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Re: [SCA-Herbalist] when you all get back from Pennsic ...

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  • Jenne Heise
    ... Um. Well, we had 7 people at the meeting. One was from Atlantia, one was from Lochac. I m not sure that any of the others were pre-existing members of the
    Message 1 of 9 , Aug 21, 2000
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      > Those of us still here at home want to hear what happened, how the Guild meeting went, and whatnot.

      Um. Well, we had 7 people at the meeting. One was from Atlantia, one was
      from Lochac. I'm not sure that any of the others were pre-existing members
      of the guild or this list... After an abortive attempt to talk about guild
      business, we just gave up and gossiped about herbs. (I spouted booklists.
      What else is new?) The lady from Lochac had some very interesting comments
      to make about what oils she and her partner (they own an herbal products
      business) used in their products, and how she went about making them (big
      jars full of oil, with plant material in them, turned daily).

      I'm thinking of setting up a Guild meeting at "A Walk in the Garden" on
      September 16 to work on the charter. C'mon people, I need comments on it.
      I think it could use more work before we send it out for signatures.
      Perhaps a petition format would be better?

      P.S.: I know that most people haven't sent their registrations for "A
      Walk in the Garden" in yet, waiting until after Pennsic. However, please
      consider sending them in soon! It will soothe the nerves of the
      feastocrat... The web page for the event, with the address to send
      registrations to, is at: http://tulgey.browser.net/~jenne/herbevent.html
      Also, I'm looking for people to judge the A&S competition and people to
      teach classes... let me know if you are interested!

      Jadwiga Zajaczkowa, mka Jennifer Heise jenne@...
      disclaimer: i speak for no-one and no-one speaks for me.

      "They do not preach that their God will rouse them a little before the
      nuts work loose.
      They do not preach that His Pity allows them to drop their job when
      they damn-well choose. " -Kipling, "The Sons of Martha"
    • Warren & Meredith Harmon
      Greetings! ... signatures. ... Having a guild meeting at the event s fine with me - if we can wiggle it in with all the classes! ;-) ;-) ;-) The only reason I
      Message 2 of 9 , Aug 23, 2000
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        Greetings!

        >I'm thinking of setting up a Guild meeting at "A Walk in the Garden" on
        >September 16 to work on the charter. C'mon people, I need comments on
        >it. I think it could use more work before we send it out for
        signatures.
        >Perhaps a petition format would be better?

        Having a guild meeting at the event's fine with me - if we can wiggle it
        in with all the classes! ;-) ;-) ;-)

        The only reason I haven't commented on the charter is because I really
        don't have much to add. One question, though - I heard someone say they
        were going to compare it to other kingdoms' charters: did that happen?
        'Cause if it's comparable, then I'd say we're a go. The only other idea
        would be to give ideas for names for the various "rankings"... weeeelll,
        let's just say I've always had a problem with "Novice - Journeyman -
        Master and that's it". (I come from a martial arts background, and look
        how many color belts there are for each discipline, plus the dans within
        the belt rankings!) So, since I dragged this soapox out and dusted it
        off, it's my helium hand going up? Yep...well, let's see....

        Novice (I really want to say "Greenie")
        Journeyman (I really want to say "Sprout")
        Mid-Journeyman ("Shoot")
        Advanced Journeyman ("Seedling")
        Master
        Advanced Master
        Adept
        Advanced Adept
        Gaia

        Okay, okay, I'm totally floofy today, but do you see my point? Feel free
        to change names, since my brain's in Strange Space today.

        -Caro

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      • newbrg@aol.com
        ... Speaking as the compiler of the draft, it was based closely on the only other ones I could find -- Meridies and ... Ansteorra, I think? (And you think
        Message 3 of 9 , Aug 23, 2000
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          In a message dated Wed, 23 Aug 2000 10:37:04 AM Eastern Daylight Time, Carowyn said:

          >One question, though - I heard someone say they
          >were going to compare it to other kingdoms' charters:
          >did that happen?

          Speaking as the compiler of the draft, it was based closely on the only other ones I could find -- Meridies and ... Ansteorra, I think? (And you think _your_ brain is floofy today . . .)

          >I've always had a problem with "Novice - Journeyman -
          >Master and that's it". <snip> well, let's see.... ><snip neat list of possible ranks>

          I wanna be Gaia! Sorry, what I meant to say was, got any ideas for qualifications?

