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Info on Ash Grove Melody

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  • Lisa Harmon
    Does anyone have a date for the melody of Ash Grove? The words aren t period, but for some reason I was thinking the music was late period. But one on line
    Message 1 of 4 , Feb 3, 2008
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      Does anyone have a date for the melody of Ash Grove?
      The words aren't period, but for some reason I was thinking the music was late period. But one on line source dates it back only to the 18th century as a minuet.
      I've been playing with a filk with it on a theme of an event that happens every year which has a competition for some time and if the music isn't period enough I may just scrap it.
       
      Thanks
       
      alais


       
      Where Lions and Tigers and Bears (and more!) become your "Beary Dear Friends" for life!
       
       


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    • Paul DeLisle
      LLwyn Onn (the original tune) was originally a harp melody, and was first published in 1802. The first Welsh words were (probably) written by John Carriog
      Message 2 of 4 , Feb 3, 2008
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        LLwyn Onn” (the original tune) was originally a harp melody, and was first published in 1802. The first Welsh words were (probably) written by John Carriog Hughes (1832-1887.) “The Ash Grove” (English translation) was written some time afterward by John Oxenford (1812-1887.)

        That’s the only info I have…I don’t know if the tune itself is older than its publication date, or not.

         

        On a personal note, don’t trash the piece you’re writing just because it might be based on post-period music…it’s a beautiful piece, and what is important is that you know it’s post-period (how many Laurels do you know that use *completely* period techniques *and* materials in their creations?)

         

        I hope this helps!

         

        In Service, I remain

        Alden Pharamond

        Ansteorra

         

        From: SCA_BARDS@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SCA_BARDS@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Lisa Harmon
        Sent: Sunday, February 03, 2008 2:10 AM
        To: Bard Bard
        Subject: [SCA_BARDS] Info on Ash Grove Melody

         

        Does anyone have a date for the melody of Ash Grove?

        The words aren't period, but for some reason I was thinking the music was late period. But one on line source dates it back only to the 18th century as a minuet.

        I've been playing with a filk with it on a theme of an event that happens every year which has a competition for some time and if the music isn't period enough I may just scrap it.

         

        Thanks

         

        alais

         

         

        Where Lions and Tigers and Bears (and more!) become your "Beary Dear Friends" for life!

         

         

         


        Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search.

      • Jeff Suzuki
        ... The earliest date I ve seen for the music is 1730, when it appeared in The Beggar s Opera (John Gay, I think). As this was a compilation musical, you
        Message 3 of 4 , Feb 5, 2008
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          --- In SCA_BARDS@yahoogroups.com, Lisa Harmon <asilnomrah@...> wrote:
          >
          > Does anyone have a date for the melody of Ash Grove?
          > The words aren't period, but for some reason I was thinking the
          > music was late period. But one on line source dates it back only
          > to the 18th century as a minuet.

          The earliest date I've seen for the music is 1730, when it appeared
          in "The Beggar's Opera" (John Gay, I think). As this was a
          compilation musical, you could argue for a date as early as 1700,
          but I think you'd be hard pessed to push it back beyond then.

          > I've been playing with a filk with it on a theme of an event
          > that happens every year which has a competition for some time and
          > if the music isn't period enough I may just scrap it.

          I wouldn't scrap it. You might not want to enter it in an A&S
          competition, but remember: there's more to the SCA than events.

          For example, it would be perfectly appropriate at 1) post-revels, 2)
          project or practice nights, 3) SF filk rooms, 4) song therapy
          sessions, etc.

          And...I'm partial to the song, as it's not only the tune for one of
          the first SCA filks I wrote ("The Newbie Song",
          http://www.geocities.com/jeff_suzuki/newbie.htm) but the tune for
          one I wrote very recently ("The SCA Parent's Lament",
          http://www.geocities.com/jeff_suzuki/scagrove.htm).

          Jeffs/etc.
        • jenny tavernier
          re the ash grove, or lonely ash grove - here is a link - it is indeed welsh, and the ash grove is not the main name (or possibly the first) of the tune, and
          Message 4 of 4 , Feb 5, 2008
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            re the ash grove, or 'lonely ash grove -

            here is a link - it is indeed welsh, and the ash grove is not the main name (or possibly the first) of the tune, and indeed there are several sets of lyrics on it -

            for fun it might be worth searching the different titles -
            (there are several here)

            http://www.gurman.org/ashgrove/
            (some other lyrics and titles)

            In fact the earliest Welsh printing = is not until Jones’s Bardic Museum (1802),...

            this was entering into the google - the search terms - (and there were a lotta links on history)

            Jen

            the lonely ash grove+earliest known date





            Jeff Suzuki <jeff_suzuki@...> wrote:
            --- In SCA_BARDS@yahoogrou ps.com, Lisa Harmon <asilnomrah@ ...> wrote:
            >
            > Does anyone have a date for the melody of Ash Grove?
            > The words aren't period, but for some reason I was thinking the
            > music was late period. But one on line source dates it back only
            > to the 18th century as a minuet.

            The earliest date I've seen for the music is 1730, when it appeared
            in "The Beggar's Opera" (John Gay, I think). As this was a
            compilation musical, you could argue for a date as early as 1700,
            but I think you'd be hard pessed to push it back beyond then.

            > I've been playing with a filk with it on a theme of an event
            > that happens every year which has a competition for some time and
            > if the music isn't period enough I may just scrap it.

            I wouldn't scrap it. You might not want to enter it in an A&S
            competition, but remember: there's more to the SCA than events.

            For example, it would be perfectly appropriate at 1) post-revels, 2)
            project or practice nights, 3) SF filk rooms, 4) song therapy
            sessions, etc.

            And...I'm partial to the song, as it's not only the tune for one of
            the first SCA filks I wrote ("The Newbie Song",
            http://www.geocitie s.com/jeff_ suzuki/newbie. htm) but the tune for
            one I wrote very recently ("The SCA Parent's Lament",
            http://www.geocitie s.com/jeff_ suzuki/scagrove. htm).

            Jeffs/etc.



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