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Re: [S-R] CHUPKA, RABAT

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  • Karen C
    Bill, Thanks so much for the words of caution. I do know where 3 of the families are in the US. The Chupko/Rabat descendent may have been the only child to
    Message 1 of 14 , Jul 12, 2006
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      Bill,

      Thanks so much for the words of caution. I do know where 3 of the families are in the US. The Chupko/Rabat descendent may have been the only child to come to US. I know how family stories can change about the name change. I just wanted to concentrate in the right direction. What I am getting from you is that he may have used the "Adam" name to get out of Austria-Hungary but very likely he went back to his surname when he boarded the ship to the US and lived in the US?

      I am visiting my husbands family next month and I'm going to try to jog their memories. Also, maybe they can look through old photos and papers and find something valuable to me in my search. So in this family I want to concentrate on the ancestors but with the lack of records, as you stated earlier, and no knowledge of where he came from I am lost where to start.

      Now the Bandzej family is a little different. There are was only one Bandzej that came to US originally. A nephew came later and I have found the nephew's daughter. She does have knowledge where this family originated. They were Carpatho-Rusyn (Orthodox Greek Catholics) and the family was originally in the village of Hradiste and then moved to Markovce which I believe is in Zemplen. I ordered some records from this area from FHC but they were Roman Catholic and glancing through them I found no entries for this name.

      I think I may start by asking what church they attended in Johnstown, PA., and maybe they have someone that does record searches for them.

      Thanks again for your help,

      Karen



      Bill Tarkulich <bill.tarkulich@...> wrote:
      Karen,

      If I may, I would like to draw two words of caution.

      1. It was highly improbable that a person needed to change their name to get
      to America. The world didn't have it's systems of checks and balances as it
      does today with high speed communications and computers. It was extremely
      difficult to go "look for someone" back then, even criminals. Language
      barriers obfuscated it further.

      2. Be extremely careful of drawing associations between two similar-looking
      old-country names, even if they are off by only a few letters. They most
      often are un-related. Even the same surname from different villages may be
      entirely unrelated.

      A corollary is once they left their native land, there was a frequent, but
      not predominant trend to "adjust" the name to the new country's language.
      Not larger, but it did occur. So when searching surnames, consider the
      context - are you looking for names extant in the US or perhaps trying to
      find the family back in Slovakia? It has been my experience that people who
      remained in Slovakia never had a reason to change their surnames. Your
      mileage will vary of course, but the odds are against it.

      Bill


      -----Original Message-----
      From: Karen C [mailto:karens_roots@...]
      Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 1:58 PM
      To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: Re: [S-R] Re: Leaving April 4 to Slovakia and other places

      Hi Andrew,

      I saw your name on this posting and I thought I would send you a quick
      note. My husband's grandparents' (Simon CHUPKA/CHUPKO to HELEN BUNJEY
      (BANDZEJ) marriage certificate (1918) lists the husbands' parents both from
      Hungary and their names as Andrew CHUPKA and Julia RABAT. There was a rumor
      in the family that his grandfather changed his name to get to US, so I don't
      know if he would have still been concerned when he arrived here but his
      original/assumed name may have been ADAM. I have just started doing this
      family but your last name is the closest I've seen to the name listed on the
      cert. Andrew and Julia did not immigrate to the US as far as I know. If
      you happen to come across one or both of these names, please keep me in
      mind. I have no clue where they are from although his father said he was
      Slovak. Please excuse my ignorance of this area, I'm Irish and just
      learning about all the border changes, etc. in this part of the world.

      There is probably no relation but you never know. Good luck. I hope I
      can talk my husband to making that flight one day. I've heard that Slovakia
      is beautiful. Have a wonderful visit.

