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Re: [S-R] Introduction

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  • treimer@nycap.rr.com
    Kris, Welcome--my ancestors are from Eisdorf and Zipser Bela, and I have tons of Johann s and Susanna s, and often with the same family name, too. Without the
    Message 1 of 14 , Nov 5, 2004
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      Kris,

      Welcome--my ancestors are from Eisdorf and Zipser Bela, and I have tons of Johann's and Susanna's, and often with the same family name, too. Without the house numbers in the parish records, I'd go nuts.

      Check my Carpathian German webpage. We just had our meeting in Philadelphia. We have many Loisch, Breyer etc attending.

      http://www.geocities.com/ycrtmr/

      Thomas

      ----- Original Message -----
      From: Kris <krisstrot@...>
      Date: Friday, November 5, 2004 1:50 pm
      Subject: [S-R] Introduction

      >
      >
      > My name is Kris and I live in Texas. I am 54 years old
      > and "digging up the past!"
      > I signed up a week or so ago and have been reading the very
      > helpful
      > messages posted here. I am researching MY Slovak Roots in
      > Neuwalddorf (aka Nova Lesna, Uj. Lesna, Also Erdöfalva). The
      > recent post about place names made me smile, knowing full well how
      > one village may have many different names. I am lucky that I know
      > the village. My grandfather was Samuel Hunsdorfer, born in
      > Neuwalddorf 1 March 1886. His brother was Johann, born 1975 in
      > Großschlagendorf (aka N. Szalok, Nagy Szalok). His sister Susanna
      > was born 14 June 1883. Samuel came to USA in 1903. Johann also
      > came
      > in 1903 but went back in 1911. Susanna came also, but went back
      > around 1910. Samuel stayed in USA (Philadelphia, and later
      > Detroit). I know the spouses names and the children, their
      > spouses,
      > and so forth DOWNWARD to current days, but I don't know anything
      > other than my grandfather's parents: Father - Johann Hunsdorfer;
      > Mother - Maria Susanna Breyer. It is very confusing to have so
      > many
      > Johann's and Susanna's, especially since Susanna Hunsdorfer
      > married a
      > man named Johann Breyer, and Johann Hunsdorfer (Jr.) married a
      > woman
      > named Susanna Loisch! Both Johann Hunsdorfer Jr. and Sr. were
      > mountain climbers and guides. Hunsdorfer Spitze (now called
      > Huncovsky stit, I believe) was first climbed by them around 1900.
      > My
      > grandfather worked in the resort area called Schmecks (now Stary
      > Smokovec?) before emigrating to the US.
      > What I'd like to find out: I believe the Hunsdorfers are
      > related
      > to Johann and Paul Hunfalvy, who I think were geographers. One or
      > the other, I believe, is the father of Johann Hunsdorfer (Sr.),
      > but I
      > don't know which one. My grandfather had another brother, named
      > Paul, who died in infancy. My grandfather had book in his
      > possession
      > (which hasn't been translated), but has indications in the margins
      > something to do with these Hunfalvy men.
      > In addition to Hunsdorfer/Hulfalvy, I am also interested in the
      > Loisch family (I believe many of them came to the U.S., including
      > Susanna Loisch's parents, sister, and I think a brother, and
      > probably
      > others) and the Breyer family (I think my grandfather's mother,
      > Maria
      > Susanna Breyer, had a brother Johann who possibly was the first to
      > emigrate to the US -- my grandfather's passenger records says his
      > destination is "Uncle Johann Breyer" in Philadelphia). Is there a
      > source for information (birth, marriage, baptism, emigration,
      > death
      > records) for Neuwalddorf? Something I can do online, or send away
      > for? I probably will never be able to travel to Slovakia and
      > research this myself. I am grateful for this group because I
      > think
      > there are some who truly do know how to research my family. I
      > have
      > researched as far as I can from my grandfather and his siblings
      > forward to today; now I would like to try to work backward to
      > older
      > records and people.
      > These families were Germans. After WWII, all of them were
      > rounded
      > up and shipped off to East Germany (some were able to get away
      > ahead
      > of the soldiers, and came to the U.S.) I have letters from my
      > grandfather's sister (who wasn't one of the lucky ones) which tell
      > that tale. They were "Lutherans" = Evangelicals, so any church
      > records would be there, not the Catholic church.
      > Thanks for any suggestions/help. I am glad I found this group
      > and
      > enjoy ALL the posts.
      > Kris
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
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      >
    • Daniela Hesse
      Hello Thomas, wow it was so cool to check out this website. I found the name Rev. Jakob Bauer on this website - I guess he was the Reverend of my
      Message 2 of 14 , Nov 5, 2004
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        Hello Thomas,



        wow it was so cool to check out this website.