          Johanna
        • Warren & Meredith Harmon
          Greetings! ... Well, then, the charter should be a go! If it s comparable to other charters, then it s probably as good as it can get, and thank you for all
          Message 4 of 9 , Aug 24, 2000
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            Greetings!

            >Speaking as the compiler of the draft, it was based closely on the
            >only other ones I could find -- Meridies and ... Ansteorra, I think?
            >(And you think _your_ brain is floofy today . . .)

            Well, then, the charter should be a go! If it's comparable to other
            charters, then it's probably as good as it can get, and thank you for all
            the work!

            >I wanna be Gaia! Sorry, what I meant to say was, got any ideas for
            >qualifications?

            Hmmm...okay, again, this is my opinion only, kick around as you need
            to... Some of the ideas will probably need to be rearranged (like make
            the garden a lesser priority, perhaps, that sort of thing), and please
            keep in mind that my tongue is firmly pressed into cheek, so read this
            with a grain of lemon thyme.....

            Novice - willing to learn about herbs

            Journeyman - fairly knowledgeable about three different herbs. Can
            produce information, hands-on demonstration (like an example poultice, or
            a pomander, or a walk in the woods to find an herb), and discuss known
            properties on those three herbs today and in period. Knows the
            difference between many period herbs and modern herbs. Knows to give the
            standard cautions about "self-medicating".

            Mid Journeyman - Can teach a class or two, with handouts. Fairly
            knowledgeable about five (six? seven? ten??) herbs, and can discourse
            on them (see above description). Can do tinctures, and tisanes; or can
            cook well with herbs; or can successfully and safely wildcraft (giving
            examples of various specialties within the varying disciplines within
            herbalism). Has much period book info, and can reference it. Also has
            modern info, and when to listen to which.

            Advanced Journeyman - Can teach four or five classes with little or no
            prep. Fairly knowledgeable about 15-20 herbs. (If there's room for it
            on their property) has a garden, in a period-style layout. Has been
            taught how to do their own research.

            Master - Has a self-made first aid kit. Knows how to use it (and when
            not to). Knowledgeable on 25-35 herbs. Doesn't need a class format to
            expound on herbs at will, with handouts and demos. Can take three
            apprentices at a crack. Extensive library, or knows where to get it.

            Advanced Master - Has written a book (make that their advancement
            challenge???). Knowledgeable on 40-50 herbs, in all their uses and which
            genus was found where. can trace the route of an herb through the Known
            Worlde. Can answer newbie questions without being condescending, but can
            talk the trade with the best of 'em too. The garden is separated -
            period species over there, modern species over here, and I'm working on
            that unique cross breed of rose over in that secret corner... Any
            question you might ask them has the disadvantage of possibly getting you
            kidnapped and transported to their backyard, and thence to their
            stillroom, for a one-on-one class.

            Adept - Okay, I'm getting lost in my own "flowery expansion" - help me
            out here...

            Advanced Adept - See under Adept, but times two...

            Gaia - Conjures the exact proper book out of thin air. Goes to Europe to
            work on archeological digs to learn what happened to "that weed". Ask
            her about a species you've only heard about in obscure texts, then peer
            closely at the ground - it'll be growing at her feet. Telepathically
            KNOWS who wants what herb lore at each event. And gives it. Twice.
            Knows Culpepper personally. Critiqued his book. Edited it when he
            wasn't looking.

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          • Jenne Heise
            ... ARGH.... Much though I hate to disagree, I think that limiting the number of rankings is pretty important if we are going to do juried rankings (where
            Message 5 of 9 , Aug 24, 2000
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              > 'Cause if it's comparable, then I'd say we're a go. The only other idea
              > would be to give ideas for names for the various "rankings"... weeeelll,
              > let's just say I've always had a problem with "Novice - Journeyman -
              > Master and that's it". (I come from a martial arts background, and look
              > how many color belts there are for each discipline, plus the dans within
              > the belt rankings!)

              ARGH.... Much though I hate to disagree, I think that limiting the number
              of rankings is pretty important if we are going to do juried rankings
              (where people get together and discuss your projects/presentations and
              interview you to determine ranking). I took the 3-level system from the
              needlework guild when I suggested it. Right now, the other thing that is
              bothering me about the rankings is who decides who is the first set of
              Masters/Mistresses so that we can start doing the rankings? *sigh*

              I'll post my thoughts on the charter when I get my head together. I'm
              going to talk to foofy herald types about it too...

