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leaks at rear scuppers + do cockpit compartments drain into cabin

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  • jwac500
    i noticed i am getting rain water into the cabin. Based on water line trails in the baby powder i put in the cabin sole under the cockpit i believe the water
    Message 1 of 10 , Nov 1, 2009
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      i noticed i am getting rain water into the cabin. Based on water line trails in the baby powder i put in the cabin sole under the cockpit i believe the water is entering from the scuppers where they meet the cockpit floor and from both the rear compartment and the port compartment. are the compartments supposed to drain into the cockpit? where are the weep holes if that was the design? also reading old posts it seems my scuppers have some separation where they join the rear cockpit deck. Is there a good fix for the scupper leaks? how about a different way to get the water out of the cockpit? it is class legal to revise the entire cockpit to open up the rear of the boat by eliminating the rear compartment and extending the side seats all the way to the transom? does anybody have a diagram showing the location of all bulkheads? a little amount of work on a nice boat seems to be turning to a big project and i want to know as much as possible before i cut into the boat. too little knowledge is a dangerous thing when doing some minor improvements. thanks for input or pointers. i am keeping a log of the work and will make it available when done. is there still a class association for sj24s?
    • William "Bill" Sims
      I also get rainwater from the stern. Mine comes through the settee. I ve tried sealing it better with weatherstripping, and reduced the amount significantly.
      Message 2 of 10 , Nov 2, 2009
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        I also get rainwater from the stern.  Mine comes through the settee.  I've tried sealing it better with weatherstripping, and reduced the amount significantly.  Plus a bimini has helped (needed down here in summer because of sun/heat). 
         
        My port lazerette hardly ever gets any water in it, and it does not drain into the cabin.  It is sealed by design.
         
        Your cockpit scuppers are not meant to drain into the cabin, and if they are, then you need to get that fixed ASAP...I doubt that is the source of water, though.
         
        Bill Sims
        Mandeville, LA
      • gc138@aol.com
        John - if the leak is not too bad, I would try a patch fix like scraping out the bad glass and fill with some thickened epoxy or if you do not have any, try
        Message 3 of 10 , Nov 2, 2009
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          John - if the leak is not too bad, I would try a patch fix like scraping out the bad glass and fill with some thickened epoxy or if you do not have any, try Bondo. If you cracks are large, you can get Bondo with glass filaments in it.
          It's very hard to work from the inside. That rear compartment is small. You can get in there to look for leaks by cutting a hole in the bulkhead under the cockpit. You have crawl back in there on your belley or side to work on things but it can be done. You cab a round hole and then cover with an inspections hatch will will give you future access to that area. If you can see separation for sure, then you probably have the culprit. Also, check for separation around the top of the rudder tube and the fiberglass surrounding it. It had a leak there I filled with a little thickened epoxy.
          The only bulkhead back there under the cockpit is the one you can see from the quarter berth. It's rather flimsy on my boat so under the cockpit sole part I beefed it up with another piece of ply and now the cockpit footing is a bit more solid. Water should not get into the cabin from anywhere. Some like Capt Bill have sealed off the rear lazarette even.
          About extending the seat to the rear - I don't know about that. It's kind of nice to have that little extra bit of room when standing and steering or sheeting in a rather narrow stern area. I would think about that for a while before doing it. If you are new to the boat, you will probably discard that idea after sailing it.
          George #18 "Spaghetti"
           
          In a message dated 11/1/2009 10:43:25 P.M. Central Standard Time, johnwaclawski@... writes:
           

          i noticed i am getting rain water into the cabin. Based on water line trails in the baby powder i put in the cabin sole under the cockpit i believe the water is entering from the scuppers where they meet the cockpit floor and from both the rear compartment and the port compartment. are the compartments supposed to drain into the cockpit? where are the weep holes if that was the design? also reading old posts it seems my scuppers have some separation where they join the rear cockpit deck. Is there a good fix for the scupper leaks? how about a different way to get the water out of the cockpit? it is class legal to revise the entire cockpit to open up the rear of the boat by eliminating the rear compartment and extending the side seats all the way to the transom? does anybody have a diagram showing the location of all bulkheads? a little amount of work on a nice boat seems to be turning to a big project and i want to know as much as possible before i cut into the boat. too little knowledge is a dangerous thing when doing some minor improvements. thanks for input or pointers. i am keeping a log of the work and will make it available when done. is there still a class association for sj24s?

        • john waclawski
          thank you for the great ideas. i searched the area around the scuppers and both have the tube to the outside (scupper tube) separated at the cabin deck where
          Message 4 of 10 , Nov 2, 2009
          • 0 Attachment
            thank you for the great ideas.   i searched the area around the scuppers and both have the tube to the outside (scupper tube) separated at the cabin deck where the tubes meet the upper surface of the cockpit deck.   I can feel with a L shaped wire that there is a open space between the deck and the tube and what seems like a second deck under the main deck.  maybe the deck was cored with foam or balsa or thin plywood and the core rotted away,    will try to fill the voids with thickened epoxie.  must be some open space between the top of the deck and the outside bottom of the boat, thus the 3 to 5 inch long tube that forms the scupper.  is it possible to replace the tube?  i am thinking a thin walled pvc tube with a new flange and then epoxie the assembly into the existing scupper.

              i know you are right about the seat and standing space so i will not extend the starboard seat back to the stern.   has anyone ever place new scuppers (larger diameter say 2 to 3 inches) thru the rear compartment and out the stern. seems if the lower edge of a new larger scupper were just above the deck area  (a more horizontal placement) so as not to have issue with the floor/bulkhead that a scupper pipe could be run thru the rear compartment and out the stern.  it would reduce the size of the rear compartment but it would be a way to get rid of water faster.

                 seems like all compartment would drain into the bilge so a good bilge pump(s) could pump it out.  sure wish i had a set of manufacturing drawings for the boat .

             thanks again for the advice and fixes.  kind of like restoring an old car,  lots of unknowns and several opportunities to carefully weight the risks and then dam the torpedoes, just go in and see what you get as long as i remember to make the hull water tight again.