        I found the name 'Rev. Jakob Bauer' on this website - I guess he was the
        Reverend of my grandparents - he was more than 100 years old before he died
        because of a car accident. :-)



        I was in Slowakia between 21st and 28th of October 2004 and I visited
        Schmiedshau / Tuzina (Hauerland) where my grandparents (both with the
        surname GROSS) came from. I have some nice photos of Slowakia (we visited
        Bratislava, Piestany, Trencin, Stary Smokovec, Spissky Hrad (Zips), Banska
        Bystrica, Nitra ..).



        My grandmother (today she is 75 years old) told me some stories about the
        time of her youth and the years before they have to leave. She told me also
        about how she helped her father and other german men from Schmiedshau that
        they could escape from the murder (she told me this "My mum told me to run
        to the men who went into the forest to hide themselves and to tell them that
        every man who will be found in the forest would be killed. I ran so fast I
        never ran before and after. I saw the partisans on the other side of our
        town, they wanted to build a circle round us and I ran faster than ever . I
        found them - my father was with them - and we were back in town just some
        minutes before the first partisans come to search for the men" - wow - I
        wondered that the partisans couldn't find my great-grandfather, my
        grandmother told them only 'I don't know where my dad is' .. although he
        hides himself under the hay and prays to god and she knows it very well.)



        I hope to hear more - also some nice - stories from her on Christmas when I
        visit her again. And then I hope to visit Schmiedshau again in 2005 to start
        my research there in the birth records etc. This time it was only a first
        short visit get to know the country and anything else.



        Bye,

        Daniela

        (Germany)



        _____


        Check my Carpathian German webpage. We just had our meeting in Philadelphia.
        We have many Loisch, Breyer etc attending.

        http://www.geocities.com/ycrtmr/

        Thomas





        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Andrea Vangor
        Welcome! I am sure that we are all very pleased to have you join us and that we will be happy to offer what help we can. What a fascinating story! ... From:
        Message 3 of 14 , Sep 29, 2005
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          Welcome! I am sure that we are all very pleased to have you join us and
          that we will be happy to offer what help we can. What a fascinating story!

          ----- Original Message -----
          From: "hungaricus_1969" <hungaricus_1969@...>
          To: <SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com>
          Sent: Wednesday, September 28, 2005 11:13 PM
          Subject: [S-R] Introduction


          Hi, I'd like to introduce myself: my name is Antal BURJAN, I am a
          Hungarian (I suppose it's not a big surprise if you read carefully my
          nick... some really bright people might even come to the conclusion
          that I'm 36 years old... and they won't be mistaken). I was born in
          Romania, Transsylvania and I moved to Hungary in 90. My father passed
          away suddenly 3 months ago and I decided to continue (actually to
          begin) the search for our ancestors, a work that should have been
          done by him. Some years ago I found the writings of one of the
          brothers of my great grandfather, who traced our family tree back to
          approx the mid 1700s. All of them living in Gyergyószentmiklós
          (Gheorgheni, Niklasmarkt - Romania). This brother of my ggf referred
          to his father telling that we are told to have noble origin, being a
          certain György (George) who received nobility. He looked in the
          Hungarian books of noble families (Kempelen) and found only one
          Burjan (Burian) family of nobles where the nobility has been granted
          to a person named György, namely Burian of Rajecz (Rajec).

          I am trying now to tie up the two lines. I want to find the family
          tree beginning from backward (1604 was the year when György received
          nobility) and starting from Rajec (Slovakia now) on the other hand I
          have to discover some unknown details (places, dates) and further
          ancestors in Transsylvania (Romania) in order to be able to tie the
          lines in Hungary. That's the reason why I asked for admission to this
          group... I don't speak Slovak and I might need some help in the
          future. On the other hand I can offer to the group my native
          Hungarian and close to native Romanian knowledge... my English is far
          from being as good as the aforementioned languages, but I can add a
          very good knowledge of Spanish and Portuguese for those who (one may
          never know) want to read the church parish records of their Romanian-
          born ancestors in let's say Portuguese :-D

          Thanks for the admission, and I wish a nice day (night, evening,
          morning...) for all of you.






