            information I have, which come from various
                            documents passed down in

                            the family. I'm working third-hand here since I
                            don't have these in my

                            possession, but I have requested copies so that I
                            can examine these

                            directly. Again, the information I have been told
                            (by my cousin,

                            quoting directly) is:

                            "I also looked at a partial copy of something
                            Irene sent me. It shows

                            the Yuhasz family coming from Rakocz, which I
                            think is Rakovec in

                            Hungarian."

                            and a quote from another e-mail:

                            "I looked at the book I have from Irene called
                            Opportunity Realized:

                            The Greek Catholic Union's First One Hundred Years
                            1892-1992... I have

                            Michel Yuhasz's village as Velky Rakovec, Zemplin
                            County,

                            Subcarpathian Rus' [I understand this to mean the
                            information came

                            from the GCU book]. I found this town on a 1906
                            map I received, and

                            don't know if it is the same today."

                            and a later response, after I'd suggested Rakovec
                            nad Ondavou as the

                            possible village in modern-day Slovakia:

                            "Anyway, I checked the book, Opportunity Realized,
                            and that is where I

                            saw Velky Rakovicz, not Rakovec nad Ondavou. I had
                            written in notes

                            that this is the correct name from the man in
                            Pittsburgh I called for

                            the 1906 map..."

                            So the information I have so far from family
                            records implies the

                            village was really Velky Rakovicz (or Rakovec) in
                            Zemplen megye of

                            pre-WWI Hungary.

                            This is all I know from the family directly. I
                            have not been able to

                            find other documentation confirming this
                            information. The best I have

                            been able to do is glean a sense of the region
                            from which the Yuhasz's

                            emigrated from data appearing on census forms over
                            several decades, as

                            political boundaries changed. The Yuhasz family
                            left Hungary in 1884,

                            and came to England. The English 1891 and 1901
                            censuses give the

                            Yuhasz family members' birthplace as Hungary and
                            Austria respectively.

                            The family immigrated to the U.S. from England in
                            1905. The US 1910

                            census gives their place of birth as
                            Hungary-Ruthenia. In 1920, this

                            appears as Rusinia, and in 1930 as Czechoslovakia.
                            A son's WWII US

                            registration card only gives Czechoslovakia as the
                            place of birth (the

                            form asks for the town, but unfortunately, that is
                            all that was

                            given). A biographical excerpt published in 1922
                            states that one of

                            the Yuhasz brothers was born in Upper Hungary,
                            Carpathian Mountains,

                            Czechoslovakia, again, unfortunately, with no
                            village mentioned. All

                            of these general locations are consistent with the
                            three most

                            promising candidate villages mentioned on this
                            thread:

                            1. Rakovec nad Ondavou, Slovakia = Ra'ko'cz,
                            Zemplen FHL # 722770

                            2. Velke' Raskovce, Slovakia = Nagyra'ska,
                            Zemplen: FHL # 722755

                            3. Velykyi Rakovets, Ukraine = Nagy Ra'Ko'cz,
                            Ugocsa: not filmed?

                            I'm hoping the village is not in Ukraine, because
                            I don't believe any

                            of the Ugocsa 1869 census records and church
                            records have been filmed

                            by the LDS. In this case, trying to find the
                            Yuhasz family in the

                            ancestral village will come to a sudden dead end.
                            However, family

                            records indicate the village was in Zemplen
                            county. I believe it more

                            likely that the village name has been garbled than
                            the county name has

                            been passed down incorrectly. So I still favor
                            Rakovec nad Ond.

                            Phil




                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          • david1law@aol.com
                            Hi Phil: Just a little clarification regarding place name suffixes, the -OCZ suffix is Hungarian, and the -OVEC is Slovak. Best regards, David
                            Message 13 of 15 , Apr 26, 2007
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                              Hi Phil:

                              Just a little clarification regarding place name suffixes, the -OCZ suffix
                              is Hungarian, and the -OVEC is Slovak.

                              Best regards,

                              David



                              ************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com


                              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                            • Juraj Cisarik
                              hello, here is a link of schematizmus of the village Rakovec nad Ondavou: http://www.cisarik.com/MINISCHEMATIZMUS-prq.htm chronology of reverends in the
                              Message 14 of 15 , Apr 26, 2007
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                                hello,

                                here is a link of schematizmus of the village Rakovec nad Ondavou:
                                http://www.cisarik.com/MINISCHEMATIZMUS-prq.htm
                                chronology of reverends in the village:

                                Danielovi� Georgius 1800 - 1849 (M) Rakovec nad Ondavou

                                Pajkossy Josephus 1849 - 1866 (M) Rakovec nad Ondavou

                                Slavik Paulus 1866 (M) Rakovec nad Ondavou

                                Zabava Michael 1866 - 1867 (M) Rakovec nad Ondavou

                                Balogh Josephus 1867 - 1876 (M) Rakovec nad Ondavou

                                Starecky Nicolaus 1876 (M) Rakovec nad Ondavou

                                Novak Joannes 1876 - 1877 (M) Rakovec nad Ondavou

                                Kallok Paulus 1877 - 1878 (M) Rakovec nad Ondavou

                                Precechtely Eugenius 1878 - 1880 (M) Rakovec nad Ondavou

                                Gulovic Nicolaus 1887 - 1888 (M) Rakovec nad Ondavou

                                Dudic Joannes 1888 - 1932 (M) Rakovec nad Ondavou

                                Pajkossy Julius 1897 - 1900 (M) Rakovec nad Ondavou

                                Pahy Gregorius 1927 - 1929 (M) Rakovec nad Ondavou

                                Sereghy Josephus 1929 - 1931 (M) Rakovec nad Ondavou

                                Tink Antonius 1932 - 1948 (M) Rakovec nad Ondavou

                                Tink Desiderius 1940 - 1941 (M) Rakovec nad Ondavou

                                Seman Joannes 1941 - 1948 (M) Rakovec nad Ondavou

                                (M)means Mukacevo eparchy/not Presov!/

                                I have a family tree of reverends: Seman, Tink, Sereghy, Dudic, Gulovic.

                                I was there last summer and I took all pictures of graves older then 40
                                years.
                                There are two churches. Older one near to the cemetery is not used by mass
                                services and
                                downthere near to the road is new greekcath. church - built just recently.

                                Juraj


                                >From: Rich Custer <rcuster@...>
                                >Reply-To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                                >To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                                >Subject: Re: [S-R] Re: looking for Velky Rakovicz
                                >Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2007 15:01:23 -0400 (EDT)
                                >
                                >Well, now this becomes somewhat clearer.
                                >
                                >Michael Juhasz of the Greek Catholic Union was
                                >absolutely born in Rakovec nad Ondavou in Zemplen
                                >County, not Velykyj Rakovec in Ugocsa county. Many
                                >of the early leaders of the Greek Catholic Union
                                >were also from villages around Vranov and Trebisov,
                                >yet despite this being Slovak ethnographic territory
                                >today, they called themselves Rusins /
                                >Carpatho-Russians.
                                >
                                >If the GCU used as their reference for _Opportunity
                                >Realized_ the "Ethnographic Map of Uhro-Rus', 1906"
                                >by Andrew Perejda and distributed by the Byzantine
                                >Catholic Eparchy of Passaic, that explains the
                                >discrepancy in the village name as stated in
                                >_Opportunity Realized_. That map is riddled with
                                >errors as far as the village names are concerned.
                                >
                                >---- Original message ----
                                >

                                _________________________________________________________________
                                MSN Pocasie vam umozni naplanovat si den a tyzden..
                                http://www.msn.sk/weather
                              • pdbennett_52
                                ... Rich, thanks for this confirmation! Your map reference sounds like it is indeed the one being referred to, although I can t be certain until I receive
                                Message 15 of 15 , Apr 26, 2007
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                                  --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com, Rich Custer <rcuster@...> wrote:
                                  >
                                  > Well, now this becomes somewhat clearer.
                                  >
                                  > Michael Juhasz of the Greek Catholic Union was
                                  > absolutely born in Rakovec nad Ondavou in Zemplen
                                  > County, not Velykyj Rakovec in Ugocsa county. Many
                                  > of the early leaders of the Greek Catholic Union
                                  > were also from villages around Vranov and Trebisov,
                                  > yet despite this being Slovak ethnographic territory
                                  > today, they called themselves Rusins /
                                  > Carpatho-Russians.
                                  >
                                  > If the GCU used as their reference for _Opportunity
                                  > Realized_ the "Ethnographic Map of Uhro-Rus', 1906"
                                  > by Andrew Perejda and distributed by the Byzantine
                                  > Catholic Eparchy of Passaic, that explains the
                                  > discrepancy in the village name as stated in
                                  > _Opportunity Realized_. That map is riddled with
                                  > errors as far as the village names are concerned.
                                  >

                                  Rich, thanks for this confirmation! Your map reference sounds like
                                  it is indeed the one being referred to, although I can't be certain
                                  until I receive copies of the documentation now in the mail.

                                  Michael Juhasz (Yuhasz) was very active in the Greek Catholic Union
                                  in the early 1900s, and served in many exective positions, including
                                  president. May I ask the source of your information about his
                                  birthplace? I'm not doubting you -- rather I just want to document my
                                  sources for future reference. I really do appreciate your help in
                                  resolving this!

                                  Phil
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