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Pennsic Siege

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  • Diane K. Hauer
    Greetings from Lady Svanhildr Karlsdottir (the new) Siege Weapon MIC for Pennsic 35. Over the past week, the siege community has seen quite a shake up. I know
    Message 1 of 15 , Aug 1, 2006
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      Greetings from Lady Svanhildr Karlsdottir (the new) Siege Weapon MIC for Pennsic 35.

      Over the past week, the siege community has seen quite a shake up. I know many people have strong feelings on all sides. As you read this letter I ask you to remember that I do not ask you to forget your thoughts or convictions. I do ask that you put them aside while on the field this Pennsic. Remember that there are three stories to all problems. The story of the wronged, the story of the one doing the wrong… and then, the story of what actually happened. Also remember that most people’s knowledge is at best second hand but more often than not third or forth hand. Information breaks down very quickly once you step away from the source. Please think about this when/if you discuss matters with anyone.

      Please know in advance that I will not discuss this topic with anyone who is not directly involved. Graywolf, Quinn, Pennsic Staff, and Kingdom officers if required; are currently the only people I will discuss matters with at this time. This has nothing to do with a Gag order. It has everything to do with what is right. Simple as that.

      I also ask that no one boycott Siege simply because they too were hurt by someone’s actions. To do that would only injure Siege at Pennsic, not the parties you may wish to attract the attention of. We are all adults and can put aside our negative feelings to make siege work. That is our goal.

      With the goal of moving Siege forward this year, Graywolf has set up many activities. Some may not go according to the original plan, but I and those who have offered their assistance to Siege are working to see that things go as smoothly as possible and that we keep as many (if not all) activities. In order to do this, Siege needs help.

      You may have noticed that I mentioned that “Siege needs help”, not that “The East needs help”. Pennsic may be hosted by the Middle or Eastern Kingdoms from year to year but the staff is made up from people all over the Knowne World. Attendants come from all over the world. Also, many kingdoms require their marshals to assist at least once during some Marshal activity at Pennsic in order to keep their Marshal status. This is true of the East. I can only ask this of Eastern Siege marshals, but I will also urge those from other kingdoms to please come out and either help with Engine inspections, Inspecting ammo, or to Marshal a battle. For those in the East if you will be at Pennsic and can not help out during any of those activities please let me know.

      In the past there have been times when no more than one Siege Marshal was on the Field. We (Pennsic) came very close to having to cancel Siege for that day. Luckily another was found and asked if they would not fight that battle so that Siege could happen. I would hate to see this happen ever again.

      Some people have asked questions about Authorizations for Siege at Pennsic. I have spoken with half the people I need to in order to obtain a clear answer. As always I advise everyone to authorize before Pennsic. As soon as I get answers I will pass them on.

      Pennsic has had many rules in place for many years. The Heavy List fighters are expected to adhere to them. Siege is also expected to equally adhere to those rules. Siege can not be an exception. I am working everyday to see that this happens and that we can still have a safe and fun Pennsic.

      The Pennsic Siege Schedule, as far as I know, is as posted on the Pennsic Website. As for marshalling the battles at Pennsic, please show up to the Marshals Tent 45 minutes prior to the battle start time. There are always Marshal Meetings about 30 minutes prior and its good to not be looking for staff at that time. There is also a Marshals court immediately following all battles. The court takes place at the Marshal tent. So if you had problems on the field during the battle you will need to meet up there at the end. Please first notify me of any issues.

      Ammo inspections will happen first thing in the mornings as well is immediately after Marshals Court. Marshals Courts do not often take very long. If there are Siege Marshals available who did not have issues on the field then ammo inspections may start sooner. The plan is to get all ammo inspected after the battle and that will leave the morning for ammo that was constructed or repaired the night before.

      Please note that inspection times for both Engines and Ammo are set firm. Late comers will not be allowed to get inspected. So be early rather than late. If you can not make the Engine inspections notify me so arrangements can be made.

      While engines are being inspected you will also be notified as to how you will be marshaled while on the field. The marshals will also be notified as to how they are expected to marshal. This will hopefully cut down on surprises during battles and inconsistent Marshaling practices. Im not going to make everyone do things the Eastern Way. We will, however have a more clear perspective of a Pennsic Way. Quinn is helping me with this.

      Remember that just as you would have to Graywolf, See me at Pennsic if you have any questions, problems, or even good news. If the information needs to go to the next level in the Chain of Command I will see that it happens.

      I will have my Cell on me... unless it is being Charged.

      518-229-6181

      Lady Svanhildr Karlsdottir (Svan)
    • graywolf
      Svan speaks well here. She has my full support. As she noted, Siege is more important than any ONE of us. This year we have intensified our efforts to
      Message 2 of 15 , Aug 1, 2006
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        Svan speaks well here. She has my full support.

        As she noted, Siege is more important than any ONE of us. This year we have
        intensified our efforts to interact with CA. Support them as well. Your
        cooperation and assistance in sustaining and advancing the program will best
        present ALL of us.

        Graywolf (SGEK)


        ----- Original Message -----
        From: "Diane K. Hauer" <dkhauer@...>
        To: <sca-siege@yahoogroups.com>; <ek-siege@yahoogroups.com>
        Sent: Tuesday, August 01, 2006 12:14 PM
        Subject: [SCA-Siege] Pennsic Siege


        Greetings from Lady Svanhildr Karlsdottir (the new) Siege Weapon MIC for
        Pennsic 35.

        Over the past week, the siege community has seen quite a shake up. I know
        many people have strong feelings on all sides. As you read this letter I ask
        you to remember that I do not ask you to forget your thoughts or
        convictions. I do ask that you put them aside while on the field this
        Pennsic. Remember that there are three stories to all problems. The story of
        the wronged, the story of the one doing the wrong… and then, the story of
        what actually happened. Also remember that most people’s knowledge is at
        best second hand but more often than not third or forth hand. Information
        breaks down very quickly once you step away from the source. Please think
        about this when/if you discuss matters with anyone.

        Please know in advance that I will not discuss this topic with anyone who is
        not directly involved. Graywolf, Quinn, Pennsic Staff, and Kingdom officers
        if required; are currently the only people I will discuss matters with at
        this time. This has nothing to do with a Gag order. It has everything to do
        with what is right. Simple as that.