      Karen


      andrew rabatin <wtravlr1@...> wrote:
      --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com, "andrew rabatin"
      <wtravlr1@...>
      wrote:
      >
      > Will be doing genealogy in the Presov, Kocise area of Slovakia for the
      > Rabatin family on April. 4. I will post notes and pics as i travel
      > every few days. my posts for the Slovak trip can be found at:
      >
      > http://blogs.bootsnall.com/wtravlr1/

      my new site for my homepage for photos is

      http://www.andrew-rabatin.org
      >
      > for anyone wanting to follow trip as we travel.
      >


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    • johnqadam
      ... family was originally in the village of Hradiste and then moved to Markovce which I believe is in Zemplen. I ordered some records from this area from FHC
      Message 2 of 14 , Jul 12, 2006
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        >>> They were Carpatho-Rusyn (Orthodox Greek Catholics) and the
        family was originally in the village of Hradiste and then moved to
        Markovce which I believe is in Zemplen. I ordered some records from
        this area from FHC but they were Roman Catholic and glancing through
        them I found no entries for this name. <<<

        There are SEVERAL instances of Hradiste. Your RC church records
        were "no help" but you may have had the wrong village as well as the
        wrong relgion.

        Markovce is in the former Zemplen Magye (county) and Zemplinske
        Hradiste is 10 km due west (much further by road). Both villages
        have GC church records available at LDS.

        LDS has (scant) Greek Catholic parish registers of baptisms,
        marriages and deaths for Zemplínske Hradište, Slovakia, formerly
        Hardicsa, Zemplén, Hungary.

        Krstení 1872-1900 Zomrelí 1872-1896 - VAULT INTL Film [ 2010708
        Item 3 ]

        Zomrelí 1896-1921 Sobášení 1872-1926 - FHL INTL Film [ 2010709 Item
        1 ]

        Also, Greek Catholic parish registers of baptisms, marriages and
        deaths for Markovce, Slovakia, formerly Márk, Zemplén, Hungary.

        Krstení 1827-1860 Zomrelí 1853-1860 Sobášení 1827-1861 Zomrelí 1827-
        1846 Krstení 1860-1913 Zomrelí 1860-1913 Sobášení 1860-1913
        DRUHOPISY Krstení, sobášení, zomrelí 1882-1895 - FHL INTL Film [
        1792637 Items 3-5 ]

        Further, this supports the ealier telephone survey of names as this
        is in area code 056. Any marriages would have been from this
        immediate area, usually within TWO villages distance.
      • johnqadam
        ... one Bandzej that came to US originally. A nephew came later and I have found the nephew s daughter. She does have knowledge where this family originated.
        Message 3 of 14 , Jul 12, 2006
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          >>> Now the Bandzej family is a little different. There are was only
          one Bandzej that came to US originally. A nephew came later and I
          have found the nephew's daughter. She does have knowledge where this
          family originated. They were Carpatho-Rusyn (Orthodox Greek
          Catholics) and the family was originally in the village of Hradiste
          and then moved to Markovce which I believe is in Zemplen. <<<

          Trebisov is one town (7 km) north of Zemplinske Hradiste. There is a
          potential cousin in Trebisov.

          Bandžej Michal
          Dobrovolnícka 243
          Trebišov
        • johnqadam
          ... moved to Markovce which I believe is in Zemplen.
          Message 4 of 14 , Jul 12, 2006
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            >>> the family was originally in the village of Hradiste and then
            moved to Markovce which I believe is in Zemplen. <<<

            Is the Ellis island entry Bandzej, Michal, born 1897, in your
            database? The indicated birthplace, "Tchoriovce", was unknown to me
            but I got the answer from Mark Sabol on the Delphi site.

            "The village of Horovce is 6 miles southwest of Michalovce and 5
            miles northeast of Trebisov. In the past its name was spelled
            Thurowce, Hor, and (in 1920) Tchorovce."

            It would appear that the nearest GC church is 3 km east at
            Trhoviste. LDS has Greek Catholic parish registers of baptisms,
            marriages and deaths for Trhovište, Slovakia; formerly Vásárhely,
            Zemplén, Hungary.