            To: SJ-24@yahoogroups.com
            From: gc138@...
            Date: Mon, 2 Nov 2009 14:48:48 -0500
            Subject: Re: [SJ-24] leaks at rear scuppers + do cockpit compartments drain into cabin

             
            John - if the leak is not too bad, I would try a patch fix like scraping out the bad glass and fill with some thickened epoxy or if you do not have any, try Bondo. If you cracks are large, you can get Bondo with glass filaments in it.
            It's very hard to work from the inside. That rear compartment is small. You can get in there to look for leaks by cutting a hole in the bulkhead under the cockpit. You have crawl back in there on your belley or side to work on things but it can be done. You cab a round hole and then cover with an inspections hatch will will give you future access to that area. If you can see separation for sure, then you probably have the culprit. Also, check for separation around the top of the rudder tube and the fiberglass surrounding it. It had a leak there I filled with a little thickened epoxy.
            The only bulkhead back there under the cockpit is the one you can see from the quarter berth. It's rather flimsy on my boat so under the cockpit sole part I beefed it up with another piece of ply and now the cockpit footing is a bit more solid. Water should not get into the cabin from anywhere. Some like Capt Bill have sealed off the rear lazarette even.
            About extending the seat to the rear - I don't know about that. It's kind of nice to have that little extra bit of room when standing and steering or sheeting in a rather narrow stern area. I would think about that for a while before doing it. If you are new to the boat, you will probably discard that idea after sailing it.
            George #18 "Spaghetti"
             
            In a message dated 11/1/2009 10:43:25 P.M. Central Standard Time, johnwaclawski@ hotmail.com writes:
             

            i noticed i am getting rain water into the cabin. Based on water line trails in the baby powder i put in the cabin sole under the cockpit i believe the water is entering from the scuppers where they meet the cockpit floor and from both the rear compartment and the port compartment. are the compartments supposed to drain into the cockpit? where are the weep holes if that was the design? also reading old posts it seems my scuppers have some separation where they join the rear cockpit deck. Is there a good fix for the scupper leaks? how about a different way to get the water out of the cockpit? it is class legal to revise the entire cockpit to open up the rear of the boat by eliminating the rear compartment and extending the side seats all the way to the transom? does anybody have a diagram showing the location of all bulkheads? a little amount of work on a nice boat seems to be turning to a big project and i want to know as much as possible before i cut into the boat. too little knowledge is a dangerous thing when doing some minor improvements. thanks for input or pointers. i am keeping a log of the work and will make it available when done. is there still a class association for sj24s?




            Windows 7: It works the way you want. Learn more.
          • bear
            when i got my sj24 its rudder post was shattered and needed to be re glassed so i put a hatch in the aft part of my cockpit to access the area it also is a
            Message 5 of 10 , Nov 2, 2009
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              when i got my sj24 its rudder post was shattered and needed to be re glassed so i put a hatch in the aft part of my cockpit to access the area it also is a nice bulkhead too and adds to my storage. But in this process of work you have full view of the scuppers and if they need work it could be done easy. the repair job of the rudder post was a bit more work but its been 4 years and still no leaks from there.if you need pics i may be able to help but its dark out now.





              --- In SJ-24@yahoogroups.com, john waclawski <johnwaclawski@...> wrote:
              >
              >
              > thank you for the great ideas. i searched the area around the scuppers and both have the tube to the outside (scupper tube) separated at the cabin deck where the tubes meet the upper surface of the cockpit deck. I can feel with a L shaped wire that there is a open space between the deck and the tube and what seems like a second deck under the main deck. maybe the deck was cored with foam or balsa or thin plywood and the core rotted away, will try to fill the voids with thickened epoxie. must be some open space between the top of the deck and the outside bottom of the boat, thus the 3 to 5 inch long tube that forms the scupper. is it possible to replace the tube? i am thinking a thin walled pvc tube with a new flange and then epoxie the assembly into the existing scupper.
              >
              > i know you are right about the seat and standing space so i will not extend the starboard seat back to the stern. has anyone ever place new scuppers (larger diameter say 2 to 3 inches) thru the rear compartment and out the stern. seems if the lower edge of a new larger scupper were just above the deck area (a more horizontal placement) so as not to have issue with the floor/bulkhead that a scupper pipe could be run thru the rear compartment and out the stern. it would reduce the size of the rear compartment but it would be a way to get rid of water faster.
              >
              > seems like all compartment would drain into the bilge so a good bilge pump(s) could pump it out. sure wish i had a set of manufacturing drawings for the boat .
              >
              > thanks again for the advice and fixes. kind of like restoring an old car, lots of unknowns and several opportunities to carefully weight the risks and then dam the torpedoes, just go in and see what you get as long as i remember to make the hull water tight again.
              >
              > To: SJ-24@yahoogroups.com
              > From: gc138@...
              > Date: Mon, 2 Nov 2009 14:48:48 -0500
              > Subject: Re: [SJ-24] leaks at rear scuppers + do cockpit compartments drain into cabin
              >
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              > John - if the leak is not too bad, I would try a patch fix like scraping
              > out the bad glass and fill with some thickened epoxy or if you do not have any,
              > try Bondo. If you cracks are large, you can get Bondo with glass filaments in
              > it.
              > It's very hard to work from the inside. That rear compartment is small. You
              > can get in there to look for leaks by cutting a hole in the bulkhead under the
              > cockpit. You have crawl back in there on your belley or side to work on things
              > but it can be done. You cab a round hole and then cover with an inspections
              > hatch will will give you future access to that area. If you can see separation
              > for sure, then you probably have the culprit. Also, check for separation around
              > the top of the rudder tube and the fiberglass surrounding it. It had a leak
              > there I filled with a little thickened epoxy.
              > The only bulkhead back there under the cockpit is the one you can see from
              > the quarter berth. It's rather flimsy on my boat so under the cockpit sole part
              > I beefed it up with another piece of ply and now the cockpit footing is a bit
              > more solid. Water should not get into the cabin from anywhere. Some like Capt
              > Bill have sealed off the rear lazarette even.
              > About extending the seat to the rear - I don't know about that. It's kind
              > of nice to have that little extra bit of room when standing and steering or
              > sheeting in a rather narrow stern area. I would think about that for a while
              > before doing it. If you are new to the boat, you will probably discard that idea
              > after sailing it.
              > George #18 "Spaghetti"
              >
              >
              > In a message dated 11/1/2009 10:43:25 P.M. Central Standard Time,
              > johnwaclawski@... writes:
              >
              >
              > i noticed i am getting rain water into the cabin. Based on water line
              > trails in the baby powder i put in the cabin sole under the cockpit i believe
              > the water is entering from the scuppers where they meet the cockpit floor and
              > from both the rear compartment and the port compartment. are the compartments
              > supposed to drain into the cockpit? where are the weep holes if that was the
              > design? also reading old posts it seems my scuppers have some separation where
              > they join the rear cockpit deck. Is there a good fix for the scupper leaks?
              > how about a different way to get the water out of the cockpit? it is class
              > legal to revise the entire cockpit to open up the rear of the boat by
              > eliminating the rear compartment and extending the side seats all the way to
              > the transom? does anybody have a diagram showing the location of all
              > bulkheads? a little amount of work on a nice boat seems to be turning to a big
              > project and i want to know as much as possible before i cut into the boat. too
              > little knowledge is a dangerous thing when doing some minor improvements.
              > thanks for input or pointers. i am keeping a log of the work and will make it
              > available when done. is there still a class association for
              > sj24s?
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
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              > _________________________________________________________________
              > Windows 7: It works the way you want.
              > http://www.microsoft.com/Windows/windows-7/default.aspx?ocid=PID24727::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:WWL_WIN_evergreen2:112009
              >
            • john waclawski
              thank you for the idea and a way to check the scuppers and rudder post. However,i cannot visualize where to put the hatch or how big it should be or where to
              Message 6 of 10 , Nov 2, 2009
              • 0 Attachment
                thank you for the idea and a way to check the scuppers and rudder post.  However,i cannot visualize where to put the hatch or how big it should be or where to put a new bulkhead.