          To unsubscribe from this group, go to
          http://www.yahoogroups.com/group/SLOVAK-ROOTS -or- send blank email to
          SLOVAK-ROOTS-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
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        • Antal Burjan
          Thank you for your information, I already found a lot about parts of the family. My task now seem to be to discover the hidden branches of the Burian family in
          Message 4 of 14 , Oct 2, 2005
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            Thank you for your information, I already found a lot about parts of the family. My task now seem to be to discover the hidden branches of the Burian family in Slovakia as well as do the opposite direction research in Transsylvania. Hopefully the two directions will meet somewhere around year 1750 when it seems that two Burian brothers moved from Westernmost Hungary to it easternmost ends. It is a challenging question and I hope that by the end of this year I'll be able to do some on the spot researches in Transsylvania. I plan to visit Slovakia next spring or summer.

            The Burian mailing list was initiated by Mr. Gerhard Burian from Austria who has quite an informative webpage also on the topic.

            Yes, indeed, my problem is precisely that there are LOTS of Burians and it is quite difficult to make some order among them. I also discovered a Burian of Rajecz supposedly living in the US, I wrote him a mail but I received no answer by this time.


            Janet Kozlay <kozlay@...> escribió:
            There is extensive information on this family in the nobility literature
            including genealogies and coats of arms. There is also a RootsWeb mail list
            for the family: BURIAN-L@... which contains results of a great deal
            of research.

            Janet





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          • Richard D. Custer
            Hello Sarah, It sounds pretty clear to me that your great-grandparents were Rusyns. Szerencsfavla, now Shchastlyve / Serenchovtsi near Mukachevo in the
            Message 5 of 14 , Jul 2, 2006
            • 0 Attachment
              Hello Sarah,
              It sounds pretty clear to me that your great-grandparents were Rusyns. Szerencsfavla, now Shchastlyve / Serenchovtsi near Mukachevo in the Zakarpatska oblast of Ukraine, was and is a majority-Rusyn ("Ruthenian") village. If your family attended an Orthodox church in West Virginia (I'm guessing either in Elkhorn, Weirton, or Morgantown, all of which were almost entirely-Rusyn congregations), why would you think they were Jewish?

              Carpatho-Rusyn ethnic/genealogy resources on the Web:

              www.carpatho-rusyn.org
              www.c-rs.org
              www.rusyn.org

              There's many more but those will give you an excellent and long list of reading / reference materials.
              Good luck!

              RDC


              ----- Original Message -----
              From: Sarah Heidt
              To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
              Sent: Sunday, July 02, 2006 4:41 PM
              Subject: [S-R] Introduction


              Hello everyone,
              I am new to the list, and not sure if I am in the right place. I am trying to find out more about my great grandparents, last names Kozar and Zuber, who came to the US through Ellis Island in Sept 1906 on the SS Carpathia. I found the passenger manifest which shows my Great-Grandfather Gyorgy Kozar, from Szerencs falva. It is said that he met my great grandmother Julia Zuber on the ship over, but I cannot find her in the manifest unless perhaps her name is spelled differently. Both of them listed their home country in the 1930 census as Czechoslovakia, but the language given is Ruthenian.
              A historian of the Holocaust that I know has said that almost half of the people living in sub-Carpathian Ruthenia before the war were Jewish, and I know that there were Jewish synagogues in both Szerencs and in Mad, which is near Szerencs. I was told that my grandfather and the other children attended a greek Orthodox church in West Virginia where they settled, but that the grandparents themselves were not observant. So I am trying to figure out if they were possibly Jewish. Not much to go on. On the JewishGen website, someone I asked there thought that Kozar was a Jewish name, and referenced the Khazars who had converted en masse to Judaism.
              (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khazars for anyone curious about this...)
              I have also seen Kozar listed in other Jewish surname lists... but since my particular ancestor is not listed as "Hebrew" in the ship's manifest, I am not sure what to think.
              If anyone has any ideas on what I should do to further my search, please let me know!
              Thanks,
              Sarah Lilly Heidt
              Dexter, MI

              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • Richard D. Custer
              Hello Sarah, It sounds pretty clear to me that your great-grandparents were Rusyns. Szerencsfavla, now Shchastlyve / Serenchovtsi near Mukachevo in the
              Message 6 of 14 , Jul 2, 2006
              • 0 Attachment
                Hello Sarah,
                It sounds pretty clear to me that your great-grandparents were Rusyns.
                Szerencsfavla, now Shchastlyve / Serenchovtsi near Mukachevo in the
                Zakarpatska oblast of Ukraine, was and is a majority-Rusyn ("Ruthenian")
                village. If your family attended an Orthodox church in West Virginia (I'm
                guessing either in Elkhorn, Weirton, or Morgantown, all of which were almost
                entirely-Rusyn congregations), why would you think they were Jewish?