        I also ask that no one boycott Siege simply because they too were hurt by
        someone’s actions. To do that would only injure Siege at Pennsic, not the
        parties you may wish to attract the attention of. We are all adults and can
        put aside our negative feelings to make siege work. That is our goal.

        With the goal of moving Siege forward this year, Graywolf has set up many
        activities. Some may not go according to the original plan, but I and those
        who have offered their assistance to Siege are working to see that things go
        as smoothly as possible and that we keep as many (if not all) activities. In
        order to do this, Siege needs help.

        You may have noticed that I mentioned that “Siege needs help”, not that “The
        East needs help”. Pennsic may be hosted by the Middle or Eastern Kingdoms
        from year to year but the staff is made up from people all over the Knowne
        World. Attendants come from all over the world. Also, many kingdoms require
        their marshals to assist at least once during some Marshal activity at
        Pennsic in order to keep their Marshal status. This is true of the East. I
        can only ask this of Eastern Siege marshals, but I will also urge those from
        other kingdoms to please come out and either help with Engine inspections,
        Inspecting ammo, or to Marshal a battle. For those in the East if you will
        be at Pennsic and can not help out during any of those activities please let
        me know.

        In the past there have been times when no more than one Siege Marshal was on
        the Field. We (Pennsic) came very close to having to cancel Siege for that
        day. Luckily another was found and asked if they would not fight that battle
        so that Siege could happen. I would hate to see this happen ever again.

        Some people have asked questions about Authorizations for Siege at Pennsic.
        I have spoken with half the people I need to in order to obtain a clear
        answer. As always I advise everyone to authorize before Pennsic. As soon as
        I get answers I will pass them on.

        Pennsic has had many rules in place for many years. The Heavy List fighters
        are expected to adhere to them. Siege is also expected to equally adhere to
        those rules. Siege can not be an exception. I am working everyday to see
        that this happens and that we can still have a safe and fun Pennsic.

        The Pennsic Siege Schedule, as far as I know, is as posted on the Pennsic
        Website. As for marshalling the battles at Pennsic, please show up to the
        Marshals Tent 45 minutes prior to the battle start time. There are always
        Marshal Meetings about 30 minutes prior and its good to not be looking for
        staff at that time. There is also a Marshals court immediately following all
        battles. The court takes place at the Marshal tent. So if you had problems
        on the field during the battle you will need to meet up there at the end.
        Please first notify me of any issues.

        Ammo inspections will happen first thing in the mornings as well is
        immediately after Marshals Court. Marshals Courts do not often take very
        long. If there are Siege Marshals available who did not have issues on the
        field then ammo inspections may start sooner. The plan is to get all ammo
        inspected after the battle and that will leave the morning for ammo that was
        constructed or repaired the night before.

        Please note that inspection times for both Engines and Ammo are set firm.
        Late comers will not be allowed to get inspected. So be early rather than
        late. If you can not make the Engine inspections notify me so arrangements
        can be made.

        While engines are being inspected you will also be notified as to how you
        will be marshaled while on the field. The marshals will also be notified as
        to how they are expected to marshal. This will hopefully cut down on
        surprises during battles and inconsistent Marshaling practices. Im not going
        to make everyone do things the Eastern Way. We will, however have a more
        clear perspective of a Pennsic Way. Quinn is helping me with this.

        Remember that just as you would have to Graywolf, See me at Pennsic if you
        have any questions, problems, or even good news. If the information needs to
        go to the next level in the Chain of Command I will see that it happens.

        I will have my Cell on me... unless it is being Charged.

        518-229-6181

        Lady Svanhildr Karlsdottir (Svan)




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      • Brian Lapham
        While I can understand your need to quell rumors and keep the peace, would it be possible to at some point in the near future when all the issues are settled
        Message 3 of 15 , Aug 1, 2006
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          While I can understand your need to quell rumors and keep the peace, would
          it be possible to at some point in the near future when all the issues are
          settled to let the rest of us know what has happened? It sounds serious and
          the "non-gag" only perpetuates things and heightens anxiety. Besides, we
          have our little issues out here in the west as well and anything we can
          learn from others peoples issues can help to smooth things over for everyone
          or even elliminate them before they happen.

          Doughal Stewart



          "The surest way to kill a hobby
          is to try to make money at it!" -Red Green

          Fowl Farms Mobile Mini's Petting Farm at:
          www.fowlfarms.net ph#602-251-FOWL (3695)
          Catapults at:
          Mangonel.com/manuscript/
          trebuchet.com/registry/show.php/124
          http://www.thehurl.org/tiki-browse_gallery.php?galleryId=13





          >From: "Diane K. Hauer" <dkhauer@...>
          >Reply-To: SCA-Siege@yahoogroups.com
          >To: sca-siege@yahoogroups.com, ek-siege@yahoogroups.com
          >Subject: [SCA-Siege] Pennsic Siege
          >Date: Tue, 1 Aug 2006 09:14:48 -0700 (PDT)
          >
          >Greetings from Lady Svanhildr Karlsdottir (the new) Siege Weapon MIC for
          >Pennsic 35.
          >
          >Over the past week, the siege community has seen quite a shake up. I know
          >many people have strong feelings on all sides. As you read this letter I
          >ask you to remember that I do not ask you to forget your thoughts or
          >convictions. I do ask that you put them aside while on the field this
          >Pennsic. Remember that there are three stories to all problems. The story
          >of the wronged, the story of the one doing the wrong��� and then, the story
          >of what actually happened. Also
        • Jeffrey Blaisdell
          For the record, I am not a marshal, but hope to be one someday... The part below about the East requiring marshals at Pennsic to marshal at least once has me
          Message 4 of 15 , Aug 1, 2006
          • 0 Attachment
            For the record, I am not a marshal, but hope to be one someday...

            The part below about the East requiring marshals at Pennsic to marshal at least once has me wondering- where is this written/posted? I cannot find it on Corpora, EK Law or the Earl Marshal's page and links. Should I persue a marshallate, I just want to know what I'm getting in to.