                 when you get time a few pictures would help me and others.  i checked with a few others in the gig harbor area of washington and they have similar issues with their 70s era boats regardless of manufacturer.  
                 


                To: SJ-24@yahoogroups.com
                From: bearsglass@...
                Date: Tue, 3 Nov 2009 01:47:45 +0000
                Subject: [SJ-24] Re: leaks at rear scuppers + do cockpit compartments drain into cabin

                 
                when i got my sj24 its rudder post was shattered and needed to be re glassed so i put a hatch in the aft part of my cockpit to access the area it also is a nice bulkhead too and adds to my storage. But in this process of work you have full view of the scuppers and if they need work it could be done easy. the repair job of the rudder post was a bit more work but its been 4 years and still no leaks from there.if you need pics i may be able to help but its dark out now.

                --- In SJ-24@yahoogroups. com, john waclawski <johnwaclawski@ ...> wrote:
                >
                >
                > thank you for the great ideas. i searched the area around the scuppers and both have the tube to the outside (scupper tube) separated at the cabin deck where the tubes meet the upper surface of the cockpit deck. I can feel with a L shaped wire that there is a open space between the deck and the tube and what seems like a second deck under the main deck. maybe the deck was cored with foam or balsa or thin plywood and the core rotted away, will try to fill the voids with thickened epoxie. must be some open space between the top of the deck and the outside bottom of the boat, thus the 3 to 5 inch long tube that forms the scupper. is it possible to replace the tube? i am thinking a thin walled pvc tube with a new flange and then epoxie the assembly into the existing scupper.
                >
                > i know you are right about the seat and standing space so i will not extend the starboard seat back to the stern. has anyone ever place new scuppers (larger diameter say 2 to 3 inches) thru the rear compartment and out the stern. seems if the lower edge of a new larger scupper were just above the deck area (a more horizontal placement) so as not to have issue with the floor/bulkhead that a scupper pipe could be run thru the rear compartment and out the stern. it would reduce the size of the rear compartment but it would be a way to get rid of water faster.
                >
                > seems like all compartment would drain into the bilge so a good bilge pump(s) could pump it out. sure wish i had a set of manufacturing drawings for the boat .
                >
                > thanks again for the advice and fixes. kind of like restoring an old car, lots of unknowns and several opportunities to carefully weight the risks and then dam the torpedoes, just go in and see what you get as long as i remember to make the hull water tight again.
                >
                > To: SJ-24@yahoogroups. com
                > From: gc138@...
                > Date: Mon, 2 Nov 2009 14:48:48 -0500
                > Subject: Re: [SJ-24] leaks at rear scuppers + do cockpit compartments drain into cabin
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
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                >
                >
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                >
                >
                >
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                >
                >
                >
                >
                > John - if the leak is not too bad, I would try a patch fix like scraping
                > out the bad glass and fill with some thickened epoxy or if you do not have any,
                > try Bondo. If you cracks are large, you can get Bondo with glass filaments in
                > it.
                > It's very hard to work from the inside. That rear compartment is small. You
                > can get in there to look for leaks by cutting a hole in the bulkhead under the
                > cockpit. You have crawl back in there on your belley or side to work on things
                > but it can be done. You cab a round hole and then cover with an inspections
                > hatch will will give you future access to that area. If you can see separation
                > for sure, then you probably have the culprit. Also, check for separation around
                > the top of the rudder tube and the fiberglass surrounding it. It had a leak
                > there I filled with a little thickened epoxy.
                > The only bulkhead back there under the cockpit is the one you can see from
                > the quarter berth. It's rather flimsy on my boat so under the cockpit sole part
                > I beefed it up with another piece of ply and now the cockpit footing is a bit
                > more solid. Water should not get into the cabin from anywhere. Some like Capt
                > Bill have sealed off the rear lazarette even.
                > About extending the seat to the rear - I don't know about that. It's kind
                > of nice to have that little extra bit of room when standing and steering or
                > sheeting in a rather narrow stern area. I would think about that for a while
                > before doing it. If you are new to the boat, you will probably discard that idea
                > after sailing it.
                > George #18 "Spaghetti"
                >
                >
                > In a message dated 11/1/2009 10:43:25 P.M. Central Standard Time,
                > johnwaclawski@ ... writes:
                >
                >
                > i noticed i am getting rain water into the cabin. Based on water line
                > trails in the baby powder i put in the cabin sole under the cockpit i believe
                > the water is entering from the scuppers where they meet the cockpit floor and
                > from both the rear compartment and the port compartment. are the compartments
                > supposed to drain into the cockpit? where are the weep holes if that was the
                > design? also reading old posts it seems my scuppers have some separation where
                > they join the rear cockpit deck. Is there a good fix for the scupper leaks?
                > how about a different way to get the water out of the cockpit? it is class
                > legal to revise the entire cockpit to open up the rear of the boat by
                > eliminating the rear compartment and extending the side seats all the way to
                > the transom? does anybody have a diagram showing the location of all
                > bulkheads? a little amount of work on a nice boat seems to be turning to a big
                > project and i want to know as much as possible before i cut into the boat. too
                > little knowledge is a dangerous thing when doing some minor improvements.
                > thanks for input or pointers. i am keeping a log of the work and will make it
                > available when done. is there still a class association for
                > sj24s?
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                > ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _
                > Windows 7: It works the way you want.
                > http://www.microsof t.com/Windows/ windows-7/ default.aspx? ocid=PID24727: :T:WLMTAGL: ON:WL:en- US:WWL_WIN_ evergreen2: 112009
                >