                (I have seen Kozar and Zuber in other contexts and they are definitely Rusyn
                surnames.)

                Carpatho-Rusyn ethnic/genealogy resources on the Web:

                www.carpatho-rusyn.org
                www.c-rs.org
                www.rusyn.org

                There's many more but those will give you an excellent and long list of
                reading / reference materials.
                Good luck!

                RDC

                ----- Original Message -----
                From: Sarah Heidt
                To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                Sent: Sunday, July 02, 2006 4:41 PM
                Subject: [S-R] Introduction


                Hello everyone,
                I am new to the list, and not sure if I am in the right place. I am trying
                to find out more about my great grandparents, last names Kozar and Zuber,
                who came to the US through Ellis Island in Sept 1906 on the SS Carpathia. I
                found the passenger manifest which shows my Great-Grandfather Gyorgy Kozar,
                from Szerencs falva. It is said that he met my great grandmother Julia Zuber
                on the ship over, but I cannot find her in the manifest unless perhaps her
                name is spelled differently. Both of them listed their home country in the
                1930 census as Czechoslovakia, but the language given is Ruthenian.
                A historian of the Holocaust that I know has said that almost half of the
                people living in sub-Carpathian Ruthenia before the war were Jewish, and I
                know that there were Jewish synagogues in both Szerencs and in Mad, which is
                near Szerencs. I was told that my grandfather and the other children
                attended a greek Orthodox church in West Virginia where they settled, but
                that the grandparents themselves were not observant. So I am trying to
                figure out if they were possibly Jewish. Not much to go on. On the JewishGen
                website, someone I asked there thought that Kozar was a Jewish name, and
                referenced the Khazars who had converted en masse to Judaism.
                (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khazars for anyone curious about this...)
                I have also seen Kozar listed in other Jewish surname lists... but since my
                particular ancestor is not listed as "Hebrew" in the ship's manifest, I am
                not sure what to think.
                If anyone has any ideas on what I should do to further my search, please let
                me know!
                Thanks,
                Sarah Lilly Heidt
                Dexter, MI
              • Sarah Heidt
                Because my historian friend said there was such a significant Jewish population in subCarpathian Ruthenia at that time, I had done a lot of looking around on
                Message 7 of 14 , Jul 3, 2006
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                  Because my historian friend said there was such a significant Jewish population in subCarpathian Ruthenia at that time, I had done a lot of looking around on JewishGen (lists of business owners, lists of ghetto occupants, various other things) and saw both Kozar and Zuber there. And also it seemed strange to me that the great-grandparents would send their children to church, but did not attend themselves. I know that some Jews who immigrated chose not to maintain their religion, so I thought that might have been possible with my great-grandparents. It was just a guess...

                  Sarah

                  ----- Original Message -----
                  From: Richard D. Custer
                  To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                  Sent: Sunday, July 02, 2006 11:56 PM
                  Subject: Re: [S-R] Introduction


                  Hello Sarah,
                  It sounds pretty clear to me that your great-grandparents were Rusyns.
                  Szerencsfavla, now Shchastlyve / Serenchovtsi near Mukachevo in the
                  Zakarpatska oblast of Ukraine, was and is a majority-Rusyn ("Ruthenian")
                  village. If your family attended an Orthodox church in West Virginia (I'm
                  guessing either in Elkhorn, Weirton, or Morgantown, all of which were almost
                  entirely-Rusyn congregations), why would you think they were Jewish?

                  (I have seen Kozar and Zuber in other contexts and they are definitely Rusyn
                  surnames.)

                  Carpatho-Rusyn ethnic/genealogy resources on the Web:

                  www.carpatho-rusyn.org
                  www.c-rs.org
                  www.rusyn.org

                  There's many more but those will give you an excellent and long list of
                  reading / reference materials.
                  Good luck!

                  RDC

                  ----- Original Message -----
                  From: Sarah Heidt
                  To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                  Sent: Sunday, July 02, 2006 4:41 PM
                  Subject: [S-R] Introduction