            Krstení 1804-1845 Zomrelí 1804-1844 Sobášení 1804-1843 Krstení 1845-
            1883 Zomrelí 1845-1883 Sobášení 1845-1883 Sobášení 1884-1911 Zomrelí
            1884-1912 Krstení 1884-1895 - FHL INTL Film [ 1794073 Items 2-4 ]

            Krstení 1895-1923 Krstení 1880, 1868, 1900-1901, 1904 . DRUHOPISY:
            Krstení, sobášení, zomrelí 1878-1895 - FHL INTL Film [ 1794056
            Items 1-2 ]
          • Karen C
            Thanks so much. I m going to an FHC tomorrow to look at some other records so I ll order these. You have been a tremendous help. Karen ... moved to Markovce
            Message 5 of 14 , Jul 12, 2006
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              Thanks so much. I'm going to an FHC tomorrow to look at some other records so I'll order these. You have been a tremendous help.

              Karen

              johnqadam <johnqadam@...> wrote:
              >>> the family was originally in the village of Hradiste and then
              moved to Markovce which I believe is in Zemplen. <<<

              Is the Ellis island entry Bandzej, Michal, born 1897, in your
              database? The indicated birthplace, "Tchoriovce", was unknown to me
              but I got the answer from Mark Sabol on the Delphi site.

              "The village of Horovce is 6 miles southwest of Michalovce and 5
              miles northeast of Trebisov. In the past its name was spelled
              Thurowce, Hor, and (in 1920) Tchorovce."

              It would appear that the nearest GC church is 3 km east at
              Trhoviste. LDS has Greek Catholic parish registers of baptisms,
              marriages and deaths for Trhovište, Slovakia; formerly Vásárhely,
              Zemplén, Hungary.

              Krstení 1804-1845 Zomrelí 1804-1844 Sobášení 1804-1843 Krstení 1845-
              1883 Zomrelí 1845-1883 Sobášení 1845-1883 Sobášení 1884-1911 Zomrelí
              1884-1912 Krstení 1884-1895 - FHL INTL Film [ 1794073 Items 2-4 ]

              Krstení 1895-1923 Krstení 1880, 1868, 1900-1901, 1904 . DRUHOPISY:
              Krstení, sobášení, zomrelí 1878-1895 - FHL INTL Film [ 1794056
              Items 1-2 ]





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            • Karen C
              That is the nephew that came after my George Bandzej. Thank you, I didn t try looking for him but I hadn t found George on a manifest as of yet. Karen ...
              Message 6 of 14 , Jul 12, 2006
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                That is the nephew that came after my George Bandzej. Thank you, I didn't try looking for him but I hadn't found George on a manifest as of yet.

                Karen


                johnqadam <johnqadam@...> wrote:
                >>> the family was originally in the village of Hradiste and then
                moved to Markovce which I believe is in Zemplen. <<<

                Is the Ellis island entry Bandzej, Michal, born 1897, in your
                database? The indicated birthplace, "Tchoriovce", was unknown to me
                but I got the answer from Mark Sabol on the Delphi site.

                "The village of Horovce is 6 miles southwest of Michalovce and 5
                miles northeast of Trebisov. In the past its name was spelled
                Thurowce, Hor, and (in 1920) Tchorovce."

                It would appear that the nearest GC church is 3 km east at
                Trhoviste. LDS has Greek Catholic parish registers of baptisms,
                marriages and deaths for Trhovište, Slovakia; formerly Vásárhely,
                Zemplén, Hungary.

                Krstení 1804-1845 Zomrelí 1804-1844 Sobášení 1804-1843 Krstení 1845-
                1883 Zomrelí 1845-1883 Sobášení 1845-1883 Sobášení 1884-1911 Zomrelí
                1884-1912 Krstení 1884-1895 - FHL INTL Film [ 1794073 Items 2-4 ]

                Krstení 1895-1923 Krstení 1880, 1868, 1900-1901, 1904 . DRUHOPISY:
                Krstení, sobášení, zomrelí 1878-1895 - FHL INTL Film [ 1794056
                Items 1-2 ]






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