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              • michael1312001
                Rather than a hatch, a deck plate would be quite cheap and much easier to install. Maybe that is what was meant. Here is an example:
                Message 7 of 10 , Nov 2, 2009
                • 0 Attachment
                  Rather than a hatch, a deck plate would be quite cheap and much easier to install. Maybe that is what was meant. Here is an example:

                  http://www.jamestowndistributors.com/userportal/show_product.do?pid=7794&familyName=Beckson+Screw-Out+Deck+Plates

                  Michael
                  Ana Maria, #66

                  --- In SJ-24@yahoogroups.com, john waclawski <johnwaclawski@...> wrote:
                  >
                  >
                  > thank you for the idea and a way to check the scuppers and rudder post. However,i cannot visualize where to put the hatch or how big it should be or where to put a new bulkhead.
                  >
                  > when you get time a few pictures would help me and others. i checked with a few others in the gig harbor area of washington and they have similar issues with their 70s era boats regardless of manufacturer.
                  >
                  >
                  > To: SJ-24@yahoogroups.com
                  > From: bearsglass@...
                  > Date: Tue, 3 Nov 2009 01:47:45 +0000
                  > Subject: [SJ-24] Re: leaks at rear scuppers + do cockpit compartments drain into cabin
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > when i got my sj24 its rudder post was shattered and needed to be re glassed so i put a hatch in the aft part of my cockpit to access the area it also is a nice bulkhead too and adds to my storage. But in this process of work you have full view of the scuppers and if they need work it could be done easy. the repair job of the rudder post was a bit more work but its been 4 years and still no leaks from there.if you need pics i may be able to help but its dark out now.
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > --- In SJ-24@yahoogroups.com, john waclawski <johnwaclawski@> wrote:
                  >
                  > >
                  >
                  > >
                  >
                  > > thank you for the great ideas. i searched the area around the scuppers and both have the tube to the outside (scupper tube) separated at the cabin deck where the tubes meet the upper surface of the cockpit deck. I can feel with a L shaped wire that there is a open space between the deck and the tube and what seems like a second deck under the main deck. maybe the deck was cored with foam or balsa or thin plywood and the core rotted away, will try to fill the voids with thickened epoxie. must be some open space between the top of the deck and the outside bottom of the boat, thus the 3 to 5 inch long tube that forms the scupper. is it possible to replace the tube? i am thinking a thin walled pvc tube with a new flange and then epoxie the assembly into the existing scupper.
                  >
                  > >
                  >
                  > > i know you are right about the seat and standing space so i will not extend the starboard seat back to the stern. has anyone ever place new scuppers (larger diameter say 2 to 3 inches) thru the rear compartment and out the stern. seems if the lower edge of a new larger scupper were just above the deck area (a more horizontal placement) so as not to have issue with the floor/bulkhead that a scupper pipe could be run thru the rear compartment and out the stern. it would reduce the size of the rear compartment but it would be a way to get rid of water faster.
                  >
                  > >
                  >
                  > > seems like all compartment would drain into the bilge so a good bilge pump(s) could pump it out. sure wish i had a set of manufacturing drawings for the boat .
                  >
                  > >
                  >
                  > > thanks again for the advice and fixes. kind of like restoring an old car, lots of unknowns and several opportunities to carefully weight the risks and then dam the torpedoes, just go in and see what you get as long as i remember to make the hull water tight again.
                  >
                  > >
                  >
                  > > To: SJ-24@yahoogroups.com
                  >
                  > > From: gc138@
                  >
                  > > Date: Mon, 2 Nov 2009 14:48:48 -0500
                  >
                  > > Subject: Re: [SJ-24] leaks at rear scuppers + do cockpit compartments drain into cabin
                  >
                  > >
                  >
                  > >
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                  > >
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                  > >
                  >
                  > > John - if the leak is not too bad, I would try a patch fix like scraping
                  >
                  > > out the bad glass and fill with some thickened epoxy or if you do not have any,
                  >
                  > > try Bondo. If you cracks are large, you can get Bondo with glass filaments in
                  >
                  > > it.
                  >
                  > > It's very hard to work from the inside. That rear compartment is small. You
                  >
                  > > can get in there to look for leaks by cutting a hole in the bulkhead under the
                  >
                  > > cockpit. You have crawl back in there on your belley or side to work on things
                  >
                  > > but it can be done. You cab a round hole and then cover with an inspections
                  >
                  > > hatch will will give you future access to that area. If you can see separation
                  >
                  > > for sure, then you probably have the culprit. Also, check for separation around
                  >
                  > > the top of the rudder tube and the fiberglass surrounding it. It had a leak
                  >
                  > > there I filled with a little thickened epoxy.
                  >
                  > > The only bulkhead back there under the cockpit is the one you can see from
                  >
                  > > the quarter berth. It's rather flimsy on my boat so under the cockpit sole part
                  >
                  > > I beefed it up with another piece of ply and now the cockpit footing is a bit
                  >
                  > > more solid. Water should not get into the cabin from anywhere. Some like Capt
                  >
                  > > Bill have sealed off the rear lazarette even.
                  >
                  > > About extending the seat to the rear - I don't know about that. It's kind
                  >
                  > > of nice to have that little extra bit of room when standing and steering or
                  >
                  > > sheeting in a rather narrow stern area. I would think about that for a while
                  >
                  > > before doing it. If you are new to the boat, you will probably discard that idea
                  >
                  > > after sailing it.
                  >
                  > > George #18 "Spaghetti"
                  >
                  > >
                  >
                  > >
                  >
                  > > In a message dated 11/1/2009 10:43:25 P.M. Central Standard Time,
                  >
                  > > johnwaclawski@ writes:
                  >
                  > >
                  >
                  > >
                  >
                  > > i noticed i am getting rain water into the cabin. Based on water line
                  >
                  > > trails in the baby powder i put in the cabin sole under the cockpit i believe
                  >
                  > > the water is entering from the scuppers where they meet the cockpit floor and
                  >
                  > > from both the rear compartment and the port compartment. are the compartments
                  >
                  > > supposed to drain into the cockpit? where are the weep holes if that was the
                  >
                  > > design? also reading old posts it seems my scuppers have some separation where
                  >
                  > > they join the rear cockpit deck. Is there a good fix for the scupper leaks?
                  >
                  > > how about a different way to get the water out of the cockpit? it is class
                  >
                  > > legal to revise the entire cockpit to open up the rear of the boat by
                  >
                  > > eliminating the rear compartment and extending the side seats all the way to
                  >
                  > > the transom? does anybody have a diagram showing the location of all
                  >
                  > > bulkheads? a little amount of work on a nice boat seems to be turning to a big
                  >
                  > > project and i want to know as much as possible before i cut into the boat. too
                  >
                  > > little knowledge is a dangerous thing when doing some minor improvements.
                  >
                  > > thanks for input or pointers. i am keeping a log of the work and will make it
                  >
                  > > available when done. is there still a class association for
                  >
                  > > sj24s?
                  >
                  > >
                  >
                  > >
                  >
                  > >
                  >
                  > >
                  >
                  > >
                  >
                  > >
                  >
                  > >
                  >
                  > >
                  >
                  > >
                  >
                  > >
                  >
                  > >
                  >
                  > >
                  >
                  > >
                  >
                  > >
                  >
                  > >
                  >
                  > >
                  >
                  > >
                  >
                  > >
                  >
                  > >
                  >
                  > >
                  >
                  > >
                  >
                  > >
                  >
                  > > __________________________________________________________
                  >
                  > > Windows 7: It works the way you want.
                  >
                  > > http://www.microsoft.com/Windows/windows-7/default.aspx?ocid=PID24727::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:WWL_WIN_evergreen2:112009
                  >
                  > >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > _________________________________________________________________
                  > Hotmail: Trusted email with powerful SPAM protection.
                  > http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/177141665/direct/01/
                  >
                • bear
                  the hatch I m talking of i got at west marine its about 10 x 20 i think and the bulkhead is there. there is a wall the separates the aft lazaret from the
                  Message 8 of 10 , Nov 2, 2009
                  • 0 Attachment
                    the hatch I'm talking of i got at west marine its about 10"x 20" i think and the bulkhead is there. there is a wall the separates the aft lazaret from the cabin about 2' forward of rudder post its already there and to put an access hatch only gives extra storage i will take pics in the morning and post them later tomorrow