            If anyone wishes to discuss things (or help enlighten me!), by all means feel free to contact me off-list.

            Geoffrey of Blesedale

            ----- Original Message -----
            From: Diane K. Hauer
            To: sca-siege@yahoogroups.com ; ek-siege@yahoogroups.com
            Sent: Tuesday, August 01, 2006 12:14 PM
            Subject: [SCA-Siege] Pennsic Siege


            Greetings from Lady Svanhildr Karlsdottir (the new) Siege Weapon MIC for Pennsic 35.

            Over the past week, the siege community has seen quite a shake up. I know many people have strong feelings on all sides. As you read this letter I ask you to remember that I do not ask you to forget your thoughts or convictions. I do ask that you put them aside while on the field this Pennsic. Remember that there are three stories to all problems. The story of the wronged, the story of the one doing the wrong… and then, the story of what actually happened. Also remember that most people’s knowledge is at best second hand but more often than not third or forth hand. Information breaks down very quickly once you step away from the source. Please think about this when/if you discuss matters with anyone.

            Please know in advance that I will not discuss this topic with anyone who is not directly involved. Graywolf, Quinn, Pennsic Staff, and Kingdom officers if required; are currently the only people I will discuss matters with at this time. This has nothing to do with a Gag order. It has everything to do with what is right. Simple as that.

            I also ask that no one boycott Siege simply because they too were hurt by someone’s actions. To do that would only injure Siege at Pennsic, not the parties you may wish to attract the attention of. We are all adults and can put aside our negative feelings to make siege work. That is our goal.

            With the goal of moving Siege forward this year, Graywolf has set up many activities. Some may not go according to the original plan, but I and those who have offered their assistance to Siege are working to see that things go as smoothly as possible and that we keep as many (if not all) activities. In order to do this, Siege needs help.

            You may have noticed that I mentioned that “Siege needs help”, not that “The East needs help”. Pennsic may be hosted by the Middle or Eastern Kingdoms from year to year but the staff is made up from people all over the Knowne World. Attendants come from all over the world. Also, many kingdoms require their marshals to assist at least once during some Marshal activity at Pennsic in order to keep their Marshal status. This is true of the East. I can only ask this of Eastern Siege marshals, but I will also urge those from other kingdoms to please come out and either help with Engine inspections, Inspecting ammo, or to Marshal a battle. For those in the East if you will be at Pennsic and can not help out during any of those activities please let me know.

            In the past there have been times when no more than one Siege Marshal was on the Field. We (Pennsic) came very close to having to cancel Siege for that day. Luckily another was found and asked if they would not fight that battle so that Siege could happen. I would hate to see this happen ever again.

            Some people have asked questions about Authorizations for Siege at Pennsic. I have spoken with half the people I need to in order to obtain a clear answer. As always I advise everyone to authorize before Pennsic. As soon as I get answers I will pass them on.

            Pennsic has had many rules in place for many years. The Heavy List fighters are expected to adhere to them. Siege is also expected to equally adhere to those rules. Siege can not be an exception. I am working everyday to see that this happens and that we can still have a safe and fun Pennsic.

            The Pennsic Siege Schedule, as far as I know, is as posted on the Pennsic Website. As for marshalling the battles at Pennsic, please show up to the Marshals Tent 45 minutes prior to the battle start time. There are always Marshal Meetings about 30 minutes prior and its good to not be looking for staff at that time. There is also a Marshals court immediately following all battles. The court takes place at the Marshal tent. So if you had problems on the field during the battle you will need to meet up there at the end. Please first notify me of any issues.

            Ammo inspections will happen first thing in the mornings as well is immediately after Marshals Court. Marshals Courts do not often take very long. If there are Siege Marshals available who did not have issues on the field then ammo inspections may start sooner. The plan is to get all ammo inspected after the battle and that will leave the morning for ammo that was constructed or repaired the night before.

            Please note that inspection times for both Engines and Ammo are set firm. Late comers will not be allowed to get inspected. So be early rather than late. If you can not make the Engine inspections notify me so arrangements can be made.

            While engines are being inspected you will also be notified as to how you will be marshaled while on the field. The marshals will also be notified as to how they are expected to marshal. This will hopefully cut down on surprises during battles and inconsistent Marshaling practices. Im not going to make everyone do things the Eastern Way. We will, however have a more clear perspective of a Pennsic Way. Quinn is helping me with this.

            Remember that just as you would have to Graywolf, See me at Pennsic if you have any questions, problems, or even good news. If the information needs to go to the next level in the Chain of Command I will see that it happens.

            I will have my Cell on me... unless it is being Charged.

            518-229-6181

            Lady Svanhildr Karlsdottir (Svan)





            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • tatiana@atlantic.net
            Please put that information on this list! I too am working on becoming a Deputy Siege Marshall for Trimaris and want to know what is expected of me as well.
            Message 5 of 15 , Aug 1, 2006
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              Please put that information on this list! I too am working on becoming a Deputy
              Siege Marshall for Trimaris and want to know what is expected of me as well.

              Thank you,
              HL Tatiana Heinemann
              Trimaris

              Quoting Jeffrey Blaisdell <jdb967@...>:

              > For the record, I am not a marshal, but hope to be one someday...
              >
              > The part below about the East requiring marshals at Pennsic to marshal at
              > least once has me wondering- where is this written/posted? I cannot find it
              > on Corpora, EK Law or the Earl Marshal's page and links. Should I persue a
              > marshallate, I just want to know what I'm getting in to.
              >
              > If anyone wishes to discuss things (or help enlighten me!), by all means feel
              > free to contact me off-list.
              >
              > Geoffrey of Blesedale
              >
              > ----- Original Message -----
              > From: Diane K. Hauer
              > To: sca-siege@yahoogroups.com ; ek-siege@yahoogroups.com
              > Sent: Tuesday, August 01, 2006 12:14 PM
              > Subject: [SCA-Siege] Pennsic Siege
              >
              >
              > Greetings from Lady Svanhildr Karlsdottir (the new) Siege Weapon MIC for
              > Pennsic 35.
              >
              > Over the past week, the siege community has seen quite a shake up. I know
              > many people have strong feelings on all sides. As you read this letter I ask
              > you to remember that I do not ask you to forget your thoughts or convictions.
              > I do ask that you put them aside while on the field this Pennsic. Remember
              > that there are three stories to all problems. The story of the wronged, the
              > story of the one doing the wrong… and then, the story of what actually
              > happened. Also remember that most people’s knowledge is at best second hand
              > but more often than not third or forth hand. Information breaks down very
              > quickly once you step away from the source. Please think about this when/if
              > you discuss matters with anyone.
              >
              > Please know in advance that I will not discuss this topic with anyone who
              > is not directly involved. Graywolf, Quinn, Pennsic Staff, and Kingdom
              > officers if required; are currently the only people I will discuss matters
              > with at this time. This has nothing to do with a Gag order. It has everything
              > to do with what is right. Simple as that.
              >
              > I also ask that no one boycott Siege simply because they too were hurt by
              > someone’s actions. To do that would only injure Siege at Pennsic, not the
              > parties you may wish to attract the attention of. We are all adults and can
              > put aside our negative feelings to make siege work. That is our goal.
              >
              > With the goal of moving Siege forward this year, Graywolf has set up many
              > activities. Some may not go according to the original plan, but I and those
              > who have offered their assistance to Siege are working to see that things go
              > as smoothly as possible and that we keep as many (if not all) activities. In
              > order to do this, Siege needs help.
              >
              > You may have noticed that I mentioned that “Siege needs help”, not that
              > “The East needs help”. Pennsic may be hosted by the Middle or Eastern
              > Kingdoms from year to year but the staff is made up from people all over the
              > Knowne World. Attendants come from all over the world. Also, many kingdoms
              > require their marshals to assist at least once during some Marshal activity
              > at Pennsic in order to keep their Marshal status. This is true of the East. I
              > can only ask this of Eastern Siege marshals, but I will also urge those from
              > other kingdoms to please come out and either help with Engine inspections,
              > Inspecting ammo, or to Marshal a battle. For those in the East if you will be
              > at Pennsic and can not help out during any of those activities please let me
              > know.
              >
              > In the past there have been times when no more than one Siege Marshal was
              > on the Field. We (Pennsic) came very close to having to cancel Siege for that
              > day. Luckily another was found and asked if they would not fight that battle
              > so that Siege could happen. I would hate to see this happen ever again.
              >
              > Some people have asked questions about Authorizations for Siege at Pennsic.
              > I have spoken with half the people I need to in order to obtain a clear
              > answer. As always I advise everyone to authorize before Pennsic. As soon as I
              > get answers I will pass them on.
              >
              > Pennsic has had many rules in place for many years. The Heavy List fighters
              > are expected to adhere to them. Siege is also expected to equally adhere to
              > those rules. Siege can not be an exception. I am working everyday to see that
              > this happens and that we can still have a safe and fun Pennsic.
              >
              > The Pennsic Siege Schedule, as far as I know, is as posted on the Pennsic
              > Website. As for marshalling the battles at Pennsic, please show up to the
              > Marshals Tent 45 minutes prior to the battle start time. There are always
              > Marshal Meetings about 30 minutes prior and its good to not be looking for
              > staff at that time. There is also a Marshals court immediately following all
              > battles. The court takes place at the Marshal tent. So if you had problems on
              > the field during the battle you will need to meet up there at the end. Please
              > first notify me of any issues.
              >
              > Ammo inspections will happen first thing in the mornings as well is
              > immediately after Marshals Court. Marshals Courts do not often take very
              > long. If there are Siege Marshals available who did not have issues on the
              > field then ammo inspections may start sooner. The plan is to get all ammo
              > inspected after the battle and that will leave the morning for ammo that was
              > constructed or repaired the night before.
              >
              > Please note that inspection times for both Engines and Ammo are set firm.
              > Late comers will not be allowed to get inspected. So be early rather than
              > late. If you can not make the Engine inspections notify me so arrangements
              > can be made.
              >
              > While engines are being inspected you will also be notified as to how you
              > will be marshaled while on the field. The marshals will also be notified as
              > to how they are expected to marshal. This will hopefully cut down on
              > surprises during battles and inconsistent Marshaling practices. Im not going
              > to make everyone do things the Eastern Way. We will, however have a more
              > clear perspective of a Pennsic Way. Quinn is helping me with this.
              >
              > Remember that just as you would have to Graywolf, See me at Pennsic if you
              > have any questions, problems, or even good news. If the information needs to
              > go to the next level in the Chain of Command I will see that it happens.
              >
              > I will have my Cell on me... unless it is being Charged.
              >
              > 518-229-6181
              >
              > Lady Svanhildr Karlsdottir (Svan)
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >
              >




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            • Siegfried
              ... This, IMO, is one of those long standing unwritten rules that everyone thinks is a rule ... Until someone proves me different. When I started in the SCA,
              Message 6 of 15 , Aug 1, 2006
              • 0 Attachment
                > The part below about the East requiring marshals at Pennsic to marshal at least once has me wondering- where is this written/posted? I cannot find it on Corpora, EK Law or the Earl Marshal's page and links. Should I persue a marshallate, I just want to know what I'm getting in to.

                This, IMO, is one of those 'long standing unwritten rules that
                everyone thinks is a rule' ... Until someone proves me different.

                When I started in the SCA, in AEthelmearc (as a principality) *mumble*
                years ago, I was told: Don't ever become a marshal since you will
                have to give up one of your days of fighting at Pennsic! (By the
                other die-hard fighters).

                Yet, being a rules-weinie, I tried to look it up, and couldn't find
                it. I've never found it, but it is repeated often, in fact, the
                statement in Atlantia is: "Don't worry about becoming a marshal,
                while it's good to help out, since we aren't East/Mid they can't MAKE
                you give up a day of fighting."

                I have a feeling that this was PROBABLY, (like most rules that fall
                into this category), a rule at one specific Pennsic, or a mandate by
                one specific Earl Marshal of the East, one year.

                Those would have lasted the 1 Pennsic, and then dissapeared. But
                people would remember them.