                  Hello everyone,
                  I am new to the list, and not sure if I am in the right place. I am trying
                  to find out more about my great grandparents, last names Kozar and Zuber,
                  who came to the US through Ellis Island in Sept 1906 on the SS Carpathia. I
                  found the passenger manifest which shows my Great-Grandfather Gyorgy Kozar,
                  from Szerencs falva. It is said that he met my great grandmother Julia Zuber
                  on the ship over, but I cannot find her in the manifest unless perhaps her
                  name is spelled differently. Both of them listed their home country in the
                  1930 census as Czechoslovakia, but the language given is Ruthenian.
                  A historian of the Holocaust that I know has said that almost half of the
                  people living in sub-Carpathian Ruthenia before the war were Jewish, and I
                  know that there were Jewish synagogues in both Szerencs and in Mad, which is
                  near Szerencs. I was told that my grandfather and the other children
                  attended a greek Orthodox church in West Virginia where they settled, but
                  that the grandparents themselves were not observant. So I am trying to
                  figure out if they were possibly Jewish. Not much to go on. On the JewishGen
                  website, someone I asked there thought that Kozar was a Jewish name, and
                  referenced the Khazars who had converted en masse to Judaism.
                  (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khazars for anyone curious about this...)
                  I have also seen Kozar listed in other Jewish surname lists... but since my
                  particular ancestor is not listed as "Hebrew" in the ship's manifest, I am
                  not sure what to think.
                  If anyone has any ideas on what I should do to further my search, please let
                  me know!
                  Thanks,
                  Sarah Lilly Heidt
                  Dexter, MI






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                  Checked by AVG Free Edition.
                  Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.8/380 - Release Date: 6/30/2006


                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • Sarah Heidt
                  Thank you Richard, for the help. Now I understand why the Szerencs I had was the wrong one... So I assume this list, then, is not appropriate to my search,
                  Message 8 of 14 , Jul 3, 2006
                  • 0 Attachment
                    Thank you Richard, for the help. Now I understand why the Szerencs I had was the wrong one... So I assume this list, then, is not appropriate to my search, because the town is now in Ukraine and because the language was Ruthenian. It is so funny to find this out, after hearing for so long that the families were "from Slovakia".
                    Sarah Heidt


                    ----- Original Message -----
                    From: Richard D. Custer
                    To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                    Sent: Sunday, July 02, 2006 11:56 PM
                    Subject: Re: [S-R] Introduction


                    Hello Sarah,
                    It sounds pretty clear to me that your great-grandparents were Rusyns.
                    Szerencsfavla, now Shchastlyve / Serenchovtsi near Mukachevo in the
                    Zakarpatska oblast of Ukraine, was and is a majority-Rusyn ("Ruthenian")
                    village. If your family attended an Orthodox church in West Virginia (I'm
                    guessing either in Elkhorn, Weirton, or Morgantown, all of which were almost
                    entirely-Rusyn congregations), why would you think they were Jewish?

                    (I have seen Kozar and Zuber in other contexts and they are definitely Rusyn
                    surnames.)

                    Carpatho-Rusyn ethnic/genealogy resources on the Web:

                    www.carpatho-rusyn.org
                    www.c-rs.org
                    www.rusyn.org

                    There's many more but those will give you an excellent and long list of
                    reading / reference materials.
                    Good luck!

                    RDC

                    ----- Original Message -----
                    From: Sarah Heidt
                    To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                    Sent: Sunday, July 02, 2006 4:41 PM
                    Subject: [S-R] Introduction

                    Hello everyone,
                    I am new to the list, and not sure if I am in the right place. I am trying
                    to find out more about my great grandparents, last names Kozar and Zuber,
                    who came to the US through Ellis Island in Sept 1906 on the SS Carpathia. I
                    found the passenger manifest which shows my Great-Grandfather Gyorgy Kozar,
                    from Szerencs falva. It is said that he met my great grandmother Julia Zuber
                    on the ship over, but I cannot find her in the manifest unless perhaps her
                    name is spelled differently. Both of them listed their home country in the
                    1930 census as Czechoslovakia, but the language given is Ruthenian.
                    A historian of the Holocaust that I know has said that almost half of the
                    people living in sub-Carpathian Ruthenia before the war were Jewish, and I
                    know that there were Jewish synagogues in both Szerencs and in Mad, which is
                    near Szerencs. I was told that my grandfather and the other children
                    attended a greek Orthodox church in West Virginia where they settled, but
                    that the grandparents themselves were not observant. So I am trying to
                    figure out if they were possibly Jewish. Not much to go on. On the JewishGen
                    website, someone I asked there thought that Kozar was a Jewish name, and
                    referenced the Khazars who had converted en masse to Judaism.
                    (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khazars for anyone curious about this...)
                    I have also seen Kozar listed in other Jewish surname lists... but since my
                    particular ancestor is not listed as "Hebrew" in the ship's manifest, I am
                    not sure what to think.
                    If anyone has any ideas on what I should do to further my search, please let
                    me know!
                    Thanks,
                    Sarah Lilly Heidt
                    Dexter, MI






