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  • fantailrubb@hotmail.com
    Hello All! Just throwing off the lurker s cloak to say Hello and ask a couple of questions. Can anyone elaborate the differances, if any, between a lute and
    Message 1 of 17 , Jun 14, 2001
      Hello All!
      Just throwing off the lurker's cloak to say 'Hello' and ask a couple
      of questions. Can anyone elaborate the differances, if any, between a
      lute and a mandolin? Also, can anyone tell me a good source for
      aquiring such instruments and pan flutes, as well?
      Thanks!
      Mark Beatty
    • sunshinegirl
      ... From: ... According to the Harvard Dictionary of music.... A lute is a plucked stringed instrument with a round body in the shape
      Message 2 of 17 , Jun 14, 2001
        ----- Original Message -----
        From: <fantailrubb@...>

        > Hello All!
        > Just throwing off the lurker's cloak to say 'Hello' and ask a couple
        > of questions. Can anyone elaborate the differances, if any, between a
        > lute and a mandolin? Also, can anyone tell me a good source for
        > aquiring such instruments and pan flutes, as well?
        > Thanks!
        > Mark Beatty
        >

        According to the Harvard Dictionary of music....

        A lute is a plucked stringed instrument with a round body in the shape of a
        halved pear, a flat neck with 7 or more frets, and a separate pegbox set
        perpendicular to the neck. The instruments of the 16th century had 11
        strings in 6 courses, tuned (in theory) G-c-f-a-d'-g' or A-d-g-b-e'-a', with
        the two lowest courses doubled, sometimes in the higher octave, and the
        three following courses doubled in the unison.
        The long necked lute dates back as far as 2000 BC. Evidence of the short
        lute dates to 800 BC. The transformation from the Arabic short lute, called
        'ud', into the European lute probably took place in Spain, shortly before
        the 15th century.

        Mandolin. The most recent instrument of the lute family and the only one
        in general use today, chiefly in southern Italy. The Neapolitan mandoin has
        four double courses (eight steel strings) tuned g d a e.

        Under the lute entry, is says the Mandolin is a diminutive form of the
        Mandola, which was used during the 16th & 17th century, but it does not give
        a specific date for the Mandolin.

        Mandolins are fairly common - Almost any decent instrument store will either
        carry them or can order them for you...
        There is a luthier in my home town who makes them - I'm not sure if he makes
        lutes, or not, but he makes bowed psaltries, as well. I have two of his
        dulcimers, one traditionally shaped, and the other a stick dulcimer that
        looks somewhat like a balalaika. The stick dulcimer has held up extremely
        well to all the SCA camping and abuse that I put it through. It also looks
        more medieval, and the contiga's sound great on it...
        If anyone is interested in contact info for him, email me privately...

        Melandra
      • Larry A Switzer
        a few quick notes on playing and purchasing lutes and mandolins... I ll keep these short and simple, as the whole thing will be too long anyway... if you want
        Message 3 of 17 , Jun 14, 2001
          a few quick notes on playing and purchasing lutes and
          mandolins... I'll keep these short and simple, as the
          whole thing will be too long anyway... if you want
          more info, email me. Also, please note that I'm
          generalizing in a number of areas.

          Lute vs. Mando:

          Mando's are (for the most part) steel stringed and
          played with a pick, strummed for chords and picked for
          melody (and effect). Lutes are nylon strung and are
          typically fingerpicked, like classical guitar.

          Most mando's look modern - metal tuners, all metal
          frets, etc. Most lutes look old - wood tuners,
          multiple fret types, etc. Even those that are new.

          There is very little lute music available. Since
          mandolin's are tuned the same as fiddles, fiddle music
          works fine plus you can play simple chords for
          accompanyment.

          Mandolin's

          Mandolins come in several froms and can range in price
          from $80 to $8000 (probably more... I just saw an $8k
          one the other day, though).

          There are other instruments in the mandolin family...
          mandola's, octive mandolins, bouzoukis, etc.

          To keep it simple there are four primary 'types' of
          mandolin, bowl back, A, F, and flat (Irish, senorita,
          etc).