                    --- In SJ-24@yahoogroups.com, "michael1312001" <michael98277@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > Rather than a hatch, a deck plate would be quite cheap and much easier to install. Maybe that is what was meant. Here is an example:
                    >
                    > http://www.jamestowndistributors.com/userportal/show_product.do?pid=7794&familyName=Beckson+Screw-Out+Deck+Plates
                    >
                    > Michael
                    > Ana Maria, #66
                    >
                    > --- In SJ-24@yahoogroups.com, john waclawski <johnwaclawski@> wrote:
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > thank you for the idea and a way to check the scuppers and rudder post. However,i cannot visualize where to put the hatch or how big it should be or where to put a new bulkhead.
                    > >
                    > > when you get time a few pictures would help me and others. i checked with a few others in the gig harbor area of washington and they have similar issues with their 70s era boats regardless of manufacturer.
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > To: SJ-24@yahoogroups.com
                    > > From: bearsglass@
                    > > Date: Tue, 3 Nov 2009 01:47:45 +0000
                    > > Subject: [SJ-24] Re: leaks at rear scuppers + do cockpit compartments drain into cabin
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > when i got my sj24 its rudder post was shattered and needed to be re glassed so i put a hatch in the aft part of my cockpit to access the area it also is a nice bulkhead too and adds to my storage. But in this process of work you have full view of the scuppers and if they need work it could be done easy. the repair job of the rudder post was a bit more work but its been 4 years and still no leaks from there.if you need pics i may be able to help but its dark out now.
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > --- In SJ-24@yahoogroups.com, john waclawski <johnwaclawski@> wrote:
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > > thank you for the great ideas. i searched the area around the scuppers and both have the tube to the outside (scupper tube) separated at the cabin deck where the tubes meet the upper surface of the cockpit deck. I can feel with a L shaped wire that there is a open space between the deck and the tube and what seems like a second deck under the main deck. maybe the deck was cored with foam or balsa or thin plywood and the core rotted away, will try to fill the voids with thickened epoxie. must be some open space between the top of the deck and the outside bottom of the boat, thus the 3 to 5 inch long tube that forms the scupper. is it possible to replace the tube? i am thinking a thin walled pvc tube with a new flange and then epoxie the assembly into the existing scupper.
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > > i know you are right about the seat and standing space so i will not extend the starboard seat back to the stern. has anyone ever place new scuppers (larger diameter say 2 to 3 inches) thru the rear compartment and out the stern. seems if the lower edge of a new larger scupper were just above the deck area (a more horizontal placement) so as not to have issue with the floor/bulkhead that a scupper pipe could be run thru the rear compartment and out the stern. it would reduce the size of the rear compartment but it would be a way to get rid of water faster.
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > > seems like all compartment would drain into the bilge so a good bilge pump(s) could pump it out. sure wish i had a set of manufacturing drawings for the boat .
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > > thanks again for the advice and fixes. kind of like restoring an old car, lots of unknowns and several opportunities to carefully weight the risks and then dam the torpedoes, just go in and see what you get as long as i remember to make the hull water tight again.
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > > To: SJ-24@yahoogroups.com
                    > >
                    > > > From: gc138@
                    > >
                    > > > Date: Mon, 2 Nov 2009 14:48:48 -0500
                    > >
                    > > > Subject: Re: [SJ-24] leaks at rear scuppers + do cockpit compartments drain into cabin
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > > John - if the leak is not too bad, I would try a patch fix like scraping
                    > >
                    > > > out the bad glass and fill with some thickened epoxy or if you do not have any,
                    > >
                    > > > try Bondo. If you cracks are large, you can get Bondo with glass filaments in
                    > >
                    > > > it.
                    > >
                    > > > It's very hard to work from the inside. That rear compartment is small. You
                    > >
                    > > > can get in there to look for leaks by cutting a hole in the bulkhead under the
                    > >
                    > > > cockpit. You have crawl back in there on your belley or side to work on things
                    > >
                    > > > but it can be done. You cab a round hole and then cover with an inspections
                    > >
                    > > > hatch will will give you future access to that area. If you can see separation
                    > >
                    > > > for sure, then you probably have the culprit. Also, check for separation around
                    > >
                    > > > the top of the rudder tube and the fiberglass surrounding it. It had a leak
                    > >
                    > > > there I filled with a little thickened epoxy.
                    > >
                    > > > The only bulkhead back there under the cockpit is the one you can see from
                    > >
                    > > > the quarter berth. It's rather flimsy on my boat so under the cockpit sole part
                    > >
                    > > > I beefed it up with another piece of ply and now the cockpit footing is a bit
                    > >
                    > > > more solid. Water should not get into the cabin from anywhere. Some like Capt
                    > >
                    > > > Bill have sealed off the rear lazarette even.
                    > >
                    > > > About extending the seat to the rear - I don't know about that. It's kind
                    > >
                    > > > of nice to have that little extra bit of room when standing and steering or
                    > >
                    > > > sheeting in a rather narrow stern area. I would think about that for a while
                    > >
                    > > > before doing it. If you are new to the boat, you will probably discard that idea
                    > >
                    > > > after sailing it.
                    > >
                    > > > George #18 "Spaghetti"
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > > In a message dated 11/1/2009 10:43:25 P.M. Central Standard Time,
                    > >
                    > > > johnwaclawski@ writes:
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > > i noticed i am getting rain water into the cabin. Based on water line
                    > >
                    > > > trails in the baby powder i put in the cabin sole under the cockpit i believe
                    > >
                    > > > the water is entering from the scuppers where they meet the cockpit floor and
                    > >
                    > > > from both the rear compartment and the port compartment. are the compartments
                    > >
                    > > > supposed to drain into the cockpit? where are the weep holes if that was the
                    > >
                    > > > design? also reading old posts it seems my scuppers have some separation where
                    > >
                    > > > they join the rear cockpit deck. Is there a good fix for the scupper leaks?
                    > >
                    > > > how about a different way to get the water out of the cockpit? it is class
                    > >
                    > > > legal to revise the entire cockpit to open up the rear of the boat by
                    > >
                    > > > eliminating the rear compartment and extending the side seats all the way to
                    > >
                    > > > the transom? does anybody have a diagram showing the location of all
                    > >
                    > > > bulkheads? a little amount of work on a nice boat seems to be turning to a big
                    > >
                    > > > project and i want to know as much as possible before i cut into the boat. too
                    > >
                    > > > little knowledge is a dangerous thing when doing some minor improvements.
                    > >
                    > > > thanks for input or pointers. i am keeping a log of the work and will make it
                    > >
                    > > > available when done. is there still a class association for
                    > >
                    > > > sj24s?
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > > > __________________________________________________________
                    > >
                    > > > Windows 7: It works the way you want.
                    > >
                    > > > http://www.microsoft.com/Windows/windows-7/default.aspx?ocid=PID24727::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:WWL_WIN_evergreen2:112009
                    > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > _________________________________________________________________
                    > > Hotmail: Trusted email with powerful SPAM protection.
                    > > http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/177141665/direct/01/
                    > >
                    >
                  • michael1312001
                    On my boat that is the bilge. Am I crazy? I have a hose running there, connected to a manual bilge pump. Sure, I need to rebed some hardware to get my boat
                    Message 9 of 10 , Nov 2, 2009
                    • 0 Attachment
                      On my boat that is the bilge. Am I crazy? I have a hose running there, connected to a manual bilge pump. Sure, I need to rebed some hardware to get my boat a lot less wet, but I'd still consider that area the bilge. Do the rest of you not have that?