                    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------


                    No virus found in this incoming message.
                    Checked by AVG Free Edition.
                    Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.8/380 - Release Date: 6/30/2006


                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • amiak27
                    Sarah, I happily disagree when you assume this is the wrong forum. You came to the right forum and recieved a solid answer, so this list proved to be a very
                    Message 9 of 14 , Jul 3, 2006
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                      Sarah,

                      I happily disagree when you assume this is the wrong forum. You
                      came to the right forum and recieved a solid answer, so this list
                      proved to be a very good start. Keep checking for at least another
                      week or so and see if anyone else comes up with more information.
                      We do not limit our interests every time the borders shift.

                      I suggest you search for the "Rusyns" forum here on Yahoo Groups and
                      make some inquiries there as well.

                      Ron

                      --- In SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com, "Sarah Heidt" <Sarah@...> wrote:
                      >
                      > Thank you Richard, for the help. Now I understand why the
                      Szerencs I had was the wrong one... So I assume this list, then, is
                      not appropriate to my search, because the town is now in Ukraine and
                      because the language was Ruthenian. It is so funny to find this
                      out, after hearing for so long that the families were "from
                      Slovakia".
                      > Sarah Heidt
                      >
                      >
                      > ----- Original Message -----
                      > From: Richard D. Custer
                      > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                      > Sent: Sunday, July 02, 2006 11:56 PM
                      > Subject: Re: [S-R] Introduction
                      >
                      >
                      > Hello Sarah,
                      > It sounds pretty clear to me that your great-grandparents were
                      Rusyns.
                      > Szerencsfavla, now Shchastlyve / Serenchovtsi near Mukachevo in
                      the
                      > Zakarpatska oblast of Ukraine, was and is a majority-Rusyn
                      ("Ruthenian")
                      > village. If your family attended an Orthodox church in West
                      Virginia (I'm
                      > guessing either in Elkhorn, Weirton, or Morgantown, all of which
                      were almost
                      > entirely-Rusyn congregations), why would you think they were
                      Jewish?
                      >
                      > (I have seen Kozar and Zuber in other contexts and they are
                      definitely Rusyn
                      > surnames.)
                      >
                      > Carpatho-Rusyn ethnic/genealogy resources on the Web:
                      >
                      > www.carpatho-rusyn.org
                      > www.c-rs.org
                      > www.rusyn.org
                      >
                      > There's many more but those will give you an excellent and long
                      list of
                      > reading / reference materials.
                      > Good luck!
                      >
                      > RDC
                      >
                      > ----- Original Message -----
                      > From: Sarah Heidt
                      > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                      > Sent: Sunday, July 02, 2006 4:41 PM
                      > Subject: [S-R] Introduction
                      >
                      > Hello everyone,
                      > I am new to the list, and not sure if I am in the right place. I
                      am trying
                      > to find out more about my great grandparents, last names Kozar
                      and Zuber,
                      > who came to the US through Ellis Island in Sept 1906 on the SS
                      Carpathia. I
                      > found the passenger manifest which shows my Great-Grandfather
                      Gyorgy Kozar,
                      > from Szerencs falva. It is said that he met my great grandmother
                      Julia Zuber
                      > on the ship over, but I cannot find her in the manifest unless
                      perhaps her
                      > name is spelled differently. Both of them listed their home
                      country in the
                      > 1930 census as Czechoslovakia, but the language given is
                      Ruthenian.
                      > A historian of the Holocaust that I know has said that almost
                      half of the
                      > people living in sub-Carpathian Ruthenia before the war were
                      Jewish, and I
                      > know that there were Jewish synagogues in both Szerencs and in
                      Mad, which is
                      > near Szerencs. I was told that my grandfather and the other
                      children
                      > attended a greek Orthodox church in West Virginia where they
                      settled, but
                      > that the grandparents themselves were not observant. So I am
                      trying to
                      > figure out if they were possibly Jewish. Not much to go on. On
                      the JewishGen
                      > website, someone I asked there thought that Kozar was a Jewish
                      name, and
                      > referenced the Khazars who had converted en masse to Judaism.
                      > (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khazars for anyone curious about
                      this...)
                      > I have also seen Kozar listed in other Jewish surname lists...
                      but since my
                      > particular ancestor is not listed as "Hebrew" in the ship's
                      manifest, I am
                      > not sure what to think.
                      > If anyone has any ideas on what I should do to further my
                      search, please let
                      > me know!
                      > Thanks,
                      > Sarah Lilly Heidt
                      > Dexter, MI
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
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                    • Bill Tarkulich
                      Sarah, If it were my family, I d cut them some slack. The state of Slovakia has only been in use, in it s present form since 1993. Between the world wars,
                      Message 10 of 14 , Jul 3, 2006
                      • 0 Attachment
                        Sarah,
                        If it were my family, I'd cut them some slack. The state of "Slovakia" has
                        only been in use, in it's present form since 1993. Between the world wars,
                        the first republic of Czechoslovakia incorporated Subcarpathia Rus, which of
                        course included Shchastlyve / Serenchovtsi. It's quite possible that was
                        the nation that was referred to. With the end of WWII, the entire region
                        became pretty much "locked down" from communication with the west. No
                        wonder confusion and speculation abounded.