          IMHO (about the types):
          F's - are right out for any 'period' music - they're
          the ones with asymmetrical bodys and the fancy
          curlycue on top. They just don't look right.

          A's - are better, they have a symmetrical body with
          soundholes cut on either side of the bridge, similar
          to a fiddle. Personally, I prefer the tone and volume
          you get from...

          Flats - I'm lumping a bunch into one group here -
          basically flat back and top with a single round
          soundhole in the center. My favorite in terms of
          playability, looks, tone, and volume. Also, probably
          the cheapest, I believe Lark in the Morning
          (www.larkinthemorning.com) has senioritas (a mexican
          version) for $80. Never heard these, but I play an
          old seniorita for a 'beater' and have always been
          pleased with it.

          And last - the bowl backs. Definatly the most period
          looking, with the rounded back. Some of these use
          nylon strings. some have wooden tuners. I personally
          find them less playable then flatbacks, I like the
          tone, but I've rarely found one that had decent
          volume.

          Again, this is my opinion, I'm generalizing, and I
          tend to play fairly lively (read: loud and fast) music
          (I save the dainty little parlour pieces for the
          classical guitar).

          I hope this helps... if you'ld like any more detail,
          I'd suggest emailing me directly and include some
          indication of your musical background. Also, if you
          let me know where you live I might be able to suggest
          a local shop. I /stongly/ urge you to try an
          instrument before you buy it... there are mando's that
          I don't like as much as my old seniorita, but cost
          many times more.

          Lothar

          --- sunshinegirl <sunshinegirl@...> wrote:
          >
          > ----- Original Message -----
          > From: <fantailrubb@...>
          >
          > > Hello All!
          > > Just throwing off the lurker's cloak to say
          > 'Hello' and ask a couple
          > > of questions. Can anyone elaborate the
          > differances, if any, between a
          > > lute and a mandolin? Also, can anyone tell me a
          > good source for
          > > aquiring such instruments and pan flutes, as well?
          > > Thanks!
          > > Mark Beatty
          > >
          >
          > According to the Harvard Dictionary of music....
          >
          > A lute is a plucked stringed instrument with a round
          > body in the shape of a
          > halved pear, a flat neck with 7 or more frets, and a
          > separate pegbox set
          > perpendicular to the neck. The instruments of the
          > 16th century had 11
          > strings in 6 courses, tuned (in theory)
          > G-c-f-a-d'-g' or A-d-g-b-e'-a', with
          > the two lowest courses doubled, sometimes in the
          > higher octave, and the
          > three following courses doubled in the unison.
          > The long necked lute dates back as far as 2000 BC.
          > Evidence of the short
          > lute dates to 800 BC. The transformation from the
          > Arabic short lute, called
          > 'ud', into the European lute probably took place in
          > Spain, shortly before
          > the 15th century.
          >
          > Mandolin. The most recent instrument of the lute
          > family and the only one
          > in general use today, chiefly in southern Italy.
          > The Neapolitan mandoin has
          > four double courses (eight steel strings) tuned g d
          > a e.
          >
          > Under the lute entry, is says the Mandolin is a
          > diminutive form of the
          > Mandola, which was used during the 16th & 17th
          > century, but it does not give
          > a specific date for the Mandolin.
          >
          > Mandolins are fairly common - Almost any decent
          > instrument store will either
          > carry them or can order them for you...
          > There is a luthier in my home town who makes them -
          > I'm not sure if he makes
          > lutes, or not, but he makes bowed psaltries, as
          > well. I have two of his
          > dulcimers, one traditionally shaped, and the other a
          > stick dulcimer that
          > looks somewhat like a balalaika. The stick dulcimer
          > has held up extremely
          > well to all the SCA camping and abuse that I put it
          > through. It also looks
          > more medieval, and the contiga's sound great on
          > it...
          > If anyone is interested in contact info for him,
          > email me privately...
          >
          > Melandra
          >
          >
          >


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        • Greg Lindahl
          ... There is a lot of lute music available -- a large number of surviving manuscripts from the late 15th and early 16th century are available in facsimile. --
          Message 4 of 17 , Jun 15, 2001
            On Thu, Jun 14, 2001 at 10:43:04PM -0700, Larry A Switzer wrote:

            > There is very little lute music available. Since
            > mandolin's are tuned the same as fiddles, fiddle music
            > works fine plus you can play simple chords for
            > accompanyment.