                There are many other rules like that. That were once a rule, now
                aren't, but everything thinks they are, such as:
                * Only 1 hand can be used on a shield.
                * Only 1 shield per person
                * No flexible edges on shields
                * No rubber axe heads on polearms
                * All 2-handed weapon swings must start from a vertical position.

                And so on.

                Siegfried

                --
                _________________________________________________________________________
                THL Siegfried Sebastian Faust - http://crossbows.biz/
                Barony of Highland Foorde - Baronial Archery Marshal
                Kingdom of Atlantia - Deputy Kingdom Earl Marshal for Target Archery
                http://eliw.com/ - http://archery.atlantia.sca.org/
              • WBFOUNTAIN@aol.com
                In a message dated 8/1/2006 8:34:56 PM Central Daylight Time, jdb967@earthlink.net writes: For the record, I am not a marshal, but hope to be one someday...
                Message 7 of 15 , Aug 2, 2006
                • 0 Attachment
                  In a message dated 8/1/2006 8:34:56 PM Central Daylight Time,
                  jdb967@... writes:

                  For the record, I am not a marshal, but hope to be one someday...

                  The part below about the East requiring marshals at Pennsic to marshal at
                  least once has me wondering- where is this written/posted? I cannot find it on
                  Corpora, EK Law or the Earl Marshal's page and links. Should I persue a
                  marshallate, I just want to know what I'm getting in to.

                  If anyone wishes to discuss things (or help enlighten me!), by all means
                  feel free to contact me off-list.

                  Geoffrey of Blesedale


                  There is a kingdom policy based on a directive by the Earl Marshal of the
                  Middle Kingdom that all marshals frm the middle participate in marshal
                  activities at pennsic - if they go to war. I imagine that there prob is a similar
                  policy over in the East.
                  Brun


                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • iheronimus@comcast.net
                  Hi Brun, You are correct, this has been the case historically in the East as well. Early EK Siege rules & regs were adapted from the EK Archery rules & regs,
                  Message 8 of 15 , Aug 2, 2006
                  • 0 Attachment
                    Hi Brun,

                    You are correct, this has been the case historically in the East as well. Early EK Siege rules & regs were adapted from the EK Archery rules & regs, and may of the conventions were brought along with them. We all work for the Earl Marshal after all...

                    8)

                    M. Iheronimus


                    -------------- Original message ----------------------
                    From: WBFOUNTAIN@...
                    >
                    > In a message dated 8/1/2006 8:34:56 PM Central Daylight Time,
                    > jdb967@... writes:
                    >
                    > For the record, I am not a marshal, but hope to be one someday...
                    >
                    > The part below about the East requiring marshals at Pennsic to marshal at
                    > least once has me wondering- where is this written/posted? I cannot find it on
                    > Corpora, EK Law or the Earl Marshal's page and links. Should I persue a
                    > marshallate, I just want to know what I'm getting in to.
                    >
                    > If anyone wishes to discuss things (or help enlighten me!), by all means
                    > feel free to contact me off-list.
                    >
                    > Geoffrey of Blesedale
                    >
                    >
                    > There is a kingdom policy based on a directive by the Earl Marshal of the
                    > Middle Kingdom that all marshals frm the middle participate in marshal
                    > activities at pennsic - if they go to war. I imagine that there prob is a
                    > similar
                    > policy over in the East.
                    > Brun
                    >
                    >
                    > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    >





                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • WBFOUNTAIN@aol.com
                    In a message dated 8/1/2006 11:24:40 AM Central Daylight Time, dkhauer@yahoo.com writes: Greetings from Lady Svanhildr Karlsdottir (the new) Siege Weapon MIC
                    Message 9 of 15 , Aug 2, 2006
                    • 0 Attachment
                      In a message dated 8/1/2006 11:24:40 AM Central Daylight Time,
                      dkhauer@... writes:

                      Greetings from Lady Svanhildr Karlsdottir (the new) Siege Weapon MIC for
                      Pennsic 35.


                      Please help her out - I know that every bit of help will be appreciated - I
                      will probably not be able to attend pennsic this year and am greatly sorry
                      that I wont be able to throw in my assistance, but mundane life threatens to
                      prevent my attendance.

                      PLEASE HELP OUT - Even if it seems trivial to you - it is needed.

                      Ways you can help even if you are not a marshal.

                      1) keep the inspection area tidy
                      2) help glean ammo and trash from the fighting area.
                      3) Play gofer for the folks stuck at point.
                      4) keep the marshals hydrated & remind them of sunscreen (esp when
                      inspecting)
                      5) Ice & sandwiches make long stays for inspection more bearable.
                      6) When it rains hold a beach umbrella over the inspectors.
                      7) Tell jokes when the inspectors get stressed.
                      8) A dry towel is real nice when an inspector is soaked to the skin.
                      (remember the rain during inspections last year?)
                      9) Help out with other machines that are not working right so that the
                      inspections dont go on forever. (TOOLS ARE GOOD)

                      You can probably get my drift - do anything possible to make their day more
                      enjoyable - they are volunteers giving up thier time to make sure that you can
                      play. They dont do it for fun they do it as a service to better the
                      society. So if you can help out too - this will lighten their load and even if they
                      dont have the time or energy to thank you - know thagt it is appreciated.

                      Sgt Brun Canutesson (MIC for seige, CA & Inspections - Pennsic 34)


                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    • WBFOUNTAIN@aol.com
                      In a message dated 8/2/2006 1:36:00 PM Central Daylight Time, iheronimus@comcast.net writes: Hi Brun, You are correct, this has been the case historically in
                      Message 10 of 15 , Aug 2, 2006
                      • 0 Attachment
                        In a message dated 8/2/2006 1:36:00 PM Central Daylight Time,
                        iheronimus@... writes:

                        Hi Brun,

                        You are correct, this has been the case historically in the East as well.
                        Early EK Siege rules & regs were adapted from the EK Archery rules & regs, and
                        may of the conventions were brought along with them. We all work for the Earl
                        Marshal after all...