                        I would agree with your conclusion that this list will not be productive in
                        your search. Most genealogy groups are organized geographically.
                        The ethnic minority Rusyn (which I also am one) does, to our relief, have a
                        number of useful groups which promulgate information on the villages. Use
                        both the cultural and geographic lists to get a handle on your research.

                        In addition to Rich's suggestions, consider the group http://cgsi.org/

                        Also,
                        http://tinyurl.com/kvu2m at Ancestry.
                        http://groups.yahoo.com/group/rusyns/
                        http://infoukes.com/lists/
                        http://www.feefhs.org/home.html

                        I have spent a small amount of time researching in Ukraine. It is not easy,
                        since the government has erected many impediments to access and the language
                        is a challenge.

                        Good Luck,


                        Bill


                        -----Original Message-----
                        From: Sarah Heidt [mailto:Sarah@...]
                        Sent: Monday, July 03, 2006 9:53 AM
                        To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                        Subject: Re: [S-R] Introduction

                        Thank you Richard, for the help. Now I understand why the Szerencs I had
                        was the wrong one... So I assume this list, then, is not appropriate to my
                        search, because the town is now in Ukraine and because the language was
                        Ruthenian. It is so funny to find this out, after hearing for so long that
                        the families were "from Slovakia".
                        Sarah Heidt


                        ----- Original Message -----
                        From: Richard D. Custer
                        To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                        Sent: Sunday, July 02, 2006 11:56 PM
                        Subject: Re: [S-R] Introduction


                        Hello Sarah,
                        It sounds pretty clear to me that your great-grandparents were Rusyns.
                        Szerencsfavla, now Shchastlyve / Serenchovtsi near Mukachevo in the
                        Zakarpatska oblast of Ukraine, was and is a majority-Rusyn ("Ruthenian")
                        village. If your family attended an Orthodox church in West Virginia (I'm
                        guessing either in Elkhorn, Weirton, or Morgantown, all of which were
                        almost
                        entirely-Rusyn congregations), why would you think they were Jewish?

                        (I have seen Kozar and Zuber in other contexts and they are definitely
                        Rusyn
                        surnames.)

                        Carpatho-Rusyn ethnic/genealogy resources on the Web:

                        www.carpatho-rusyn.org
                        www.c-rs.org
                        www.rusyn.org

                        There's many more but those will give you an excellent and long list of
                        reading / reference materials.
                        Good luck!

                        RDC

                        ----- Original Message -----
                        From: Sarah Heidt
                        To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                        Sent: Sunday, July 02, 2006 4:41 PM
                        Subject: [S-R] Introduction

                        Hello everyone,
                        I am new to the list, and not sure if I am in the right place. I am trying

                        to find out more about my great grandparents, last names Kozar and Zuber,
                        who came to the US through Ellis Island in Sept 1906 on the SS Carpathia.
                        I
                        found the passenger manifest which shows my Great-Grandfather Gyorgy
                        Kozar,
                        from Szerencs falva. It is said that he met my great grandmother Julia
                        Zuber
                        on the ship over, but I cannot find her in the manifest unless perhaps her

                        name is spelled differently. Both of them listed their home country in the

                        1930 census as Czechoslovakia, but the language given is Ruthenian.
                        A historian of the Holocaust that I know has said that almost half of the
                        people living in sub-Carpathian Ruthenia before the war were Jewish, and I

                        know that there were Jewish synagogues in both Szerencs and in Mad, which
                        is
                        near Szerencs. I was told that my grandfather and the other children
                        attended a greek Orthodox church in West Virginia where they settled, but
                        that the grandparents themselves were not observant. So I am trying to
                        figure out if they were possibly Jewish. Not much to go on. On the
                        JewishGen
                        website, someone I asked there thought that Kozar was a Jewish name, and
                        referenced the Khazars who had converted en masse to Judaism.
                        (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khazars for anyone curious about this...)
                        I have also seen Kozar listed in other Jewish surname lists... but since
                        my
                        particular ancestor is not listed as "Hebrew" in the ship's manifest, I am