            There is a lot of lute music available -- a large number of
            surviving manuscripts from the late 15th and early 16th century
            are available in facsimile.

            -- Gregory Blount
          • Archibald Spendthrift
            Welcome Mark, Glad you decided to stop lurking. The other responses to your message posted before mine describe lutes and mandolins well. I d like to add that
            Message 5 of 17 , Jun 15, 2001
              Welcome Mark,

              Glad you decided to stop lurking.

              The other responses to your message posted before mine describe lutes and
              mandolins well.

              I'd like to add that there are other stringed instruments of this general
              sort that are fairly easy to find and are also period.

              I am primarily a mandolin player but since I've started to get involved in
              the SCA I've picked up a cittern. The cittern was around as early as the mid
              1500's. It was strung with 4 or 5 courses of metal strings and was often
              played with a plectrum. Since they are gaining popularity in today's celtic
              music it isn't to hard to lay your hands on a modern version. A good one
              will probably cost you a few bucks though. The one that I bought was only
              $300.00US but needed some work. I currently have mine tuned like a mandolin
              but an octave lower. I call it my "instant gratification" tuning because it
              lets me play the chords and tunes that I know from the mandolin.
              Historically there were a variety of tunings.

              If you're interested in further details please e-mail me.

              Regards,

              Archibald


              >From: fantailrubb@...
              >Reply-To: SCA_BARDS@yahoogroups.com
              >To: SCA_BARDS@yahoogroups.com
              >Subject: [SCA_BARDS] Greetings!
              >Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 02:30:23 -0000
              >
              >Hello All!
              > Just throwing off the lurker's cloak to say 'Hello' and ask a couple
              >of questions. Can anyone elaborate the differances, if any, between a
              >lute and a mandolin? Also, can anyone tell me a good source for
              >aquiring such instruments and pan flutes, as well?
              > Thanks!
              > Mark Beatty
              >

              _________________________________________________________________________
              Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com
            • Larry A Switzer
              In comparison with the amount of violin (and therefore mandolin) music? ... __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Spot the hottest
              Message 6 of 17 , Jun 17, 2001
                In comparison with the amount of violin (and therefore
                mandolin) music?

                --- Greg Lindahl <lindahl@...> wrote:
                > On Thu, Jun 14, 2001 at 10:43:04PM -0700, Larry A
                > Switzer wrote:
                >
                > > There is very little lute music available. Since
                > > mandolin's are tuned the same as fiddles, fiddle
                > music
                > > works fine plus you can play simple chords for
                > > accompanyment.
                >
                > There is a lot of lute music available -- a large
                > number of
                > surviving manuscripts from the late 15th and early
                > 16th century
                > are available in facsimile.
                >
                > -- Gregory Blount
                >


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              • Greg Lindahl
                ... There s so much lute music that I don t think anyone s played it all. There is no music specifically for the violin from that era, but there is tons of
                Message 7 of 17 , Jun 18, 2001
                  On Sun, Jun 17, 2001 at 09:50:57PM -0700, Larry A Switzer wrote:

                  > In comparison with the amount of violin (and therefore
                  > mandolin) music?

                  There's so much lute music that I don't think anyone's played it
                  all. There is no music specifically for the violin from that era, but
                  there is tons of consort/vocal music. So, given two very large amounts
                  of material to learn, what's the point of comparing, or picking one
                  over the other?

