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Re: Archery Company Guidelines

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  • Chris Nogy
    There are several examples of miniature bows used as assasins weapons in the 14th-16th centuries - these bows had short, usually 2 piece prods so they could be
    Message 1 of 26 , Sep 23, 1999
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      There are several examples of miniature bows used as assasins weapons in the
      14th-16th centuries - these bows had short, usually 2 piece prods so they could
      be collapsed and fitted into pocket or a pouch.

      These bows did not have a modern semi-automatic style pistol grip, they had
      what more resembled an early powder-pistol grip - long and bulbous, with a
      gentle curve (rather like the bows on that horrible movie, First Knight - it is
      one of the few things they actually got partly right.) There was a single
      example that I have seen drawings of from 15th century Germany of a bow that
      had a pistol grip that looked like a plumbing elbow, a complete curve that
      ended in a swelling much like a modern match pistol (The remmington Fireball is
      a good example), and it used a unigue modification of a drop-pin release that I
      have never quite gotten to work, but am still trying.

      These were not full-sized bows, mind you. They would not have been made with
      full sized prods or have been made with near the power of a good half or full
      bow. But for close-up work (as in assasination) they were more than effective.

      I have a couple of these bows that I have built, including a skein-powered
      collapsible (actually, breakapart) assasin's bow, and a small bow with a
      drop-roller release that uses a small Barnett prod.

      So if you are looking for the .45 cal Desert Eagle period crossbow, a
      documentable high-powered piece that can compete head-to-head with the other
      bows on the line, I can't help you. But I can find a few examples of the .25
      cal equivalent....

      Kaz

      > From: Siegfried Sebastian Faust <eliwhite@...>, on 9/22/1999
      11:33 AM:
      > From: Siegfried Sebastian Faust <eliwhite@...>
      >
      > Really? (*He says with actual enthusiasm - no kidding*)
      >
      > For what period/culture? I love picking up new information like this ...
      >
      > Siegfried
      >
      > At 08:59 AM 9/22/99 -0700, you wrote:
      > >Pistol grip crossbows are period....
      > >
      > >Kaz
      >
      > ______________________________________________________________________
      > Lord Siegfried Sebastian Faust Barony of Highland Foorde
      > Minister of Misinformation (Chronicler & Web Minister)
      > http://highland-foorde.atlantia.sca.org
      >
      > > This list sponsored by House Wyvern Hall
      > of Barony Beyond the Mountain, East Kingdom
      > [SCA-Archery-unsubscribe@... to leave this list]
      >
      >
      >
    • Chris Nogy
      Trick response (I love it when folks rise to bait like that - gives me faith in my fishin abilities.) Explaination in next message - it was only half a trick
      Message 2 of 26 , Sep 23, 1999
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        Trick response

        (I love it when folks rise to bait like that - gives me faith in my fishin
        abilities.)

        Explaination in next message - it was only half a trick question...

        Later

        Kaz

        > From: Siegfried Sebastian Faust <eliwhite@...>, on 9/22/1999
        11:33 AM:
        > From: Siegfried Sebastian Faust <eliwhite@...>
        >
        > Really? (*He says with actual enthusiasm - no kidding*)
        >
        > For what period/culture? I love picking up new information like this ...
        >
        > Siegfried
        >
        > At 08:59 AM 9/22/99 -0700, you wrote:
        > >Pistol grip crossbows are period....
        > >
        > >Kaz
        >
        > ______________________________________________________________________
        > Lord Siegfried Sebastian Faust Barony of Highland Foorde
        > Minister of Misinformation (Chronicler & Web Minister)
        > http://highland-foorde.atlantia.sca.org
        >
        > > This list sponsored by House Wyvern Hall
        > of Barony Beyond the Mountain, East Kingdom
        > [SCA-Archery-unsubscribe@... to leave this list]
        >
        >
        >
      • Robert w stephenson
        No! No! I think that a 50 cal Desert Eagle crossbow would be more period. It would make a bigger and better impression . You might even make a wrist snapping
        Message 3 of 26 , Sep 23, 1999
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          No! No!
          I think that a 50 cal Desert Eagle crossbow would be more period. It
          would make a bigger and better "impression". You might even make a wrist
          snapping remark. A 25 cal crossbow will just upset your opponent. Then
          again maybe your opponent will laughs himself to death.
          Knut
          On Thu, 23 Sep 1999 09:13:45 -0700 Chris Nogy <cnogy@...>
          writes:
          >From: Chris Nogy <cnogy@...>
          >
          >--BeyondBoundary_1_Thu_Sep_23_09:13:47_1999__29
          >Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
          >Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit
          >
          >There are several examples of miniature bows used as assasins weapons
          >in the
          >14th-16th centuries - these bows had short, usually 2 piece prods so
          >they could
          >be collapsed and fitted into pocket or a pouch.
          >
          >These bows did not have a modern semi-automatic style pistol grip,
          >they had
          >what more resembled an early powder-pistol grip - long and bulbous,
          >with a
          >gentle curve (rather like the bows on that horrible movie, First
          >Knight - it is
          >one of the few things they actually got partly right.) There was a
          >single
          >example that I have seen drawings of from 15th century Germany of a
          >bow that
          >had a pistol grip that looked like a plumbing elbow, a complete curve
          >that
          >ended in a swelling much like a modern match pistol (The remmington
          >Fireball is
          >a good example), and it used a unigue modification of a drop-pin
          >release that I
          >have never quite gotten to work, but am still trying.
          >
          >These were not full-sized bows, mind you. They would not have been
          >made with
          >full sized prods or have been made with near the power of a good half
          >or full
          >bow. But for close-up work (as in assasination) they were more than
          >effective.
          >
          >I have a couple of these bows that I have built, including a
          >skein-powered
          >collapsible (actually, breakapart) assasin's bow, and a small bow with
          >a
          >drop-roller release that uses a small Barnett prod.
          >
          >So if you are looking for the .45 cal Desert Eagle period crossbow, a
          >documentable high-powered piece that can compete head-to-head with the
          >other
          >bows on the line, I can't help you. But I can find a few examples of
          >the .25
          >cal equivalent....
          >
          >Kaz
          >
          >> From: Siegfried Sebastian Faust <eliwhite@...>, on
          >9/22/1999
          >11:33 AM:
          >> From: Siegfried Sebastian Faust <eliwhite@...>
          >>
          >> Really? (*He says with actual enthusiasm - no kidding*)
          >>
          >> For what period/culture? I love picking up new information like
          >this ...
          >>
          >> Siegfried
          >>
          >> At 08:59 AM 9/22/99 -0700, you wrote:
          >> >Pistol grip crossbows are period....
          >> >
          >> >Kaz
          >>
          >>
          >______________________________________________________________________
          >> Lord Siegfried Sebastian Faust Barony of Highland
          >Foorde
          >> Minister of Misinformation (Chronicler & Web Minister)
          >> http://highland-foorde.atlantia.sca.org
          >>
          >> > This list sponsored by House Wyvern Hall
          >> of Barony Beyond the Mountain, East Kingdom
          >> [SCA-Archery-unsubscribe@... to leave this list]
          >>
          >>
          >>
          >
          >--BeyondBoundary_1_Thu_Sep_23_09:13:47_1999__29
          >Content-Type: x-juno/st1
          >
          >
          >--BeyondBoundary_1_Thu_Sep_23_09:13:47_1999__29--
          >------------------------------------------------------------------------
          >This list sponsored by House Wyvern Hall
          >of Barony Beyond the Mountain, East Kingdom
          >[SCA-Archery-unsubscribe@... to leave this list]
          >
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        • Karl Sandhoff
          My Lord, I would very much like to know what you included as an attachment but my email doesn t accept them. Carolus von Eulenhorst On Wed, 22 Sep 1999
          Message 4 of 26 , Sep 23, 1999
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            My Lord,
            I would very much like to know what you included as an attachment but my
            email doesn't accept them.
            Carolus von Eulenhorst