                        not sure what to think.
                        If anyone has any ideas on what I should do to further my search, please
                        let
                        me know!
                        Thanks,
                        Sarah Lilly Heidt
                        Dexter, MI






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                      • johnqadam
                        ... of Szerencs and you want the one in Zemplen Megye. You are able to research the church records of Szerencs, Zemplen Megye, at your nearest LDS Family
                        Message 11 of 14 , Jul 3, 2006
                        • 0 Attachment
                          >>> after hearing for so long that the families were "from Slovakia"<<<

                          >IF< the family was from Slovakia, >THEN< you have the wrong instance
                          of Szerencs and you want the one in Zemplen Megye.

                          You are able to research the church records of Szerencs, Zemplen
                          Megye, at your nearest LDS Family History Center. That may help you to
                          verify which location is correct.
                        • treimer@nycap.rr.com
                          Zuber is also a German family name, and there were Germans living in the Karpatho-Ukraine as well. Thomas ... From: Richard D. Custer
                          Message 12 of 14 , Jul 20, 2006
                          • 0 Attachment
                            Zuber is also a German family name, and there were Germans living in
                            the Karpatho-Ukraine as well.

                            Thomas

                            ----- Original Message -----
                            From: "Richard D. Custer" <rcuster@...>
                            Date: Thursday, July 20, 2006 9:35 am
                            Subject: Re: [S-R] Introduction
                            To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com

                            > Hello Sarah,
                            > It sounds pretty clear to me that your great-grandparents were
                            > Rusyns. Szerencsfavla, now Shchastlyve / Serenchovtsi near
                            > Mukachevo in the Zakarpatska oblast of Ukraine, was and is a
                            > majority-Rusyn ("Ruthenian") village. If your family attended an
                            > Orthodox church in West Virginia (I'm guessing either in Elkhorn,
                            > Weirton, or Morgantown, all of which were almost entirely-Rusyn
                            > congregations), why would you think they were Jewish?
                            >
                            > Carpatho-Rusyn ethnic/genealogy resources on the Web:
                            >
                            > www.carpatho-rusyn.org
                            > www.c-rs.org
                            > www.rusyn.org
                            >
                            > There's many more but those will give you an excellent and long
                            > list of reading / reference materials.
                            > Good luck!
                            >
                            > RDC
                            >
                            >
                            > ----- Original Message -----
                            > From: Sarah Heidt
                            > To: SLOVAK-ROOTS@yahoogroups.com
                            > Sent: Sunday, July 02, 2006 4:41 PM
                            > Subject: [S-R] Introduction
                            >
                            >
                            > Hello everyone,
                            > I am new to the list, and not sure if I am in the right place. I
                            > am trying to find out more about my great grandparents, last names
                            > Kozar and Zuber, who came to the US through Ellis Island in Sept
                            > 1906 on the SS Carpathia. I found the passenger manifest which
                            > shows my Great-Grandfather Gyorgy Kozar, from Szerencs falva. It
                            > is said that he met my great grandmother Julia Zuber on the ship
                            > over, but I cannot find her in the manifest unless perhaps her
                            > name is spelled differently. Both of them listed their home
                            > country in the 1930 census as Czechoslovakia, but the language
                            > given is Ruthenian.
                            > A historian of the Holocaust that I know has said that almost
                            > half of the people living in sub-Carpathian Ruthenia before the
                            > war were Jewish, and I know that there were Jewish synagogues in
                            > both Szerencs and in Mad, which is near Szerencs. I was told that
                            > my grandfather and the other children attended a greek Orthodox
                            > church in West Virginia where they settled, but that the
                            > grandparents themselves were not observant. So I am trying to
                            > figure out if they were possibly Jewish. Not much to go on. On the
                            > JewishGen website, someone I asked there thought that Kozar was a
                            > Jewish name, and referenced the Khazars who had converted en masse
                            > to Judaism.
                            > (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khazars for anyone curious about
                            > this...) I have also seen Kozar listed in other Jewish surname
                            > lists... but since my particular ancestor is not listed as
                            > "Hebrew" in the ship's manifest, I am not sure what to think.
                            > If anyone has any ideas on what I should do to further my
                            > search, please let me know!
                            > Thanks,
                            > Sarah Lilly Heidt
                            > Dexter, MI
                            >
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                            >
                            >
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