                  -- Gregory Blount
                • ananda_of_the_bells
                  Hi! I am a new member. I live in central PA, and I enjoy the bardic arts very much! Is anyone planning to attend EK coronation in April? If so, perhaps we
                  Message 8 of 17 , Jan 25, 2002
                    Hi! I am a new member. I live in central PA, and I enjoy the bardic
                    arts very much! Is anyone planning to attend EK coronation in April?
                    If so, perhaps we could meet and share songs. Bye! Ananda
                  • SilverOak
                    I am still trying to decide between coronation, and the Snowflake Ball in Albany. However, we are hosting the EK Bardic Championship here in Bridge (RI) March
                    Message 9 of 17 , Jan 25, 2002
                      I am still trying to decide between coronation, and the Snowflake Ball in Albany. However, we are hosting the EK Bardic Championship here in Bridge (RI) March 6 (or is that 9?, whichever one is a Saturday) which is another event you would most definitely enjoy.

                      ananda_of_the_bells wrote:

                       Hi! I am a new member. I live in central PA, and I enjoy the bardic
                      arts very much! Is anyone planning to attend EK coronation in April?
                      If so, perhaps we could meet and share songs. Bye! Ananda
                       


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                    • greenstein@stargate.net
                      ... Greetings, and welcome! Living where you do, I hope you will come play with your good neighbors in AEthelmearc, as well. Pittsburgh, where I live, is not
                      Message 10 of 17 , Jan 26, 2002
                        > Hi! I am a new member. I live in central PA, and I enjoy the bardic
                        > arts very much! Is anyone planning to attend EK coronation in April?
                        > If so, perhaps we could meet and share songs. Bye! Ananda

                        Greetings, and welcome! Living where you do, I hope you will come play with
                        your good neighbors in AEthelmearc, as well. Pittsburgh, where I live, is
                        not so far away and we have an active and well-rounded Barony here. There
                        is also one much closer to you, in the Johnstown area (St. Swithin's Bog).

                        You might consider coming to Ice Dragon at the beginning of March (Buffalo,
                        NY area), during which one category of the famed A&S competition will be in
                        performance.

                        Regards,
                        Mi
                      • Brad Boda d'Aylward
                        Subject: [SCA_BARDS] Greetings! ... Welcome to the Dream. The shire of Abhainn Ciach Ghlais covers north central Pa (Lycoming, Northumberland, Clinton, and
                        Message 11 of 17 , Jan 27, 2002
                          Subject: [SCA_BARDS] Greetings!


                          >Hi! I am a new member. I live in central PA, and I enjoy the bardic
                          >arts very much! Is anyone planning to attend EK coronation in April?
                          >If so, perhaps we could meet and share songs. Bye! Ananda
                          >


                          Welcome to the Dream. The shire of Abhainn Ciach Ghlais covers north central
                          Pa (Lycoming, Northumberland, Clinton, and north to the NY. border) We have
                          the St. Vitas Guild for performing arts. Within the gild we have the
                          medieval acting troupe of Cave Canum and the Middle Eastern dance troupe of
                          Night Tribe. We also have one of the premier story tellers (Both SCA and for
                          real) next door in the excellent person of Her Ladyship, Rosamunde of
                          Oxbridge.

                          This humble person is a Bardic addict. In songs I have one memorized (simple
                          laziness) but the stories and jokes will last until the Bardic circle
                          closes.

                          We have in this kingdom and the East some of the most talented performers of
                          the known world. You will find yourself welcomed with open arms, I'm sure.

                          Lord Brad
                          Seneshal, Abhainn Ciach Ghlais
                        • ananda_of_the_bells
                          HI Linnette! It s good to hear from you! I hope that you and Wulfgar are fine! I just found out that this music group existed, and I have been in contact with
                          Message 12 of 17 , Jan 31, 2002
                            HI Linnette! It's good to hear from you! I hope that you and Wulfgar
                            are fine! I just found out that this music group existed, and I have
                            been in contact with some of the people. It's been a while since I've
                            had the chance to do anything musical, and I have missed it. I know
                            that you will be busy at the event, but I hope that I do get the
                            oppourtunity to hear you sing soon! Sigh. It's hard to find time to
                            do the things that one enjoys--- somehow it seems that only
                            necessities can be covered. I hope that we can get together at some
                            point the way we did at the event last spring. Take care, and I look
                            forward to seeing you at the event! Bye! Ananda
                          • oldeways
                            Greetings all! I just wanted to take a moment to say hello, as I m new here! I ve been writing sonnets (English) for quite a few years, and have just now
                            Message 13 of 17 , Nov 17, 2002
                              Greetings all!
                              I just wanted to take a moment to say hello, as I'm new here!
                              I've been writing sonnets (English) for quite a few years, and have
                              just now decided to try to fit them into my SCA persona (1510 woman
                              of Catherine of Aragon's court who came with her from Spain).

