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To Hell on a Sled

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  • Andrea Vangor
    Has anyone else noticed that life in Slovakia deteriorates noticeably in the late 1870 s? I don t know if it was the cholera in 1873, the increasingly
    Message 1 of 5 , Jan 27, 2000
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      Has anyone else noticed that life in Slovakia deteriorates noticeably in the
      late 1870's? I don't know if it was the cholera in 1873, the increasingly
      oppressive Magyar mis-rule, the young men flying the coop and emigrating in
      herds, or what, but it sure looks like things were rocky in my little corner
      of eastern Slovakia after that date. One clear social indicator: the
      number of illegitimate births skyrockets. They were previously very rare in
      this Lutheran parish community, in southern S~aris~, but after the late
      '70's it seems that there is an unwed mother on every page of the baptismal
      records, and sometimes three or four. It makes me wonder what is going on
      with family life at that time. Any thoughts?

      Andrea
    • Jim Honeychuck
      My little theory is that the women wanted babies to encourage the men going to America to come back, or to send for them. I m trying not to be judgmental about
      Message 2 of 5 , Jan 28, 2000
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        My little theory is that the women wanted babies to encourage the men going
        to America to come back, or to send for them.

        I'm trying not to be judgmental about this situation, by the way.

        Jim Honeychuck

        ----- Original Message -----
        From: Andrea Vangor <drav@...>
        To: Slovak Roots <SLOVAK-ROOTS@onelist.com>
        Sent: Friday, January 28, 2000 12:49 AM
        Subject: [SLOVAK-ROOTS] To Hell on a Sled


        > From: "Andrea Vangor" <drav@...>
        >
        > Has anyone else noticed that life in Slovakia deteriorates noticeably in
        the
        > late 1870's? I don't know if it was the cholera in 1873, the
        increasingly
        > oppressive Magyar mis-rule, the young men flying the coop and emigrating
        in
        > herds, or what, but it sure looks like things were rocky in my little
        corner
        > of eastern Slovakia after that date. One clear social indicator: the
        > number of illegitimate births skyrockets. They were previously very rare
        in
        > this Lutheran parish community, in southern S~aris~, but after the late
        > '70's it seems that there is an unwed mother on every page of the
        baptismal
        > records, and sometimes three or four. It makes me wonder what is going on
        > with family life at that time. Any thoughts?
        >
        > Andrea
        >
        >
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      • Maura Petzolt
        You can also consider that the priests etc just started noting them more in the registers. I ve looked at the Sabinov registers from late 1600 s to 1895. Have
        Message 3 of 5 , Jan 28, 2000
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          You can also consider that the priests etc just started noting them more
          in the registers.

          I've looked at the Sabinov registers from late 1600's to 1895. Have
          noticed more after 1850 or so registered illegitimate births. But I took
          that as they started keeping better records then, or maybe there was
          some church rule instituted around then of allowing the illegitimate
          births to be registered where they couldn't before.

          Of course, that's just a theory.

          ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
          Maura Petzolt Mobile Alabama USA
          sabinov@...
          Helpful Hints for Successful Searching
          http://www.rootsweb.com/~irlwat/instruct.htm
          ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
        • Andrea Vangor
          Well, the absence of a father is not something that can be concealed. All Christian infants were baptized, in one church or another, and all baptisms were
          Message 4 of 5 , Jan 28, 2000
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            Well, the absence of a father is not something that can be concealed. All
            Christian infants were baptized, in one church or another, and all baptisms
            were recorded, by strict necessity. Being illegitimate is not a bar to a
            future marriage in a traditional Christian community, but being unbaptised
            is quite another matter.

            This is a Lutheran church record, and illegitimacies occurred from time to
            time as far back as the records go, but not in the numbers I am finding
            beginning in the later 1870's. I think these events are telling us
            something about a time of social upheaval, equivalent to a war lasting many
            years. All the young men going off in groups of fifty or more -- not
            available to take their place in the community -- and the economic pressure
            placed on those left behind... I noticed that many of the unwed mothers
            were servant girls. If I may speculate, it seems possible that families who
            were deprived of a young laboring man might have been forced to send an
            older daughter out to work, and that these farm girls were not prepared for
            the dangers of life away from home. I will have to see what the Roman
            Catholic records from C~ervenica and the Lutheran records from Rankovce show
            about this time period.


            > From: sabinov@... (Maura Petzolt)
            >
            > You can also consider that the priests etc just started noting them more
            > in the registers.
            >
            > I've looked at the Sabinov registers from late 1600's to 1895. Have
            > noticed more after 1850 or so registered illegitimate births. But I took
            > that as they started keeping better records then, or maybe there was
            > some church rule instituted around then of allowing the illegitimate
            > births to be registered where they couldn't before.
            >
            > Of course, that's just a theory.
            >
          • Andrea Vangor
            Well, these things happen in wartime, and this was almost the same kind of thing, in terms of the impact at home. ... From: Jim Honeychuck
            Message 5 of 5 , Jan 28, 2000
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              Well, these things happen in wartime, and this was almost the same kind of
              thing, in terms of the impact at home.

              ----- Original Message -----
              From: Jim Honeychuck <jimhoney@...>
              To: <SLOVAK-ROOTS@onelist.com>
              Sent: Friday, January 28, 2000 3:33 AM
              Subject: Re: [SLOVAK-ROOTS] To Hell on a Sled


              > From: "Jim Honeychuck" <jimhoney@...>
              >
              > My little theory is that the women wanted babies to encourage the men
              going
              > to America to come back, or to send for them.
              >
              > I'm trying not to be judgmental about this situation, by the way.
              >
              > Jim Honeychuck
              >
              > ----- Original Message -----
              > From: Andrea Vangor <drav@...>
              > To: Slovak Roots <SLOVAK-ROOTS@onelist.com>
              > Sent: Friday, January 28, 2000 12:49 AM
              > Subject: [SLOVAK-ROOTS] To Hell on a Sled
              >
              >
              > > From: "Andrea Vangor" <drav@...>
              > >
              > > Has anyone else noticed that life in Slovakia deteriorates noticeably in
              > the
              > > late 1870's? I don't know if it was the cholera in 1873, the
              > increasingly
              > > oppressive Magyar mis-rule, the young men flying the coop and emigrating
              > in
              > > herds, or what, but it sure looks like things were rocky in my little
              > corner
              > > of eastern Slovakia after that date. One clear social indicator: the
              > > number of illegitimate births skyrockets. They were previously very
              rare
              > in
              > > this Lutheran parish community, in southern S~aris~, but after the late
              > > '70's it seems that there is an unwed mother on every page of the
              > baptismal
              > > records, and sometimes three or four. It makes me wonder what is going
              on
              > > with family life at that time. Any thoughts?
              > >
              > > Andrea
              > >
              > >
              > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ----------------------------
              > >
              > > Looking for the lowest refinance rate for your mortgage?
              > > GetSmart.com can help. We'll help you find the loan you
              > > need - quick, easy, and FREE click
              > > <a href=" http://clickme.onelist.com/ad/GetSmartRefinance ">Click
              Here</a>
              > >
              > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
              > >
              > >
              >
              >
              > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ----------------------------
              >
              > Looking for the lowest refinance rate for your mortgage?
              > GetSmart.com can help. We'll help you find the loan you
              > need - quick, easy, and FREE click
              > <a href=" http://clickme.onelist.com/ad/GetSmartRefinance ">Click Here</a>
              >
              > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
              >
              >
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