                      Michael
                      Ana Maria, #66

                      --- In SJ-24@yahoogroups.com, "bear" <bearsglass@...> wrote:
                      >
                      > the hatch I'm talking of i got at west marine its about 10"x 20" i think and the bulkhead is there. there is a wall the separates the aft lazaret from the cabin about 2' forward of rudder post its already there and to put an access hatch only gives extra storage i will take pics in the morning and post them later tomorrow
                      >
                      > --- In SJ-24@yahoogroups.com, "michael1312001" <michael98277@> wrote:
                      > >
                      > > Rather than a hatch, a deck plate would be quite cheap and much easier to install. Maybe that is what was meant. Here is an example:
                      > >
                      > > http://www.jamestowndistributors.com/userportal/show_product.do?pid=7794&familyName=Beckson+Screw-Out+Deck+Plates
                      > >
                      > > Michael
                      > > Ana Maria, #66
                      > >
                      > > --- In SJ-24@yahoogroups.com, john waclawski <johnwaclawski@> wrote:
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > thank you for the idea and a way to check the scuppers and rudder post. However,i cannot visualize where to put the hatch or how big it should be or where to put a new bulkhead.
                      > > >
                      > > > when you get time a few pictures would help me and others. i checked with a few others in the gig harbor area of washington and they have similar issues with their 70s era boats regardless of manufacturer.
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > To: SJ-24@yahoogroups.com
                      > > > From: bearsglass@
                      > > > Date: Tue, 3 Nov 2009 01:47:45 +0000
                      > > > Subject: [SJ-24] Re: leaks at rear scuppers + do cockpit compartments drain into cabin
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > when i got my sj24 its rudder post was shattered and needed to be re glassed so i put a hatch in the aft part of my cockpit to access the area it also is a nice bulkhead too and adds to my storage. But in this process of work you have full view of the scuppers and if they need work it could be done easy. the repair job of the rudder post was a bit more work but its been 4 years and still no leaks from there.if you need pics i may be able to help but its dark out now.
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > --- In SJ-24@yahoogroups.com, john waclawski <johnwaclawski@> wrote:
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > > thank you for the great ideas. i searched the area around the scuppers and both have the tube to the outside (scupper tube) separated at the cabin deck where the tubes meet the upper surface of the cockpit deck. I can feel with a L shaped wire that there is a open space between the deck and the tube and what seems like a second deck under the main deck. maybe the deck was cored with foam or balsa or thin plywood and the core rotted away, will try to fill the voids with thickened epoxie. must be some open space between the top of the deck and the outside bottom of the boat, thus the 3 to 5 inch long tube that forms the scupper. is it possible to replace the tube? i am thinking a thin walled pvc tube with a new flange and then epoxie the assembly into the existing scupper.
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > > i know you are right about the seat and standing space so i will not extend the starboard seat back to the stern. has anyone ever place new scuppers (larger diameter say 2 to 3 inches) thru the rear compartment and out the stern. seems if the lower edge of a new larger scupper were just above the deck area (a more horizontal placement) so as not to have issue with the floor/bulkhead that a scupper pipe could be run thru the rear compartment and out the stern. it would reduce the size of the rear compartment but it would be a way to get rid of water faster.
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > > seems like all compartment would drain into the bilge so a good bilge pump(s) could pump it out. sure wish i had a set of manufacturing drawings for the boat .
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > > thanks again for the advice and fixes. kind of like restoring an old car, lots of unknowns and several opportunities to carefully weight the risks and then dam the torpedoes, just go in and see what you get as long as i remember to make the hull water tight again.
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > > To: SJ-24@yahoogroups.com
                      > > >
                      > > > > From: gc138@
                      > > >
                      > > > > Date: Mon, 2 Nov 2009 14:48:48 -0500
                      > > >
                      > > > > Subject: Re: [SJ-24] leaks at rear scuppers + do cockpit compartments drain into cabin
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > > John - if the leak is not too bad, I would try a patch fix like scraping
                      > > >
                      > > > > out the bad glass and fill with some thickened epoxy or if you do not have any,
                      > > >
                      > > > > try Bondo. If you cracks are large, you can get Bondo with glass filaments in
                      > > >
                      > > > > it.
                      > > >
                      > > > > It's very hard to work from the inside. That rear compartment is small. You
                      > > >
                      > > > > can get in there to look for leaks by cutting a hole in the bulkhead under the
                      > > >
                      > > > > cockpit. You have crawl back in there on your belley or side to work on things
                      > > >
                      > > > > but it can be done. You cab a round hole and then cover with an inspections
                      > > >
                      > > > > hatch will will give you future access to that area. If you can see separation
                      > > >
                      > > > > for sure, then you probably have the culprit. Also, check for separation around
                      > > >
                      > > > > the top of the rudder tube and the fiberglass surrounding it. It had a leak
                      > > >
                      > > > > there I filled with a little thickened epoxy.
                      > > >
                      > > > > The only bulkhead back there under the cockpit is the one you can see from
                      > > >
                      > > > > the quarter berth. It's rather flimsy on my boat so under the cockpit sole part
                      > > >
                      > > > > I beefed it up with another piece of ply and now the cockpit footing is a bit
                      > > >
                      > > > > more solid. Water should not get into the cabin from anywhere. Some like Capt
                      > > >
                      > > > > Bill have sealed off the rear lazarette even.
                      > > >
                      > > > > About extending the seat to the rear - I don't know about that. It's kind
                      > > >
                      > > > > of nice to have that little extra bit of room when standing and steering or
                      > > >
                      > > > > sheeting in a rather narrow stern area. I would think about that for a while
                      > > >
                      > > > > before doing it. If you are new to the boat, you will probably discard that idea
                      > > >
                      > > > > after sailing it.
                      > > >
                      > > > > George #18 "Spaghetti"
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > > In a message dated 11/1/2009 10:43:25 P.M. Central Standard Time,
                      > > >
                      > > > > johnwaclawski@ writes:
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > > i noticed i am getting rain water into the cabin. Based on water line
                      > > >
                      > > > > trails in the baby powder i put in the cabin sole under the cockpit i believe
                      > > >
                      > > > > the water is entering from the scuppers where they meet the cockpit floor and
                      > > >
                      > > > > from both the rear compartment and the port compartment. are the compartments
                      > > >
                      > > > > supposed to drain into the cockpit? where are the weep holes if that was the
                      > > >
                      > > > > design? also reading old posts it seems my scuppers have some separation where
                      > > >
                      > > > > they join the rear cockpit deck. Is there a good fix for the scupper leaks?
                      > > >
                      > > > > how about a different way to get the water out of the cockpit? it is class
                      > > >
                      > > > > legal to revise the entire cockpit to open up the rear of the boat by
                      > > >
                      > > > > eliminating the rear compartment and extending the side seats all the way to
                      > > >
                      > > > > the transom? does anybody have a diagram showing the location of all
                      > > >
                      > > > > bulkheads? a little amount of work on a nice boat seems to be turning to a big
                      > > >
                      > > > > project and i want to know as much as possible before i cut into the boat. too
                      > > >
                      > > > > little knowledge is a dangerous thing when doing some minor improvements.
                      > > >
                      > > > > thanks for input or pointers. i am keeping a log of the work and will make it
                      > > >
                      > > > > available when done. is there still a class association for
                      > > >
                      > > > > sj24s?
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > > __________________________________________________________
                      > > >
                      > > > > Windows 7: It works the way you want.
                      > > >
                      > > > > http://www.microsoft.com/Windows/windows-7/default.aspx?ocid=PID24727::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:WWL_WIN_evergreen2:112009
                      > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
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                    • bear
                      the bilge is the area just above the keel and the pump is mounted on the cockpit floor all the way forward and by the companionway
                      Message 10 of 10 , Nov 3, 2009
                      • 0 Attachment
                        the bilge is the area just above the keel and the pump is mounted on the cockpit floor all the way forward and by the companionway

