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Re: [S-R] Taxpayers but not villages in the 1715 census

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  • Vladimir Bohinc
    These are the names of villages. Vladimir ... From: jeff_stana To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, March 07, 2005 5:48 PM Subject: [S-R] Taxpayers
    Message 1 of 4 , Mar 7, 2005
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      These are the names of villages.
      Vladimir

      ----- Original Message -----
      From: jeff_stana
      To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
      Sent: Monday, March 07, 2005 5:48 PM
      Subject: [S-R] Taxpayers but not villages in the 1715 census



      Hello forum,

      Concerning the 1715 Census of Hungary
      (Az 1715. évi országos összeírás),

      when searching by taxpayer (Adózók), some taxpayer names, appear
      listed under something other than a village. For example, "Kis
      Pallugya", "Demén Falva", "Jász Apati".

      What sort of settlements are these if not villages? Or are they
      different classifications entirely?

      TIA





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    • Alan Antoska
      Jeff, What names are you researching? I have done some searching in the 2 villages of: Kis Pallugya = Paludzka, Lipt. Mikulas, SK Deménfalva = Demanova,
      Message 2 of 4 , Mar 8, 2005
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        Jeff,
        What names are you researching?
        I have done some searching in the 2 villages of:
        "Kis Pallugya" = Paludzka, Lipt. Mikulas, SK
        "Deménfalva" = Demanova, Lipt. Mikulas, SK

        Thanks.

        --- jeff_stana <jeff@...> wrote:
        >
        > Hello forum,
        >
        > Concerning the 1715 Census of Hungary
        > (Az 1715. évi országos összeírás),
        >
        > when searching by taxpayer (Adózók), some taxpayer names,
        > appear
        > listed under something other than a village. For example,
        > "Kis
        > Pallugya", "Demén Falva", "Jász Apati".
        >
        > What sort of settlements are these if not villages? Or
        > are they
        > different classifications entirely?
        >
        > TIA

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      • jeff_stana
        Thanks Alan, The family name and proven relations, STANA (SZTANYA) occurs in the Spis region since about 1800 s. While no family taxpayers from Szepes appear
        Message 3 of 4 , Mar 8, 2005
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          Thanks Alan,

          The family name and proven relations, STANA (SZTANYA) occurs in the
          Spis region since about 1800's.

          While no family taxpayers from Szepes appear in the 1700's tax
          rolls, records show a Nitra concentration around Myjava, Racisce,
          Kovalovec, Vradiste, & Hradiste pod Vratnom.

          Also, a second demographic concentration (STANO), around Ruzomberok,
          Nolcovo, and now as you say Alan: Paludzka & Demonova, in Lipto as
          well.

          A migration Nitra-Lipto-Spis along the Gothic Road? To early and,
          perhaps to ancient to tell.

          Your village name translations are much appreciated.

          S uctou Vas,
          Jeff Stana

          --------------------------------------

          What names are you researching?
          I have done some searching in the 2 villages of:
          "Kis Pallugya" = Paludzka, Lipt. Mikulas, SK
          "Deménfalva" = Demanova, Lipt. Mikulas, SK
        • Alan Antoska
          Jeff, (I think) I replicated your search. Your Kis Pallugya shows Oldalszam 203, 204. My KP shows pages 87, 88, 153, 154. Likewise, on the pages for
          Message 4 of 4 , Mar 11, 2005
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            Jeff,
            (I think) I replicated your search.
            Your Kis Pallugya shows 'Oldalszam' 203, 204.
            My KP shows pages 87, 88, 153, 154.
            Likewise, on the pages for Demenfalva, yours & mine are
            also different.

            Therefore we are not looking at the same search results.
            You did a name search, on the green page. I didn't.

            I drilled down on the 1715 census (LHS, below the pop-up
            menu) to Lipto county and managed to get a list of all the
            villages, again on the lhs). By clicking on the folder
            icons for each village, the taxpayer names then appear on
            the rhs of the page. Plus all the village name variants, up
            to present.
            I never got to the green search page and the 'big list'
            (which btw, does not appear to respond to a shortcut
            command of jumping to names starting with (say) K when I
            press K on the keyboard).

            Arcanum was not able to show 'your' pages 203 & 204 so I
            was not able to compare with mine, nor gleen a clue as to
            what period they covered.
            I suspect, your search results are not 1715. Could be a
            later year, a conglomerate of years stored on their db or
            ...?
            My Hungarian is 'zip' so that also does not help.
            We should pin down exactly what we are looking at.

            BTW I have had a little breakthru (which I need to share).
            Archival land records show my ancestors 'inherited' land in
            Szent-Istvan (Svaty Stefan (S) or St. Steven (E)). That
            place does not exist today. Folklore said the Turks
            destroyed it as it was built on an exposed hill-top and the
            surviving villagers, including my ancestors, moved to
            present day Ziar, a distance of only about 2 klm.

            However surprisingly, I find SI on this 1715 census,
            without my family names listed. Also, I need to check, but
            I believe the Otterman Turks were forced out of Hungary
            before 1700 so they did not destroy Szent-Istvan.
            Did I say breakthru? Perhaps not. Just more questions and
            another example of the facts not supporting the folklore.


            --- jeff_stana <jeff@...> wrote:
            >
            > Perhaps I was unclear Alan, sorry.
            >
            > "Kis Pallugya" was a score when searching for "STANO"
            > under the 1715
            > tax census.
            > See:
            >
            http://www.arcanum.hu/mol/lpext.dll?f=templates&fn=main-hit-
            > h.htm&2.0
            >
            > I got a different set of taxpayers than you, so perhaps
            > we are
            > looking at a different village(?) Which gets back to my
            > original
            > query -- my arcanum record does not give provide country
            > reference
            > (SK), as does the Paludzka hit, which you site. Since my
            > normal
            > pursuit is the Spis region, I did not recognize Lipto
            > area names.
            >
            > I do appreciate the fine details which you add to your
            > comments Alan.
            >
            > Much obliged.
            >
            > --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com, Alan Antoska
            > <aantoska@y...>
            > wrote:
            > > Jeff,
            > > Not so fast. The 1715 urbarial census shows:
            > >
            > > Kis-Paludgya, Palugya, Kis-, Kispalugya, Liptó,
            > Palúdzka,
            > > SK, Liptószentmiklós része
            > > Adózók neve: Joannes Zbada; Jacobus Argay; Andreas
            > Kusnyer;
            > > Martinus Guoth; Martinus Pasko; Martinus Kreva; Paulus
            > > Vrabecz; Georgius Hreyár; Andreas Argay
            > > Oldalszám: 87, 88, 153, 154,
            > >
            > > Deménfalva, Deménfalva, Deménfalu, Liptó,
            > Demänová, SK
            > > Adózók neve: Paulus Kustka; Michael Mahulka; Georgius
            > > Pancsovich
            > > Oldalszám: 89, 90, 153, 154,
            > >
            > > My point being, I don't understand how a search for
            > > 'SZTANYA' would give you a hit in either Paludzka (a
            > > 'suburb' of Liptovsky Mikulas (LM) in which the
            > hospital is
            > > located) and Demanova (after which village a distillery
            > is
            > > named).
            > >
            > > The closest name in my db is 'Stanco' from the village
            > of
            > > Veterna Poruba, 10 klm NE of LM.


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