            On Wed, 22 Sep 1999 08:59:17 -0700 Chris Nogy <cnogy@...>
            writes:
            >From: Chris Nogy <cnogy@...>
            >
            >--BeyondBoundary_1_Wed_Sep_22_08:59:19_1999__29
            >Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
            >Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit
            >
            >Pistol grip crossbows are period....
            >
            >Kaz
            >
            >
            >> From: Siegfried Sebastian Faust <eliwhite@...>, on
            >9/13/1999
            >12:19 PM:
            >> From: Siegfried Sebastian Faust <eliwhite@...>
            >>
            >> Ok, my thoughts as they were ...
            >>
            >> Exceptable stuff:
            >> >All archery bows/crossbows that look like a period bow. eg. self
            >long
            >> >bows, composite (laminated) long bows, mongol reflex's (I think
            >those
            >> >are period) _____ (insert example of a common crossbow here) etc.
            >>
            >> Looks good, but you might want to add that 10' in there: "All
            >archery
            >> bows/crossbows that look like a period bow from 10'"
            >>
            >> This covers the exceptions of people with fiberglass bows that are
            >covered
            >> in leather ... but immediately knocks out the takedown recurves,
            >pistol
            >> grip crossbows and such ...
            >>
            >> >eg. wooden
            >> >shafted arrows with feather fletching
            >>
            >> Good ...
            >>
            >> >, a self nock (or a plastic one not
            >> >visible from 10 ft.)
            >>
            >> Well, PERSONALLY (everyone feel free to argue here), I think that
            >this
            >> should possibly allow (specifically) for solid black or brown
            >plastic nocks
            >> ... they arn't noticible (to myself at least), and I know alot of
            >people
            >> who don't like shooting with self-nocks ... yet own some ...
            >>
            >> why not?
            >>
            >> Because they get chewed up too easily ... the plastic nocks will
            >take a
            >> nick from an arrow and just move out of the way ... the self nocks
            >will be
            >> destroyed by an arrow hit and then the arrow is ruined ...
            >>
            >> > and a period looking SCA safe point. (Any examples
            >> >of one? Or something to say about points the ten foot rule pretty
            >much
            >> >says that all would work unless they were bright pink or
            >something. :-))
            >>
            >> In general I think that modern field & target points should be
            >allowed,
            >> just because they are convenient, and don't tooooo out-of-period -
            >plus
            >> that's what marshals are used to be seeing, and what targets are
            >usually
            >> designed for.
            >>
            >> Siegfried
            >>
            >>
            >______________________________________________________________________
            >> Lord Siegfried Sebastian Faust Barony of Highland
            >Foorde
            >> Minister of Misinformation (Chronicler & Web Minister)
            >> http://highland-foorde.atlantia.sca.org
            >>
            >> > This list sponsored by House Wyvern Hall
            >> of Barony Beyond the Mountain, East Kingdom
            >> [SCA-Archery-unsubscribe@... to leave this list]
            >>
            >>
            >>
            >
            >--BeyondBoundary_1_Wed_Sep_22_08:59:19_1999__29
            >Content-Type: x-juno/st1
            >
            >
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