                        --- In SJ-24@yahoogroups.com, "michael1312001" <michael98277@...> wrote:
                        >
                        >
                        > On my boat that is the bilge. Am I crazy? I have a hose running there, connected to a manual bilge pump. Sure, I need to rebed some hardware to get my boat a lot less wet, but I'd still consider that area the bilge. Do the rest of you not have that?
                        >
                        > Michael
                        > Ana Maria, #66
                        >
                        > --- In SJ-24@yahoogroups.com, "bear" <bearsglass@> wrote:
                        > >
                        > > the hatch I'm talking of i got at west marine its about 10"x 20" i think and the bulkhead is there. there is a wall the separates the aft lazaret from the cabin about 2' forward of rudder post its already there and to put an access hatch only gives extra storage i will take pics in the morning and post them later tomorrow
                        > >
                        > > --- In SJ-24@yahoogroups.com, "michael1312001" <michael98277@> wrote:
                        > > >
                        > > > Rather than a hatch, a deck plate would be quite cheap and much easier to install. Maybe that is what was meant. Here is an example:
                        > > >
                        > > > http://www.jamestowndistributors.com/userportal/show_product.do?pid=7794&familyName=Beckson+Screw-Out+Deck+Plates
                        > > >
                        > > > Michael
                        > > > Ana Maria, #66
                        > > >
                        > > > --- In SJ-24@yahoogroups.com, john waclawski <johnwaclawski@> wrote:
                        > > > >
                        > > > >
                        > > > > thank you for the idea and a way to check the scuppers and rudder post. However,i cannot visualize where to put the hatch or how big it should be or where to put a new bulkhead.
                        > > > >
                        > > > > when you get time a few pictures would help me and others. i checked with a few others in the gig harbor area of washington and they have similar issues with their 70s era boats regardless of manufacturer.
                        > > > >
                        > > > >
                        > > > > To: SJ-24@yahoogroups.com
                        > > > > From: bearsglass@
                        > > > > Date: Tue, 3 Nov 2009 01:47:45 +0000
                        > > > > Subject: [SJ-24] Re: leaks at rear scuppers + do cockpit compartments drain into cabin
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                        > > > > when i got my sj24 its rudder post was shattered and needed to be re glassed so i put a hatch in the aft part of my cockpit to access the area it also is a nice bulkhead too and adds to my storage. But in this process of work you have full view of the scuppers and if they need work it could be done easy. the repair job of the rudder post was a bit more work but its been 4 years and still no leaks from there.if you need pics i may be able to help but its dark out now.
                        > > > >
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                        > > > >
                        > > > > --- In SJ-24@yahoogroups.com, john waclawski <johnwaclawski@> wrote:
                        > > > >
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                        > > > > > thank you for the great ideas. i searched the area around the scuppers and both have the tube to the outside (scupper tube) separated at the cabin deck where the tubes meet the upper surface of the cockpit deck. I can feel with a L shaped wire that there is a open space between the deck and the tube and what seems like a second deck under the main deck. maybe the deck was cored with foam or balsa or thin plywood and the core rotted away, will try to fill the voids with thickened epoxie. must be some open space between the top of the deck and the outside bottom of the boat, thus the 3 to 5 inch long tube that forms the scupper. is it possible to replace the tube? i am thinking a thin walled pvc tube with a new flange and then epoxie the assembly into the existing scupper.
                        > > > >
                        > > > > >
                        > > > >
                        > > > > > i know you are right about the seat and standing space so i will not extend the starboard seat back to the stern. has anyone ever place new scuppers (larger diameter say 2 to 3 inches) thru the rear compartment and out the stern. seems if the lower edge of a new larger scupper were just above the deck area (a more horizontal placement) so as not to have issue with the floor/bulkhead that a scupper pipe could be run thru the rear compartment and out the stern. it would reduce the size of the rear compartment but it would be a way to get rid of water faster.
                        > > > >
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                        > > > > > seems like all compartment would drain into the bilge so a good bilge pump(s) could pump it out. sure wish i had a set of manufacturing drawings for the boat .
                        > > > >
                        > > > > >
                        > > > >
                        > > > > > thanks again for the advice and fixes. kind of like restoring an old car, lots of unknowns and several opportunities to carefully weight the risks and then dam the torpedoes, just go in and see what you get as long as i remember to make the hull water tight again.
                        > > > >
                        > > > > >
                        > > > >
                        > > > > > To: SJ-24@yahoogroups.com
                        > > > >
                        > > > > > From: gc138@
                        > > > >
                        > > > > > Date: Mon, 2 Nov 2009 14:48:48 -0500
                        > > > >
                        > > > > > Subject: Re: [SJ-24] leaks at rear scuppers + do cockpit compartments drain into cabin
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                        > > > > > John - if the leak is not too bad, I would try a patch fix like scraping
                        > > > >
                        > > > > > out the bad glass and fill with some thickened epoxy or if you do not have any,