                        8)

                        M. Iheronimus



                        Everyone should remember that many hands make light work. If every marshal
                        helps then no one has to give up every battle. But lately help marshalling
                        has gotten rather sparse. Evryone is more interested in fighting than helping
                        out. I know that last year I was the only one that marshalled at Pennsic
                        from my entire region (The region covers an entire state).
                        Sgt Brun Canutesson


                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      • graywolf
                        Okay Folks, Here s the View from the Top of the Siege Tower. I m gonna keep this Plain and Simple. As for Siege in EK, there is no Written Law that
                        Message 11 of 15 , Aug 2, 2006
                        • 0 Attachment
                          Okay Folks,

                          Here's the "View from the Top of the Siege Tower."

                          I'm gonna keep this Plain and Simple.

                          As for Siege in EK, there is no "Written Law" that requires Siege Marshals
                          have to Marshal at Pennsic.

                          On the Other Hand, many of us voluntarily Marshal more often than we Play
                          just out of devotion to our Program. This shows at All Events not just
                          Pennsic. Smaller events need less Marshals but, events the size and style
                          of Pennsic require a lot of effort. It is an Honor to be Warranted as a
                          Siege Marshal in East Kingdom. This is not given lightly. It shows that
                          the Marshal has Knowledge, Willingness, and Wherewithal to maintain and
                          teach both Safety and Skills in our Program. At Pennsic where there are
                          many opportunities to both Play and take time to Assist, it is sorely hoped
                          that Siege Marshals from the EK would return the Honor by volunteering their
                          assistance to some portion of the activity. NO ONE is asked nor demanded to
                          Not Play. That's what most of us go for. The more our Chosen
                          Burden/Honorific Duties are dispersed the easier it is for all of us.

                          I can not nor will not foist this attitude on any other Kingdom or Marshal
                          Group but, at least let's show the others we are dedicated to the Program.
                          I am loathe to write in a requirement in the Rules for something that I feel
                          should be considered a courtesy.

                          Graywolf the Gonner (SGEK)

                          Those who Lead must Serve Most!


                          ----- Original Message -----
                          From: <WBFOUNTAIN@...>
                          To: <SCA-Siege@yahoogroups.com>
                          Sent: Wednesday, August 02, 2006 2:22 PM
                          Subject: Re: [SCA-Siege] Pennsic Siege


                          >
                          > In a message dated 8/1/2006 8:34:56 PM Central Daylight Time,
                          > jdb967@... writes:
                          >
                          > For the record, I am not a marshal, but hope to be one someday...
                          >
                          > The part below about the East requiring marshals at Pennsic to marshal at
                          > least once has me wondering- where is this written/posted? I cannot find
                          it on
                          > Corpora, EK Law or the Earl Marshal's page and links. Should I persue a
                          > marshallate, I just want to know what I'm getting in to.
                          >
                          > If anyone wishes to discuss things (or help enlighten me!), by all means
                          > feel free to contact me off-list.
                          >
                          > Geoffrey of Blesedale
                          >
                          >
                          > There is a kingdom policy based on a directive by the Earl Marshal of the
                          > Middle Kingdom that all marshals frm the middle participate in marshal
                          > activities at pennsic - if they go to war. I imagine that there prob is a
                          similar
                          > policy over in the East.
                          > Brun
                          >
                          >
                          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > --
                          > [Email to SCA-Siege-unsubscribe@egroups.com to leave this list]
                          > Yahoo! Groups Links
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                        • Siegfried
                          ... I wholeheartedly agree with Brun s statement. Everyone should go help out. Of course, also realize that some people have multiple commitments and have
                          Message 12 of 15 , Aug 2, 2006
                          • 0 Attachment
                            > Everyone should remember that many hands make light work. If every marshal
                            > helps then no one has to give up every battle. But lately help marshalling
                            > has gotten rather sparse. Evryone is more interested in fighting than helping
                            > out. I know that last year I was the only one that marshalled at Pennsic
                            > from my entire region (The region covers an entire state).

                            I wholeheartedly agree with Brun's statement. Everyone should go help out.

                            Of course, also realize that some people have multiple commitments and
                            have spent alot of time helping (over there), instead of (here).

                            But also, I wanted to address the 'lack of marshal' situation. I
                            personally have a theory, based upon my experience of starting in the
                            SCA in AEthlemearc, while it was a principality, and fully under the
                            'You MUST marshal at Pennsic' command structure. Versus when I moved
                            to Atlantia.

                            Under the 'MUST marshal', less people become marshals. In fact, I
                            remember being told when I started by some of the more involved heavy
                            fighters: "Not to become a marshal since it means you have to give up
                            your time at Pennsic & other events."

                            People will specifically NOT become a marshal, because of an implied
                            requirement. Even if it is something that they would be happy to
                            volunteer for normally, the idea of 'YOU MUST' drives people away.

                            In Atlantia, there are no requirements (in that sense) of marshals.
                            Therefore, we have more of them! In archery we have about a 50%
                            marshal to archer ratio. In heavy combat we seem to have many more
                            than other Kingdoms. Everyone who becomes a semi-decent
                            archer/fighter/etc is just expected via peer pressure to become a
                            marshal, so that they CAN help out. Not so that they MUST help out.

                            So, having more people now marshals, there is a greater chance that a
                            few more will decide to donate some time. And suddenly you have lots
                            of marshals running around. When you dictated in the first place,
                            then people don't even become marshals.

                            Siegfried


                            --
                            _________________________________________________________________________
                            THL Siegfried Sebastian Faust - http://crossbows.biz/
                            Barony of Highland Foorde - Baronial Archery Marshal
                            Kingdom of Atlantia - Deputy Kingdom Earl Marshal for Target Archery
                            http://eliw.com/ - http://archery.atlantia.sca.org/
                          • graywolf
                            I Second that! Graywolf P.S. Your and Iherionums posts came in while I was composing mine. ... From: To:
                            Message 13 of 15 , Aug 2, 2006
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                              I Second that!