                              If there are any sonneteers out there who wouldn't mind reading one
                              of my sonnets and give me some (constructive) criticism I would love
                              it! I've only had my partner read them, and before I put it 'out
                              there' I would like to see what an 'expert' thinks!

                              You've probably heard this many times, but I'm glad that I found you,
                              others who are (hopefully) crazy like me! And, I promise I'm not the
                              type to just ask for favors, I have a lot to add too (I have a big
                              mouth LOL)

                              Sonia
                            • Susanna Rodriguez
                              I don t know about expert but I d be happy to look them over and give feedback. Elsa ... __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!?
                              Message 14 of 17 , Nov 17, 2002
                                I don't know about "expert" but I'd be happy to look them over and give
                                feedback.

                                Elsa

                                --- oldeways <oldeways@...> wrote:
                                > Greetings all!
                                > I just wanted to take a moment to say hello, as I'm new here!
                                > I've been writing sonnets (English) for quite a few years, and have
                                > just now decided to try to fit them into my SCA persona (1510 woman
                                > of Catherine of Aragon's court who came with her from Spain).
                                >
                                > If there are any sonneteers out there who wouldn't mind reading one
                                > of my sonnets and give me some (constructive) criticism I would love
                                > it! I've only had my partner read them, and before I put it 'out
                                > there' I would like to see what an 'expert' thinks!
                                >
                                > You've probably heard this many times, but I'm glad that I found you,
                                >
                                > others who are (hopefully) crazy like me! And, I promise I'm not the
                                >
                                > type to just ask for favors, I have a lot to add too (I have a big
                                > mouth LOL)
                                >
                                > Sonia
                                >
                                >


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                              • GYPSYDANCER@prodigy.net
                                I just added 6 new people to the group. Thank you for your patience. If you have time, read up on some of the previous posts, as they are a wealth of
                                Message 15 of 17 , Apr 6, 2004
                                  I just added 6 new people to the group. Thank you for your
                                  patience. If you have time, read up on some of the previous posts,
                                  as they are a wealth of information and ideas. If you feel brave,
                                  introduce yourself. If you want to wait a while to see if we are all
                                  a bunch of nuts first, you can do that as well.
                                • bardofthesun
                                  Unto this fine companionship of bards, greetings! I just joined this group, and thought an introduction was in order. I am known as Lady Syele von der Rosen of
                                  Message 16 of 17 , Jul 10, 2005
                                    Unto this fine companionship of bards, greetings!

                                    I just joined this group, and thought an introduction was in order. I
                                    am known as Lady Syele von der Rosen of Atenveldt, and have been an
                                    unofficial bawdy bard for about the past 3 years. :) Most of my
                                    repertoire was learned around the campfires of my mercenary family,
                                    the Landsknechts. Recently I lost a bet... er, um, performed a fine
                                    period piece of music at our competition for the Atenveldt Kingdom
                                    bard, the Bard of the Sun. The rest is history. :)

                                    I look forward to meeting a great many of you at the upcoming Pennsic
                                    War!

                                    In Service to the Crown of Atenveldt,
                                    Syele
                                  • Marcus Antaya
                                    Well Syele, I will be having a bawdic circle around the campfire at pennsic. Probably later on on war week. Check information point for the bardic locator book
                                    Message 17 of 17 , Jul 10, 2005
                                      Well Syele,

                                      I will be having a bawdic circle around the campfire
                                      at pennsic. Probably later on on war week. Check
                                      information point for the bardic locator book to find
                                      out when.

                                      Hope to see you there...

                                      Gyric


                                      Lord Gyric of Otershaghe
                                      Troubadour, Entertainer and generally all-around nice guy

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