                        > > > >
                        > > > > > try Bondo. If you cracks are large, you can get Bondo with glass filaments in
                        > > > >
                        > > > > > it.
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                        > > > > > It's very hard to work from the inside. That rear compartment is small. You
                        > > > >
                        > > > > > can get in there to look for leaks by cutting a hole in the bulkhead under the
                        > > > >
                        > > > > > cockpit. You have crawl back in there on your belley or side to work on things
                        > > > >
                        > > > > > but it can be done. You cab a round hole and then cover with an inspections
                        > > > >
                        > > > > > hatch will will give you future access to that area. If you can see separation
                        > > > >
                        > > > > > for sure, then you probably have the culprit. Also, check for separation around
                        > > > >
                        > > > > > the top of the rudder tube and the fiberglass surrounding it. It had a leak
                        > > > >
                        > > > > > there I filled with a little thickened epoxy.
                        > > > >
                        > > > > > The only bulkhead back there under the cockpit is the one you can see from
                        > > > >
                        > > > > > the quarter berth. It's rather flimsy on my boat so under the cockpit sole part
                        > > > >
                        > > > > > I beefed it up with another piece of ply and now the cockpit footing is a bit
                        > > > >
                        > > > > > more solid. Water should not get into the cabin from anywhere. Some like Capt
                        > > > >
                        > > > > > Bill have sealed off the rear lazarette even.
                        > > > >
                        > > > > > About extending the seat to the rear - I don't know about that. It's kind
                        > > > >
                        > > > > > of nice to have that little extra bit of room when standing and steering or
                        > > > >
                        > > > > > sheeting in a rather narrow stern area. I would think about that for a while
                        > > > >
                        > > > > > before doing it. If you are new to the boat, you will probably discard that idea
                        > > > >
                        > > > > > after sailing it.
                        > > > >
                        > > > > > George #18 "Spaghetti"
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                        > > > > > In a message dated 11/1/2009 10:43:25 P.M. Central Standard Time,
                        > > > >
                        > > > > > johnwaclawski@ writes:
                        > > > >
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                        > > > > > i noticed i am getting rain water into the cabin. Based on water line
                        > > > >
                        > > > > > trails in the baby powder i put in the cabin sole under the cockpit i believe
                        > > > >
                        > > > > > the water is entering from the scuppers where they meet the cockpit floor and
                        > > > >
                        > > > > > from both the rear compartment and the port compartment. are the compartments
                        > > > >
                        > > > > > supposed to drain into the cockpit? where are the weep holes if that was the
                        > > > >
                        > > > > > design? also reading old posts it seems my scuppers have some separation where
                        > > > >
                        > > > > > they join the rear cockpit deck. Is there a good fix for the scupper leaks?
                        > > > >
                        > > > > > how about a different way to get the water out of the cockpit? it is class
                        > > > >
                        > > > > > legal to revise the entire cockpit to open up the rear of the boat by
                        > > > >
                        > > > > > eliminating the rear compartment and extending the side seats all the way to
                        > > > >
                        > > > > > the transom? does anybody have a diagram showing the location of all
                        > > > >
                        > > > > > bulkheads? a little amount of work on a nice boat seems to be turning to a big
                        > > > >
                        > > > > > project and i want to know as much as possible before i cut into the boat. too
                        > > > >
                        > > > > > little knowledge is a dangerous thing when doing some minor improvements.
                        > > > >
                        > > > > > thanks for input or pointers. i am keeping a log of the work and will make it
                        > > > >
                        > > > > > available when done. is there still a class association for
                        > > > >
                        > > > > > sj24s?
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                        > > > >
                        > > > > > __________________________________________________________
                        > > > >
                        > > > > > Windows 7: It works the way you want.
                        > > > >
                        > > > > > http://www.microsoft.com/Windows/windows-7/default.aspx?ocid=PID24727::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:WWL_WIN_evergreen2:112009
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                        > > > >
                        > > > > _________________________________________________________________
                        > > > > Hotmail: Trusted email with powerful SPAM protection.
                        > > > > http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/177141665/direct/01/
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                        > > >
                        > >
                        >
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