                              Graywolf

                              P.S. Your and Iherionums' posts came in while I was composing mine.
                              ----- Original Message -----
                              From: <WBFOUNTAIN@...>
                              To: <SCA-Siege@yahoogroups.com>
                              Sent: Wednesday, August 02, 2006 2:40 PM
                              Subject: Re: [SCA-Siege] Pennsic Siege


                              >
                              > In a message dated 8/1/2006 11:24:40 AM Central Daylight Time,
                              > dkhauer@... writes:
                              >
                              > Greetings from Lady Svanhildr Karlsdottir (the new) Siege Weapon MIC for
                              > Pennsic 35.
                              >
                              >
                              > Please help her out - I know that every bit of help will be appreciated -
                              I
                              > will probably not be able to attend pennsic this year and am greatly sorry
                              > that I wont be able to throw in my assistance, but mundane life threatens
                              to
                              > prevent my attendance.
                              >
                              > PLEASE HELP OUT - Even if it seems trivial to you - it is needed.
                              >
                              > Ways you can help even if you are not a marshal.
                              >
                              > 1) keep the inspection area tidy
                              > 2) help glean ammo and trash from the fighting area.
                              > 3) Play gofer for the folks stuck at point.
                              > 4) keep the marshals hydrated & remind them of sunscreen (esp when
                              > inspecting)
                              > 5) Ice & sandwiches make long stays for inspection more bearable.
                              > 6) When it rains hold a beach umbrella over the inspectors.
                              > 7) Tell jokes when the inspectors get stressed.
                              > 8) A dry towel is real nice when an inspector is soaked to the skin.
                              > (remember the rain during inspections last year?)
                              > 9) Help out with other machines that are not working right so that the
                              > inspections dont go on forever. (TOOLS ARE GOOD)
                              >
                              > You can probably get my drift - do anything possible to make their day
                              more
                              > enjoyable - they are volunteers giving up thier time to make sure that you
                              can
                              > play. They dont do it for fun they do it as a service to better the
                              > society. So if you can help out too - this will lighten their load and
                              even if they
                              > dont have the time or energy to thank you - know thagt it is appreciated.
                              >
                              > Sgt Brun Canutesson (MIC for seige, CA & Inspections - Pennsic 34)
                              >
                              >
                              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              > --
                              > [Email to SCA-Siege-unsubscribe@egroups.com to leave this list]
                              > Yahoo! Groups Links
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                            • Deianira of Rivenstar
                              Lady Svanhildr, We have a new siege engine coming to war and I was wondering if we could get some practice time during the first week of war to tweak it before
                              Message 14 of 15 , Aug 3, 2006
                              • 0 Attachment
                                Lady Svanhildr,
                                We have a new siege engine coming to war and I was
                                wondering if we could get some practice time during
                                the first week of war to tweak it before siege
                                authorizations. Also, I'm a siege marshal for the
                                Middle Kingdom and I'm available to help out whenever
                                and wherever as long as it does not conflict with my
                                rapier duties.

                                Lady Deianira


                                --- "Diane K. Hauer" <dkhauer@...> wrote:

                                > Greetings from Lady Svanhildr Karlsdottir (the new)
                                > Siege Weapon MIC for Pennsic 35.
                                >
                                > Over the past week, the siege community has seen
                                > quite a shake up. I know many people have strong
                                > feelings on all sides. As you read this letter I ask
                                > you to remember that I do not ask you to forget your
                                > thoughts or convictions. I do ask that you put them
                                > aside while on the field this Pennsic. Remember that
                                > there are three stories to all problems. The story
                                > of the wronged, the story of the one doing the
                                > wrong… and then, the story of what actually
                                > happened. Also remember that most people’s
                                > knowledge is at best second hand but more often than
                                > not third or forth hand. Information breaks down
                                > very quickly once you step away from the source.
                                > Please think about this when/if you discuss matters
                                > with anyone.
                                >
                                > Please know in advance that I will not discuss this
                                > topic with anyone who is not directly involved.
                                > Graywolf, Quinn, Pennsic Staff, and Kingdom officers
                                > if required; are currently the only people I will
                                > discuss matters with at this time. This has nothing
                                > to do with a Gag order. It has everything to do with
                                > what is right. Simple as that.
                                >
                                > I also ask that no one boycott Siege simply because
                                > they too were hurt by someone’s actions. To do
                                > that would only injure Siege at Pennsic, not the
                                > parties you may wish to attract the attention of. We
                                > are all adults and can put aside our negative
                                > feelings to make siege work. That is our goal.
                                >
                                > With the goal of moving Siege forward this year,
                                > Graywolf has set up many activities. Some may not go
                                > according to the original plan, but I and those who
                                > have offered their assistance to Siege are working
                                > to see that things go as smoothly as possible and
                                > that we keep as many (if not all) activities. In
                                > order to do this, Siege needs help.
                                >
                                > You may have noticed that I mentioned that “Siege
                                > needs help”, not that “The East needs help”.
                                > Pennsic may be hosted by the Middle or Eastern
                                > Kingdoms from year to year but the staff is made up
                                > from people all over the Knowne World. Attendants
                                > come from all over the world. Also, many kingdoms
                                > require their marshals to assist at least once
                                > during some Marshal activity at Pennsic in order to
                                > keep their Marshal status. This is true of the East.
                                > I can only ask this of Eastern Siege marshals, but I
                                > will also urge those from other kingdoms to please
                                > come out and either help with Engine inspections,
                                > Inspecting ammo, or to Marshal a battle. For those
                                > in the East if you will be at Pennsic and can not
                                > help out during any of those activities please let
                                > me know.
                                >
                                > In the past there have been times when no more than
                                > one Siege Marshal was on the Field. We (Pennsic)
                                > came very close to having to cancel Siege for that
                                > day. Luckily another was found and asked if they
                                > would not fight that battle so that Siege could
                                > happen. I would hate to see this happen ever again.
                                >
                                > Some people have asked questions about
                                > Authorizations for Siege at Pennsic. I have spoken
                                > with half the people I need to in order to obtain a
                                > clear answer. As always I advise everyone to
                                > authorize before Pennsic. As soon as I get answers I
                                > will pass them on.
                                >
                                > Pennsic has had many rules in place for many years.
                                > The Heavy List fighters are expected to adhere to
                                > them. Siege is also expected to equally adhere to
                                > those rules. Siege can not be an exception. I am
                                > working everyday to see that this happens and that
                                > we can still have a safe and fun Pennsic.
                                >
                                > The Pennsic Siege Schedule, as far as I know, is as
                                > posted on the Pennsic Website. As for marshalling
                                > the battles at Pennsic, please show up to the
                                > Marshals Tent 45 minutes prior to the battle start
                                > time. There are always Marshal Meetings about 30
                                > minutes prior and its good to not be looking for
                                > staff at that time. There is also a Marshals court
                                > immediately following all battles. The court takes
                                > place at the Marshal tent. So if you had problems on
                                > the field during the battle you will need to meet up
                                > there at the end. Please first notify me of any
                                > issues.
                                >
                                > Ammo inspections will happen first thing in the
                                > mornings as well is immediately after Marshals
                                > Court. Marshals Courts do not often take very long.
                                > If there are Siege Marshals available who did not
                                > have issues on the field then ammo inspections may
                                > start sooner. The plan is to get all ammo inspected
                                > after the battle and that will leave the morning for
                                > ammo that was constructed or repaired the night
                                > before.
                                >
                                > Please note that inspection times for both Engines
                                > and Ammo are set firm. Late comers will not be
                                > allowed to get inspected. So be early rather than
                                > late. If you can not make the Engine inspections
                                > notify me so arrangements can be made.
                                >
                                > While engines are being inspected you will also be
                                > notified as to how you will be marshaled while on
                                > the field. The marshals will also be notified as to
                                > how they are expected to marshal. This will
                                > hopefully cut down on surprises during battles and
                                > inconsistent Marshaling practices. Im not going to
                                > make everyone do things the Eastern Way. We will,
                                > however have a more clear perspective of a Pennsic
                                > Way. Quinn is helping me with this.
                                >
                                > Remember that just as you would have to Graywolf,
                                > See me at Pennsic if you have any questions,
                                > problems, or even good news. If the information
                                > needs to go to the next level in the Chain of
                                > Command I will see that it happens.
                                >
                                > I will have my Cell on me... unless it is being
                                > Charged.
                                >
                                > 518-229-6181
                                >
                                > Lady Svanhildr Karlsdottir (Svan)
                                >
                                >
                                >