              Jadwiga Zajaczkowa, mka Jennifer Heise jenne@...
              disclaimer: i speak for no-one and no-one speaks for me.

              " Oh, Adam was a gardener, and God who made him sees
              That half a proper gardener's work is done upon his knees,
              So when your work is finished, you can wash your hands and pray
              For the Glory of the Garden, that it may not pass away!" -- Kipling
            • annys
              ... Right now, the other thing that is ... Jadwiga, Have you asked anyone in the other Kingdom s guilds how they decided on their first set of
              Message 6 of 9 , Aug 24, 2000
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                ----------
                Right now, the other thing that is
                > bothering me about the rankings is who decides who is the first set of
                > Masters/Mistresses so that we can start doing the rankings? *sigh*
                >
                > I'll post my thoughts on the charter when I get my head together. I'm
                > going to talk to foofy herald types about it too...
                >
                > Jadwiga Zajaczkowa, mka Jennifer Heise jenne@...
                > disclaimer: i speak for no-one and no-one speaks for me.
                >
                Jadwiga,
                Have you asked anyone in the other Kingdom's guilds how they decided on
                their first set of Masters/Mistresses? Just a thought...
                Annys
              • newbrg@aol.com
                So Caro was just saying -- The other charters are in the June issue of the newsletter,
                Message 7 of 9 , Aug 25, 2000
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                  So Caro was just saying --

                  <I snipped it all, but she mentioned charters and rankings>

                  The other charters are in the June issue of the newsletter, (www.tulgey.browser.net/~EKHerb/tisane.html, right? A mind is a terrible thing to lose.) if you want to see where I diverged. I added some stuff that had been mentioned on this list, too.

                  Rankings: I fall somewhere between you and Jadwiga on this one. We agreed early on that we needed to allow people to specialize -- those with green thumbs, those with "green" libraries, those who wouldn't touch herbal medicine with a ten-foot sapling but know everything there is about dyeing, etc. This limits us. On the other hand, three _is_ probably too few.

                  And, Jadwiga, I've gathered that the basic principle for starting a ranking system is that the first few candidates sit down and judge each other!

                  Johanna
                • Kathy Eygabroad
                  There is also this: Rankings in each area. Say: Alchemy, Cooking, Homesteading/Gardening, and a Magi of sorts (the bookish type). Also, you could use a
                  Message 8 of 9 , Aug 25, 2000
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                    There is also this: Rankings in each area.

                    Say: Alchemy, Cooking, Homesteading/Gardening, and a "Magi" of sorts (the
                    bookish type).

                    Also, you could use a "Degree system" (i.e. First, Second, Third...or
                    colors)

                    Of course, I don't understand if this is Guild is to be SCA wide or
                    individual to a Kingdom here, since I am pretty new to this list and thread.

                    Dreaming of fields of heather,
                    Lady Wynne MacGillebride
                  • István László
                    greetings ! I am thLady AElia Doughty and I wrote the Herbal guild charter for the kingdom of Meridies. What we did to get the rankings started was to use
                    Message 9 of 9 , Sep 4, 2000
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                      greetings !  I am thLady AElia Doughty and I wrote the Herbal guild charter for the kingdom of Meridies.  What we did to get the rankings started was to use intertested Laurles and members of the order of the Oveo to do the judging untill we had enough people inthe guild to do the ranking our selves.  I am not sure the ranking is verry important.  the main thinking  with the guild seams to be having  a group to shear a common intrest with .  And by the way most meetings do seem to be just people setting around talking about herbs , is'ent  it great.
                      ----- Original Message -----
                      From: annys
                      Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2000 8:32 PM
                      Subject: Re: [SCA-Herbalist] when you all get back from Pennsic ...



                      ----------
                      Right now, the other thing that is
                      > bothering me about the rankings is who decides who is the first set of
                      > Masters/Mistresses so that we can start doing the rankings? *sigh*
                      >
                      > I'll post my thoughts on the charter when I get my head together. I'm
                      > going to talk to foofy herald types about it too...
                      >
                      > Jadwiga Zajaczkowa, mka Jennifer Heise       jenne@...
                      > disclaimer: i speak for no-one and no-one speaks for me.
                      >
                      Jadwiga,
                      Have you asked anyone in the other Kingdom's guilds how they decided on
                      their first set of Masters/Mistresses?  Just a thought...
                      Annys

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