                                I do not seek answers but the knowledge to ask more questions.

                                __________________________________________________
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                                Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
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                              • Donald Luby
                                ... Let me state, unequivocally, that such a thing was *Never* official policy of the Æthelmearc marshallate, either when a principality or a kingdom. If you
                                Message 15 of 15 , Aug 3, 2006
                                • 0 Attachment
                                  On Aug 2, 2006, at 3:27 PM, Siegfried wrote:

                                  > > Everyone should remember that many hands make light work. If every
                                  > marshal
                                  > > helps then no one has to give up every battle. But lately help
                                  > marshalling
                                  > > has gotten rather sparse. Evryone is more interested in fighting
                                  > than helping
                                  > > out. I know that last year I was the only one that marshalled at
                                  > Pennsic
                                  > > from my entire region (The region covers an entire state).
                                  >
                                  > I wholeheartedly agree with Brun's statement. Everyone should go help
                                  > out.
                                  >
                                  > Of course, also realize that some people have multiple commitments and
                                  > have spent alot of time helping (over there), instead of (here).
                                  >
                                  > But also, I wanted to address the 'lack of marshal' situation. I
                                  > personally have a theory, based upon my experience of starting in the
                                  > SCA in AEthlemearc, while it was a principality, and fully under the
                                  > 'You MUST marshal at Pennsic' command structure. Versus when I moved
                                  > to Atlantia.


                                  Let me state, unequivocally, that such a thing was *Never* official
                                  policy of the Æthelmearc marshallate, either when a principality or a
                                  kingdom. If you were told such, then you, and probably those telling
                                  such things to you, were misinformed. Not knowing what area of
                                  Æthelmearc you were in, I can't even guess who could have told you
                                  this, but for their ignorance, let me apologize (years after the fact,
                                  apparently).

                                  The closest Æthelmearc ever came to this was, while a principality, the
                                  East and Middle agreed that if there were not a sufficient number of
                                  marshals (split evenly between the two sides) for any given battle, the
                                  kings of the East and Middle qould require enough of Their Chivalry to
                                  marshal until the quota was reached. As far as I ever heard, this was
                                  never necessary, but the rules were in place to implement it, should
                                  the situation have ever arisen.

                                  Now, we request that everyone who is a warranted marshal spend some
                                  time marshalling at Pennsic, in whatever capacity they wish, in
                                  whatever martial discipline they are warranted as a marshal. There
                                  have been, over the years, a *large* number of individuals who, their
                                  fighting days done, kept current warrants just so they could marshal at
                                  Pennsic, which would allow those who still could, and wished to, fight,
                                  that opportunity. And today, Æthelmearc has no shortage of warranted
                                  marshals, regardless of what you may have been given to believe -
                                  between myself, my kingdom deputies, marshals for local groups, and
                                  at-large marshals, we have more than 100 warranted marshals, or over
                                  20% of the authorized fighters in the kingdom.


                                  > Under the 'MUST marshal', less people become marshals. In fact, I
                                  > remember being told when I started by some of the more involved heavy
                                  > fighters: "Not to become a marshal since it means you have to give up
                                  > your time at Pennsic & other events."
                                  >
                                  > People will specifically NOT become a marshal, because of an implied
                                  > requirement. Even if it is something that they would be happy to
                                  > volunteer for normally, the idea of 'YOU MUST' drives people away.
                                  >
                                  > In Atlantia, there are no requirements (in that sense) of marshals.
                                  > Therefore, we have more of them! In archery we have about a 50%
                                  > marshal to archer ratio. In heavy combat we seem to have many more
                                  > than other Kingdoms. Everyone who becomes a semi-decent
                                  > archer/fighter/etc is just expected via peer pressure to become a
                                  > marshal, so that they CAN help out. Not so that they MUST help out.
                                  >
                                  > So, having more people now marshals, there is a greater chance that a
                                  > few more will decide to donate some time. And suddenly you have lots
                                  > of marshals running around. When you dictated in the first place,
                                  > then people don't even become marshals.
                                  >
                                  > Siegfried


                                  Sir Koredono
                                  Æthelmearc Earl Marshal
                                  (warranted marshal in the East and Æthelmearc for 19 years)
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